# Location of filtration



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Hey, I was gonna build a hood for my 55 gallon soon, so I was wondering where exactly would be a good place for the filter inlet/outlet to be located. I've seen many people do it on either the sides or the back, so I'm wondering what the advantages/disadvantages are. I'm using a HOB filter right now, but gonna upgrade to a filstar xp3 in a month or two, so I need to know if I should build a opening on the side or back of the hood. Thanks!


----------



## SimplyOrange (Oct 5, 2007)

i've always liked the idea of having the inlet and outlet on opposite sides or at the very least not on top of each other like hobs are setup. at least this way there is a better circulation. i have no clue as to whether that is a fact or not but just seemed reasonable.

how about creating removable sides/panels?


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Yeah, I thought about putting them on opposite sides too for better circulation. I just see some people have their filter in/outlet right next to each other, so I haven't ever thought about it until I had to to build a hood.

I guess I could try put removable ones, but do you think it'd be nicer if I had holes/squares on the side for the filter hoses? I could make a removable back for my HOB for now, and put holes in the side. 

Not sure how exactly would I do removable, cause I want the front panel and a single panel on top to lift for easier maintenances. I would need need the sides to be in place right? I guess I could attach it to the back panels, but I don't know exactly how I would do removable in the first place!

and sorry, I've been capitalizating random works in my posts right now for some reason XD.
thanks for the input!


----------



## SimplyOrange (Oct 5, 2007)

pm hoppycalif, he just built a stand/cabinet for his 10g. maybe he can give you better ideas. lol.

why wouldnt the hoses be able to go through the back once you replace the hob's with a canister?

as for removable lets scratch that idea for structural reasons.

if you drill the holes now you can just cover it up with various caps from the home improvement stores or even possibly plan for a future fan add-on.

do you have one of the many diy hood plans floating on the net in mind?


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I use the XP3 for my 45 gallon tank, with the spray bar across the back, near the top, so it slightly ripples the surface. The return is in the lower right corner. As long as the plants don't grow too much this gives good water circulation, but with a lush growth I had to add a powerhead aimed along the lower back of the tank to maintain the circulation. My hoses enter from the back, but I don't see any benefits to either the back or sides.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Alright, thanks for the tip. But I'm sorry, but I don't know exactly what a spray bar is. Is it just a bar that releases the outlet water throughout the tank? And what are the rupples for? 
And I'm going for a densely planted tank on the left side of my tank, with a small open field in the front/right side.







(probably not gonna be only stems, sorry)
Something like a dutch styled tank with a open side since its located to the top right of the living room couches.

I would need good circulation along the bottom back right and what about the return?
Sorry for asking so much questions!
Thanks.

Oh, also probably just gonna build the hood with an open back for the filter hoses, I guess side isn't too important. I mostly see it with Amano style tanks anyways.


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Some surface ripple is good because that is where the water gains most of the dissolved oxygen in it, and a little surface movement helps that process.

A spray bar is a tube with holes drilled along one side, so the water entering the tank from the filter is sprayed out in multiple small "jets". That distributes the water flow across a large area to get more and gentler circulation.

If you have the spray bar near the top of the tank, the filter suction pipe needs to be near the bottom to get good water flow at that level too. And, if the spray bar is to the right, as mine is, the suction should be near the left, also to get good water flow in that corner too.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Ok, thank you! I'm gonna put the spray bar on the left area where it mores densely planted and intake on the right corner. I'll see if I can get a powerhead eventually along with the filstar.
http://www.ahsupply.com/images/1x55wmrretro2.jpg

Do you think it would be worth it to retro it like this on my light strip? If so, I could probably do it a lot faster since I already have a hood, just redo the light strip. Problem is that I don't want to mess it up. I could also use this on in addition to my new ahsupply kit, though dunno how I would take it out and mount it.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...cts/14229-show-off-your-diy-enclosures-3.html
This is actually pretty much how I wanted my hood to be, so maybe I'll base my design off Jon's, except not as wide since mine is a 55. I also might eventually upgrade lighting, so that would probably go on the part that lifts up, but this is how I'm gonna build it. Maybe I should ask him for instructions...


