# HELP!!! Algae everywhere!!!



## Shrimplett (Mar 21, 2013)

Hello to all from APC! It's been a while since I have been on the forum, but I need help from you guys and gals. 

A little over a year ago I set up my first el natural tank. The fish are doing great and the plants were doing great until I started getting brush algae everywhere. Now I have brush algae growing all over my plants (amazon swords and java ferns mostly) along with a small patch of hair algae that I found, and maybe another type of algae. Brush algae is even growing on my glass  I am trying to figure out what is out of whack to get all this algae growth. That's where you guys come in. 

A little about my tank: 

75 gallons w/2 HOB filters (one rated for 30-40 gallons other rated for 90 gallons)
T5HO lighting w/1 actinic, 1 natural daylight (I replaced the bulbs recently and that's when algae just went nuts) 
topsoil w/gravel cap
Fish: 6 turquoise rainbowfish, 3 banded rainbowfish, 2 bosimani rainbowfish, 2 angelfish, 6 harlequin rasboras, 3 otocinclus, 2 female bettas
Inverts: 3 Horned nerite snails, 3 tracked nerite snails
Plants: Amazon swords (4), ruffle plant, java fern, vesuvius swords(2), water sprite, java lace, anubis hastifolia, and another plant I forgot the name of

My cleaning schedule isn't very regular, but I tend to do water changes about every month or so. In some ways that's why I picked the el natural route because I didn't want to constantly be doing water changes all the time. Besides the algae the tank seems to be able to run itself pretty well. When I do water changes I take out about 40-50% of the water with a syphon and suck up any junk that that is settled on the surface of the gravel. I also clean all the filters and scrub the junk out of them with the tank water that I remove. The filters are carbon filters. I also don't dose much expect for flourish really. I need to get some flourish excel again. 

I think that's a good start, but if you guys need anymore information to help solve this issue then I would be happy to give it to you. Pictures can be arranged if needed as well. Thanks for reading.


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## qwe123 (Jun 15, 2011)

How long do you leave the lights on each day? T5HO lights over a tank with no CO2 can be dangerous...



Shrimplett said:


> The filters are carbon filters. I also don't dose much expect for flourish really.


You don't really want carbon in a planted tank, as it removes nutrients that plants use.

Also, not sure if you're referring to Flourish or Flourish Excel here, but if you have topsoil bottom, you don't need to dose any ferts (Flourish). Flourish Excel is fine...


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## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

Knowing that black algae usually occurs in dirty tanks and reading that you've 13 large fish and some small fish in a 75 gallon with only monthly water changes, I think this is an easy one. 

You said you don't want to do water changes often, so you chose EI natural. But EI natural isn't build for a large fish load. You can still keep that many fish, but you'll probably need to do at least weekly a large water change and/or use a huge filter.


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## sushant_sagar (Mar 13, 2015)

Yo-han said:


> Knowing that black algae usually occurs in dirty tanks and reading that you've 13 large fish and some small fish in a 75 gallon with only monthly water changes, I think this is an easy one.
> 
> You said you don't want to do water changes often, so you chose EI natural. But EI natural isn't build for a large fish load. You can still keep that many fish, but you'll probably need to do at least weekly a large water change and/or use a huge filter.


+1, also actinic actually doesn't do any good in planted tanks, algae are more efficient in utilising it and it also makes iron available to algae by a process of 'photoreduction of iron' ,replace it with natural daylight or something for plants.


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## Shrimplett (Mar 21, 2013)

Sorry for not responding sooner guys, life kind of got in the way for a bit.



qwe123 said:


> How long do you leave the lights on each day? T5HO lights over a tank with no CO2 can be dangerous...
> 
> You don't really want carbon in a planted tank, as it removes nutrients that plants use.
> 
> Also, not sure if you're referring to Flourish or Flourish Excel here, but if you have topsoil bottom, you don't need to dose any ferts (Flourish). Flourish Excel is fine...


My light are on 9 or 10 hours, from 10am to 6-7pm. I think they turn off at 6pm. The tank is in my room so I am not around it much. I don't have any co2, and what do you mean by dangerous?

Ok I will change the filters to non carbon instead.

I am referring to Flourish, not Excel. I used to have the Excel, but I haven't bought any in a while.


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## Shrimplett (Mar 21, 2013)

Yo-han said:


> Knowing that black algae usually occurs in dirty tanks and reading that you've 13 large fish and some small fish in a 75 gallon with only monthly water changes, I think this is an easy one.
> 
> You said you don't want to do water changes often, so you chose EI natural. But EI natural isn't build for a large fish load. You can still keep that many fish, but you'll probably need to do at least weekly a large water change and/or use a huge filter.


Ok more waterchanges. I will admit the tank has been a bit on the neglected side of things, so doing waterchanges more often wont hurt a thing.

I was under the impression that you needed enough fish to give nutrients back to the soil. I will admit I have a lot of fish and could probably do with less and the tank would be just fine.


