# Co2 question



## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

I am looking for answers from people who own 125 gal aquariums and larger. What type of diffuser are you using? Can you get your Co2 up to 30ppm with it?
I am having troubles getting my Co2 past 8ppm, and its even running with lights out. I dont use air stones and have a canister filter, I also have a rio 600 lightly stirring the surface of the water to stop the scum layer from showing up. Any info would be greatley appreciated and I thankyou in advance.


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## eklikewhoa (Jul 24, 2006)

What method of diffusion are you using?


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

aquamedic 1000, but I dont think I have enough pressure behind it to mix the Co2, so I ditched that and am using a homemade diffuser, gravel cleaner with power head attached and media inside to stir around Co2, looks as though it works awesome but I ran it over night with a lot of co2 going into the tank, tested it, and got 8ppm? what is wrong?


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

Is it because my water is liquid rock out of the tap? will Co2 dissolve more readlily into RO water, I have a RO unit but have not set it up yet.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

It probably does have a lot to do with your hard water.
I struggle to keep my levels up in my 55 too, using the power reactor from ?? (I'm drawing a blank right now). I can get it up to acceptable levels by keeping the flow rate at around 3 or 4 bps, though.

For some reason, the tanks with the Eco-complete for substrate are much easier to keep at the right levels, so it may be that the substrate in the 55 gallon has something in it that really buffers. I got it with the tank, so I don't know what kind it is for sure.

What kind of substrate and rocks to you have in the tank? 

The powerhead is also something that will be contributing to your lower levels. 
A scum layer shouldn't be normal, so I also wonder what is causing that?


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

Thanks Jan, I have regular gravel in my tank, the scum, which I poorly described, is just a white hazy film that will appear on the surface if there is no water movement, a little water movement, and tada gone.


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## oblongshrimp (Aug 8, 2006)

I use 2 of the redsea CO2 reactors

http://www.bigalsonline.com/BigAlsUS/ctl3684/cp18478/si1431660/cl0/redseaco2reactor500wpump

they work GREAT and I have a 120 gal tank.


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

oblongshrimp do you use RO water? and can you get your Co2 up to 30ppm?


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## vic46 (Oct 20, 2006)

In line diffuser by Gomer on this board. I use this diffuser on a 125g and it works very well. I have installed it on the return line of an xP3. The bubble count is simply a visual of the rate and cannot be used to guage the CO2 level in the tank. Get a drop checker. Red Sea has one for about $8USD.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/attachment.php?attachmentid=471&d=1099597504


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

vic46 said:


> In line diffuser by Gomer on this board. I use this diffuser on a 125g and it works very well. I have installed it on the return line of an xP3. The bubble count is simply a visual of the rate and cannot be used to guage the CO2 level in the tank. Get a drop checker. Red Sea has one for about $8USD.
> 
> http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/attachment.php?attachmentid=471&d=1099597504


I have a drop checker and the aquamedic 1000 is the exact same thing as gomers inline reactor and I have not been able to get past 8ppm, the aquamedic 1000 is also hooked up to a Xp3, I only stated that the bubbles were going really fast because I was intentionally trying to use more co2 than needed.


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## vic46 (Oct 20, 2006)

Gibmaker:
Do you have anything in the tank that is causing surface disturbance, like an air stone , HOB, etc.? CO2 does not dissolve easily in water and any surface disturbance will foster off gassing of the CO2. I am not familiar with the diffuser you are using however, you have indicated that it is similar to Gomer's. Gomer's is designed so that the the water and CO2 inflow are at the top (vertically highest) end of the diffuser and the pump pressure forces the water "down" the differ to the return line to the tank. Is this the same with the diffuser that you are using? If you are using the xP3 jet type apparatus on the return in the tank, this may also foster off gassing. I use the xP3 spray bar with no flow reduction. Is your tank close to empty. CO2 is stored in a liquid form and once the tank gets low, the liquid becomes a gas and regulation of delivery goes to H... in a handcart. I would suggest that you have a look at Rex Grigg's dissertation on CO2 on this forum. You may glean some further information toward resolution of your difficulty.
Vic


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

vic46 said:


> Gibmaker:
> Do you have anything in the tank that is causing surface disturbance, like an air stone , HOB, etc.? CO2 does not dissolve easily in water and any surface disturbance will foster off gassing of the CO2. I am not familiar with the diffuser you are using however, you have indicated that it is similar to Gomer's. Gomer's is designed so that the the water and CO2 inflow are at the top (vertically highest) end of the diffuser and the pump pressure forces the water "down" the differ to the return line to the tank. Is this the same with the diffuser that you are using? If you are using the xP3 jet type apparatus on the return in the tank, this may also foster off gassing. I use the xP3 spray bar with no flow reduction. Is your tank close to empty. CO2 is stored in a liquid form and once the tank gets low, the liquid becomes a gas and regulation of delivery goes to H... in a handcart. I would suggest that you have a look at Rex Grigg's dissertation on CO2 on this forum. You may glean some further information toward resolution of your difficulty.
> Vic


The aquamedic 1000 is exactly like gomers diy model in every way, I do have a rio 600 just barely stirring the surface, no HOB's and no airstones. The tank is close to full so thats not an issue either. I am going to read through Rexx Griggs sight, the only thing I can think of is the small amount of surface turbulance and really really really hard water?


