# Over planting?/New setup ok?



## stew (May 7, 2012)

I am just about to set up my new tank and am a bit concerned that I could be introducing too many plants at one go, is this possible? Should I really stagger their introduction like fish?

The basic situation is:

The tank is 6 1/2 feet long about 20 inches front to back and 2 feet deep (654 litres, 145 imperial gallons, 175 us gallons), the lighting is looking like 2 t8 30w proper tubes (5000k 1A) and the option for another t8 ordinary 30w tube on just one side (actually mabe the option for more), a fluval fx8 filter (which is capable of dealing with a tank twice the size), 2 30w heaters.

I know the lighting isn't as strong as it might be, if it's way off what should it be for healthy plant growth (I suppose the plants I buy wont be fully grown), if it's relevant I also have an air ball pushing some oxygen into the top of the tank, the hardness of the water is about 20d or 358ppm. The temperature of the tank is about 24/25c. I have a co2 thing you put sugar and yeast in.

I'd like quite a lot of healthy looking plants (hard to define, but the usual set up I suppose of tall plants at the back and clumps at the sides).

Thanks

Stewart


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## The Trigger (Apr 23, 2012)

You cannot overplant. Those plants will help great to suck up any excess nutrients in the water during the startup phase.


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## Tex Gal (Nov 1, 2007)

With your weak light you will most likely find yourself with dying plants, due to not enough light vs plants that just "won't fully grow". 24" deep is pretty deep for only two 30 watt T8s. I think you should consider upgrading your light in some way. You can also choose plants that do well in lower light. Your light is so weak I'm not sure many plants at all will be able to survive.

Trigger is also correct, abundant plants will cycle your tank quickly. The only "overplanting" you can do is the plant might overshadow each other and block the light or they can overgrow so that there is not enough nutrients in the water to sustain the plant mass.


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## stew (May 7, 2012)

What sort of wattage do i require fo healthy growing plants?


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## Tex Gal (Nov 1, 2007)

It depends on the plants and the bulbs. T8's are not as powerful as T5's. If you can follow this thread you can see the par data for certain lights. It can help you get an idea. You will see that the intensity of the light changes with bulb types, and tank depth.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/dallas-ft-worth-aquatic-plant-club/80982-par-data-collection.html


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## stew (May 7, 2012)

I couldn't get an answer from that link.
I would like healthy plants at the bottom and top of my tank, the tank is in my living room and gets very little sunlight. My tank is 196cm by 63cm deep by 53 cm wide 145 imperial gallons. Also is it wise to use tinfoil as reflectors? If t5ho's are the way to go what wattage should I go for? Are there any other details I should look for in particular bulbs eg K's, A's, PAR figures, nm?


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## The Trigger (Apr 23, 2012)

tin foil is AWFUL for reflectors. Better off using white paint if you dont want to shell out the cash for top quality polished sluminum reflectors. if your getting a fixture, get a t5ho fixture. whatever length fits your tank


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## stew (May 7, 2012)

Really, I am surprised, I would have thought tin foil was reflective as the shop bought stuff! OK, but what about the finer details of the bulbs I require, there are are different t5ho's? I am thinking 3 feet long ones would be the right size for my tank as there is a divider in the middle.


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## The Trigger (Apr 23, 2012)

You would have to measure to get exact numbers unless it actually is 36". And yes there are different bulb types by brand and how good of quality thy are. I use the giesemanns. Highly recommended


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

If you are still working with T-8 bulbs, I would aim for close to 2 watts per gallon and use a mix of bulbs labeled Daylight, Cool and 'Plant and Aquarium' bulbs. 60 or even 90 watts over your tank is barely enough light just to see the fish. Nowhere near enough to provide the proper energy for the plants. 
This is an old way to at least get something close to enough light to keep things alive until you can get the right lights. (T-5 set ups with really nice reflectors are great) Do not take too long, though. 
I run set ups like that near bright windows, so the plants have not only the light from the fixtures, but a little bit of direct sun for a short time each day. 

Heater: the usual rule of thumb for heaters is 5 watts per gallon, but larger tanks are more stable, so unless the room is cooler than average, or you need to keep the tank extra warm you can get by with less. But 60 watts is almost nothing. OK if the tank is in a warm room (low 70sF) and you are keeping cool water fish. 

CO2: DIY yeast is nowhere enough for this large a tank. I used 3 set ups of 2 liter bottles each for my 125, swapping out one set up each week. That was OK with the low light (as described above), but the little bottles they sell in the stores are just a drop in the bucket compared to what you need in that large a tank. 

Do not go by what the manufacturer says about the filter. Use some tools and figure out how many gallons per hour the filter is really putting out (ie, hold a bucket under the outlet of the filter, at tank height, and time it to see how long it takes to fill the bucket). 
Then set up filter, power head and other water movement so you are getting a minimum of 5 times the tank volume per hour turnover. 

Air bubblers help with some water turnover, but not much. They are more useful in a non-planted tank. They are not adding oxygen in the sense that most people think. The way they work is by the rising bubbles creating a small circulation of water. Water from near the bottom of the tank rises with the bubbles and ends up at the top of the tank. When the water was at the bottom the fish and microorganisms used some of the oxygen and added CO2 to the water. When that water reaches the surface the excess CO2 can leave the water, and more oxygen can enter the water. The water then circulates back down as more water from the bottom rises to take its place. 
In a planted tank, however, the fish and plants share the oxygen and CO2 back and forth, so that a planted tank more often has too little CO2 and more than enough oxygen for the fish and microorganisms. When water circulates (driven by air bubbles or any other method) the water that is at the surface may gain CO2 and lose oxygen. At night the opposite happens. This is where an air bubbler on a timer is helpful for tanks with pressurized CO2. Too much CO2 can build up in the water overnight (when plants are respiring in a similar way to the fish). The added water movement at the surface drives off the CO2 and more oxygen can enter the water. 
None of that has anything to do with the bubbles themselves, the bubbler is just another water movement device. Ask yourself, "How many gallons per hour am I moving for how many watts of electricity?" Is an air bubbler really an efficient way to move water? 
It is rare for DIY yeast set ups to add too much CO2 to the water, even overnight.

I have some bubblers, but I use them only in the heat of summer to add just a little water movement during the day. This helps cool the tanks a bit. Water circulating near the surface allows the warmest water to evaporate. Again, nothing to do with the actual bubbling.


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