# Comparison of Flourish and F. Trace?



## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

What are the differences? When is a good time to use one or the other? I here people talk of Flourish but rerely is the trace mentioned. I have a 10 gal, 3 wpg with indica, repens, nummilaria, Bacopa, crypts and a little difformis, java ferm and Didiplis. Dose currently 10 k(from K2SO4) kno3 as needed for N, will deal with P in a couple days when my goodies arrive, DIY co2 and a little Sera florena for iron and traces. Any recomendations for using Florish and trace I also battle small amounts of BGA especially towards the end of the week as my NO3 gets near 10ppm. My plants don't seem difficient really but they certainly are not growing like they used to. I assume traces are missing. Any ideas?

Thanks


----------



## gpodio (Feb 4, 2004)

You can compare the two here:
http://www.gpodio.com/fert_table.htm

In short, I think Seachem simply chose a very confusing name for both products. Flourish is a complete trace mix and is the one you should be using should you decide to choose between one or the other. Flourish Trace is a supplement containing only some of the more unstable trace elements that have a shorter lifespan in our tanks than the rest of the elements. So if you dose Flourish once a week, you _may_ find that some of the more unstable elements were depleted mid week, leaving a small deficiency for the remainder of the week. At least this is what Seachem has told us. Personally I don't use Flourish Trace however I dose everything daily so I am immune to these issues. Your best bet is to buy a small bottle and use it between doses of regular Flourish, if the plants show improvements continue to use it, otherwise just stick to Flourish.

Hope that helps
Giancarlo Podio


----------



## tsunami (Jan 24, 2004)

I'd like to share an experience with using Flourish/Flourish Trace:

I had been dosing 21 mL of Flourish and 21 mL of Flourish Iron weekly into my 20g long aquarium in 3 mL daily doses, obtaining excellent results with this high dosage. I pushed Flourish Iron upward even further, with no positive results and went back to 3 mL a day. I doubled the amount of Flourish I added with no observable differences other than a lot of unhappy shrimp. About two weeks ago, I started adding Flourish trace at 15mL weekly along with the other two products into my tanks (3mL every other day). There is a big difference in the way the plants are growing with this extra shot of micronutrients. The red plants are redder and the green plants are shiny, emerald green --it is a subtle number of differences and perhaps only noticeable to me since I see this tank every day, but the tank seems to 'sparkle' even more now.

IME,

Carlos


----------



## JLudwig (Feb 16, 2004)

I guess I was born to be different... :wink: 

Your tap water contains more "rare trace elements" than Flourish Trace, take a good look at that chemical breakdown... its a $7 bottle of RO water! Add a cup of water top off and you've done more for your tank than this product does.

Carlos,
It is possible to do a more controlled study? Tank A&B, same light, same water changes, everything the same with only Flourish trace the variable? I can think of 100s of things that may have caused the improvement you've seen...

My objection to this product is largely philosophical: the most simple solution that requires the least amount of chemical intervention is best. There's nothing in Flourish trace that plain 'ol Flourish isn't providing in ample quantities. If you're concerned about lifetimes dose Flourish daily instead of weekly. I think we're way off base to be thinking about vanadium concentrations dropping during the week, we're getting close to snake oils here...

Cheers,
Jeff


----------



## tsunami (Jan 24, 2004)

> Carlos,
> It is possible to do a more controlled study? Tank A&B, same light, same water changes, everything the same with only Flourish trace the variable? I can think of 100s of things that may have caused the improvement you've seen...


I wouldn't be able to do something like this, especially in a dorm. I am pretty much at my max now for tanks --I don't have time to take care of more than two at the same time! All I can do is observe differences from week 1 to week 2 by changing one variable --and made an observation.

I keep a journal for each of my aquariums, btw.

I think heavy trace additions are important --if not they wouldn't be in your fertilizer. Would a tank running on Flourish Iron only with just tap water providing all the micronutrients function better than one with Flourish+Flourish Iron?

I know that Flourish has all the products Flourish Trace does, and Flourish has them in higher concentrations. The fact that the addition of Flourish Trace resulted in a general improvement of the aquarium versus just adding more Flourish was a surprise to me and worthy of further investigation.

Carlos


----------



## JLudwig (Feb 16, 2004)

tsunami said:


> I know that Flourish has all the products Flourish Trace does, and Flourish has them in higher concentrations. The fact that the addition of Flourish Trace resulted in a general improvement of the aquarium versus just adding more Flourish was a surprise to me and worthy of further investigation.


Right, it seems to imply toxicity, thats why I was wondering if it would be possible for a little more control... We've (John Wheeler and myself) added much more than 21ml to 20 gallons weekly with no ill effects...

But I still don't really buy this I mean we're talking ppb or less with a lot of these elements, thats really less than a seasonal fluctuation in a water supply.

I really can't say much more since I've moved to a TMG+Flourish Fe cocktail over concerns about iron. I was concerned about the level of other stuff I needed to add to get adequate iron levels to my plant, so I'm not using the Flourish line exclusively anymore.

Jeff


----------



## jerseyjay (Jan 25, 2004)

Just to follow up on Flourish Trace addition with real example. 

I have 75G african cichlid tank with Anubias sp., Cryptocoryne sp. and Microsorum pteropus and do weekly or every other week ~30% water changes. My plants are very healthy with addition on trace elements through water changes. No fertilizer is provided. :idea:


----------



## gpodio (Feb 4, 2004)

Just like Jay's tank, my 90 gallon low light tank relies on water changes for trace elements in the water plus some Flourish tabs in the substrate. A high light tank on the other hand will require more than what tap water can provide.

I think I'd much rather see a Flourish without iron than Flourish Trace, in my case I have plenty of iron and have to watch my Flourish dosing to avoid excessive FE levels which always give me an increase in durt and green spot algae.

If you look closely at the numbers however, F. Trace has very small amounts of traces, only zink and copper are present in a comparable amount, which is actually somewhat scary... Perhaps it's just a zink supplement... :wink: 

Giancarlo Podio


----------