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

I read through his site, didnt tell me anything I didnt allready know.


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## kaaikop (Mar 22, 2005)

I split my CO2 in two Aquamedic 1000, one on each filter output (eheim 2128 ), coming out at each end of the tank. works fine.
Got an aquaclear 70 powerhead for better circulation.
Co2 shuts down at night, replaced by airpump. 
Regardless... I am still an algae farmer, LOL


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

gibmaker said:


> aquamedic 1000, but I dont think I have enough pressure behind it to mix the Co2, so I ditched that and am using a homemade diffuser, gravel cleaner with power head attached and media inside to stir around Co2, looks as though it works awesome but I ran it over night with a lot of co2 going into the tank, tested it, and got 8ppm? what is wrong?


What do you mean you don't have enough pressure? Are you using pressurized or mix?


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

gibmaker said:


> ...
> I am having troubles getting my Co2 past 8ppm, and its even running with lights out. ....


8ppm is a pretty exact figure; how do you know you're at 8ppm?


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

Laith said:


> 8ppm is a pretty exact figure; how do you know you're at 8ppm?


a drop checker


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

houseofcards said:


> What do you mean you don't have enough pressure? Are you using pressurized or mix?


pressure from the Xp3 because it says in the manual that you need it to sit a minimum of 24" below the water surface. My tank is 24" tall and on cinder blocks, the Xp3 sits a couple of inches higher than the bottom of my tank, I think this is causing a reduced flow rate, Co2 is not diffusing well. I use pressurized.


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## simpsota (Mar 11, 2006)

Are you using tank water or a 4KH standard solution in your drop checker?

Various substances in tank water can effect the reading so you'll get more accuracy by using a KH standard in the drop checker.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

gibmaker said:


> pressure from the Xp3 because it says in the manual that you need it to sit a minimum of 24" below the water surface. My tank is 24" tall and on cinder blocks, the Xp3 sits a couple of inches higher than the bottom of my tank, I think this is causing a reduced flow rate, Co2 is not diffusing well. I use pressurized.


I'm not seeing where that should be a problem. Have you tried running the 
co2 into the tank directly with a limewood airstone. At least you can "see" exactly what's making it to the tank. That's one reason I prefer the diffusor method over the reactor method. You can physically see what's going on in the tank.


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

houseofcards said:


> I'm not seeing where that should be a problem. Have you tried running the
> co2 into the tank directly with a limewood airstone. At least you can "see" exactly what's making it to the tank. That's one reason I prefer the diffusor method over the reactor method. You can physically see what's going on in the tank.


If you have a canister filter lift it up over the top of your tank and watch the flow rate reduce, same cocept as a gravel cleaner. It is making it work harder to circulate water.


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

simpsota said:


> Are you using tank water or a 4KH standard solution in your drop checker?
> 
> Various substances in tank water can effect the reading so you'll get more accuracy by using a KH standard in the drop checker.


could you please explain more, sorry I dont know how to go about doing that.....jeeze you made me feel dumb j/k


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

gibmaker said:


> could you please explain more, sorry I dont know how to go about doing that.....jeeze you made me feel dumb j/k


do you mean using tank water and then changing the KH before you test it?


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

The basic idea of the KH reference solution drop checker is to get away from the skewed readings one gets from aquarium water due to everything that's in it.

Here's a thread with more detail:

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...aquarium-projects/32100-diy-drop-checker.html


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

gibmaker said:


> If you have a canister filter lift it up over the top of your tank and watch the flow rate reduce, same cocept as a gravel cleaner. It is making it work harder to circulate water.


Maybe it's me, but if you run co2 from a pressurized cylinder directly into the tank there would be less flow than running it even through the weakest of filters. You control the BPS so where would the co2 go unless it's being aerated out.


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

houseofcards said:


> Maybe it's me, but if you run co2 from a pressurized cylinder directly into the tank there would be less flow than running it even through the weakest of filters. You control the BPS so where would the co2 go unless it's being aerated out.


I am sorry I dont fully understand what you are getting at.


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## simpsota (Mar 11, 2006)

Laith said:


> The basic idea of the KH reference solution drop checker is to get away from the skewed readings one gets from aquarium water due to everything that's in it.
> 
> Here's a thread with more detail:
> 
> http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...aquarium-projects/32100-diy-drop-checker.html


Yes, this is exactly it. If you use aquarium water in the drop checker rather than a solution of known KH, you can't be sure that the color change (which actually corresponds to the pH inside the checker) corresponds to the CO2 concentration you want.

All those pretty charts and tables and calculators out there will show you that a KH of 4 and pH of 6.8 indicate you have 30ppm of CO2 which is a common target these days.

If you're not interested in making a 4KH standard yourself, Bill is offering it for sale (at a very reasonable price) over on the Barr Report (Tom Barr's web page) in the trades, sales, and swaps thread.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

Bill is also a member here. His user name is billionz. If you do a search for him, you will find that he also has a thread that has directions to make the reference solution yourself.


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## gibmaker (Jan 3, 2007)

Thanks everyone for the info it is greatly appreciated!


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## simpsota (Mar 11, 2006)

Here's where to go for KH standards.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/for-sale-or-trade/37080-kh-standards.html#post284871


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