# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Reactor 1000 and water pump compatibility



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

I have a Reactor 1000 CO2 reactor that I want to set up on a tank, with the waterpump below it by about 3 1/2 to 4 feet. The reactor is rated for a pump with a capacity of 250 gallons per hour, and I've been considering a Mag Drive 250 that does 250 gph and a Quiet One (Lifeguard) that's rated at 268 gph. I'm a little insecure about the correct gph of these pumps at a distance below the reactor and some water pumping ability that would be lost by that head room. Can anyone help me with this?


----------



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

I have a Reactor 1000 CO2 reactor that I want to set up on a tank, with the waterpump below it by about 3 1/2 to 4 feet. The reactor is rated for a pump with a capacity of 250 gallons per hour, and I've been considering a Mag Drive 250 that does 250 gph and a Quiet One (Lifeguard) that's rated at 268 gph. I'm a little insecure about the correct gph of these pumps at a distance below the reactor and some water pumping ability that would be lost by that head room. Can anyone help me with this?


----------



## imported_Nathan (Feb 17, 2004)

Mag Drive 2 @ 4' ~125GPH
Mag Drive 3 @ 4' ~270GPH
Quiet One 800 @ 4' ~50GPH
Quiet One 1200 @ 4' ~200GPH

When you figure in frictional losses, the Mag Drive 3 looks to be sufficient. It would be my choice in the situation.

And then again, I could be completely wrong,

gnatster

[This message was edited by Nathan on Wed March 10 2004 at 11:51 PM.]


----------



## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Sounds good to me.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Rate My Tank!!

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))*


----------



## bharada (Apr 17, 2004)

For people running external reactor separate from their filters, is using a pump better than a powerhead? I'm trying to weigh the tradeoffs for each (pump: takes up cabinet space and possible noise level vs. powerhead: takes up tank space and possible flow rate issues).

Thanks.

Bill


----------



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

Those were major considerations that I've been making. But a power head in the tank is something I really want to avoid so I've been leaning toward the dedicated water pump. When I posted the question, I thought I'd have to mount the reactor on the side of the aquarium and that would have been about 3 to 4 feet above the water pump, but I see that I do have the necessary room available in the cabinet under the tank for a neat installation. 

I decided against using one of the Eheim 2217 canisters to "drive" the reactor because I'm concerned that the flow is lessened as the filter builds up the bio-filter after a cleaning, and that would lessen the flow rate of the 2217, (which is rated at 265 gph) down to significantly less than the 250 gallons per hour I need for the Reactor 1000. 

As for noise, I've used Mag Drives and they are dead silent. There's one rated at specifically 250 gph, so that's the one I'm leaning toward. There'll be hardly any headroom between the Mag Drive 250 pump and the reactor so the 250 should be perfect for the Reactor 1000. I hope this analysis isn't flawed.


----------



## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Rule of thumb is to remove all hardware possible from the inside of the tank. 
In that the external powerhead is the best solution.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Rate My Tank!!

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))*


----------



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

Thanks for the responses...James, maybe you can clear up one thing for me...Do you know if I'd lose any flow rate down from the 250 gph Mag Drive 250 by having it on the bottom of the cabinet under the tank and with the reactor being mounted just above it for a good, close fit? If there is any flow rate loss due to the water pump being about four feet or so below the tank's water lever, I'd have to reconsider the Mag Drive 250 and get a water pump with a higher flow rating. THANKS...and, your tank is REALLY fine...really!


----------



## bharada (Apr 17, 2004)

Avi,
According to Nathan's post above, the 250's flow rate is down to 125gph with a 4' head (meaning that the pump is 4' lower than the highest point of the output tube).

My 40 gal tank on its stand would be about 4.5' higher than the pump (a 4.5' head) so I'm opting to buy the Mag 3/350 instead (270gph @ 4').

Bill

[This message was edited by bharada on Fri March 12 2004 at 08:45 PM.]


