# What's wrong with my java fern (pictures)?



## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

Hi all,

after being a long time forum-lurker, I think it's time for me to come out of the closet and start asking some questions  .
Right now I'm experimenting with my small 7g tank, so I can learn how to grow plants.
For the first 4-5 months this went fairly well:








As you can see there is nice growth on the java fern, with lots of little 'baby-plants'.

Now, a few months later (7-8, months from startup) things aren't looking that great anymore:








About 1/3 of the java fern has melted away (brow spots->holes->leaves death), the leaves show strange growing patterns (not straight) and there is algea on heavy-lit leaves.
The rest of the plants are doing fairly well, exept for some algea on the hc
(I replanted it last week, i think it became too thick).

Some parameters:
No3: 12.5 (test kit calibrated)
po4: 0 (always 0 with jbl and sera test kits)
kh: 6
kg: 10
ph: 6.4 (digital)
co2: dunno, i don't trust the kh/ph chart (it says 70 for me) but the fish aren't gasping, i'm using pressurised.
light: 11w pc color 840 (i can use 2x11w, but it burns the plants).

dosing (small tank):
0.7 ppm of seachem potassium 2x weekly
0.5 ml micro's 2xweekly 
0.5 ml excel every day and 3ml during wather change (been slacking on this one)
0.3 ppm of seachem phosphorus 2x weekly
1.2 ppm of seachem nitrogen 2x weekly (tap water already contains 12.5 ppm).

There must be something wrong, but i can't detect it.
Some theory's of my own:
1. My test kits are really bogus and i'm dosing too much po4 and too little no3 (i calibrated the no3 test kit)
2. I'm dosing too little micro's
3. There is something wrong with ca/mg (I don't have acces to ca/mg test kits)
4. combination of above

Any suggestions?

Thanks, Andreas


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## titan97 (Feb 14, 2005)

Another indicator to what your problem may be is what kind of algae do you have. Green spots indicate low PO4, staghorn indicates low CO2 and/or high micros, etc. 

-Dustin


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## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

*algea...*

Well, first i tought it was gsa, but i have none on the glass (only on the plants and filter) and i can kindof rub it off the leaves (not all of it).
When I scrape some off with my fingernail, it's like a dark-green gunk (not really smelly tho), so secondly i was thinking of some sort of bga, but i think that would indicate that i have 2 faulty test kits (jbl and sera), because they show zero po4.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Try using the EI method for fertilizing. You need to dose about:
20 ppm of NO3 per week
3-4 ppm of PO4 per week
So, you are not dosing nearly enough of those two basic fertilizers, and the plants are starving. Don't try to finesse the fertilizing by testing and adjusting the amounts dosed. Just do weekly 50% water changes to get rid of whatever excesses you have.

Light will not "burn the plants", and for a 7 gallon tank with pressurized CO2 and full fertilizing schedule you would do better to have 30 or so watts, so turn the other 11 watt bulb on. The Java Ferns don't need it, but the other plants probably do, especially that low ground cover in front.


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## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

Yeah, I know it sounds logical to use the two lamps instead of one.
I used to use them both, so the plants would pearl right after lights on.
The plants would grow fast, but looked very 'skinny', very thin (hard to describe), and i got a bad case of hair algea. Probably just another fert problem.

Another, maybe more important problem with the lights is the location of the tank: it sits right into the middle of our tv-corner and with two lights on it looks very bright and not so pleasing.
So i turned one light off and tried to go for slower growth.

As for the ferts, seachem recommends not to dose as much as you would do with pmdd ferts, so i guess i could dose some more nitrogen, because i'm realy not that comfortable with dosing more phosphorus (right now i'm dosing 5x the recommended).
Do you think i need to dose more micro's too?


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I don't know if you are dosing enough micros or not, since I'm not familiar with the recommended doses for flourish. Another thing you could try is to increase your CO2 bubble rate a bit. You can raise it a bit, watch the tank carefully for a few days to be sure the fish aren't in trouble, then repeat until either the algae problem gets better or the fish start to show problems. That way you find out just how high you can safely go with the CO2. If you decide to stick with the single light, you probably don't want to dose as much as I suggested - those numbers are for high light tanks.


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## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

As for the micro's, i'm using profito, it's a fertilizer from a dutch manufacturer.
Currently, i'm dosing 1/2 of what they recommend.
I don't think i'm going to change that.
As for no3 and po4, I will be dosing some more no3 and less po4, totaly ignoring the readings of my test kits (fingers crossed).
I also repositioned the outflow of the filter, so i have less surface agitation(more co2?).


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## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

An observation: the plants who are directly positioned in the output stream of the filter, are growing better (they pearl faster).
Maybe I should experminent with this!


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

It could be nutrient deficiencies. But java fern leaves also start to die off and go blackish just like you described as they age.

So some of what you are seeing might be due to the age of the individual leaves themselves.


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## Andre002 (May 6, 2006)

OK, another quick update,

I neglected the tank for about 3 weeks (vacation), only fishfood went in.
The plants look much better now!? Strange indeed...
Maybe I don't have enough light for the amount of fertilizers I was throwing in.


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