# Cladophora aegagropila (Moss Balls / Marimo Balls)



## onemyndseye

Ok...whats the story with this plant? Most sources say that its undemanding of light and CO2 however mine are looking abit sickly...

They are a paler green than they were when I got them and have started looking alittle brown.... Now the brown color could just be from them being in a New Tank with a new peice of driftwood but I dunno...

Just wanted to see what you guys here thought....

Thanks,
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## schaadrak

I think they prefer cooler temps, like around 65-70ºF. At least that's the impression I got when I was researching them.


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## Lawrence Lee

There are the real ones, (marimo balls are protected I think) and there are the fake ones, which are a wad of Cladophora algae rolled together to form a ball.

To check, soak in water till puffed up, then try to peel the little knobs or bumps on the ball. If it comes undone, you have the "common LFS variety".

My "imitation marimo ball" grows in a lowtech, high temp tank with all the wrong water conditions. It's putting out plantlets onto the rock and wood. pH: 6.8, dGH: exceeding 20, temp: 30 C, Heavy fish load, 1.2 WPG

I find mine grows best in heavily fertilised (NO3 greater than 15ppm) water. It is important to move it around, and at water change, wring out the dirt within like you would a sponge.


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## onemyndseye

I'll have to check again, but that doesnt SOUND like mine - the ones I have seem rather more solid....or rather whole. I do try to move 'em around when I think about it.

".... (NO3 greater than 15ppm)...."
This could be it - they WERE in my shrimp tank which has pretty low nutrients. I have moved them to a fry tank thats probably not much higher... so I'll have to think about this one.


"....dGH: exceeding 20 ...."

that may be the deciding factor... my water is pretty soft. I'll try adding some of Greg's GH builder to that tank and see if they respond. 


Thanks,
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## Lawrence Lee

I use Seachem Equilibrium when changing water. It has the added potassium for additional kick.


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## onemyndseye

Yeah... from what I've read the 2 are almost the same except for the potassium... 

It will also be interesting to see if these guys respond to the cooler temps comming.... since my tanks are unheated they will run slightly cooler in the winter (only slightly as my indoor temp is pretty well regulated)...probably 5 degrees cooler..maybe 

Take Care,
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## onemyndseye

schaadrak -

Your quote threw me off there for a minute .... I said to myself "Hey..thats sounds familiar..!??..... OH YEAH!" DOH!


LOL - Man I'm a brainchild sometimes


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## Robert Hudson

> There are the real ones, (marimo balls are protected I think) and there are the fake ones, which are a wad of Cladophora algae rolled together to form a ball.


I hear people saying that every once in a while, but I have never seen any evidence that is true. These balls are protected in Japan in a lake there, but that is not the only place they are native to. They are found in Iceland of all places and in eastern europe. Most of the balls being sold in the trade are being imported into this country from eastern Europe or from Oriental Aquarium in Singapore. They are just as real as the protected ones in Japan.

If you allow sedimant to build up on the balls, the balls will get chocked. It is good to every so often remove the balls from the aquarium, hold them under running cold water and squeeze then like a sponge, which cleans them. Also rolling them in the palm of your hand will help them to keep their round shape. Other types of algae can even grow on these algae balls, and that is not good for them either. In the cold mountain lakes where they are from, they keep their round shape from waves rolling them back and forth on the lake bottom.

They grow extremely slow under any condtions. A softball size ball is estimated to be over 20 years old.


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## Lawrence Lee

Robert Hudson said:


> They grow extremely slow under any condtions. A softball size ball is estimated to be over 20 years old.


That's what I read off the web too. But not in my experience. I've had 1 marimo ball in one of my tanks for 6 months and now I have 1 Cladophora covered driftwood. Perhaps they grow slowly in a ball shape, but they spread rather quickly on wood.

Some months back, as I was wringing out my ball, I noticed that it is not quite the ball it appears to be. I carefully unravelled it and found that it is actually a mat of cladophora, rolled into a ball.

I tore off a 1cm diameter piece from the ball that is had not rolled in nicely. Put it in another tank, and now cladophora is also seen growing onto the rock in this tank. (All my other tanks are free of cladophora). I believe it is the same cladophora as the marimo ball but had settled onto growing on driftwood and rock, When pieces tear off the wood, they get tumbled around and is eventually rolled into a ball, I surmise.

If I remember correctly, there's an Oliver Knott who used cladophora to do one of his 'scapes. If it grows so slowly, it'll be impossible for him to create the scape, or for that matter, for Oriental to grow enough to sell.

So for clarity, I say the store bought marimo balls are also true cladophora, but cladophora that are peeled off the wood it is growing and rolled to form the ball, as opposed to the naturally formed algae balls found on some lakes. The true/false differentiation I made in my earlier post is to differentiate between naturally formed balls and man assisted formation of balls


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## schaadrak

What about recreating wave action with a powerhead and a hydor flow nozzle. Maybe they need a constant movement like that to expose all sides to the light keep them healthier.

Also, how is sediment kept out of them in the wild? Is no sediment present in the lakes, or are there people that walk around squeezing all the marimo balls they find?


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## Robert Hudson

You made it sound like there were two different species and someone was being deciteful by selling a fake marimo ball. Its just not the case. It doesn't matter if they are rolled by hand or not, it is the same specie.

