# [Wet Thumb Forum]-O2 and Algae



## IUnknown (Feb 24, 2004)

Good thread going on the aquatic plant mailing list
http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/month.200303/index.html
just incase anyones missed it, Tom Barr talks about O2 and algae. I think brigit mentioned one time that that is probably why Amano uses ricca in a lot of his setups.


> quote:
> 
> This is getting very interesting. It's like having your own
> researcher right in your living room. While I am a layman when it comes to
> ...


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## IUnknown (Feb 24, 2004)

Good thread going on the aquatic plant mailing list
http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/month.200303/index.html
just incase anyones missed it, Tom Barr talks about O2 and algae. I think brigit mentioned one time that that is probably why Amano uses ricca in a lot of his setups.


> quote:
> 
> This is getting very interesting. It's like having your own
> researcher right in your living room. While I am a layman when it comes to
> ...


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## plantbrains (Mar 11, 2003)

You cannot trust that Tom Barr








Regards, 
The real Tom Barr


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## kor4ever (Mar 22, 2003)

In regards to O2 and Algae, a O2 reactor would cause surface agitation and increased loss of CO2. So my question is, would increase O2 saturation during the night time also aid in elimination of algae or is the O2 saturation more critical during the daytime.

Felix


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## Guest (Mar 31, 2003)

No, O2 and CO2 are independent. If you try to increase O2 by aeration alone, then you will never get above 100% saturation levels and drive off CO2. O2 reactor function as a close chamber, not exposed to the air. 

If you use an O2 reactor, then you treat it like the CO2, you add pure CO2 or O2 in this case, into a chamber to dissolve fully then return to the tank. This way you can have 150% O2 and 500% CO2 levels or whatever levels above amibent you want.

This is what happens in our tanks that have good healthy plant growth during a fair amount of day and evening hours. 

You would need two reactors, one for CO2 and the other for O2. Gas tank for CO2 and the other for O2.

The only difference here would be that the O2 comes from a controlled system vs the by product of plant production.

The utility in this would be that one could say that the O2 levels produced by the plants and not some plant chemical etc, or other confounding factor causes the decline in algae growth. 

O2 levels of 200-500% have been measured and these levels kill off everything in natural systems after a fierce algal bloom. Then everything dies and rots and the bacteria consume all the O2 and then you get the reverse, anaerobic conditions which algae seem to like and they start growing right a way.

And another cycle begins......but if the levels are maintained at a somewhat moderate high level, this seems to cause a decrease in algae growth in most species.



Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## Madpiano (Feb 4, 2003)

Elodea is supposed to be a fast growing oxygenator ? Would that work ?

I have figured out how to do DIY CO2, but how would I produce DIY O2 ???









Greetings
Mad


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## Guest (Apr 7, 2003)

Ergeria is good for this. Any fast grower works like narrow leaf water sprite. It always pearled like mad. 

DIY O2 is done with the plants, so you grow those and get plenty of O2. Best method out there. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## wetmanNY (Feb 1, 2003)

Daniel Larssen, that's a long list of posts. Can you give us the running title of this interesting thread?

I note that elevated oxygen levels are seen to depress _cyanobacteria_ --as is well known, even to me. "Drop your water level and let the filter outlet play more directly on your cyanobacteria" is familiar advice.

Could the leap to algae be made because cyanobacteria are colloquially still sometimes called "blue-green _algae"_?

Most organisms are sensitive to their own metabolic wastes. Oxygen is a metabolic waste of cyanobacteria. Eukaryotic cells, such as algae, have evolved anti-oxidants to deal with this toxic by-product.

Cyanobacteria cannot be compared to algae. They can be compared to the _chloroplasts_ of algae, however. Anti-oxidants "mop up" intracellular O2 that would damage chloroplasts...

Tom Barr is much better up on this kind of stuff than I am...


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## defdac (May 10, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Most organisms are sensitive to their own metabolic wastes. Oxygen is a metabolic waste of cyanobacteria. Eukaryotic cells, such as algae, have evolved anti-oxidants to deal with this toxic by-product.


This would implicate a really big advantage for plants over algae because the plants constantly use oxygen in their respiration?
But what does plants metabolic wastes consists of? O2 is for sure a byproduct of the photosynthesis - but it can't be regarded as waste because they actually use oxygen both in the photorespiration and at night in the dark respiration phase?

[email protected]_, www.akvarie.net [email protected]_,


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## wetmanNY (Feb 1, 2003)

Cellular respiration of all the photosynthetic eukaryotes is not dissimilar. But in well-oxygenated water, eukaryotes-- such as plants and algae-- have advantages over prokaryotes like cyanobacteria. Anti-oxidants for one thing.

That's why O2 is a useful weapon against cyanobacteria-- and other bacteria too, as you're aware-- but doesn't degrade plants, except at quite high levels. For O2 to be destructive to plants, you'd need to use a lot of some oxidizer like potassium permanganate or hydrogen peroxide


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## BobAlston (Jan 23, 2004)

Yo Tom Barr -

Didn't I see a post from you some time back that you were going to do a test of high O2 in an aquarium and were just waiting for a pressure canister to arrive? 

Results???

Bob


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## wetmanNY (Feb 1, 2003)

Would there be a difference between O2 bubbled out of a canister and O2 oxidized from KMnO4? What would be novel about O2 diffused from a canister?
No manganese oxides precipitating out. Anything else?


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## Guest (Apr 30, 2003)

Yes, the project starts in a couple of weeks.

I'll post more here and there.

Using strong oxidizers(Bleach, H2O2, permangnate etc) vs using O2 itself can be somewhat misleading and also one would have to drip it in, much like adding H2CO3 into a tank to make CO2. PITA.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## IUnknown (Feb 24, 2004)

Has anyone played with this,
http://www.oxydator.de/oxydate3.htm
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?siteid=6&pCatId=4513
Maybe this will get popular if the project favors oxygen.


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