# new rummy nose tetras



## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

'golden' rummy nose[still no name for this hybrid]

thought you guys might like this... indonesian breeder came up with these stunning guys... nippy like the common rummies so please excuse the blurry photo










stan


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

Wow, I've never heard of them before. Interesting. It sort of looks like they don't have as much tail striping like the regular ones do, and they look a little chubbier... Funky yellow "hat" they have too. LOL!

Thanks for sharing.


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## trenac (Jul 16, 2004)

Nice looking fish... _Are these as sensitive as the originals?_


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

these are mature adults...cute huh...they really stand out in a green tank! hint hint...

some of them still have the striping but faint...and some what we call 'peppering' in pigeon blood discus.

i'm not sure if they are line bred or mutated like pigeon blood discus but they are nice...
:flame:

they are very new... the ones here a like sample specimens...as to their hardiness...not sure...

gonna get a few for my three footer!


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

I'm going to take the other side of the argument. I really wish people would leave nature alone. I love angelfish but 99.9% of what is sold in stores doesn't look a thing like a real angelfish. I love rams - same arguement. I guess what I dislike about the "fancy" goldfish varieties is that they are so far removed from anything existing in nature. If you look at what has happened in the last 20 years there have been an enormous number of previously unknown species that are now routinely available to the hobby. The incredible variety that exists in nature is good enough for me.

When it comes to 'new varieties' I stick to this: Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. What was wrong with the rummy's that we had? In a few years this mutation will have mixed into breeding stock around the world, diluting what we used to have.


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## JaySilverman (Jun 19, 2005)

I dunno. I'm quite fond of selective breeding. We aren't exacly messing with nature. We aren't gene spliting here. Not only does it make the gene pool stronger, these mutant speciments are usually much stronger then their original form. More colourful too! Also we aren't exacly throwing them back into nature. They stay in the relitively small fish keeping hobby.


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## bensaf (Jun 20, 2005)

My own beef about these variants is simply that most simply don't compare to the natural varieties. So, why bother ? 

Living in Indonesia I've seen these guys in the flesh. Personally I thought they were yukky. Nowhere close to being as beautiful as normal rummies. The beige coloring looks quite uneven and pathcy, the tail marking were there but very faded. I personally thought they were quite sickly looking (although their behaviour was quite normal). I wouldn't touch them with a ten foot barge pole purely for aesthetic reasons rather then ethical. But that's just my taste, if someone else likes 'em , fine.


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## h4n (Dec 23, 2005)

ya, i actully got some reg rummy noses the other day, and those "golden" rummy noses look ok. But like bensaf said, they're missing there beautiful black/white tails.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

JaySilverman said:


> I dunno. I'm quite fond of selective breeding. We aren't exacly messing with nature. We aren't gene spliting here. Not only does it make the gene pool stronger, these mutant speciments are usually much stronger then their original form. More colourful too! Also we aren't exacly throwing them back into nature. They stay in the relitively small fish keeping hobby.


Much stronger than the originals? Not true. Possibly, perhaps, slight chance that a few hybrids are easier to keep than wild stock, but the vast majority of mutations and other "improvements" created by selective breeding result in sickly fish with shorter life spans, abnormal behavior, and problems with spawining. Ignore the fact that they'd never last a minute in the wild. Also, there IS plenty of genetic modification going on. The "electric pink" or glo-fish (or 100 other names) zebra danio is one example. Natural selection in nature is perfectly capable of maintaining a healthy gene pool without our messing with it.

Check this out:

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_2/cav2i3/glofish/Glofish.htm

Also:

http://www.glofish.com

Sorry to hijack the thread.


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

wow,

so many upset people... just a little line breeding guys or whatever. like discus mutations when bred in farms...phew

i'd understand if it were like balloon rams.. sigh

btw it's pretty much a personal taste and this is also a good thing in my opinion. too many people hungry for wilds till they are almost extinct. L46 Betta macrostomas, P altums, S discus etc... plants included.

stay cool guys..


