# Anyone Have Any Experience With These Home Mixed Substrates?



## Homer_Simpson (Apr 2, 2007)

This article references using Vermiculate mixed with Topsoil and layering that with sand. I have read mixed things about the use of any kind of garden soil including topsoil. Anyone ever experiment with this and if you did what did you find? Did water parameters stay within acceptable limits(especially nitrates)? Did the substrate fall apart after time and cloud the water? Did the fish/shrimp stay healthy or suffer? Did the plants grow well and continue to do so?
http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html
http://www.aquatic-gardeners.org/budget.html

How about Kitty Litter overlaid with 11/2" of sand. Dan S. Quackenbush swears by this.
http://www.malloftheworld.com/aquarium/part2.htm

Yes, I know it is just easier and cheaper to buy eco-complete or fluorite, but at $32 a bag VS $7 to mix your own, there is a huge savings to be had especially if you are on a tight budget.


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## darkfury18 (Apr 28, 2006)

I've tried Kitty litter without any problems, it's similar to Schultz aquatic soil/ Profile/ Fluorite but a really light gray color instead of the orangish color. The new one that I like right now is Oil-Dri from Walmart. I just redid my 50g with it for just about $5. The color is almost the same as Soilmaster Select Charcoal, a darker gray than the Kitty litter.


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## neonfish3 (Feb 12, 2004)

I have also used kitty litter with great success! Make sure you cap it well as it can become a mess if it gets to the surface. The kitty litter I used ( I think Hartz pH 7.0) did become mushy liquid clay when it got wet. As time went by (a couple years) it did end up on top a little from pulling plants, rescaping, fussing with the tank. 
If I used it again I would only use at most an inch on the bottom covered with at least 2" inches of top dressing.

I also go the "cheap" route on everything I can. My cheap substate of choice now is Shultz Clay Soil Conditioner which is the same as Profile, Turface, and Aquatic Plant Soil (from my understanding). I get the Shultz CSC at garden center for $12 for a 50# bag.
HTH
regards,


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## Homer_Simpson (Apr 2, 2007)

neonfish3 said:


> I have also used kitty litter with great success! Make sure you cap it well as it can become a mess if it gets to the surface. The kitty litter I used ( I think Hartz pH 7.0) did become mushy liquid clay when it got wet. As time went by (a couple years) it did end up on top a little from pulling plants, rescaping, fussing with the tank.
> If I used it again I would only use at most an inch on the bottom covered with at least 2" inches of top dressing.
> 
> I also go the "cheap" route on everything I can. My cheap substate of choice now is Shultz Clay Soil Conditioner which is the same as Profile, Turface, and Aquatic Plant Soil (from my understanding). I get the Shultz CSC at garden center for $12 for a 50# bag.
> ...


What do you use as the capping medium? Sand or gravel? and if you use sand, what kind? I have some Tahitian Moon Sand that I need to use up. Have you ever tried this as a cap and would you recommend it. Thanks and best regards.


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## neonfish3 (Feb 12, 2004)

I used playsand from Walmart. 
I think your TMS should work fine.


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## snickle (Apr 8, 2007)

I am useing small gravel mixed with Shultz aquatic plant soil. Very cheap. I was was to start over in my 90, I would use all the Shultz Aquatic Plant soil and then a thin layer of small gravel.


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## Homer_Simpson (Apr 2, 2007)

snickle said:


> I am useing small gravel mixed with Shultz aquatic plant soil. Very cheap. I was was to start over in my 90, I would use all the Shultz Aquatic Plant soil and then a thin layer of small gravel.


I tried introducing some aquatic plants into my 55 gallon tank. The anubias, and the Windelov java fern are doing well but the ambulia and regular java fern is not doing well. The ambulia appears stunted in growth and the regular java fern is not doing well and seems to just barely surviving. Since the lighting was adequate, I assumed it was the lack of fertilizer, so I added a weekly dosage of Fluorish Comprehensive. I did that for almost two months and the plants did not seem to improve. I then assumed that it was due to the substrate as I was using plain gravel(interestingly the Ambulia is doing excellent in my 20 gallon tank with plain gravel and minimal lighting - go figure), so I redid the substrate by mixing the existing gravel with a generous supply of Schultz Aquatic Soil. That was almost a month ago and it does not appear to have made any difference. I even dosed with fluorish excel but that made things worse, so I stopped. About the only thing left to try is C02 dosing. The only other thing I can think of is that the UV sterilizer filter in the 55 gallon may have something to do with the poor plant growth, but then you would think that all the plants would be equally effected and they aren't.


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## sprwoman1 (Jun 18, 2007)

I tried a soil/vermiculate mix at a depth of 1 - 1 1/2 inches under 1 inch of Tahiti moon sand, in a 20gT started in Jan of 07. Personally, if I had it to do over I would do it differently. 
I am still getting gas release from newly submerged soil. Which is pushing soil pockets up under the sand.
Tahiti moon sand seems (at least at the depth I used) to be too light/fine particles to sufficiently weight the soil down. 
Kneed you vermiculate very well! I added more to the mix that was not kneaded in well enough to make the mixture the consistacy I wanted. Now when it dose get above the sand it looks horrible. I tried sucking the vermiculate out with the siphon, it's too heavy. Tried picking the bigger pieces out, takes forever. Tried pushing it back into the gravel with little success. It shows up very well with the Tahiti moon sand, along with all the feces.
When uprooting plants do so very slowly to minimize the stir up effect. 
That's all the problems I can think of right now that I have encountered.


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## sprwoman1 (Jun 18, 2007)

Another thing about the Tahiti moon sand, some places say it dose not affect PH, and some places say it raises it. In my tanks, the one with the Tahiti moon sand has an even higher PH than all the others (except when I was doing DIY co2 of course).


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