# Why is rimless so expensive?



## zeek

Why do rimless aquariums cost 3X their rimmed counterparts? The prices remain 3X even if the rimmed brotheren have the "euro style lip" rather than the center braces!

Is the manufacturing that much different? Are the edges of the glass cut at 45 degrees instead of 90? If I had acrylic cut and I made a rimless tank, with the euro lip, what would I need to do differently than my store-bought Oceanic 120gal?


Isaac


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## turtlehead

rimless tanks use glass that is thicker so it wont crack.


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## gnatster

Rimless tanks have glass that is usually beveled and polished, increasing labor and cost. They also are engineered differently as the rim adds support again increasing cost. With the increased cost comes a smaller market creating fewer tanks to amortize the engineering costs over. 

Also consider this, the tank builders possibly perceive the consumer for a rimless tank is willing to pay more. 

One other point, in the US none of the major builders are constructing rimless tanks at this time. That leaves the market to a smaller specialty builder that does not enjoy the same ability to purchase glass in volume. That will increase costs. The smaller builder is more of an artesian then the assembly line process the majors use, again increasing costs. 

Lastly I think you will find the quality of the some of the smaller tank builders to be superior then the mass marketers.


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## John P.

Clearforlife brand (AdvanceAquaTanks) makes them:
http://clearforlife.com/images/vgdiamondedge3.jpg
(here with overflow)
http://clearforlife.com/vgdiamondedge.html


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## turtlehead

do you know where I can purchase a simple ada like glass tank in the US?


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## Gomer

Also consider that Rimmed tanks are built assembly line style where everything has jigs all make up and all the little details calculated. Custom tanks have lots of new variables.


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## IUnknown

http://www.glasscages.com/
http://www.aquariumobsessed.com/


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## gpodio

turtlehead said:


> do you know where I can purchase a simple ada like glass tank in the US?


Without the rim... yes some of the above links may help. With the same level of craftmanship and invisible silicon bead.... not that I know of.

I wonder how many people would participate in a group purchase from Europe of such tanks?

Giancarlo


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## TWood

I think Jeff Senske (Aquarium Design Group) said he has convinced Oceanic to make rimless tanks, you might want to ask in his forum.

TW


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## pineapple

Giancarlo,

I would consider doing so - but my final decision would be price dependent. I just asked for and received quotes from aquariumobsessed.com for the following:

Starphire glass on all sides, no bracing, no rims:
36 x 18 x 18 = USD400.00
24 x 16 x 16 = USD200.00

Plus shipping which amounts to about USD150-250 per tank delivered to NYC.

Greg's aquarium seems to be nice quality. The prices seem fairly good. My guess is that it all comes down to shipping.

As for Oceanic, Jeff did say they would make them custom and the order would have to come via a LFS to Oceanic. There is no way I would order via a NYC LFS for something like that. The communication channel is far to indirect.

Andrew Cribb


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## John P.

Interesting that Hagan Canada imports rimless 
http://www.hagen.com/canada/english/aquatic/sub_category_psubtype.cfm?CAT=1&SUBCAT=103&PSUBCAT=10301


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## Rob G

gpodio said:


> I wonder how many people would participate in a group purchase from Europe of such tanks?
> 
> Giancarlo


I am interested in investigating the possibilities of such a group purchase. How many people would it take to make such a thing economically feasible?


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## gnatster

Thinking out loud...

Wonder what Aq Obsessed would cjarge for a run of similiar tanks. There should be a some discount in volume.


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## Rob G

gnatster said:


> Thinking out loud...
> 
> Wonder what Aq Obsessed would cjarge for a run of similiar tanks. There should be a some discount in volume.


That's a good idea. Does anyone here have a good contact over there?


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## IUnknown

My tank was $250 and $150 to ship (about the same). You have to put Styrofoam underneath or it voids the warranty. I received the tank with a couple minor scratches. I flipped the tank and the bigger one is on the back (right in the middle). At first I was happy just to get the tank in one piece, but with how everyone responded to how much I paid for the tank, I started to get upset that I could go down to petco and get a 20 for $40 and not have any scratches on it. Will offered to send a new one at no charge, I just had to pay the $150 shipping. I worked it out with him so that when I get my 75 gallon ($800) down the road, I wouldn't have to pay for shipping.


















> As Tony (Gomer) said, the price of the rimless aquarium is only the start. Given an elegant aquarium, one needs an elegant lighting system too. One needs to plan for that too.