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

rummies have been around forever...and forever it wouldn't hurt to see a good looking line bred one.


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## Gumby (Aug 1, 2005)

As far as the debate goes for these fish being introduced to the wild and breeding with wild stock to introduce crazy mutant light colored freaks, think about why the fish look the way they do in the first place. Their coloring has enabled them to escape predation. 

I read that article about the glofish. It's just incredibly retarded that California banned them out of fear that they would be released into the wild and start breeding crazy mutant glowing fish. 

Number one, the fish aren't native there in the first place; therefore there is no local population for them to interbreed with in order to create mutant fish. Number two, THEY'RE FRICKIN FLOURESCENT ORANGE! They would be the #1 target for predators, they stick out like a sore thumb. I'd give a GloFish 2 days max before it is eaten in the wild. 


I'm not all gungho about genetically modified/selectivly bred fish either. I just hate when people make arguments (or laws!) out of ignorance. I personally HATE what they've done to goldfish. Bubble Eye Goldfish are probably the biggest abomination to selective breeding in existance. Not only do the animals look hideous, their natural functions are impeeded. They can't swim properly, don't live nearly as long as regular GF do, and have a boatload of genetics related diseases. 

I'm also not a fan of a lot of the albino or novelty strains they've isolated from wild populations. That's purely asthetic though. If these fish were reintroduced back into the wild in their natural habitat, they'd be the first to go due to their flashy colors.


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

good point but...

what we're doing is already weird. keeping plants and fish in an glass gilded cage. so let's not be so worked up over some selectively bred fish even if we're not too hot about it. these fish here are of no immediate threat to the world's environment. they're not piranhas or snakeheads and i agree those glow fish most likely won't not survive very long if thrown into a pond where you live. eace:

i totally agree on letting nature takes it's course of course but when you breed something, nature/luck surprises you with some new beautiful mutants[happens in nature all the time too]. don't they deserve to live as well? what gives?...survival of some aq bred species also depends a lot on it's beauty/uniqueness. if nobody liked it wouldn't survive very long would it?

the opposite is worse if we were not allowed to breed it for the hobby and everything are collected from the wild...that's unthinkable.

the discussion somehow has become weird IMO...
if you wanna be called a purist[biotope only-wilds only] then the other camp can say you're an environment destroyer? Our money fuels the trade in raping the land and water.[i'm as guilty, i don't think they have driftwood farms!]

I agree that getting it to look cute/unique by stunting, mutating, over hybridizing for the sake of getting a new mutt or deforming it's growth is heinous. luohan, blood parrots, balloons etc. there's something about the cold blooded business minds that irks me...

btw, i love my golden albino discus...gorgeous...nothing deformed or handicapped about them...just don't inbreed to f2. they're as strong if not stronger than wilds in they're own way. they can tolerate chlorine... all the toxic stuff in the municipal water. 
i won't be dumping them into the local pond...promise! 
nor the golden rummies...[smilie=l:


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## Gumby (Aug 1, 2005)

My Responses are in bold:



standoyo said:


> good point but...
> i totally agree on letting nature takes it's course of course but when you breed something, nature/luck surprises you with some new beautiful mutants[happens in nature all the time too]. don't they deserve to live as well?
> 
> *Sure they do. I wasn't really arguing against that. I acknowledge that weird mutants occur in nature, I've seen them my self (when catfish spawn in the spring I always spot a few albinos in the shoal). I was really just trying to make the point that the mutants that stand out will be picked off(natural selection). *
> ...


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

Well, this thread has gone completely down a tangent. Sorry for bringing up the 'ethical' issue. I'm not opposed to other people keeping weird things (to a reasonable point). I am opposed to fish manipulation that results in inferior specimens (the whole goldfish thing).

My whole argument is that the wild-type fish frequently becomes unavailable. I'd really like to keep wild-type discus, wild-type angels, and wild-type rams. Selective breeding has gone to the point of making these fish almost impossible to find. There is no lifeguard patroling the gene pool.


