# Possible success over bba



## Olivia (May 5, 2006)

I posted a few weeks ago with a battle against bba on-going for about 2 years. I think I may have finally had a break through! I decided to try the Flourish Excel method and here it is, 2 weeks later and almost all the algae is gone! There is still a very thin layer on the driftwood but I am wondering if it is a different type as it is lighter green and much easier to remove than the bba was. I can handle that! My plants are doing fine and look so much nicer once the layer of bba went away.

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone on this board who offered their advice and support! 

Woo Hoo!
Olivia


----------



## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

Had the exact same experience. BBA plagued me for months despite having CO2 high enough to kill fish (removed all fish once they started gasping). But a x3 dose of excel really kicked its ass, and it hasn't come back even after i stopped dosing it. Been free for about 3 or 4 months now its great!! DDDDDDD


----------



## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

That's awesome to hear. The excel overdosing method does seem to work. 

I'm at the stage where all the algae is gone for the most part, and deciding whether or not to continue dosing. Maybe I'll do it for insurance, but it sounds like Zapins and others do it until its gone, and then it's gone for good. Great news to hear. 

-John N.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 18, 2005)

*???*

Would'nt this method hurt copper sensitive fish like puffers and and or shrimps, snails??? I am fighting this algae too, would like to try the excell method but do not want to risk my fish.


----------



## Fiki (Apr 16, 2006)

In the light of the above-mentioned, it would be highly appreciated if somebody could give me an advice regarding the recommended level of CO2 in water column, in order to have a success over BBA. Also, besides CO2 concentration, is there any other significant parameter that should be taken into consideration... 

Thank you in advance.
Fiki


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Fiki said:


> In the light of the above-mentioned, it would be highly appreciated if somebody could give me an advice regarding the recommended level of CO2 in water column, in order to have a success over BBA. Also, besides CO2 concentration, is there any other significant parameter that should be taken into consideration...
> 
> Thank you in advance.
> Fiki


It is very hard to know what the CO2 concentration we have is. What I see as 40 ppm may be seen by someone with different water as 60 ppm or 20 ppm. None of the methods I know of for measuring CO2 in the water is foolproof. All can be wrong - usually by overestimating the amount. The one way that always works, but leaves you without a number to quote, is to raise it gradually until your fish are having trouble living in the water, then reducing it until the fish are comfortable again. That amount, whatever it is, is ok for your tank, fish and water. And, if you keep it at that amount, not allowing it to drop on some days, the BBA should not restart once it is removed.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 18, 2005)

I do not know if this helps but try this site it has some useful info about algae,
C02 use to remove. I am going to try this myself, to leery to try the excel method because of the copper, my fish http://www.zen77408.zen.co.uk/plantedtank/algae.htm 
This is from the site" 
"Removal In a high light tank you will need to increase your levels of CO2. every time that BBA has grown, increasing CO2 will remove it. Increase levels slowly to 30ppm or more but watch the fish to see if they are gasping at the surface. If you have a low light tank without CO2 injection then not doing any water changes will help. This is because tap water has lots of CO2 dissolved in it which causes CO2 levels in your tank to fluctuate. The algae respond to this a lot quicker than the plants do. Siamese Algae Eaters are known to eat BBA so can be used to control this algae. I don't recommend doing this but some people overdose on Flourish Excel (3x dosing) and have had good results." http://www.zen77408.zen.co.uk/plantedtank/algae.htm



Fiki said:


> In the light of the above-mentioned, it would be highly appreciated if somebody could give me an advice regarding the recommended level of CO2 in water column, in order to have a success over BBA. Also, besides CO2 concentration, is there any other significant parameter that should be taken into consideration...
> 
> Thank you in advance.
> Fiki


----------



## Fiki (Apr 16, 2006)

Thanks for your prompt reply. Talking about Siamese Algae Eaters, I have never mentioned (BTW I have a dozen of them) that SAEs show any interests in eating this type of Algae, although a lot of aquarists on NET claim so... However, my level of dissolved CO2 is between 30-40 for a last few weeks as well as while ago, but I still do not see any advantage... What else could be a reason for appearance of BBA, having in mind that the CO2 level was constantly "high" in my tank.