----------



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

I guess Nathan's remark that he could be completely wrong didn't instill much confidence...Sorry, Nathan! I was also a bit unclear about the question of "headroom" given the fact that the reactor would be just about directly connected to the water pump...I wondered if that meant there was no "head" since there'll be no significant distance between them. I was under the impression that the "headroom" would be 4 feet IF the water pump was on the bottom of the cabinet and the reactor was on the side of the rim of the tank at it's surface. I have a book about all that but, man, it's so confusing that if I see another equasion, I'll take up collecting stamps after all these years of fish keeping. I think you...and Nathan...are right, that I'd be better off just getting the Mag 3.


----------



## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Always go with the bigger pump







. Its easier to throttle it back or put a spraybar on it than to get another one.

As for the head on the pump...its the distance from the pump to the highest vertical point. Then add alittle for any applicances you may out on it. where the reator is in the design does not affect this value. I would plan on a six foot head.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Rate My Tank!!

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))*


----------



## imported_Nathan (Feb 17, 2004)

I'm sorry my tag line left so many questions. I usually use "And then again, I could be completely wrong" when I post on the Formula One mail-list. The quote is attributable to Murry Walker, the now retired British F1 commentator who sometimes would let his enthusiasm get the better of him.

In general, when you see a pump rating it is listed in Static Head @ 0 feet. Some manufacturers will also give a value for x # of feet along with the 0-foot measurement. The problem inherent with a unit at x feet is one is generally not privy to the pipe construction. PVC has differing frictional losses then copper or iron pipe, not saying that these are viable for our use. Increasing the dia. of the effluent pipe lowers frictional losses. Given all other parameters are equal, a pump with a ¾" output line mated to a 1" delivery pipe, will flow more liquid at a lower frictional loss then the exact same setup using ¾" pipe.

The measurement you are looking for is from the centerline of the pump shaft to the highest point the pipe will reach before discharge. For ease of figuring and the fact that we do not need 6-9's accuracy here I'll take some liberties with the math. The frictional losses for 5' of 1/2 " pipe flowing 120 GPH is 0.21 feet, at 300GPH it jumps to a whopping 1.17 feet. The reactor has losses but they are not readily available and I frankly don't feel like doing the math, and I have no figures of losses from bioballs. For ease of figuring I'm going to say 4' of ½" pipe with the reactor will have a Dynamic Head (see below for definition) of 5'. The position of the reactor in the return line is of no consequence in this case. Given the published specs of ~270GPH @ 4' and ~210GPH @ 5' for the Mag 3, that would be the pump I would use from your list.

That said, and my penchant for over engineering, the Mag 5 will flow ~250GPH @ 5', of the Mag line that would be my choice.

One should also take into account the long term fixed costs. Again a simple model; a 100W light bulb uses 1 unit of energy (KW Hour) in 10 hours. The Mag 3 is rated at 35W, the 5 at 45W. Electric costs in my area run $0.09 KWHr, all inclusive (taxes, fees, etc). Assuming, again for ease of figuring, 10 hours per day of use, the Mag 5 would add 0.45 KWHR's per day, 13.5 KWHr per avg. month, $1.21 a month, the Mag 3 $0.95.

Static Head: The vertical distance from the water level to the point of free discharge of the water. Measured when the pump is not operating.

Dynamic Head: The vertical distance from the center of the pump to the point of free discharge of the water. Pipe friction is included.

We don't need no steenkin' tags lines,

gnatster

[This message was edited by Nathan on Sat March 13 2004 at 11:25 AM.]


----------



## Avi (Apr 7, 2004)

Gentlemen, you guys are terrific!! I'm finally getting to the point where I believe I comfortably get all this sufficiently to go ahead and setup the reactor. And, I won't have to resort to stamp collecting, which I don't like anyway. I even happen to have a spare Mag 5 - which I thought would be too powerful - that I can use, so I don't have to go to the expense of buying a water pump.

I *really appreciate* your help on this.


----------