Oliver has done a lot of things, he started the whole HC craze here, but I do not remember seeing him ever using Cladophora. Tony Gomez or somebody I remember used algae growing on branches of wood in an aquascape, but it was not flat algae balls. It was just algae he grew in his tank by accident. Maybe Oliver has done that. Cool if he has.



> unravelled it and found that it is actually a mat of cladophora, rolled into a ball


So? That doesn't mean anything.



> What about recreating wave action with a powerhead and a hydor flow nozzle. Maybe they need a constant movement like that to expose all sides to the light keep them healthier.
> 
> Also, how is sediment kept out of them in the wild? Is no sediment present in the lakes, or are there people that walk around squeezing all the marimo balls they find?


That would be pretty hard to re create. You want balls rolling around in your tank? I don't think the fish would like that! 

In a lake they get sedimant on them, but the waves moving them around and help to prevent it from building up a thick layer that blocks light and C02. Same problem with any plant. If you allow crud to build up on the leaves it becomes a haven for algae to grow on it and the plant is not able to absorb light as easily.

If you want to flatten out a algae ball and grow it that way, then fine. I am not saying there is anything wrong with that. To me it kinda defeats the whole reason for having it. It is the ball that makes it so unique and gives it that oddity appeal, but just because you are able to unroll it doesn't mean what you have is not the real thing.

Here is what Kasselmann says in her book Aquarium Plants

"Lately, large numbers of lake balls of Cladophora aegagrophila from Romania and Russia with diameters of 13 cm have shown up in pet ships"

"...inhabits the bottoms of lakes as flat pillows or floating balls. ...the balls roll back and forth and in this way ar illuminated equally on all sides"


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## menschenjaeger

I was going to post a thread asking about these things, but this thread looks just fine...

First off, there are many species of _Cladophora_ out there, yes? I suspect that the few cases of clado blooms in an aquarium after adding a mariomo ball are simply coincidence. The marimo-owner could have been hoodwinked, as well, but _C. aegagrophila_ just isn't weedy enough to become a problem in a tank - so if they got what they paid for, then it's not what's causing a problem in the tank. I say this knowing that some of us couldn't get certain types of plants to grow if our lives depended on it while the rankest of amateurs might be able to grow the same plant like a weed. Luck is a factor. Maybe the clado-bloom guys are just...er..."lucky."

I was hoping to find more info on growing "marimo" balls in a rapid fashion. My searches have turned up references to them being faster growing under "certain conditions" and even to them growing better with some sea-salt in the water (it seems that _C. aegagrophila_ is a plant that would prefer some salt, but has been "stranded" in these lakes?), and I was hoping someone here could get more specific.


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## J-P

Can I revive this thread? I've had mine for about 3 months now and it is steadily getting worse. It is almost totally brown now. I dose with excel and potassium.

I am going to try the rinse thing BUT I am on a water conditioner, so I have a feeling I should bipass that.

Everything else in the tank is doing fairly well.

Comments and suggestions are always welcome.


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## NayR:D

This is so wierd haha. I was just cleaning my 2g when i noticed abit of build up on my marrimo balls so i took them out and squeezed them and noticed the bit that was flat on the floor of the tank is now a hole not rotting but a finger hole lol. And i was going to make a thread about them asking whats going on with them.

From reading the posts above seems this subject got abit heated lol i no zero about these balls other than its seems evident that in my npt all other plants are fine and the marrimo although very green arnt very round and have developed a hole and my sisters 'normal' tank with no dosing low light and gravel base there doing great!! Lol maybe they are not very good and getting nutrition before other plants sap it up?


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## J-P

I could place them near a power head ... as for sediment.. I would assume they are shallow water?

Never seen one in its natural state 

Oddly enough, I picked it up and found that the underside was still slightly green.


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## NayR:D

From what ive read i belive i have a moss rolled ball haha. Also sounds like it grows rather quick flat, there is very little free ground space in my little 2g maybe i could unfold it and carpet it on a net? Sounds abit offkey to me. 

If u had a power hed to blow it around surely it would roll away with the flow and then be at the other end of the tank, and breadcrumbs or not i dont think itll find its own way back


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## J-P

haha yes I agree.. it did roll away but I placed so that it has current and is fairly secure. I just hope my balls aren't dead


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## NayR:D

Haha! The one in the picture is looking pretty poor :t i looked on a website and there claiming the balls roll on there own accord to go to stronger light.... Ive never seen my move but they are tucked in with alot of plants and rocks, ill ask my sister soon and see if hers moves around her tank.

Do you dose your tank high or low light? Many other plants? Im nor claiming to solve anything with this info but compare it to my lighting ect we could maybe work it out.


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## J-P

I am in fairly low light with many other plants (a 3 month old system). Most of the plants are not mature enough to divide as of yet. Also of key note: I was medicating a fish so was doing high and frequent water changes and at the moment I have LOTS of brown algae.


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## NayR:D

Ive got 5watts in a 2gallon lol so i supose im med light, quite heavily planted with some floating water sprite, no algae though did you medicate the fish some medicine isnt good for plants, id say remove the ball and clean it lol hope for the best.....

I could proberly solve the worlds problems......but just wouldnt want the fame haha  
Other than my amazing(ly garbadge) input try and get in contact with who you bort it from?


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## Newbie1

Hi, I bought some Marimo (Cladophora) Moss Balls from aqauticmoss.co.uk I love them, I used them as decor and I have popped some in my filter to use as Media. Perfect!!


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