# ALL tanks went green! help!



## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

<note: this is a reprint. still having issues. advice welcome>

I've been a fan of the EI method for about 2 years now. I have followed a modified EI method (lowered Phosphates to 0.1 instead of 0.5 because of green water issues) to fertilization with a great deal of success.

However, I've been having problems lately. I've had a breakout of green water across all three of my tanks within the last few weeks...I think I know why, but I would very much like an opinion for a possible fix and also suggestions on a dosing regimen afterwards.

As an aside, I am not able to do a blackout as I have in the distant past. Elatine Triandra (the main plant in all three tanks) is incredibly sensitive to lack of light. Currently, I have a Laguna Power Clear UV Sterilizer that is being swapped between each of the three tanks, every few days, to try and alleviate the problem. I understand this is not a fix, but just enough to keep me from tearing out my hair when I look at the tanks.

*Recent Tank History:*
About 6 weeks ago, I began to move all three tanks to a biweekly schedule. I'm beginning to think this was a bad idea. Since last Saturday, I have played around with the dosing to try and determine the issue. The 240 has had NO chems since then, the 55#1 has had it's normal dosing MINUS the Phosphates, and the 55#2 has had it's normal dosing.
I perform 50% water changes every week, except for the last 6 weeks (as stated above). As fertilizers, I use Plantex CSM+B, Fleet, Green Light Stump Remover, No-Salt and Epsom Salts. Here are the current tank parameters (as of 09/27/2005, 4am "local time") :

*240G*
Actual water volume - 160 gallons
440W CF lights, 11 hr photo period
Profile substrate
4 bps CO2
GH - 15
KH - 5
nitrAtes - 10
pH - 6.6
Ammo - 0
tempRange - 83-86
nitrItes - 0
Phosphates - 0.2
Dosing regimen at Water Change --
Phosphates - 15 drops @ WC
CMS+B - 20 ml @ WC
Iodine - 5 ml @ WC
NitrAtes - 1 tsp @ WC
Magnesium - 4 tsp @ WC
Potassium - 3 tsp @ WC
Daily Dosing regimen --
CSM+B - 10 ml daily 
Phosphates - 5 drops, M,W,F

*55G #1*
Actual water volume- 30 gallons
110W CF lights, 11 hr photo period
Profile substrate
<1 bps CO2
GH - 13
KH - 3
nitrAtes - 5
pH - 6.5
Ammo - 0
tempRange - 84-87
nitrItes - 0
Phosphates - 0.2 
Dosing regimen at Water Change --
Phosphates - 3 drops @ WC
CMS+B - 5 ml @ WC
Iodine - 1 ml @ WC
NitrAtes - 3/16 tsp @ WC
Magnesium - 3/4 tsp @ WC
Potassium - 1 tsp @ WC
Daily Dosing regimen --
CSM+B - 1.5 ml daily 
Phosphates - 1 drop, M,W,F

*55G #2*
Actual water volume- 30 gallons
110W CF lights, 11 hr photo period
Flourite substrate
2 bps CO2
GH - 14
KH - 7
nitrAtes - <5
pH - 6.9
Ammo - 0
tempRange - 84-87
nitrItes - 0
Phosphates - 0.1
Dosing regimen at Water Change --
Phosphates - 3 drops @ WC
CMS+B - 5 ml @ WC
Iodine - 1 ml @ WC
NitrAtes - 3/16 tsp @ WC
Magnesium - 3/4 tsp @ WC
Potassium - 1 tsp @ WC
Daily Dosing regimen --
CSM+B - 1.5 ml daily 
Phosphates - 1 drop, M,W,F

*Tap water --*
Phosphates - 0.1
GH - 10
KH - 5
nitrAtes - 0 
Ammo - 0
nitrItes - 0

I'm a little worried about the pH readings. They seem awfully low for the early morning, I would expect that level of pH about 2 hours into the photoperiod. I'm trying to decide if the problem is in the nitrAtes or the CO2. The temps are very high, mostly because the wife won't let me keep the tanks anywhere but a small room off of the garage. I've had temps higher than this, so I don't think this is the major cause of the GW. Again, I would appreciate advice on this issue and I would also very much appreciate suggestions on dosing regimens for the three tanks.

Thank you very much in advance!