----------



## teacherthomas (Jul 14, 2006)

Wouldn’t having the spray bar on the top right and the intake on the bottom left of the tank cause the circulation to be poor at the bottom right under the spray bar. My understanding is if the spray bar is pushing the upper water to the left, it would cause a round circulation pattern in the tank (what is desired) but only in the middle range of the tank and anything a below the rainbar and from below it on the bottom of the tank inward about 4 inches would not get circulation.

However if the rainbar was at the top right and the intake was at the bottom right, then the water would be pushed by the rainbar from the top right to the top left and hit teh side of the tank and be pushed down, then be pulled back by the intake from the bottom left to the bottom right, causing a full circulation path.

Am I not correct in this?


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

teacherthomas said:


> Wouldn't having the spray bar on the top right and the intake on the bottom left of the tank cause the circulation to be poor at the bottom right under the spray bar. My understanding is if the spray bar is pushing the upper water to the left, it would cause a round circulation pattern in the tank (what is desired) but only in the middle range of the tank and anything a below the rainbar and from below it on the bottom of the tank inward about 4 inches would not get circulation.
> 
> However if the rainbar was at the top right and the intake was at the bottom right, then the water would be pushed by the rainbar from the top right to the top left and hit teh side of the tank and be pushed down, then be pulled back by the intake from the bottom left to the bottom right, causing a full circulation path.
> 
> Am I not correct in this?


Yes, that would probably be a better layout with better circulation. I couldn't set up mine that way because the hoses were a bit too short, so I used a compromise. I ended up adding a powerhead to get better circulation in the middle of the tank, near the substrate. But, however you do this, once the plants grow well they interfere with the circulation and you have to either do a lot of pruning or move things around to improve the circulation again - that has been my experience anyway.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

I guess putting it on the bottom right would be best for me? Or maybe just putting it in the front right where it would be open, but then I would need to change my hood for that.
And I was talking about on_the_newb's hood.
actually, madpat has what I want too. Stand and hood looks great together, and I want it similar to that too. Too bad the woodwork is too fancy for me D:
Gonna modify jon's a bit so I don't need the extra board outside. I'm gonna extend the middle board up about 1/2 in so I can fit a 1/2 in board on top to hold the lights. Will this cause any stability problems? Thanks
I'll try post up diagrams after I finish designing it and studying for a test.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Eh, looks like I'm not getting the filter, and maybe not a regulator -_-
My mom said she would rather buy me a PS3 than for my to continue spending so much on my tanks  I don't know if I should accept this offer or not. Tempted, but I still really want to do my 55 gal -_- I might have to switch to low tech. Will 110 watts give me lots of algae w/o co2? 
D:


----------



## SimplyOrange (Oct 5, 2007)

gotcheaprice said:


> Eh, looks like I'm not getting the filter, and maybe not a regulator -_-
> My mom said she would rather buy me a PS3 than for my to continue spending so much on my tanks  I don't know if I should accept this offer or not. Tempted, but I still really want to do my 55 gal -_- I might have to switch to low tech. Will 110 watts give me lots of algae w/o co2?
> D:


umm thats a pretty good deal your mom has going.

as for 110w over a 55g it depends on how much plants you start with and how long you run the total 110w.

i only ran 160w for a few hours as my sunburst then back to 80w before and after.
i planted heavily and i used anacharis in the empty spots until the plants grew into place.
as for algae the only ones i saw were on the rocks which i didnt mind since i had otos and an sae at the time. also mine was definitely lowtech. no co2, only fert at the time was 1ml of flourish iron usually once every few weeks. that was when i would remember.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Lol, yeah, it's so tempting! But I'd still feel guilty about it after since I won't play it much. My wii is collecting dust right now -_-
And I'm planning to plant it really pretty, probably dutch/amano hybrid. Thanks for the help. I guess it'd be fine w/o CO2. I'll just dose excel(gonna get expensive though...) once in a while.