And a ADA styles stand,
http://www.aquascapingjournals.com/journals/cabinet.htm
Haven't found a place to build it though, got a quote of $150 but the guy never got back to me.


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## chubasco

I would use black tape or something to cover up the white styrofoam. The rimless tank
look is starting to grow on me. Nice setup!

Bill Ruyle


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## John P.

Greg, with some minor changes my stand design would look mighty nice with your tank.

I plan to go rimless, open-top soon. My acrylic is gettng on my nerves. Anyhow ...


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## Gomer

What was the problem with your Acrylic John?


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## John P.

Hey Tony, 

The top braces bow, probably because of heat, weight, or a combo thereof. 

I also made the mistake of using a Kent ProScraper on it after hearing positive things from other acrylic owners. I put 3 or 4 nice scratches right on the front. I'll probably lower the water level & try to buff them out at some point. Back to acrylic-safe pads I go.


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## Raul-7

That's weird. My post just disappeared. 

But I'll ask again. Andrew, why would you need/want starphire on all sides. Aren't you only viewing the tank from three? And IUknown how much did it cost for your 20? And the size?


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## gnatster

> That's weird. My post just disappeared.


APC had a small hiccup during a server move and some posts were lost. Sorry for the troubles


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## pineapple

No kidding, I lost a post as well. I think you (server admin) could at least give some forewarning. I will get round to posting again shortly. Sigh.

Andrew Cribb


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## IUnknown

Raul the size was 24"x13"x16"


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## pineapple

The _devil in the details_ is the price of shipping. It's impossible to consolidate shipping, unless you order via a club with one delivery point from which members collect their order. Maybe Will at aquariumobsessed.com would be willing to give APC members a better price. It might be worth asking. I wonder how many people would be interested in making an order and what size/type aquariums they would prefer. As far as I know, there is no quoted price list at aquariumobsessed.com. It is a custom shop.

I like the idea of a 4-sided Starphire aquarium because that gives the option of turning it around, if need be. My personal preference is not to colour the back panel. In the office, I might keep an aquarium in a more central location for viewing on both sides.

In NYC we have cabinet makers who can produce good quality well-finished birch plywood-based units for aquariums. Depending on the size and design required, the price would be anything from USD300-600. I am pretty sure you could get such cabinets made locally anywhere in the USA if you know how to specify what you require.

I usually support aquariums with flat rubber 1-2mm matting between the rim/glass and the cabinet or shelf.

Andrew Cribb


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## gpodio

pineapple said:


> Giancarlo,
> 
> I would consider doing so - but my final decision would be price dependent. I just asked for and received quotes from aquariumobsessed.com for the following:
> 
> Starphire glass on all sides, no bracing, no rims:
> 36 x 18 x 18 = USD400.00
> 24 x 16 x 16 = USD200.00
> 
> Plus shipping which amounts to about USD150-250 per tank delivered to NYC.
> 
> Greg's aquarium seems to be nice quality. The prices seem fairly good. My guess is that it all comes down to shipping.
> 
> As for Oceanic, Jeff did say they would make them custom and the order would have to come via a LFS to Oceanic. There is no way I would order via a NYC LFS for something like that. The communication channel is far to indirect.
> 
> Andrew Cribb


I've seen rimless custom tanks from various sources here in the US, unfortunately none of them showed the same skill in running a silicon bead as the ADA tanks. All the ones I've seen had the same sloppy run of silicon that I get with my cheaper AGA tanks. For photography reasons, I care more about the silicon seal than the rim itself... If it weren't for the seal I'd make my own rimless tanks, anyone who has had to re-seal a tank knows how easy it can be if you have a little help to support the pieces of glass.

I have started to investigate prices, the tanks themselves are not that expensive, however only quantity will make shipping worth it. We'd also have to risk loss of warranty and possible breakage during shipping. The minimum I can see as being economically viable is from a half container upwards. Meaning somewhere like 50+ tanks. If I get it all together I will see if I can get a NY-PA LFS to go in on the order to make it cheaper for all. Once I get an idea of total price I'll know if it's worth it or not...

Giancarlo


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## Raul-7

Glasscages has very cheap prices on shipping. Tom told me he could ship it to me for something like $50-$90(I can't remember the price), though of course his tanks can't be compared to aquariumobsessed but I was told they are similar to AGA quality.

BTW, does anyone know if he hooked up his glass polisher yet?


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