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## Gumby (Aug 1, 2005)

I'll be lifeguard for the gene pool if the pay is good 

Back on topic: These new rummy nose. I don't know what to think about them. When I see them (in photos, at least), they remind me of the gold white clouds. Same shade of gold, it seems. I personally am not a fan of the gold white clouds, I like the regular better. I think it'd be the same with the rummy nose. I'll let you know when they make it to the US 

I'd also miss that flag tail, thats one of my favorite things about them.


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## bensaf (Jun 20, 2005)

And trying to keep it on track...



> rummies have been around forever...and forever it wouldn't hurt to see a good looking line bred one.


This is my problem. I just don't think they are good looking

And so many of these new variants are the same. I've seen hybrid Rainbows, Praecox and Turqouise, that didn't have the irredescent blue of the Praecox and the stripes were far more faded then on a Turqouise. So it's really got nothing much from either fish. It really is a case where the total is way less then the sum of the parts.

So many are like that, Angels with random black splotches just can't compare to the simple grace and beauty of a natural looking Angel with teh strong vertical stripes.

White Clouds are lovely colorful little fish, why on earth would I want to buy one where the color has been bred out ? 

I find all the multi colored livebearers tacky and overdone.

Momma Nature would make a great fashion designer, nobody can beat her for color co-ordination and matching the markings. She knows how to use stripes 

So really I just find these rummies pale and dull compared to the regular rummies.

But then I don't even like long finned varieties of fish.

I always equate it to dogs. Some folks like fluffy yappy poodles, I'm more of a labrador kind of guy. If you like poodles good for you.

Now if they do come up with a rummie that looks better then the "natural" I'll be the first one down the store with cash in my sweaty palms and drool hanging from my lips :clap2:


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

you guys really got me on my soap box there! over a few crummy rummies!



it's good to see everybody's taste differs and how different it is...
not selling these fellas but rather wanted to get a reaction. [whew what a reaction!]

:flame:


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

Yup. That's what's fun about a public fourm


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## JerseyScape (Nov 18, 2005)

I kind of like them and don't mind when people start messing with genetics. After all, half of the most popular fish would not be around if it was not for genetic mutations. ie. Guppies, swordtails, mollies, goldfish, angelfish, etc etc. Sure, they would have these fish but they wouldn't be as colorful and might have boring shapes. If no new fish would come out this hobby would get stagnant really fast....maybe most of you don't agree with mutations but ALOT of regular community fish keepers seem to buy them. It's sort of like being a car enthusiast and you only got to play with the same ones over and over. Wouldn't you love it when new cars would come out?  

I guess everybody has their own opinion, this is why the world is a wonderful place.  

Heck, I'm seriously considering getting 3 different variations of Endlers and just letting them go at it to see what comes out in a year or two. I probably won't do it though since supposedly mine are a wild strain from Venezuela. I can always dream though 


Jersey


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

Funny, I happened to see these at Aquarium Adventure in New York last week. My first reaction was to get them and let them school with my regular rummies, but when I looked closer at them they really had very little constrast between the tail, body and nose colors that the regular rummies had, although they look better in your pic than they did in the store where I saw them, but they probably hadn't "reddned up yet" at the LFS.

BTW - The regular rummes were selling for $3.99 and the hybrids for $3.49.


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## standoyo (Aug 25, 2005)

we have it good here in some ways...rummies cost like a quarter or less dependin g on qty...RM1.00 ~USD25c. these golden rummies are like RM0.80.


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## hoplo (May 14, 2007)

standoyo said:


> we have it good here in some ways...rummies cost like a quarter or less dependin g on qty...RM1.00 ~USD25c. these golden rummies are like RM0.80.


Same situation here down south. Regular rummies have plunged from SGD1/pc to 50cents/pc to 3 for a dollar at the LFS. One large LFS even sells them at $15 for 100pcs. Enen then, golden rummies are hard to come by. Means they are shipped out, somewhere where people love them.


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## Chuppy (Aug 5, 2007)

Rummies!!!
-Yes that was random-
Drew


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