# Organic Fertilizers



## JeffyFunk (Apr 6, 2006)

I've been (re)reading a lot about biological processes that occur outside in the garden in relationship to plants and bacteria and fungi and ecology and stuff. In almost all of the literature i've been reading, the authors point out that inorganic chemical fertilizers, while able to provide the 'nutrients' needed for the plant, are destructive to the microscopic organisms that exist in the soil. This is important because 'The proximity of microbial action in the rhizosphere is what makes mineralized inorganics far more bioavailable than the soluble inorganics commonly provided by modern-day chemical fertilizers'. 

Now, i understand that it's not entirely possible to match what goes on in your garden or the forest floor with what goes on in your planted aquarium substrate. (Especially as it relates to fungi interactions... Do fungi even exist in the planted aquarium?) That said, the whole idea of organic methods and permaculture got me thinking:

Has anyone ever tried any organic fertilizers in their planted aquarium? 

I think a lot of people have heard about Ca/Mg organic fertilizers like dolomitic lime and calcitic limestone (as in oyster shells) but what about organic fertilizers for other nutrients like N? P? K? Trace? (I don't really want to discuss dolomitic lime as that fertilizer has been talked about to death already...)

I tried Greensand once (For K & Trace elements) as an additive to my substrate layer but that resulted in a hair-like algae, presumably from the unchelated Fe dissolving into the water. 

I've been trying some liquid fish fertilizers recently and have been having okay success with them (I've never had an amazing tank to begin with so i can't say if any difficult species have done better or worse). Neptune's Harvest Fish Emulsion (2-4-1) seems to work a lot better than the Alaska Fish Emulsion (5-1-0) that i bought at Home Depot. Supposedly the process in which the fish fertilizer is made is quite important. (From The Holistic Orchard by Michael Phillips, quality brands to use are: Organic Gem, Neptune's Harvest, Eco-Nutrients, Dramm, Schafer Fisheries.) I've been using those with Neptune's Harvest Kelp extraction (0-0-1), though i have no idea if it's doing anything positive on it's own or not. (Supposedly, cold-processed liquid kelp / seaweed products contain naturally chelated nutrients, amino acids and other growth-promoting sustances such as cytokinins.)

The downside of liquid fish fertilizers? They're opaque liquids/emulsions so they make your aquarium cloudy for a little bit (I estimate that it takes less than an hour for the aquarium to clear up. Not a lot of time, but when you compare it to inorganic fertilizers that have no cloudy issues, it is a disadvantage.) 

Supposedly unsulfured blackstrap molasses is a common organic nutrient for providing trace elements, but i have yet to try it (the sugars in it scare me...). Table molasses is not the same as blackstrap molasses; The later is the syrup left after the final extraction of the sugar cane and includes the solid nutrients that have not boiled out like K, Fe, and B vitamins. 

So has anyone else tried using organic fertilizers? I'm in no way saying that they are better or worse than inorganic fertilizers, but i'm just curious if anyone else has tried them and what their results were?


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

I use Age Old products at times.
http://www.ageoldorganics.com/

Mostly I use it in the house plants and as a diluted spray on emersed plants. I have used it on aquariums but never on a regular enough basis to know what the results would be.

I have to say however that since most aquariums are based on some kind of bacteria filtration and since many people use ei chemistry in their tanks it seems there isn't really any long term harm.


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## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

Too bad this thread didn't had more replies. Because I'm very intrigued by this as well.

Let me start off with what I've read (not entirely sure if it's true). We always talk about bacteria, but in our aquaria there are also protozoa, archaea and fungi helping to keep everything healthy. 

Organic fertilizer, yes it's used. Think about all the feces that sink into your substrate. The microorganisms reduce it to inorganic substances which will be used by the plants. A perfect symbiosis, because the plant supplies the microorganisms with oxygen in return. This is why old aquaria usually run perfectly fine with little help from our hands.

Dosing it as liquid fertilizer? Maybe the new line from Seachem is doing it?


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## OTPT (Sep 27, 2010)

Funny, today I've just received my fulvic acid powder (70%). 
I've read that it's natural chelator that can be absorbed 
into the plants, unlike synthetic chelator (EDTA, etc.).
Thus, improves nutrient mobility and absorption.

It's used in aquaculture too, fish/shrimp love it.

Tried dosing it into my tank, 1 PPM fulvic acid...
Fish (shrimp too) went crazy, "where, where does that yummy smell come from!?".
It didn't affect water clarity too much. So I added another 1 PPM.
Hmmm, I think the right amount for me is 1 PPM, LOL.

