# First rock scape.



## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

It's summer so i decided to make a new scape. I need comments/ help.










in the back of the big rock will be HM, and everything else will be HC. any other plant suggestions? and should i move and of the rocks or take out any?

heres a pictures of my old setup, which was torn down because the loaches keep burrowing under the HC and i got tired of the HC popping up.


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## jazzlvr123 (Apr 29, 2007)

you should a a rock grouping on the left side too one somewhat smaller than the grouping on the right the look of symmetric rock groupings make an aquarium look really balanced


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

like this?










that's all the rocks i got for today, couldnt make a smaller grouping.


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## travis (Oct 5, 2004)

I like the rockwork you've done on the right side of the tank but the rocks you've placed on the left give the tank a much too symmetrical look (although I have to say that you've got some very nice looking rock for your 'scape). Their shape and placement looks like a mirror image of those on the right and appears a little unnatural to me. Unbalancing them by breaking up the left group, possibly moving some of them a bit forward and playing around with their angles, would help give your tank a more natural look. 

In a small tank like this one, with rocks as proportionally large as yours, you should consider using only three of the larger rocks, possibly adding some of the smaller pieces in the foreground and to the sides. Iwagumi, the Japanese art of stone arrangement that Takashi Amano has so brilliantly adapted to aquascaping, uses odd numbered groupings of prominent rocks to create focal points and to produce a natural, asymmetric feel. The most popular style, sanzon iwagumi, uses three main rocks in its arrangements: one large rock complemented by two somewhat smaller rocks that are placed at varying distances from the main rock, often leaning reverentially toward it. Viewed from the top-down, the three primary rocks in a sanzon iwagumi arrangement may often be seen to form the points of a scalene triangle (one having three unequal sides). The relative positions and angles at which these three rocks are placed, along with their shape and texture are key factors in determining where the focus of the arrangement will be.

The focal point of the iwagumi design (which can be the rocks themselves or a spot toward which the rock arrangement leads the eye), tends to look most natural when it is not dead-center. In the case of your last picture the two similar groupings of rock on either side of the tank, although each looks great on its own, focus the eye on the open area at the very center of the tank and give the 'scape (to my eye anyway) an unnaturally balanced look. 

An off-balance iwagumi arrangement with the focal point roughly 2/5ths of the way in from either the left or right side will help lend your tank a more natural appearance. I'm not sure why 2/5ths works so well (try searching for "golden ratio" here on APC to read more about it) but I have to admit that it really does seem more organic. Take a look at some of Amano's iwagumi-style tanks (or for that matter some of the amazing iwagumi tanks from members here at APC) and they will give you a much better illustration of what I've poorly tried to explain here in four rambling paragraphs.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

i scooted the rocks on the left more towards the front


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

ive noticed change in the leaf size and shape in the HM. What causes this? it changed from a long, narrow shape to a short, rounder shape (sort of like a tear drop).


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## mikenas102 (Feb 8, 2006)

Either the HM was grown emersed and is adapting to being submersed or its a reaction to a change in lighting.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

probably the latter....i was worried that it might be nutrient deficiency. sounds right because it was narrow leaf in the setup from the store i bought them, and i only got them for like a week. thanks.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

this morning i woke up and discovered that all of my amanos were laying on its sides. i quickly relocated them into another tank, but they dont seem to be doing any better. Theyve been in the tank for a year and a half. The only difference is that i started feeding Hikari Tropical Algae Wafers, and i stopped dosing ferts for a few months and only started dosing again on Wednesday. What is to blame?

i went back to my old dosing schedule, which was fine with the shrimps awhile ago.


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## travis (Oct 5, 2004)

When something like that happens in an established tank like yours you should always look at what has changed. Just started dosing ferts again? Any copper in the micronutrient formula you're using?

I like the way you've adjusted your rocks, btw.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

yes, its Flourish. but the thing is i stuck to this dosing schedule for a loooong time until i got busy at school and stopped dosing for a few months. would it be the big change from no dosing to full on dosing that killed the shrimps?


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

one month update.










whats the rotala species in the middle called? The HM is recovering from the melt but the new growth is still relatively short (hiding behind the rocks). Should i replace the HM with rotala sp. green? i like how rotala sp. green leans forward, and it would be cool to see it lean forward over the big rocks.

My 2.5 gallons.

My new project, anubias scape.




























please comment or leave advice.


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## tex627 (Nov 2, 2008)

hey YOUR SCAPE SUCKS!


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## mcsinny99 (Sep 2, 2008)

tex627 said:


> hey YOUR SCAPE SUCKS!


Good job man, you have discovered that you suck balls. The guy is trying to do something positive and he has to deal with people like you.

Keep it up, kiwik.

Send him to hell...


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## cotranchau_vn (Nov 18, 2006)

Not bad man, your tank now looks much much better. It just needs time for HC to grow up. Dont worry about any negative words, your tank looks awesome


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## gravy9 (Aug 28, 2008)

Folks,

This is a forum for everyone to learn and share ideas. Please encourage others by providing positive critiques to help them improve. Please do not leave insulting comments.


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## thief (Feb 20, 2008)

Wow thats sad. Very immature, seriously if your here just to degrade others just leave you alreadt broke like 3 rules. Bringing back old post, your first post is offensive, and you got to have nerve just coming here to ay that. 

Kiwik I think the scape is looking good. Lucky you to get some Main ryouh stones going there. You just need some supportive stones to help balance it all out!


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## fishman9809 (Feb 4, 2008)

somehow i think tex627 sucks

your tnak has improved form the start, good job.