----------



## SimplyOrange (Oct 5, 2007)

well that is true that game consoles will end up in storage for the lack of spare time to play them.

sounds like i just flipped my stance on the issue. haha.
tell your mom at least everyone can enjoy the continuous benefits of looking at a planted tank.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Haha, yeah, well, she'll let me, but she said that she would rather me get the PS3. I have no clue on her logic for this as before she used to tell me to find a hobby and stop playing games, lol.
Plus, we don't have a HDTV, so I told her to get one of those before I decide to get the PS3, lol.

And I think I'm still going to get a CO2 tank once my tank sets up for a while. I still need to make my hood, buy plants and stock it with fish, lol. It's so incomplete D:


----------



## SimplyOrange (Oct 5, 2007)

lol, but dont worry xmas is around the corner.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Haha, well, I was gonna use my own money, but my mom doens't really let me use it freely either.
But my xmas present was supposed to be a trip to Japan... But tickets are way too expensive, so it might turn out I can't go if it doesn't get A LOT cheaper.
So maybe just get a ps3 and some fishy stuff  Also considering a 360 cause of halo. But all my friends already have 360's, so maybe not. don't want to pay for online either. But of course, I'll probably get neither in the end, lol.

And if my mom does let me get the stuff, should I get co2 or filter first? If I get co2 first, I only have a 2 nano diffusers, but I'm sure that won't work out well for pressurized for a huge tank. If I get like a $30 diffuser, I might as well wait and save that money for a filter and make a reactor.


----------



## Felf808 (Mar 21, 2006)

I would say go for co2 first since you can use it on existing tanks and reap the benefits while you're saving up for a bigger tank. Keep in mind that co2 refills and tanks are really expensive from gaspro(the only local source). I paid $140+tax for a 10lb tank and about $30 for the co2; I also have a 20lb tank which runs $180+tax and about $50 for co2 but I was lucky and got the tank for free  If you do decide to get a filter first, I had the best luck on ebay. Shipping prices are astronomical to Hawaii so you always have to keep that in mind. I got a brand new eheim 2222 and a 2224 for $30-$40 cheaper (including shipping) than the cheapest online retailers. If you don't have an ebay account then petsolutions is the best choice since they have low prices and offer shipping via parcel post which is the cheapest but slowest. Don't buy any filters locally unless you want to get ripped off for no reason.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Yeah, I think I'm gonna go with CO2 first. And my dad knows where to get it changed, I think he goes straight to the coke company though and they switch the tanks out. 
And I've checked out a lot of places and the cheapest place, including shipping was either amazon or petsmart for the rena filstar xp3, but I'm waiting for coupons or something.
Thanks for the help.


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

http://www.bigalsonline.com/BigAlsU...umpharmaceuticalsrenafilstarxp3canisterfilter This is usually the best price on the internet. I think it is occasionally lower, maybe $10 lower, but I'm not sure.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Yeah, but they don't ship to hawaii D: I emailed them for a price quote to ship here and it would cost $16 more than petsmart or amazon in total. And I would also have to call them during their store hrs which I'm usually not awake for or at school...


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Well, perhaps you just have to move to California. heh! heh! If there were no disadvantages to living in Hawaii it would be paradise on earth, and that isn't possible.

Seriously, I always forget that I'm lucky to be able to buy things that many people have no access to. We hear this when folks in Sweden or India, etc. post here. But, then we also envy those living in Indonesia or Singapore because of their easy access to so many plants and fish.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Lol, yeah, but we have good weather year round!
Lol, yeah, I'm going to Cali for school in 2 more years! Maybe my dorm will let me, though my brother's didn't.
He is living in a apartment now in SD, so maybe I'll move in with him lol. Then biggy tank


----------



## Felf808 (Mar 21, 2006)

gotcheaprice said:


> Lol, yeah, but we have good weather year round!


