# does Csm+b kill rcs and plants



## krissy (Jun 3, 2014)

Can dosing csmb kill rcs, snails, and plants? Can you over dose on micros??? I noticed my nerites dying an d becoming more lethargic after using csmb. I had only a few rcs die. 

I also noticed some plants that were growing fine all of a sudden start to get stunted...


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## krissy (Jun 3, 2014)

My water parameters are fine. Nitrates and nitrites are 0. The only real change is ferts. I used to use seachem flourish and micros and everything was fine.

I started dosing according to the fert calculator. Do you think it's too strong???


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

I've read mixed opinions on CSM+B with shrimp. It does contain some copper, but not a lot.

I've become a little weary of it. The only tank I have that I dose micros in, is also high light, CO2 injection, and a sump. Shrimp always seem to slowly die in it. However, as a whole, it's vastly different than my other small, slow growing, sponge filter tanks I have. It could have a high level of dissolved organics from the massive bioload of the plants and fish*.

You could try running the micros very lean. Most of us overdose the micros_(in the sense that we use more than we need, not that we poison our fish)._ I've cut my micros by a 1/3 and add the requisite iron as straight DPTA now. This way I have the iron needed, but the other traces are very low. Also, Seachem Flourish is a micro mix, so you're double dosing your micros. It has a tiny amount of NPK, but nothing significant.

As for plant growth, a 0 Nitrate reading tells you that you're plants want more Nitrate. They've exhausted their supply. I imagine you either have, or soon will, start getting some yellowing on the tips of old leaves. Ammonia and Nitrite should be 0, but you should have a reading for Nitrate.

*Just to clarify, the fish are small and the shrimp I find dead are intact. It's not predation.


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## krissy (Jun 3, 2014)

Thanks for replying Tugg. I am trying to only add about 1/4 of the recommended dose of csmb according to the ferts calc. I add the recommended amount of Chelated iron 10% to micro bottle also. Do you think that's ok?


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

I can't honestly say one way or the other. There a plenty of people that dose more and don't have problems. I would hope that at 1/4 the recommended you would be fine.


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

CSM+B can be overdosed.

Macros are not easily overdosed and usually will be fine even into the hundreds of ppm range. Micros on the other hand can easily be overdosed. If you keep CSM+B's level below about 1 ppm iron then you should not see toxicity effects on plants or fish or shrimp. 

The LD50 for cherry shrimp is 0.37 ppm copper, and adding 1 ppm of iron from CSM+B adds less than 0.02 ppm copper. So don't even worry about copper toxicity from CSM+B.


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## krissy (Jun 3, 2014)

My nitrates and ammonia is at 0. My nitrates are about 10 according to the api tester. I will try dosing micros very very low at about 1/4 and see how it workss. Thanks guys


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## iseethruyou1 (Jun 1, 2012)

I dont know how much it would take to kill the the shrimp. But i think you would really have to overdose to cause problems. I dose about 1/2 of what i normally do in my plant tanks and all is well. 
scott


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