# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Potassium problems



## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

Folks,

Prior to the last few weeks I heard of no problems with elevated potassium levels in aquariums. Hydroponics literature makes it pretty clear that potassium levels need to be balanced against the concentrations of calcium and magnesium. Should that advice carry over to aquariums?

There have been a lot of problems reported in the last couple weeks, but I am still concerned. My concerns are:

1) I'm not sure that all the symptoms I've read ascribed to potassium excesses are nutrient-related problems.

2) None of us uses a potassium test kit. We can only estimate the potassium levels that are associated with problems.

3) It very clearly is possible that our estimated potassium levels are *much* higher than we think they are.

I'd like this thread to summarize problems with high potassium doses. Would those of you who solved a problem by reducing potassium levels post to this thread and give us your experience? 

Specifically, I'd like to know:

1) The symptoms that typified the problem
2) The plants that were effected, the plants that were not effected.
3) The hardness of your tap water. If possible please give the calcium and magnesium levels in your tap water and tank. It would also be good to know the potassium level in your tap water.
4) The volume of your tank.
5) Your water change schedule -- volume and frequency.
6) Is yours a high light, high growth tank?
7) The potassium dose you use -- if possible, in grams per dose and frequency of the dose. Please account for all sources.
8) The amount (if any) of calcium or magnesium that you dose.

Hopefully, if we pull things together from the 4 or 5 different threads running on this topic right now then we might be able to see patterns and come to conclusions.


Roger Miller


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## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

Folks,

Prior to the last few weeks I heard of no problems with elevated potassium levels in aquariums. Hydroponics literature makes it pretty clear that potassium levels need to be balanced against the concentrations of calcium and magnesium. Should that advice carry over to aquariums?

There have been a lot of problems reported in the last couple weeks, but I am still concerned. My concerns are:

1) I'm not sure that all the symptoms I've read ascribed to potassium excesses are nutrient-related problems.

2) None of us uses a potassium test kit. We can only estimate the potassium levels that are associated with problems.

3) It very clearly is possible that our estimated potassium levels are *much* higher than we think they are.

I'd like this thread to summarize problems with high potassium doses. Would those of you who solved a problem by reducing potassium levels post to this thread and give us your experience? 

Specifically, I'd like to know:

1) The symptoms that typified the problem
2) The plants that were effected, the plants that were not effected.
3) The hardness of your tap water. If possible please give the calcium and magnesium levels in your tap water and tank. It would also be good to know the potassium level in your tap water.
4) The volume of your tank.
5) Your water change schedule -- volume and frequency.
6) Is yours a high light, high growth tank?
7) The potassium dose you use -- if possible, in grams per dose and frequency of the dose. Please account for all sources.
8) The amount (if any) of calcium or magnesium that you dose.

Hopefully, if we pull things together from the 4 or 5 different threads running on this topic right now then we might be able to see patterns and come to conclusions.


Roger Miller


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

1. New leaves coming in severely deformed. Classic symptoms of a Ca deficiency.

2. Ammannia gracllis, Ammannia senegalensis, Nesaea, Rotala macrandra, Rotala rotundifolia.

3. kH/gH 0/0 Ca = 1.4-2.5 ppm. Mg = 0.59-1.1 ppm. K = 0.19-0.37 ppm (All figures taken from CCR). Tank levels unknown other than gH is raised to 4-5 degrees using a mixture of 4 parts CaCO3, one part Epsom salts, one part baking soda.

4. 55 gallons nominal

5. Once a week 50%

6. High light 4 wpg with high growth

7. Was using 1 teaspoon twice a week of K2SO4 and 1/4 teaspoon of KNO3 three times a week. Now using same amount of KNO3 but down to 1/2 teaspoon of K2SO4 once a week and then 1/4 teaspoon once a week.

8. After water change I use the mix in #3 to bring my gH into the 4-5 degree range and the kH into the 3-4 degree range.

4.

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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

- 1) The symptoms that typified the problem

Severely affected:
-Nesaea pedicellata - badly cupped leaves, stunted stems
-E. quadricostatus - literally white leaves
-H. corymbosa - crinkled, cupped

Moderately affected:
-Ludwigia arcuata - leaves that resembled curly fries

Mildly affected:
-V. spiralis - one or two white leaves
-Callitriche sp. - a _few_ mildly curved leaves
-H. micranthemoides -a few small, dark green shoot tips

In the past:
-Alternanthera reineckii (crinkled)
-R. macrandra (stunting after pruning)
-A. gracilis (stunting)
-B. alternifolia(?) (mild stunting even though it grew too well)
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2) The plants that were effected, the plants that were not effected.

