# First 'El Natural' tank questions



## JessJesting (Jun 30, 2013)

Hello all! 

I have an empty 20 gallon long tank I am going to make into a planted tank. I've decided I want to use dirt as substrate (miracle gro organic choice) with a sand cap. I want it to be heavily planted eventually. It will also be a cool water tank (probably making it into a newt tank once it's up and established). 

First question! What kind of sand should I use as a cap? I've already decided I don't want to buy the expensive aquarium sand since I'm trying to do this on a budget. I've been doing lots of research on this and it seems it comes down to play sand or pool filter sand. I'm worried about the roughness of pool filter sand since it will eventually be a newt tank. And with the play sand I'm worried about compaction. I've read about people just swirling the sand around to avoid compaction and others say it can compact in minutes. I personally do not have any experience with sand so I'm looking for people's experienced opinion! So play sand or pool filter sand?

Second question! I'm a DIYer and I was wanting to try making a filter with a water bottle, an air pump, tubing and media. Would this be sufficient in the 20g long tank? It will be heavily planted non CO2 so basically I'm looking for something for keep the water flowing around a bit. So theoretically this should work, right? 

Third!! Plants!! What kind of plants would work well in a low to medium light cold water situation? Temps around 60 degrees but could drop down pretty low during winter months. I already have Anubias Nana, java fern growing in my betta tank. I know the fern would work ok but what else are you all thinking??

Thank you all for reading my novel of a post! Any and all input much appreciated!! Thanks!


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## Tattooedfool83 (Jul 7, 2013)

Pool filter sand all the way. I have had it in a tank with cories and loaches and its not to rough on them at all. They just sift it around like crazy. As far as plants go with low light fast growing stems wisteria, Val's, ludwigia repens. I'm aetting up a dirt tank as well currently and from what I've read and watches its beat with dirt tanks to plant what you want at the beginning as moving plants with dirt gets tricky.


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## atc84 (May 18, 2013)

Welcome to APC! check out as many threads you like, they all have great info 

personally, i would get any plants you want or can find. If you have unlimited choices, like the internet, look for low light bundles, a lot of people do that. I would stay away from foreground carpeting plants until your tank is more established.

What lighting are you using?

I use playsand, and in order for my substrate to get aerated i have to get MTS. Pool Filter Sand is better, its not rough.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

Jess, welcome to APC!

"I want it to be heavily planted eventually." Really, you want it to be heavily planted right from the beginning. This is was gives Walstad tanks their stability.

Sand seems to work best if it is not too deep. I would try to keep it no more than 1". Either Quickcrete or Sacrete makes a "multi-purpose" sand that is sold at Home Depot. It is not as fine as play sand and has a mix of particle sizes that looks good to me. It is not rough.

Kaldness media works well in the kind of filter you want to build, and there is a lot of evidence that it is very effective.

There are lots of plants native to southern North America that would do well in a cool temperature tank. Go to the Plant Finder, under Region pick North America from the menu and click go. You will get a list of mostly easy plants. Of course there are lots of others, but that will give you a start.


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## Skizhx (Oct 12, 2010)

> Hello all!
> 
> I have an empty 20 gallon long tank I am going to make into a planted tank. I've decided I want to use dirt as substrate (miracle gro organic choice) with a sand cap. I want it to be heavily planted eventually. It will also be a cool water tank (probably making it into a newt tank once it's up and established).
> As Michael already said, you want it to be densely planted from the beginning. This is very important, as it's a crucial step to making this work.
> ...


Some of this is based on my own personal opinions and preferences. Everyone has personal preferences and reasoning.

My method produces results that are consistent and predictable for me. Your results may vary, and I certainly haven't explained every aspect of what I do, the reality is that I can't, because aquariums become very personal, and the reality is that we're dealing with some very complex biological relationships and balances. After awhile I find most people develop 'trademarks' in their methods and maintenance which impact things a little more than they may realize, so experimentation is highly encouraged. Work with the overarching principals and refine them into your own approach, and don't get flustered if things don't appear to match your ideal vision perfectly.

Keep in mind that anything anyone tells you is likely just what they do or what they think, and often there are other components to their styles that are likely to be overlooked, or simply too complicated to fully describe. Pay attention to broad-sweeping advice like "start plant-heavy", and use experience to work out the finer details of things for yourself (like filtration).


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## JessJesting (Jun 30, 2013)

Awesome guys thanks for the info and quick responses!! And thanks for the welcome! I came over from the Betta forums. Okay I know the home depot carries the quikrete stuff. That's actually what I was looking at. =) glad to know that the pfs isn't too rough that's what I was worried about. Do you happen to remember the brand name? I heard that play sand is very messy, how'd it work for you atc? I was wanted to stay away from the snails because I was afraid the newties would just eat them lol. 