=Praxx42


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## urville (Sep 20, 2004)

well i can tell you that uprooting plants without an immediate water change and high temps, high light, and messing with my dosing regime caused or all had a hand in my gw.

i didnt have acess to uv, or diatom and like you a blackout was not possible. what saved me was my canister filter. heres what i did.

i took out 100% of the water. i disconnected the fluval, sucked the water, filled the tank. i took the fluval changed my floss, dumped the water, took my ouput and dropped it in a bucket below the tank and towards the bottom of the canister, hooked it back up and let the flow go. and it just siphoned water through. i did this for two buckets worth, then i refilled the tank, obviously i was missing some water, and then i went back about business. so far day 2 still 100% clear. so we'll see.
ian


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

Hey Praxx, are you saying you think phosphates caused your gw??? I would maintain normal dosing, I would also bump up the PO4 to 1-2ppm. For all tanks to get gw at the same time, it sounds like the same thing happened to all at the same time. 

Have you considered doing a rolling black out regimen? If your concern is for the Elatine, you could uproot it from which ever tank you're going to be blacking out and move it to a different tank. Perform the black out on the tank, then when you return the tank to normalcy, replant the Elatine. I know that's a pita (I have Elatine and know how brittle it is and can be difficult to plant), but you know it grows fairly quickly.

Good luck!


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

The common factor in all of the tanks that I can see is that they all have low NO3 and low PO4.

I'd raise the NO3 to around 20mg/l and the PO4, as suggested, up to 1-2mg/l, more like 2...

Also your dosing calculations may be off due to your estimate of actual water volume in your tanks. You're subtracting 33% (from the 240g tank) and 45% (from your 55g tanks)...why? This is too much unless you have *alot* of hardscape in there.


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

Laith said:


> The common factor in all of the tanks that I can see is that they all have low NO3 and low PO4.
> 
> I'd raise the NO3 to around 20mg/l and the PO4, as suggested, up to 1-2mg/l, more like 2...
> 
> Also your dosing calculations may be off due to your estimate of actual water volume in your tanks. You're subtracting 33% (from the 240g tank) and 45% (from your 55g tanks)...why? This is too much unless you have *alot* of hardscape in there.


That *is* the actual water volume. A different kind of hardscape (think iwagumi without the rocks) and a lot a LOT of substrate. I measured the volume a couple of times by different methods. When I calculate, I try to shoot for actual volume, not tank size since EI is based on concentrations in a certain volume, not actual tank size.


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

Bert H said:


> Hey Praxx, are you saying you think phosphates caused your gw??? I would maintain normal dosing, I would also bump up the PO4 to 1-2ppm. For all tanks to get gw at the same time, it sounds like the same thing happened to all at the same time.
> 
> Have you considered doing a rolling black out regimen? If your concern is for the Elatine, you could uproot it from which ever tank you're going to be blacking out and move it to a different tank. Perform the black out on the tank, then when you return the tank to normalcy, replant the Elatine. I know that's a pita (I have Elatine and know how brittle it is and can be difficult to plant), but you know it grows fairly quickly.
> 
> Good luck!


I'd rather not do blackout. I have several square feet of e. triandra and while I will be replanting it, I don't want to have to do it more often than necessary.

However, your crypts are growing like mad.


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## urville (Sep 20, 2004)

how do you filter these tanks?


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

They are all filtered with a DIY CO2 reactor/filter. One of the 55s is getting an Aqua Medic CO2 Reactor 1000 in the next couple of weeks. I'm trying to make it as little equipment in the system as possible for correct functioning. So far, they are working quite well. I'll take some pics of the internal CO2 systems after I get the GW issues worked out. I've taken some advice to heart, and restructured my chem dosages, and will be setting everything back up this Sunday. Wish me luck!


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## urville (Sep 20, 2004)

oh so your not using like canister filters or anything?


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

Nope. All either hard-plumbed with inline reactor, or the reactor _is_ the filter.

Well, really more like the _plants _are the filter, I just move water around and pump CO2 into it.


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## urville (Sep 20, 2004)

Praxx42 said:


> Nope. All either hard-plumbed with inline reactor, or the reactor _is_ the filter.
> 
> Well, really more like the _plants _are the filter, I just move water around
> and pump CO2 into it.


 oh... darn what i did wont work for you


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

No. but that's okay. Every tank is different.


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