# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Intro + Pics



## whiskey (Oct 9, 2004)

Hi all, I just found this fourm, I was looking for somplace that discusses something other then the high tech tanks.









First a question:

I am having a problem, when I first set up my "low tech" tank I got potting soil from home depot and had huge problems with it, only to find out it had no soil content. I went to a nursery and although they had nothing for me they did alow me to take a bucket of dirt from the ground. This works great but now it is all gone and I don't think they will let me get more for my 30G. The other problem is that I have no way of knowing if they use pesticides or fertalizers that could cause problems. I live in a APT. and can't just get some dirt from the ground.

The question is what kind of soil do you guys use??? Do you have problems with the water getting "tea" colored?

Anyway some pics, this tank was setup 2-1-05 and it is filling in nicely I think the fish do better in this tank than the ones I am injecting co2 into. They grow much faster and appear happier. The molly in this tank was a baby from a litter in another tank, one went in here another went in a "high tech" tank I also have, this one is more than twice the size of the other in the high tech tank.

This tank is 2 sides viewable (front and back)

Front









Back









Comments please,
Whiskey


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## whiskey (Oct 9, 2004)

Hi all, I just found this fourm, I was looking for somplace that discusses something other then the high tech tanks.









First a question:

I am having a problem, when I first set up my "low tech" tank I got potting soil from home depot and had huge problems with it, only to find out it had no soil content. I went to a nursery and although they had nothing for me they did alow me to take a bucket of dirt from the ground. This works great but now it is all gone and I don't think they will let me get more for my 30G. The other problem is that I have no way of knowing if they use pesticides or fertalizers that could cause problems. I live in a APT. and can't just get some dirt from the ground.

The question is what kind of soil do you guys use??? Do you have problems with the water getting "tea" colored?

Anyway some pics, this tank was setup 2-1-05 and it is filling in nicely I think the fish do better in this tank than the ones I am injecting co2 into. They grow much faster and appear happier. The molly in this tank was a baby from a litter in another tank, one went in here another went in a "high tech" tank I also have, this one is more than twice the size of the other in the high tech tank.

This tank is 2 sides viewable (front and back)

Front









Back









Comments please,
Whiskey


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## imported_Creature (Feb 6, 2003)

Really nice looking growth. Too bad your soil has decomposed away. I suppose that's what you meant. I'm sure the answer to your question is somewhere in the El Natural forum. I wouldn't know, but the whole topic of substrates as they relate to roots and has gotten my attention away from the already exhausted (for me anyway) topic of nutrient uptake through leaves and the "high tech" methodology, which I currently employ on my 90 gallon tank. My educational background is in molecular plant biology, so I'm interested in plant biochemistry wherever it might occur, and this is a whole new "branch" of the planted aquarium hobby that is being ignored, IMO, except by people like Diana and yourself.

My initial thoughts would be to use aquatic soil for use in potted pond plants. It's rather fine and turns to mud, but, it seems that it should be of organic nature and work much like dirt or soil from the garden. It's probably been tried already, but I wouldn't know what the results would be. I'm sure someone can better answer your question, but until then, I would read all I can from this forum. I for one intend to do just that as well as to purchase Diana's book...I need more INPUT!


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## imported_Creature (Feb 6, 2003)

Along the same topic, I've been using Flora Base for about 1.5 years now and was really started to dislike it because it wasn't 'behaving' like other substrates I was used to. It just seemed too messy as there were many fine particulates in addition to the larger grains that would 'pollute' the water every time it was disturbed. That was about 3 months ago, when I was having algae problems; the free floating fines were just another ugly issue to dwell upon.

Since that time, I've gotten tha algae under control, and plants are growing lushly, and, all of a sudden, the substrate doesn't seem to be a big deal any more, in fact, I'm actually liking it again. It's probably due to my attention now being turned towards the root system of plants. I'm finding that Flora Base has some of the physical qualities of soft aquatic soil, including the quality that the nutrient content gets depleted after a year. Some have stated that it turns to mush after a years' time, but I haven't noticed that at all, though I am starting to supplement it with Flourish Tabs, in hopes that I really don't need to replace it.

It appears true that in a highly lighted tank with CO2 and dosing the water column, that the roots play an insignificant role in nutrient uptake; one person even keeps a bunch of stemmed plants suspended in the water with lead weights and gets excellent growth rates. That's my take from the 'high tech' planted tank people, but from my past studies of molecular adsorption and transport in terrestrial plants, I know that roots play a significant role in these processes, the fact that we grow plants submerged, wouldn't seem to rule out a significant role for root systems.

