# kissing gouramis in planted tank



## sb483 (May 29, 2006)

Has anyone here ever gotten kissing gouramis to breed? I have 3 -- 2 females & 1 male (the females are "plumper" from carrying eggs).








Arrows pointing to what I think are eggs:








Here's a more recent photo, with even clearer water:








I've never seen them wrapping around each other, though. My tapwater is hard; is it true that softwater triggers them? As for the eggs, I'm hoping (if they ever do breed) that there's enough lilaeopsis&tenellus on the floor for them to miss eating some of the eggs.
If anyone here has ever bred kissing gouramis, I'd love to hear how you did it.


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## Lawrence Lee (Jul 17, 2004)

I can't say I've bred them, but last year while I was a missionary in Indonesia, I observed them breed happily in the swamp just a stone's throw outside the village I stay in.

The kids will fish for them and once a while, their mothers will present me with a meal of fried kissing gourami.

From my observations, the kissing pair is actually sparring males doing battle in a jaw lock. The fishes in the swamp are around 200mm SL in length.

The banks of the swamp are shallow and still with plants growing out of the water. The babies are caught there among the plants. Water depth can be 2-6 inches deep from where the babies are caught and there's little to no water movement.

Your tank may be too deep and the fry may drown before they catch a breath of air. The circulation may be too strong for the fry too.

Perhaps you should first float a breeding cage in preparation for the happy day?


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## sb483 (May 29, 2006)

Thanks for the comments *Lawrence Lee*.
Kissing is sparring between conspecifics, not necessarily males. Since the _only _visible distinction between males and females is plumper bodies from the egg-sacs, and since one of my kissing gouramis (the largest one) has a slim stomach while the other 2 have a pronounced bump (if I could take better quality pictures, you would see them too), I'm almost certain I have 1 male and 2 females.
But you're right, I've read they go to shallow waters to breed. Instead of lowering the water, I'll just enjoy them swimming around; maybe one day they'll decide What the heck

*edit*: and as for the strong circulation, I doubt it. See 10-gallon hang-on-back filter below


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## LunchBox (Jun 9, 2006)

this doesn't really help, but I wanted to say the first picture you posted of the tank looks cool.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

Don't kissing gouramis get quite large? Perhaps yours at not yet at full sexual maturity.


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## nick gajewski (Jun 12, 2006)

sb483 said:


> Has anyone here ever gotten kissing gouramis to breed? I have 3 -- 2 females & 1 male (the females are "plumper" from carrying eggs).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am almost positive that if they are kissing like that they are two males not a male and a female...


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## sb483 (May 29, 2006)

I'm not so sure. 
This site is UMichigan's Zoology page, not a hobbyist page, and it sure looks like they did their research (they say conspecifics):
http://animaldiversity.ummz.umich.edu/site/accounts/information/Helostoma_temmincki.html

Also, the eggsacs I think I'm seeing seem to match up with female-kisser descriptions (slight swelling around the stomach), and the largest and dominant kissing gourami doesn't have this swelling, and so is probably male. And when I kept other gouramis (gold, opaline) where the genders are easy to tell apart, the females were just as territorial as the males (except, of course, when it's a male protecting its bubblenest). In fact, those gouramis engaged in essentially the same kissing action, only their mouths were so much smaller.

So I'm sticking with "sparring between conspecifics" and not just males. But unfortunately, until I see them wrapping around each other or see fry popping up, I can't prove it

*edit*: of course, not being a hobbyist page, it doesn't say anything about how breeding can happen in a home aquarium. I hope AaronT is right, so I'll just sit back and wait


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## Lawrence Lee (Jul 17, 2004)

AaronT said:


> Don't kissing gouramis get quite large? Perhaps yours at not yet at full sexual maturity.


I'm not sure what size sexual maturity occurs in kissing gouramies , but I want to offer a possibility that the size of the body of water may cause the fish to stunt. Therefore aquarium fish may reach sexual maturity with smaller body sizes than their wild brethren.

I've bred wagtail platies in small water volumes (for mosquito control in a 2ft x 1ft x half-inch water depth, emersed culture tub), and the subsequent generations maxed at half the size of the parents or smaller.

Kissing gouramies grow large. Long before there were "balloon" kissers, I had a brace of regular kissers that I bought from hard saved pocket money many many years ago as a kid. One became a crispie on the floor. The other became our family pet as it adapted to recognising and interacting with us. It lived with us for a long 11 or more years and survived all kinds of illnesses and worms, growing to around 20cm in length.

It is interesting to note that when mine expired, it had aged skin, almost like my grandma's - age spots, uneven pigmentation, dull scales, and what appeared as blood coloured spots like moles or birthmarks. Capillaries also appear clearly thru the flesh-coloured skin.

In the wild, I've not seen these characteristics in those being prepared for the dinner plate. They probably are still young and have grown quickly to that size in the swamp, I surmise.


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## Lawrence Lee (Jul 17, 2004)

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sb483 said:


> *edit*: and as for the strong circulation, I doubt it. See 10-gallon hang-on-back filter below


The way the carpet plants and the roots of the waterlettuce bend away from the light led me to think that you had a current circulating in the tank.

Anyway, if you set up a "maternity net" now at the right corner by floating a shallow netted box, you'll have time for the fishes to get used to the device before moving the couple over when the time is right.

Inside the net will be still, and it'll be shallow enough for the fries.

Good luck


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## sb483 (May 29, 2006)

Lawrence Lee said:


> I'm not sure what size sexual maturity occurs in kissing gouramies , but I want to offer a possibility that the size of the body of water may cause the fish to stunt. Therefore aquarium fish may reach sexual maturity with smaller body sizes than their wild brethren.
> 
> I've bred wagtail platies in small water volumes (for mosquito control in a 2ft x 1ft x half-inch water depth, emersed culture tub), and the subsequent generations maxed at half the size of the parents or smaller.
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting this, so many examples support what you described. For example, I bought these 3 gouramis at a "medium" size, from your typical store display tank (around 10 of 'em in 10 or 20 gallon), and within weeks they reaches this size (medium-to-large, I'd say) in this 55-gallon. And while that growth happened pretty fast, I don't see them growing further. So you're right, they are most likely older than gouramis of the same size growing up in 100+ gallon tanks or in nature.


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## Script404 (Jun 30, 2006)

If they do breed you may want to cover you're tank as well, a lack of warm humid air kills a lot of anataboid fry when they take their first breaths.


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