Your opinion would be extremely appreciated.
Fiki


----------



## banderbe (Nov 17, 2005)

Same here. My tank had BBA, thread, fuzz, BGA, you name it.. started dosing Excel at around 5 times the recommended dosage for one month.. and after that month the algae was totally gone.

This gave my plants a chance to thrive and (no pun intended) flourish, and now I don't need excel because my plants are happy and doing whatever mysterious thing it is they do that keeps algae at bay.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 18, 2005)

Most algae info seems to point to an imbalance, which is a common occurrence in a delicate man made environment like an aquarium (over deeding, over fertilizing, slacking on WCs, Cross contamination form another infected plant or other object. Too me the whole thing is frustrating 
But my SAEs will eat the bba if I limit their food. Also heard several claims the flag fish will eat bba, thread algae as well " I have no experience with FF" 
I have raised my co2, slacked way back on feeding, I am in the process of altering my light intensity for different times of day instead of keeping it at a one constant level. One thing I have noticed with the higher co2, the bba has become easy to remove. I guess the method that works varies on what ever caused the algae in the first place. Again frustrating



Fiki said:


> Thanks for your prompt reply. Talking about Siamese Algae Eaters, I have never mentioned (BTW I have a dozen of them) that SAEs show any interests in eating this type of Algae, although a lot of aquarists on NET claim so... However, my level of dissolved CO2 is between 30-40 for a last few weeks as well as while ago, but I still do not see any advantage... What else could be a reason for appearance of BBA, having in mind that the CO2 level was constantly "high" in my tank.
> 
> Your opinion would be extremely appreciated.
> Fiki


----------



## Fiki (Apr 16, 2006)

First of all, want to thank you all for your efforts and advices. But have to say that I'm a bit confused. If I'm correct, BBA problem in planted tank should be solved (for good) by keeping CO2 for a "long" term at the constantly high level, which is approx. 30-40ppm (I've already had that). In light of that, my question would be, when is expected to see first signs that I'm successfully fighting a battle with BBA ? Few days, weeks, months... Or is more efficient to use some more radical measures such as bleach, H2O2 etc...

To be more specific, water chemistry in my tank is as follows: kH 3, pH 6.4, gH 8, light 2.4WPG (T5&T8), liquid ferts K2SO4, chelated complex of microelements, KNO3 and MgSO4x7H20. The tank is around 1 year old, water changes 25% weekly, external filtration 500GPH.
Three schools of Tetras, SAE, Otto's, Corries... All at all, not more than 100 little fishes.



In short, that would be quick description of my tank conditions...

Due to urgency of this mater, your suggestion are more than welcome.

Rgds.
Fiki


----------



## banderbe (Nov 17, 2005)

Fiki said:


> If I'm correct, BBA problem in planted tank should be solved (for good) by keeping CO2 for a "long" term at the constantly high level, which is approx. 30-40ppm (I've already had that).


I would say that keeping CO2 high (along with ensuring good levels of all other nutrients) will _prevent _BBA. It will not make it go away, at least it never has in my experience. When I had BBA, all the CO2 in the world did nothing. I had to treat my tank with Excel before I could get it to go away. Once it did, I could stop with the Excel and as long as my regime was in order and the plants were happy, all types of algae have been gone and stayed gone.



Fiki said:


> To be more specific, water chemistry in my tank is as follows: kH 3, pH 6.4, gH 8, light 2.4WPG (T5&T, liquid ferts K2SO4, chelated complex of microelements, KNO3 and MgSO4x7H20. The tank is around 1 year old, water changes 25% weekly, external filtration 500GPH.
> Three schools of Tetras, SAE, Otto's, Corries... All at all, not more than 100 little fishes.


One thing that appears to be missing is a PO4 source. Also, tell me more about your "chelated complex of microelements". Where do you get it? What's in it and in what amounts? If that information is not available I suggest getting another source for your micronutrients.