Ok so plant heavy right off. Got it =) I will look for a low light package for plants, sounds perfect, maybe someone on here could help me out with that. As far as lighting goes I haven't got anything yet. Just to clarify what would be 'low light' for a 20g long? I was just gonna use screw in cfls. I was thinking about 2 20w lights? Still learning in the lighting department...

On an off note I love these forums. Definitely my go to for answers. Everyone is so helpful without having to be mean! Thanks so much for being so awesome!

Edit: As far as the miracle gro goes I have sifted through it until it was very fine. I plan on doing a wet dry cycle. (Filling the bucket with water and letting it settle then dry in the sun repeat) I chose it because I have heard a lot of people use it with great success. If it doesn't work ill just tear it down and try again. I'm a stay at home mom I have plenty of time on my hands lol. This is just my little project/experiment. I like to try different things and see how they work with the advice of all you experts of course.


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## corsair75 (Dec 21, 2011)

Play sand is messy, but cleaning it is fairly simple. Put the sand in a bucket outside, run water into it and just let it spill over for a while. This will wash off the light 'floaters' and dust, leaving the heavy sand behind. That works for most anything too fine for a strainer.

Another good source of substrate is blasting sand. If you call around to materials stores in your area (i.e. a landscaping supply place), you will probably find it. It comes in many grades, sugar fine to coarse and is priced similarly to play sand with a more pleasing appearance. I use it in my marine tank and have been very happy with it. Look for the brown sand, black is coal slag (bad). My place also sells aragonite sand for about a third of what the pet store wants for it, but that will buffer your water to a higher pH. You can also get bigger stone there. Holey rock, lava, river rock, anything people might use outside. I got about 400lbs of rock for my lizard vivarium for about $60.

Water movement is something that you will heavy discussion of around APC. I tend to favor very high water flow and little or no bio-filtration, but that's assuming heavy planting. This is a technique that works well for me. Incidentally, if newts are what you are looking at, are you planning on a lower water level? You get several more plant options when they allowed to emerge from the water.


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## atc84 (May 18, 2013)

I did something similar to corsair, but what i ended up with was a much heavier version of the straight from the package playsand that people complain with. However i didn't like the color it was, because under my lighting it would look basically white, which doesn't seem very natural. I mixed a 50 50 or so of playsand and the blasting sand he is talking about. The blasting sand i believe has a lot of silica in it, which caused some algae problems in my tank i believe. 

aquabid.com has a subsection under plants called bundles, which is where people have extra plants laying around, and pile in together plants they have. Ebay has some bundles, aquaticjungles.com has some pricier, but good bundles. The cheapest route would probably be the people on this forum. Theirs an area in the forum for people selling stuff, which can also be found on other fish forums. 

Diana suggests minimal water movement, basically a powerhead, something with a low amount of surface movement. I kinda forgot about this, and so i have a powerful HOB and powerhead on mine, but that only makes your tank more protected from ammonia because of the extra biofiltration. 

Low light tends to be under 2 watts per gallon, 1.5 is pretty minimal. Many people think watts per gallon is outdated, and PAR rating is more useful. I'm not an expert on PAR, but theres some things you can guesstimate, like the reflectors, distance from tank, depth of tank, bulb, etc. btw, make sure to get a light with the right light spectrum, 6500 or 6700 are ideal. You can always have extra light, more light isn't going to hurt low light plants, they will only grow faster. You will be able to get algae easier though.

Do you have a test kit? Those are basically essential for a NPT.

-Andrew


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## JessJesting (Jun 30, 2013)

I have the API master test kit for my other tanks. Should I get the Gh and Kh test kit as well? I decided to go with quikrete all purpose sand medium grain. Im pretty sure its the same as what Michael had suggested. It's not as fine grain as the playsand but I liked the look of it better. It looks more natural. I actually found someone locally selling me a whole bundle of plants for a great deal. She's throwing in FloraMax substrate for free. I haven't decided if I'm going to use it or not, I have little knowledge of this particular substrate. Anyone use it before? I'm setting up the 10g with the plants and I got a 25w cfl. I'm hoping this will be enough but if not Ill just use it for a lamp and get a more powerful light. 

Thanks again! =)


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## atc84 (May 18, 2013)

thats the sand i wouldve used if they hadnt run out.  Thats awesome you got some locally, that way they probably have the same water parameters, and they will always have more for you, haha. floramax substrate? never hear of it. Try googling it, see what people say about it


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## JessJesting (Jun 30, 2013)

Alright so I decided to just use the FloraMax to see what happens lol. The plant package I got included some java moss, dwarf sag, crypt wendtii and undulatas and willisii, ludwigia repens, and an aponogeton. Good amounts of all of them! The lady threw in 5 otos and 3 cory habrosus for free! I absolutely love the little cories! I have never had any before and they have such big personalities! I am now on the search for a few more! So far the closest LFS doesn't carry any but there are a few more to search in neighboring cities! I really feel like I got a great deal from the lady! I am so happy with my plants and the little fishies are such a great addition!

Anyways lol anyone got any advice on the plants I have?


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