People with ADA Aquasoil, you don't need to be excited.
Since there is load of it in the soil already. 
I use plain small sized gravel.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

--begin rant--

It is important to make a distinction between "_Organic_" and "organic". _Organic_ is an essentially meaningless term used to market certain types of non-synthetic products for garden use. Spelled without capitals, organic refers to any substance composed of carbon-based molecules derived from living materials.

As Yohan points out, we constantly fertilize our tanks with organic substances: fish food and all the materials produced from it by digestion and decomposition. Early in the last century, Innes recommended fertilizing aquarium plants with the conveniently packaged feces of rabbits and guinea pigs.

Actually, I think the _Organic_ method, in its original form, is a very sound and sustainable way to grow terrestrial plants, and we can adapt its techniques to aquaria. If you do this, it will look like the Walstad method: feed the soil to feed the plants.

Used by marketers, terms like _Organic_ or _Natural_ are intended to sell stuff, usually at grossly inflated prices.

--end rant--


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

[rant=continued]
The whole natural vs organic vs holistic thing drives me insane. When you tack on that "Aquarium Safe" label it gets ridicules. If you put MTS in a bag with a fancy label and setup a spiffy website with nice pictures, I bet you could market some _Naturally Organic Aquarium Substrate_ for a lot of money.

Cost: Bunch of dirt pennies/lb
MSRP: Dirt $1, Natural label $5, Organic label $5, "Aquarium Safe" label $20

So lets call it $30 for a 20lb bag of MTS. Then you can sell the "Nutrient Seal" (aka sand cap), another "natural aquarium product". We'll be nice and sell that one at $10 for a 15lb bag (when even at retail we can buy it at Tracker Supply at $7 for 50lbs)
[/rant]

Back to the OP. I wouldn't consider dolomitic limestone and the like to be an "organic" fertilizer. They're natural, but without carbon I wouldn't say "organic". With the idea of using natural minerals, I have a bag of azomite I'll be using on my next tank setup. This is a mix of all kinds of yummy micronutrient minerals. I'm hoping it will keep the soil rich with micros for a good long time. (I suspect iron will go first, but the Safe-T-Sorb will hopefully help leech out a sufficient supply there). I also have a little MgCO3 (gymnast chalk) I'll be mixing in.

It makes sense that inorganic salts would interfere/inhibit bacterial activity. If we put a bunch of K+ in the system, the bacteria that release it as a byproduct from the decomposition of silicate minerals would likely have problems and see it as a toxin. To them, it's a waist product like ammonia to fish. It can throw off their chemical balance and the bacteria may not be able to dissolve the complex minerals because we've artificially raised the levels.

In the natural environment, plants can (to a degree) self regulate their nutrient needs from various available stores by increasing root density and pumping more O2 to the area. This would promote increased bacterial activity by helping remove what the bacteria sees as waist products (NPK, CO2, etc) and also allows increased respiration for a larger colony of microbes.

It also makes sense that other microbial byproducts can help plants as well. We already know that some organic compounds like glutaraldehyde can act as a carbon source, and the various acids act as chelators. Who knows what other "waist" products these bacteria are releasing for the plants.

I think using "organic" ferts will likely have the same results as inorganic salts. It's still the same process of shorting around the bacteria, and giving the plants the bacterial byproducts directly. Instead of the organic and natural vs synthetic, I prefer to just approach it holistically. What do the plants need? How to they naturally consume it? How is it naturally replenished?

The last I feel is one of the most important factors we need to work on. Figuring out the best way to keep the nutrients in supply. How can we keep ample buffers of each nutrient available to the plants, so it's there when they need it, and they can drink it up as they see fit. Instead of a just-in-time dosing regime of adding immediately available raw plant food constantly, I want to occasionally replenish a less immediately available storage of food.

Most are easy enough of find insoluble/organic forms that can be buried and slowly released. Potassium is the harder one. It's almost always soluble, so it's hard to maintain a buffer if it's always dissolving out quickly. It's CEC affinity isn't that high; so Ca+, Mg+, and other cations will kick it out into the water as well. I figure I'll just use Potassium BiCarb when I remineralize my RODI. I'm also looking into using Granite Dust, Amazonite, or generic k-spar type sandy gravel as an additive to MTS. I'm thinking I'll hit up some granite countertop makers and see if I can offer to empty their vacuum bags.


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## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

So I think we all agree that organic fertilizer in the substrate improves plant (and bacterial) growth. But how about soluble organic fertilizers, dosed daily/weekly with just sand as a substrate? Would it work better or worse than inorganic salts? And who can tell me a few organic substances which combined would make a nice organic fertilizer?


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

You could probably get some comfrey and make a tea out of it. The thing is the heart of organic gardening is really compost and that is kind of hard to deal with. The other day I went and looked at some hydroponic "organic' stuff and realized it was essentially the same chemicals used in a standard ei mix!


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