# serious help



## KungPaoChicky (Oct 11, 2005)

i have been lurking around these forums for months now. Iam still VERY confused as to fertalizing my planted tank. Right now i use these products: Seachem Iron, Kent Pro Plant, Kent Plant, Seachem potassium. My plants seem to be doing pretty well. I have read a little about dry fertilizing and PMDD but i still dont know what the heck is up with it. What are Micros? What are Macros? How should i dose them? Shouldnt there be a thread or sticky on here for beginer fertalizers? THanks!


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

First a breakdown of your current ferts with quotes from both the Kent and Seachem websites about their products:

Pro Plant - "This product provides bio-available nitrogen, magnesium and micronutrients for lush freshwater plant growth • Contains no phosphates to cause unwanted algae growth."

Kent Plant - "This product provides bio-available iron and other micronutrients for lush fresh water plant growth. Contains no phosphates, nitrates, or other fertilizers to cause unwanted algae growth. "

Seachem Iron - "Flourish Iron™ is a highly concentrated (10,000 mg/L) ferrous iron (Fe+2) gluconate supplement. It should be used in those cases where the iron requirements exceed that which can be delivered by Flourish™ at the recommended dose or signs of iron deficiency appear (such as short and slender stems or yellowing between veins.) Plants are able to much more easily derive a benefit from Flourish Iron™ than from EDTA-iron sources because all EDTA iron is in the ferric (Fe+3) state. Since plants require iron in the ferrous state, additional physiological energy must be expended in order to extract the ferric iron from EDTA-iron and then convert it to the ferrous form. Contains no phosphate or nitrate."

Seachem Potassium - "Flourish Potassium™ contains 50,000 mg/L of potassium suitable for the natural planted aquarium. Potassium is one of several elements that are vitally important to maintaining a vigorous level of growth in a planted aquarium. Potassium can become depleted in a rapidly growing system or when the source water has a low mineral content. In these cases potassium could become the limiting factor to growth. Use Flourish Potassium™ to prevent potassium depletion (signs of which include yellowing in older leaves) and maintain the highest level of growth. "

Macros - Nitrates, Phosphates, and Potassium. You are currently missing nitrates and phosphorous in your dosing. The nitrogen in Kent's Pro Plant if probably a very small amount and this product would probably be considered a micro fertilizer. Of course, Hydrogen and Oxygen (H2O) along with CO2 could be considered macros 

Micros - pretty much everything other than the above items.

You are supplying iron, micros, and some nitrogen by dosing the Kent Products. You are adding additional iron by fertilizing with Seachem Iron. You are also adding Potassium via Seachem Potassium. What you seem to be missing is Nitrates and Phosphates. Kent Pro Plant does provide some nitrogen but depending on your light level and CO2 usage, it may not be enough. If you can provide your light levels in watts per gallon and your CO2 usage it would help 

There are a couple of schools of thought on adding fertilizers. You can do a search on the Estimative Index or Perpetual Preservation System on this site. I do believe there are stickies for both of them at the top of the fertilization forum.

Some like to test their water before they add ferts and then add enough to keep them at certain levels. While this may not be a bad idea, it requires one to purchase accurate test kits or calibrate the kits. You also have to test the water before adding ferts which for some of us is 3x a week for macros. That is too much testing for me 

At one time I believe there was a sticky on the basics of planted tanks that covered things like macros and micros. I thought it was in either the New to Aquarium Plants Forum or the General discussions forum but it doesn't seem to be there any longer. Maybe it should be added again...I can check into it for you if you would like.

If you read through the EI and PPS stickies in the fertilization forum and have questions, please ask! There is always someone willing to lend a hand


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## JaySilverman (Jun 19, 2005)

Macros = Phosphates (KH2P04) and Nitrates (KN03)
Micro = Magnesium, Copper, Iron etc

Right now you are paying an arm and a leg for products that cost literally pennies per dose. You have much more control over what nutrients go in the tank with using dry ferts. All it takes is a little patience and time to figue out how much to dose. In the long run it will save you ALOT of money and your plants will do ALOT better.

Bassicly if you are injecting CO2 in your tank you will want about 10 ppm NO3 and 1 ppm PO4.
You can't test Micros very well so just use the amount specified on gregs site.

You will need to get test kits if you decide not to use Barrs method of dosing.

What you will need to purchase is the following. All of these will most likely last you 5+ years. You can get them at www.gregwatson.com

1lb of Plantex CSM+B or CSM+B Plus Extra Iron if you think you really need the extra Iron. That should take care of all the Micros your plants need.

1lb of Mono Potassium Phosphate (KH2PO4) for Phosphates and
1lb of Potassium Nitrate (KNO3) for Nitrates. That should take take of your Macro needs.

That's pretty much it. Dosing these ferts are another story and there is plenty of info out there to figure out exacly what your tank needs.


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

Here is a very good link that covers all of the basics of planted tanks:

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/showthread.php?t=8790

You can read through the entire article or just read the section on fertilizing. I have it bookmarked and it is also a sticky in the New to Aquarium Plants forum


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## KungPaoChicky (Oct 11, 2005)

wow thanks alot!  I feel much more relieved knowing that Iam not left alone here. Its kind of intimidating trying to figure out diffrent things and alot of other forums dont take the time to teach any new comers anything. Thank you for your advice. My tank specs are as follows:

10 gal tank
96 watts
Eco Complete substrate
DIY co2 Diffused through power head
Fluval sponge filter.

Everything seems to be growing fine, I have a little hair algea but it seems my water changes and the addition of a SAE have been doing the trick. But with all these water changes i have been worrying about over dosing my tank! Thanks for clearing everything up!


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

Hey KPC,

Here is a good online fertilizer calculator for commercial fertilizers like Kent and Seachem's line of products. You would need to convert your tanks volume in gallons to liters (3.8L = 1 gal) and add in the milliliters of each liquid solution you add to determine your fertilizer levels. 

As you can see from the calculator, Kent's Pro Plant would need to be dosed at a rate of 20ml for a 10g tank to get you into the 5 ppm range on your nitrates. Very expensive considering a pound of Greg's KNO3 (Potassium Nitrate) is only about $3. You would only need to add 1/16th tsp of dry KNO3 to get into the 5ppm range of nitrate (NO3) in your tank. That means one ounce of KNO3 would last you for 96 doses if my math is correct and you just purchased 16 ounces for $3  

As suggested by Jay, you may want to look into getting KNO3, KH2PO4, and some CSM+B from Greg's site. It should only cost about $20, including shipping and will last for a long time! Most of your Kent and Seachem products are only contributing micros to your dosing. You really need to start adding some macros (nitrates, phosphates, and potassium) to your tank. If you get the KNO3 and KH2PO4 from Greg, they should provide all of the potassium (K) you need for your tank also.

Keep asking questions if you have them


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## TES (Aug 16, 2005)

9.6 watts per gallon? i have 220 watts for a 60 gallon and the tank is brighter than the sun. 

is it only me or does this seem like an inordinately high level of light? especially with diy co2, though it is a small tank.


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