Not affected - C. beckettii, C. parva, H. palustris, E. tenellus, H. sibthorpiodes, P. gayi, E. parvula, E. acicularis, E. "Ozelot", L. aromatica? (aka Gratiola - slightly in past), L. madagascariensis, Microsorium pteropus narrow leaf (a tad chalky), Pellia (attacked by snails!)
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3) The hardness of your tap water. If possible please give the calcium and magnesium levels in your tap water and tank. It would also be good to know the potassium level in your tap water.

Tap -GH 7 - 4-5/1 calcium to magnesium. 2 KH I don't know the potassium level in the tap yet but am working finding out (apparently they don't usually test for it).

tank water - 7GH, 4 Kh (raised with Seachem alkaline buffer)

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4) The volume of your tank.

30 gallons, but deep gravel bed
-----------------------------------------------

5) Your water change schedule -- volume and frequency.

5 gallons weekly (usually)
-----------------------------------------------

6) Is yours a high light, high growth tank?

4.8 watts per gallon PCF and T8. Very high growth.

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7) The potassium dose you use -- if possible, in grams per dose and frequency of the dose. Please account for all sources.

Currently - 2.5ml of 2/1 Flourish/F Trace mixture, .75 ml of 4 teaspoon potassium phosphate in 250ml distilled water solution - all daily
non-K additions - 2.5 ml Flourish Iron, 2.5ml Flourish Nitrogen - daily

Previously - 2ml of the Flourish mixture, 2 ml Flourish Potassium, .75ml of potassium phosphate mixture - all daily
non-K additions: 2ml Flourish Iron, 2.25ml Flourish Notrogen - both daily

Did use double dose of Equilibrium per 5 gallons changed every week plus Flourish mixture and potassium phosphate (over 80ppm K).
Ca/Mg ratio found to be fine - discontinued.

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8) The amount (if any) of calcium or magnesium that you dose.

None.

Most plants improving with curent regemine and water changes with tap water (last 2 weeks). One stem of N. pedicellata still having trouble but looks like it might be getting better very slowly.

PS. My tank is NOT the wild assortment of plants it must sound like. Many plants are only present in small quantities. I am currently changing my tank over from an AHAP propagation project into an actual aquascape and keeping my favorites (Hottonia!)


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## Freemann (Mar 19, 2004)

All the current details are here:
http://www.bellybean.com/~pave/deficiencies/deficiency.htm
I will change my solution to 0 ppm Mg, 5,6 ppm total K weekly from today and see what happens.
By the way could the increased bubbling and the increase in the growth of the plants even in the 2nd and 3rd day after a water change be attributed to the dilution of K or for that matter of something else? Water I use is not from mains it is reconstituted so no gas trapped (anyway this could not have affect on the second day but there is a difference)


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## Mortadelo (Mar 14, 2004)

1) The symptoms that typified the problem

Distorted growth in new leaves.

2) The plants that were effected, the plants that were not effected.

Affected:
Ludwigia arcuata, Rotala rotundifolia, Altenanthera reineckii, Hygrophila corymbosa (two forms), Bacopa monnieri, M. umbrosum and a few others I can not remember.

Unaffected:
Too many to list here. Mostly rosette plants were unaffected while many stem plants are.

3) The hardness of your tap water. If possible please give the calcium and magnesium levels in your tap water and tank. It would also be good to know the potassium level in your tap water.

Tap water from an updated water report:

K+ 4 ppm
Ca 86,3 ppm
Mg 43 ppm

4) The volume of your tank.

900 Liters (RO water with a little tapwater)
43 Liters (100% tap)
60 Liters (100% tap)

5) Your water change schedule -- volume and frequency.

900 liters aquarium (25% weekly)
43 and 60 liters aquarium (50% weekly)

6) Is yours a high light, high growth tank?

The two small ones are high light (4 W/G), the 900L is low light (1 W/G).

7) The potassium dose you use -- if possible, in grams per dose and frequency of the dose. Please account for all sources.

The big aquarium recieves 10 ppm weekly after water change from K2SO4.

THe small ones get 20 ppm total from K2SO4 and KNO3 weekly.

8) The amount (if any) of calcium or magnesium that you dose.

Nothing.