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## tex627 (Nov 2, 2008)

Dam haha. kiwik is a friend of mine, and hes also helping me with my first scape. it was jusst a joke..... i didnt think 5 people would see my comment and get so pissed off. i dont have the right to criticize him since hes helping me with everything. i apologize for making you guys angry. Kiwik has been pretty busy but i got to see his tanks 2-3 weeks ago and he redid the 2 2.5s the one with the ferns was infested with algae so he just gave it to me. if you guys arent too pissed off when i post my scape later please leave some comments.


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## ferris89 (Jul 31, 2008)

tex, I know that you are friends, but next time you might want to add that in the post where you say something like that....  

Wikik- I love the positioning of the rocks, can't wait to see everything all grown up. the plant in the back-right seems a little out of place, but I think I will like it better when everything grows up


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

lol. thanks guy. heres a mini update:










the tanks a little messy right now because im dealing with moderate string algae growth. It doesnt seem to die down even tho i lowered my iron dosing, ODed Excel, and am continuously removing them manually with old toothbrushes. any tips on the string algae?

also, i know i needa give the HC a trim  but im too lazy


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

i gave the hc a small trim....straining the little pieces is a pita

any help with the string algae?


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## matt1045 (Oct 11, 2008)

looking good. I think moving the rocks was a good idea. Keep it up


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

I've decided to break down the old tank and add new plants to the scape. Current new plants include blyxa japonica and glosso. The HC grew successfully in my tank, but trimming was a hassle.


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## ch3fb0yrdee (Jul 26, 2008)

kiwik said:


> lol. thanks guy. heres a mini update:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That is an amazing tank. I really how your carpet grew in. Dont worry about what others have told you. That dude doesnt even know. =D How long did it take for the carpet to grow in? Is the rotala you have there rotala araguaia by any chance?

I still dont see any fish inside, are you still in the process of cycling your tank?


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## ferris89 (Jul 31, 2008)

wow, it thought it looked quite lovely!! everything looked so natural, but I am still intrigued to see how the glosso works for you, I might try it again someday...


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

chefboyrdee, i did have a few shrimps inside and like 2 panda cories, but ya i didn't have many fishes inside. The carpet filled in rather fast compared to my previous scape mainly because of the increased lighting. i think it took a month or few to grow in. I'm not completely sure if it is rotala arguaia or ammania sp. bonsai. They look fairly similar. Thanks for the comments 

ferris, thanks a lot for the comment. The scape before was actually HC. I've had luck with it in both of my previous scapes, but i find it a hassle to trim the HC every so often to keep the bottom part from decaying. That is the main reason why im trying glossos now. I've only set it up for 2 days, so its still getting accustomed to the tank. HC is a beautiful foreground, but i think glosso will be easier to maintain


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## Tex Gal (Nov 1, 2007)

kiwik said:


> chefboyrdee, i did have a few shrimps inside and like 2 panda cories, but ya i didn't have many fishes inside. The carpet filled in rather fast compared to my previous scape mainly because of the increased lighting. i think it took a month or few to grow in. I'm not completely sure if it is rotala arguaia or ammania sp. bonsai. They look fairly similar. Thanks for the comments
> 
> ferris, thanks a lot for the comment. The scape before was actually HC. I've had luck with it in both of my previous scapes, but i find it a hassle to trim the HC every so often to keep the bottom part from decaying. That is the main reason why im trying glossos now. I've only set it up for 2 days, so its still getting accustomed to the tank. HC is a beautiful foreground, but i think glosso will be easier to maintain


Looks like R. araguaia to me. The bonsai leaf looks rounder. The R. araguaia gets red on the top leaves in high light. 

SO... how long did it take you to plant all those little glosso plants......


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

haha, i was watching some chinese drama, so it took about....1.5 to 2 hours, which is pretty amazing because this is only a 10 gal  

planting glosso is even harder than planting HC  i wish i got another half bunch of glosso. I didn't get to fill all the areas that i wanted it to grow in. Guess it'll just have to take a little longer to fill in 

any opinions on what i should do with the areas behind the rocks? should i add a midground plant or just let the glosso and Blyxa grow in? i dont think i want something too tall. I'm also willing to swap out the blyxa if i get a good suggestion.


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## ferris89 (Jul 31, 2008)

well, I love the left side of the tank, behind the rocks, but maybe on the right side try something a little darker green in color, or maybe something with a rounder leaf, 
I dunno, just suggestions


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## ch3fb0yrdee (Jul 26, 2008)

You are gifted. I am so jealous of this tank. I currently have a 3 gal tank that ive been trying to get HC to grow in, but its hopeless. Darn Amano shrimps keep digging them up. I see bits floating around each day. I cant wait to get it to fill in like yours. Awesome work. 

*droll over HC carpet*


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## Tex Gal (Nov 1, 2007)

Maybe for a back corner or something Hygro sp bold... It's got a darker color and will play off the red lights your blxya will get if it's in higher light.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

ch3fb0yrdee, IME HC isn't very demanding. Just give adequate light and good substrate and it'll take off. I've also noticed that it isnt as sensitive to fert levels as most other plants are. GL with your HC.

Thanks for the suggestions Tex Gal and Ferris. I'll do a little research on Hygro sp. bold.


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## ch3fb0yrdee (Jul 26, 2008)

I have HC growing inside my 10 gal right now. I hope it takes off. I have really good light and good CO. Its an AS tank, so i hope i can get it to start growing.


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## kiwik (Apr 3, 2007)

sounds good. what ferts are you dosing and how much light are you giving it?


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