Don't forget the superclean tap water with no chlorine.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Felf808 said:


> Don't forget the superclean tap water with no chlorine.


Q: Is all of our drinking water on Oahu chlorinated?
A: No. The BWS chlorinates approximately 60% of the total municipal water supply pumped each day. Chlorine is used to disinfect the water as it moves through the distribution system

From the BWS site, so you _might_ have chlorine, nut sure if I do or not. Hopefully not!


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Hmm, so far with my xp3, the best place to put the spraybar is in the middle. I don't feel as if it gets the whole tank, but it is better than in the corner. I'll see if I can get a spray bar to fit on the side(I don't really wanna cut it though), and then put the intake on the other side(tubing is long enough).

Does PVC work to make a spraybar?


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

PVC works fine for a spraybar, but it is an off white color, which gets very discolored quickly. I am getting set to try a different filter outlet fitting: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+10090+14680&pcatid=14680, located at the end of the tank, with the inlet fitting at the same end, making the water go down and back.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Uhh, lol, I'd love to try that out but $20 for shipping that thing, I think I'll skip xD Unless you don't mind ordering 2 and shipping one via flat rate xD
I'd pay a little premium if the shipping is a lot lower!


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

gotcheaprice said:


> Uhh, lol, I'd love to try that out but $20 for shipping that thing, I think I'll skip xD Unless you don't mind ordering 2 and shipping one via flat rate xD
> I'd pay a little premium if the shipping is a lot lower!


I paid only $9.44 for mine from Custom Aquatic, Inc., and Priority Mail to Honolulu is only $4.60, so the total cost would only be $14.04 plus whatever PayPal charges if I bought it for you and mailed it on to you. If you are interested PM me.

Custom Aquatic is in Oceanside, CA 92056, so they probably would only charge you $4.99 plus 4.60, based on them only charging me the actual postage cost.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Alright, thanks for the heads up, I'll order from them if they have cheap shipping here. My filter flow rate seemed to drop tremendously though once, cleaned it, and it dropped again after a while... I'll have to check that out.

Question though, I can't seem to find it on their site. What category should I be looking under?
Thanks again!


----------



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

gotcheaprice said:


> Alright, thanks for the heads up, I'll order from them if they have cheap shipping here. My filter flow rate seemed to drop tremendously though once, cleaned it, and it dropped again after a while... I'll have to check that out.
> 
> Question though, I can't seem to find it on their site. What category should I be looking under?
> Thanks again!


http://www.customaquatic.com/customaquatic/searchhomekeyresult5.asp and notice that there are two sizes. I got the 1/2",3/4" size.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

I don't think your link works since the search doesn't do anything to the address bar. What did you search up?

And how is that current filter head anyways? Flow any better?
Thanks!


----------



## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

Filter flow rate dropping: Debris somewhere in the tubes or filter. 
On the XP3 the debris seems to go through the intake tubing and lands on the top of the media trays. It seems to catch there, and the flow slows.
Kinks in the tubing are bad news. 
Debris over the intake can also slow it. 

Location:
I have an intake manifold across the entire lower rear of the tank. I use PVC with several Ts, (Quantity varies with tank size, but Ts are about 6" apart) and a sponge over each T. (Aquaclear sponge, 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" x 3-1/2"... I got some bigger sponges and cut them)
Most of the outlets are more or less centered on the upper back, and are aimed horizontally toward the front of the tank.The water ripples, but there is no sound until the water evaporates a bit. 
I have powerheads in most tanks to air the water movement in dead spots, (mostly between rocks and driftwood) but the intakes plug up too fast on these. Most are covered with just one sponge. Am working on connecting them to the multi-sponge manifold system.


----------



## gotcheaprice (Sep 4, 2007)

Alright, I guess getting a powerhead is what I should do. I'll put the filter in the corner and a power head with co2 injecting into a diffuser in the other corner. 
But one of my corners are heavily planted, and if I have another powerhead on the other side, it'll blow all my stem plants down. What should I do?


----------