¡Mi web!
http://www22.brinkster.com/aguaverde/


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## Antonio Trías (Feb 4, 2004)

I had the same troubles with (the ones I sure remember, they are more but I,m doubtful):

Distorted grow:
Echinodorus bleheri
Rotala macrandra
Vallisneria gigantea
Nuphar japonica
Higrophila (severals)

Curling:
Cryptocoryne wendtii

Everytime, the problem resolved when K fertilization

I saw that, not only on my tanks, several friends experienced more or less the same.-

My K fertilization depends on my needs but is Sulfate, Fosfate, Nitrate and sometimes with hidroxid, but i never used clorides

I,m dispointed because I never registred the water parameters.-

Best Regards
Antonio Trías


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## BenMontana (Feb 1, 2003)

I was dosing a tablespoon of K2SO4 a week. 20% weekly waterchange 55 gal.

Excellent growth for 8 to 12 months. Then heavy perforation of Anubias leaves coupled with some distorted twisted leaves and asymetric leaf development appeared. Ammania gracilis (or Nessae c. was what I bought it as) also perforated and very slow growth.

Eliminated K and Mg (Espsom salts) dosing for 2 weeks, added 1/8 tsp of CaCl twice a week to regimen. Continued other ferts. Symptoms have reversed after 2 weeks+. Will start dosing again with only 1 teaspoon weekly for a while.

Pearling has increased dramatically.


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## imported_Ghazanfar Ghori (Jan 31, 2003)

1) The symptoms that typified the problem

Textbook Ca deficiency symptoms. Severe distortion of leaves, curling of leaves, death of growing tip and whiteish new leaves in some fast growing plants.

2) The plants that were effected, the plants that were not effected.

Affected:
Ammania gracilis, Nesea pendicillata, rotala macranda, ludwigia arcuata, blyxa sp. vietnam

Slightly affected
H. zosterfolia (whiteish new leaves)


3) The hardness of your tap water.

KH4, GH6

4) The volume of your tank.

75 Gallons

5) Your water change schedule -- volume and frequency.

50% weekly

6) Is yours a high light, high growth tank?

Yes.

7) The potassium dose you use -- if possible, in grams per dose and frequency of the dose. 

K2SO4. I was doing 2 tsp weekly after water changes.

8) The amount (if any) of calcium or magnesium that you dose.

No Mg dosing. I do have some crushed coral
in my filter. I'll be removing that shortly.



After suspection K levels were too high and were blocking Ca uptake. I did 2 large water
changes and did not add back K. Over all
plant growth increased dramatically. The plants
are no longer exhibiting distorted growth.

I spoke with Dr. Prescott about my tanks
a while ago, shortly after I had started
dosing K into my tanks (months ago) and
he mentioned that for a while he had major
issues with growing certain plants and he
couldn't figure out why. Traced it back to
high K levels and once he cut those back,
plant growth increased significantly. He said,
he even developed his own K test kit because
of this. 
-
Ghazanfar Ghori


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## Guest (May 5, 2003)

G-
Check the APD archives for this.
Prescott said 2ppm K was a potential for causing algae amongst other things which I know simply not to be true.


Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## Guest (Sep 8, 2003)

1) crinkled, stunted, burned tops
2) Ammania gracillis (indicator of this problem), Rotala macranda; E. stellata (few months ago - gone now)
3)3-4dKH
4)55G
5)40-50% weekly
6)4wpg PC
7)Using hydrophonic K2SO4 and Chucks calculator:
---7 tablespoons + 900 distilled water = .33ppm/ml
weekly schedule: 
---20ml x 3 times weekly for the total of 19.8ppm
8)no calcium no magnesium

Latest observation. 
Aftering loosing entire E. stellata due to burned leaves and having Ammania gracillis w/ stuned tips I decided to back off K completely for few weeks. I did 50-75% water changes for next 2 weeks and I didn't add any potassium. 

Unfortunately E. stellata never recovered but my Ammania gracillis never grew any better. Leaves grew very wide, long and I had ZERO burned tips. 

Side effect of not adding potassium at all for long period of time was slow down in growth in general. I decided to start ading K again. At first, I was doing about 8ppm weekly and everything was growing well with no adverse reaction but for last couple of weeks I noticed the same problem all over again.

Conclusion:
There has to be something associated with excess of Potassium. Changes will not go into effect quickly but you should see positive or negative reaction in period of a month from either change. 
I plan on doing major water change this week and going back to 10ppm weekly.


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## kekon (Aug 1, 2005)

The same as above. Having 27 ppm of K (measured in lab) caused severe deformed leaves, curled, and "burned" tips. The most affected plants were Alternatera Reinecki and Umbrosum. I cut off K dosing and symptoms dissapeared. However, K deficency showed up eventually. So i dosed 10 ppm K to changed water. K deficiency dissapeared but K excess appeared again. It was not as severe as before but still existed. Now i dose only 3ppm K to changed water and about 0,4 ppm daily and observe what happens.


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