# It's smothering everything...



## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

Okay, here's a puzzler for all you algae experts. I apologize for not having a picture, but let's just say it's pretty bad. The algae appears to have properties similar to cyanobacteria, though it's much less dense, is a bit "stringy," and doesn't form a "carpet." Nor is it green. It has a similar orange brown color that diatoms have and it's "dusty," that is, I can stir it off and it looks like a bunch of dust swirling in the water. It is _not_ hair, staghorn, or bba. Upon closer inspection with a microscope, it appears similar to _Trichodesmium_. It is unbranched single cell-width filaments. The large clumps sway in the water current. And it appears to be choking my moss. I need help with a treatment, _please_. It also grows on my java fern and anubias, though nowhere near as thick as on my moss. Oh, and it pearls. I've been battling GW too, so I uped my CO2 a bit w/8 hour photoperiod from 10 hr. and am planning on purchasing a diatom filter soon.

The tank is:
10 gal.
40w CF 6700/10000K
4 pinches PMDD w/CSM+B 2x week and 1 tsp flourish when dosing PMDD 
Pressurized CO2
Out of water perameter test kits  
Still cycling the tank, 1 cory, one 2 1/2" SAE from my "big tank"

The moss is still sending out new "runners" so I assume it's still okay. I'm getting desperate, can moss survive a quick bleach or peroxide dip?


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

Not a proclaimed expert, but it sounds a lot like what people call brown algae. Though it isn't an algae at all, its a small animal with flagella. Otto cats eat it with relish.


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## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

After viewing the horrific algae contest, I noticed an entry from Chris S that looks vey similar to the probem I'm having. It looks a lot like the algae growing in the upper right-hand corner of the aquarium in the picture below, under the filter. I _really_ need to find out what it is in order to treat it  .


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Instead of trying to treat the algae, try to establish good water parameters for the plants. For example, you don't mention dosing any nitrates or phosphates, and you need to do both for the plants. Use KNO3 for nitrate and KH2PO4 for the phosphate and you will also be providing a good supply of potassium, which the plants also need. Then set the CO2 bubble rate as high as you can without distressing the fish - raise it a bit each day, and check the fish frequently for distress, such as gathering at the water surface, color fading, etc. Once the fish show distress, back off on the CO2 a bit and make sure the fish are no longer in distress. Use that bubble rate for CO2, no matter what the KH/pH tables say your ppm is, until or unless you change your method of diffusing CO2 into the water.

Now, clean the tank, change 50% of the water, and see if any algae are still growing. Now you will be in a good position to adjust water parameters and lighting according to what algae type you are battling.


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

Dewmazz said:


> After viewing the horrific algae contest, I noticed an entry from Chris S that looks vey similar to the probem I'm having. It looks a lot like the algae growing in the upper right-hand corner of the aquarium in the picture below, under the filter. I _really_ need to find out what it is in order to treat it  .


I had a similar, if not the same, algae in my 75g grow out tank after my duaghter was born. The tank was pretty much ignored for the first 6 weeks or so after her birth. It did get occasional ferts and water top off but no water changes or regular maintenance. As a result, every plant in the tank was covered with this algae and I thought I was going to loose all of the plants.

I figured I would black out the tank for 3 days and see what happened. The tank is located in my basement so it wasn't a complete blackout, just no lights for 3 days. Much to my suprise, the algae totally disappeared after the 3 day blackout. I did a 50% water change after the blackout and it has not come back.

A blackout may work for you and it is free so what have you got to loose? You would still need to account for the cause of the algae but Hoppy has given you some good recommendations.


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

Hmmm i would be careful with blackouts... Some plants don't like no light. I did a 2-3 day one over the weekend and all my HC died. I had almost a full 55 gal tank carpeted too...


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

Zapins said:


> Hmmm i would be careful with blackouts... Some plants don't like no light. I did a 2-3 day one over the weekend and all my HC died. I had almost a full 55 gal tank carpeted too...


If it is the same stuff that I had, the plants were already bad enough that I was going to toos them due to the algae anyways so the blackout shouldn't have hurt them.

Strange, I've never had HC die off during a blackout. I had some survive after 5 days with no power due to a hurricane and tank temps in the upper 80's. Those 5 days were not a total blackout since the tnak did receive some ambient light. Not near enough since the tank was in a basement.


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## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

Thanks for the input, i'll give the blackout a shot (plants used in the tank are very hardy, java fern, java moss, A. nana, etc.). Hoppy, the PMDD mix I use is from Greg Watson, the pre-mixed stuff. As states on the label:

PMDD Pre-Mix One Pound
Contains Equal Parts:
Plantex CSM + B
MgSO4+7H2O
K2SO4
KNO3

would 3-4 drops Fleet Enema suffice for phosphate? (10 gal. tank)

Please keep in mind that I purchased these before I figured out it was easier to add each nutrient individually.  

I'll keep up on updates, hopefully my lfs will have some otos for me to pick up, see if they don't do anything.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

PMDD doesn't contain enough nitrate per tsp to let you run the nitrate level high enough without running the traces much higher than needed. When the PMDD recipe was developed it was believed that a lot of nitrate was a major no-no. Fleets enema is a good phosphate source, but use the fertilator for the right dosage - or someone else will chime in and tell you how much to use.


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

I am not sure what exactly happened with the HC, though my angel fish and otto cat died too during the blackout as well as the HC. Maybe it had something to do with gas exchange as well...


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

hoppycalif said:


> ... Fleets enema is a good phosphate source, but use the fertilator for the right dosage - or someone else will chime in and tell you how much to use.


Note that the fertilator calculation for Fleet enema dosing is wrong.

I've never used Fleet enema for Phosphate so can't help with the dosing...


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## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

Laith said:


> Note that the fertilator calculation for Fleet enema dosing is wrong.
> 
> 
> > WHAT!?
> ...


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

This may help:

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...ilizing/27545-phosphate-from-fleet-enema.html


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## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

Thanks Laith.

Based on this:

*For 75 gallon tank
Assume 66.2 gallons for the 75 gallon tank and that we need 1 ppm PO4
1ppm = (1 mg/liter) x (66.2 gals x 3.77) = 250 mg PO4 needed.
(250 mg)/(131.36 mg/ml) = 1.90 ml of enema to get 1 ppm PO4 in 66.2 gallons of water/
In general use .3 ml of enema per 10 gallons to get 1 ppm PO4.*

I found that I need to dose approx. 7 drops of fleet enema with my dropper. It takes 50 drops to fill 2 ml, so 25 drops per ml. 1 ml divided by 25 drops = .04 ml per drop. 0.3 ml divided by .04 = 7.5, so that's ~7 drops for 1 ppm in my 10 gallon tank. Yay! School teaches you stuff! Thanks again for the link, much appreciated. I'll update my situation on sunday.


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## banderbe (Nov 17, 2005)

Well, since you're still cycling your tank then I can guess one reason why you have algae. Your bacterial colonies aren't done developing yet so you have ammonia in your tank.

Lots of folks have found a strong connection between NH4 levels and the presence of algae.

Of course there may be other reasons, and that may not be the reason at all.

Also I think it is *way* too early to be talking about blacking out your tank, but apparently I am too late to this party as it appears you've already done it.

My tank went through a good month of awful algae problems before things settled into place.

Read up on over-dosing Flourish Excel to get rid of algae. It worked for me.

The other advice you've been given about CO2 and your fert. regime is good so include that in your arsenal.


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