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## Shrimplett (Mar 21, 2013)

Sorry for all the quote responses guys. I don't know how to double quote on this forum.



sushant_sagar said:


> +1, also actinic actually doesn't do any good in planted tanks, algae are more efficient in utilising it and it also makes iron available to algae by a process of 'photoreduction of iron' ,replace it with natural daylight or something for plants.


Ok I will replace it with a daylight bulb then. I only have it actinic because I thought if I had two daylight bulbs that the algae would increase. Seems it's the exact opposite though.


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## sushant_sagar (Mar 13, 2015)

I would also suggest you to start co2 dosing, this will promote plant growth and restrict algae.


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## Shrimplett (Mar 21, 2013)

As long as it keeps my plants growing and restricts algae, I am all for it. 

Anything else?


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

Actinic lighting? Is this a saltwater tank?


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## qwe123 (Jun 15, 2011)

Newt said:


> Actinic lighting? Is this a saltwater tank?





Shrimplett said:


> Ok I will replace it with a daylight bulb then. I only have it actinic because I thought if I had two daylight bulbs that the algae would increase. Seems it's the exact opposite though.


I think if you make all the changes noted, you should notice a big improvement. If you're looking to use Excel as your carbon source, I would look into Metricide for a big cost savings with such a large tank... You can find guides on how to use it here or on other forums.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I'm so tired of posting this. DO NOT USE actinic bulbs on a freshwater tank. It does little for plants as you can see in the graph.








Most actinic bulbs are around 460nm in wavelength. Photosynthesis falls off to almost nothing where your actinic bulb peaks. On the other hand the photo-reduction of iron becomes an issue. You can read about this in Walstad's book.


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## qwe123 (Jun 15, 2011)

Newt said:


> I'm so tired of posting this.


FYI, if you had read through the thread (instead of just the first post) you probably wouldn't have felt the need to post it...


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## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

Shrimplett said:


> Sorry for all the quote responses guys. I don't know how to double quote on this forum.
> 
> Ok I will replace it with a daylight bulb then. I only have it actinic because I thought if I had two daylight bulbs that the algae would increase. Seems it's the exact opposite though.


I think you're right on this one. The actinic gives little useable light, the daylight does. 2 daylight bulbs is almost double the amount of light so algae will get worse.

About the more fish is more nutrients, this is true for PO4 and NO3, but this will also add lots of organics (proteins, fat etc.) which will induce algae instead of preventing it. So a better option would be to add the good stuff purely and not the bad stuff (less fish or more frequent large waterchanges to remove the good and bad, add the good from a bottle!)

About the carbon, keep using it! It doesn't scavenge any useful nutrients, but it does for organics. So it does help to keep black algae at bay. For example: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_7/volume_7_1/carbon.html


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## vicberg (Apr 18, 2015)

A good rule of thumb with lo tech/hi tech tanks is balancing nutrients -> light -> CO2. CO2 may be dosed or may come from dissolved organics, which also provides nutrients. Plants yellowing/leaves dying are a sign of low nutrients. Algae is a sure sign of light/CO2 issues. Water quality and water flow is also a major factor overall. 

I'll share with you my experience as my tank is a little over 1 year. I put in soil/sand & fluorite to keep the soil down. The tank was placed within a couple of feet of a large window. I started having algae issues, so I got a CO2 Regulator/Tank and dosed. Algae went away. During late summer/winter, the tank received direct sunlight and everything exploded in growth. I have a 22" sword. Wistra was growing up an outside of the back of my 60 gallon, 24" tall tank. 

The first hint of a problem was GH was increasing with no apparent cause. Heavy metals from the water and insufficient water swaps. So I got a RO unit put into the house and started 5% water swaps. My second hint was nitrates went to 10ppm. That shouldn't happen with the plant mass I have in the tank. So I started paying closer attention to the tank, which I too neglected due to it's success. 

I had just removed pounds of duckweed which pretty much covered the top (it exploded also). The Wistra forest growing out of the tank occupied 1/3 of the tank and the corner 1/3 of the tank had almost no sunlight and no water flow because 1) the sun moved, so no more direct sunlight and 2) the leaves at the top of the tank blocked almost all light down to the bottom and 3) the forest prevent water flow into the corner. So I cut out the forest and replanted the good parts of the Wistra, removed dead/dying leaves and found a MASS of algae in that corner and on the glass. It had become a nutrient sink. No light, little to no CO2 due to poor water flow, high nutrients (from fish waste/dying leaves) = Algae. 

Now, the tank is corrected, Nitrates down to 5ppm. But why not 0ppm? I'm noticing slow growth (very slow at the bottom). Why? I have crap Petsmart lighting. 2 marinelands in front and 1 Aqueon at the back across 48 inches. The PAR value is barely qualified at low level 24 inches down. Insufficient lighting. Nuisance algae only right now which the Corys knock off root around the leaves. I could leave as is, but I want nitrates down to 0ppm and the tank looks washed out due to the terrible lighting, so getting 2Finnex Finray LEDS (PAR value medium at 24 inches). This may cause other imbalances once in place. 

Just think balance. Experiment and be patient and adjust.


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