# Air hose/stones



## Red_Rose (Mar 18, 2007)

I don't have my book at the moment because someone is borrowing it so I would just like to ask everyone what it says all in Diana's book about using airstones or air hoses in NPT's.

I know that some people who keep bettas, for example, in uncycled tanks add an airstone to the tank to circulate the water around a bit especially if the tank is too small for a filter but I just can't remember if you can use something like that in NPT's.

Can anyone tell me more about this please?

Thank you.


----------



## flagg (Nov 29, 2004)

Bubbling is not recommended as you'll lose precious CO2 which you want to try to keep as much as possible since it's not added in an NPT.

-ricardo


----------



## Red_Rose (Mar 18, 2007)

flagg said:


> Bubbling is not recommended as you'll lose precious CO2 which you want to try to keep as much as possible since it's not added in an NPT.
> 
> -ricardo


I had come across this thread during a search on this after posting these threads. I figured that if Diana herself said that it should be okay to use these in NPT's then it must be.


----------



## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Red_Rose said:


> I had come across this thread during a search on this after posting these threads. I figured that if Diana herself said that it should be okay to use these in NPT's then it must be.


There's some wiggle room on air-stones, mainly for fish health.

Here's a situation where you would want to use a small air-stone:

Fish lethargic and not doing well in a new tank with soil. That's because decomposition of the fresh organic matter may have depleted oxygen from the water AND added excessive CO2. [Note: The fish don't need to be gasping at the surface in early morning to suffer from this unhealthy water condition.]​
Red Rose: If your Betta is doing fine without the air-stone, then you might not need it. Aeration not only removes CO2, but it oxidizes water iron, so that plants may become iron-starved.


----------



## Red_Rose (Mar 18, 2007)

dwalstad said:


> There's some wiggle room on air-stones, mainly for fish health.
> 
> Here's a situation where you would want to use a small air-stone:
> 
> ...


Ms. Walstad,thank you for replying.

The pump will not be used in my betta's tank. He has an AquaClear HOB in his tank so he doesn't need anymore circulation.

The air hose will be going into my 2.5g tank that contains two male guppies and some snails. I had set up this tank a little over a week ago but the guppies are now in a separate small tank because there was an ammonia spike in the tank from the soil. I won't actually be adding one of those airstones at the end of the hose because I don't want a million bubbles so I'm just running the hose into the tank attached to an air-driven ornament that releases the bubbles every few seconds or so. I also have a regulator for the pump so I can set the flow of air to whatever I want and I don't plan on setting the air flow very high. I will also be placing floating plants over where the ornament will be so it won't disturb the water's surface a great deal. I've heard that just doing things like this will circulate the water around a bit and my guppies like some movement but not a whole lot.

I do have a small filter in there for now but even on the lowest setting, it still blows them around a bit. I had put some filter sponge in the outflow to slow it down a bit but the sponge needs to be cleaned more then once a week and that can become quite a nuisance.

A friend of mine has a tank set up with just an air hose as circulation(no airstones at the end of the hose) and they don't seem to be having any problems with it so I thought it would be okay.


----------



## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

Some say that circulation is necessary in a planted tank in order to spread the nutrients around. It also can prevent temperature stratification in cool weather, if the aquarium isn't too densely planted.

I have a 20 gallon that is densely planted with cryptocorynes and badly in need of a pruning. I use a small Aquaclear for water circulation. But when I put my hands in it a few weeks ago, I noticed that the water in the middle of the plant forest was quite cool. The plants seemed OK, but the fish stayed in the warmer areas.

Bill


----------



## neilfishguy (Mar 10, 2008)

An air hose wont remove co2 unless you inject it.... you people claim this and you give no reason!

The co2 will be replaced as it is used up if you use an air stone...


----------



## helenf (Mar 24, 2008)

neilfishguy said:


> An air hose wont remove co2 unless you inject it.... you people claim this and you give no reason!
> 
> The co2 will be replaced as it is used up if you use an air stone...


I was just going to say this.

But actually, since the fish and plants produce CO2 as they respire, I would expect there to be slightly more than atmospheric CO2 in the water when the plants are not consuming it, ie: when it's dark.

But I don't know how much CO2 fish and plants produce. If they produce enough to build up enough overnight to keep the plants satisfied throughout the day then you are going to be worse off for CO2 if you add an airstone.

If the fish and plants don't produce enough CO2, and the tank is mcuh depleted after a few hours of light, I reckon you are better to add an airstone, as at least that will keep the CO2 levels to being about equal with the air.

Does anyone have any actual figures on this?


----------



## neilfishguy (Mar 10, 2008)

I have talked to an ichthyologist that works at a public aquarium who confirmed to me that it will increase your co2 concentration


----------



## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

CO2 is removed from water at a faster rate than it is replenished from the atmosphere. Significant surface agitation does "drive off" CO2 and the level in the aquarium will be lower than otherwise, all other things being equal.

A lightly bubbling air hose or a small filter probably wouldn't cause siginficant surface agitation.

By the way, the higher the pH, the less CO2 the water will hold. People with high pH aquariums need to be more conservative of the CO2 that they have than those with lower pH tanks.

Here's a link that discusses that: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem03/chem03761.htm

Bill


----------



## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Red_Rose said:


> A friend of mine has a tank set up with just an air hose as circulation (no airstones at the end of the hose) and they don't seem to be having any problems with it so I thought it would be okay.


Your plan for the 2.5 gal sounds good. With plants and the air bubbles, you probaby won't need a filter, especially after the tank gets established. Either way, you can use fish behavior to guide you.


----------



## neilfishguy (Mar 10, 2008)

aquabillpers said:


> CO2 is removed from water at a faster rate than it is replenished from the atmosphere. Significant surface agitation does "drive off" CO2 and the level in the aquarium will be lower than otherwise, all other things being equal.
> 
> A lightly bubbling air hose or a small filter probably wouldn't cause siginficant surface agitation.
> 
> Bill


This really makes no sense. If the Co2 is removed from the water at a faster rate (by plants) , then the agitation will replenish it.


----------