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 18, 2005)

I do not know if this will help you with your BBA (Black Beard Algae) problem.
They say high phosphate Nitrogen content in the water are said to encourage BBA growth, fish are great providers of N and P. I also read that constant swings in co2 along with an imbalance of nutrients create the perfect environment for BBA. I have also found claims that stagnant water flow can contribute to the growth of bba. A constant level of CO2 does make conditions unfavorable for bba. But the underlying factor that caused the bloom must be figured out to get rid of and prevent bba from coming back. That is were your nutrient levels come in to play. Have you manually remove any of your bba yet? What are your N&P readings?
Oh the pic of your tank is beautiful, I really hope you are able to get ride of your bba.



Fiki said:


> First of all, want to thank you all for your efforts and advices. But have to say that I'm a bit confused. If I'm correct, BBA problem in planted tank should be solved (for good) by keeping CO2 for a "long" term at the constantly high level, which is approx. 30-40ppm (I've already had that). In light of that, my question would be, when is expected to see first signs that I'm successfully fighting a battle with BBA ? Few days, weeks, months... Or is more efficient to use some more radical measures such as bleach, H2O2 etc...
> 
> To be more specific, water chemistry in my tank is as follows: kH 3, pH 6.4, gH 8, light 2.4WPG (T5&T8), liquid ferts K2SO4, chelated complex of microelements, KNO3 and MgSO4x7H20. The tank is around 1 year old, water changes 25% weekly, external filtration 500GPH.
> Three schools of Tetras, SAE, Otto's, Corries... All at all, not more than 100 little fishes.
> ...


----------



## banderbe (Nov 17, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> They say high phosphate Nitrogen content in the water are said to encourage BBA growth


They are wrong!


----------



## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

I agree with Barry: they're wrong on this point.

And yes, BBA will not disappear by itself even with good CO2 and fert levels; it will stop further growth and spread but the existing BBA still needs removal.

And in the fert dosing explained above, I also don't see a source of PO4.


----------



## |squee| (Feb 3, 2005)

I second that: BBA is only prevent by good CO2 levels. Algae once induced needs work to get rid of. You need to remove the present BBA because they are already established and are going to continue growing.


----------



## Skelley (Mar 4, 2006)

is it only bba that the excel workes so well on, or have you found it works on others well too? if i already have co2 injection in my tank will the excel be over kill on my fish or plants?


----------



## Maurici (May 31, 2004)

Hi,
The excel method is proved useful, there is no doubt, on BBA control but here I want to share my fears.
We know that algae boom is not gratuite and it necessary refer to a chemical disiquilibrium. Then we fight directly but not changing or correcting the origin of problem (often we have not investigate it enought). We win (bba go away). Is a victory or is only a selective war event like midle-east contemporany war method?
Can anybody contribute a re-invasion of this algae in a short time lapse?


----------



## [email protected] (Jul 18, 2005)

I think there is sufficient evidence for both sides are just listed as possible causes. Its kinda like the saying how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop? answer we may never know . I can honestly say for me my n& p readings were higher than they should be. After I got that in check and fed my lazy little fish less food they started to eat the algae (my sae's and my mollies mainly) and I removed some bba myself, I have noticed an improvement with higher co2 levels as well.( I am also trying different lighting variations) But I can see we all agree to an imbalance, and to the fact that no matter which method you choose to fight this nasty little algae, you must fix the underlying cause that started the bloom in the first place. Are posts are just helpful opinions, useful recounts from our own experiences. What may not work for you or me might work for some one else. I would like to know if some one in here has had experience with the excel method with some of the med sensitive fish like puffers and loaches, invertebrates like shrimp.


----------



## Fiki (Apr 16, 2006)

As I can see, Florish Excel is highly recommended by majority, in order to fix the problem with BBA. Does anybody know what it exactly contains, besides organic source of carbon obtained from simple organic compounds and iron reducing properties which promote the ferrous state of ferric iron (Fe+2) . Is there any other chemical compound that could be significant in getting rid of BBA?

Thank you all.
Fiki


----------



## Chris S (Feb 27, 2006)

This thread discussed active ingredients of flourish excel.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...my-post36497.html?highlight=active+ingredient


----------