I just wanted to relay my experience with Flora Base substrate and thoughts as a possible good substrate for good root growth and nurient uptake in a low tech tank and possibly for a high tech tank as well. I mean, why is Flourite and Eco-complete so popular? They, too, get depleted, so why pay that much for a substrate, then not ever pay attention to it again? Just seems odd to me.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

Nice tank.









I have cheapo bagged topsoil from a home improvement store in my natural planted tanks. It appears to be working fine.


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## whiskey (Oct 9, 2004)

It has not desolved, I need to set up another tank and I don't have anymore to use.









Thanks for the reply, I use florite in my high tech tanks, but I have found it to be useless once you remove the co2. I have never understood why it is a good substrate but everyone uses it, so I did, I suspect it is not such a great substrate after all.

I have been doing some reading, and I have found that Mrs. Walsted reccomends "miricle grow" potting soil in some posts, and discourages its use in others it in others, one such post was about planting in pots. Although she never says it is ideal. What I am looking for is something I can use with repeatable results, and can get easaly, and cheaply. I plan to setup a bottle with a test, but would like some input as well.

Thanks,
Whiskey


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## kenmeyer (Jul 31, 2004)

I use The Miracle Grow Potting Mix that containes N:K 0.18%:0.06%:0.12%. But I have soft well water so this soil helps raise my gh and kh up. On my first tank I covered it with Schultz Aquatic plant soil the tank is still going for almost a year with little issues. Tank two I used small gravel from lfs been going about 6 months with no problems. On my 125 I used eco-complete tanks only been up a month so jurys still out.


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## yalej (Dec 8, 2004)

I used landscapers top soil (not Miracle Grow), which you can find in Lowes or Home Depot. It's like $3 for 30 lbs. It has no fertilizers in it.

Dennis


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## imported_BobB (Feb 26, 2005)

Whiskey-My best results have come form using the cheap top soil from a local garden center and adding (maybe 5% by volume) organic materials. I've used composted cow manure, potting soil and fresh rabbit manure. All seem to get the job done but the heavy root feeders lie Val do especially well with the rabbit droppings. I do cover the dirt with an inch or two of gravel. That is not necessary from the standpoint of the plants or the fish but it makes viewing a lot easier. Typically has taken the dirt (uncovered) about 6 months to really settle down. Yes, it will clear in 3-6 weeks but water changes are a daunting task until about the 6 month line.
Hmmmm...thought just crossed my mind. I dont' ever recall having algae in those muddy tanks...


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## MyraVan (Feb 13, 2005)

I have only one low-tech tank - a 5-gallon tank in my office. I used cheap topsoil from the garden center, covered with alpine gravel (small gravel for alpine plants). The tank has been up less then a month so it's too early to say how it will work in the long run. My water is also tea-colored. Well, more like yellow. I'm hoping it will settle down and be clear eventually, but for now it doesn't bother me much. The plants are growing, and the inhabitants (a couple of snails) are happy. I don't have an algae problem because one of my snails is a nerite that spends all of its time cruising the glass, looking for algae to eat!


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Do you have problems with the water getting "tea" colored?

Anyway some pics, this tank was setup 2-1-05 and it is filling in nicely I think the fish do better in this tank than the ones I am injecting co2 into. They grow much faster and appear happier. The molly in this tank was a baby from a litter in another tank, one went in here another went in a "high tech" tank I also have, this one is more than twice the size of the other in the high tech tank.

This tank is 2 sides viewable (front and back)

Comments please,
Whiskey[/QUOTE]

The tank looks nice. Don't worry about the tea color; it's just harmless humic acids. Glad to hear that your Mollies are doing well. Baby Mollies are just so cute!


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## whiskey (Oct 9, 2004)

Well it is good to know the "tea" coloration is not harmfull, but I do think it is ugly. Will it go away? I have heard carbon can remove it but will it be bad for the tank in other ways? In your book you said continued use of carbon can be detremental.

I currentally have 3 soils in cups testing, so far so good.

Thanks,
Whiskey


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:Originally posted by Whiskey:
> Well it is good to know the "tea" coloration is not harmfull, but I do think it is ugly. Will it go away? I have heard carbon can remove it but will it be bad for the tank in other ways? In your book you said continued use of carbon can be detremental.
> 
> I currentally have 3 soils in cups testing, so far so good.
> ...


If the tea color annoys you, by all means use activated carbon to remove it!

Activated carbon can be very helpful.


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