# [Wet Thumb Forum]-cameras...



## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

I'm looking at getting a better digital camera than the one I have (kodak dc215)and was wondering what you though of this one (link below)?
I've read that a lot of you guys are using higher end models, but I can't spend that much!
This one is $499CAD, that's about as high as I can justify going!









Just though i'd ask maybe there is others in my price range that maybe better.

Canon powershot A70
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/A70/A70A.HTM

Thanks


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

I'm looking at getting a better digital camera than the one I have (kodak dc215)and was wondering what you though of this one (link below)?
I've read that a lot of you guys are using higher end models, but I can't spend that much!
This one is $499CAD, that's about as high as I can justify going!









Just though i'd ask maybe there is others in my price range that maybe better.

Canon powershot A70
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/A70/A70A.HTM

Thanks


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Somebodies test photos, http://www.pbase.com/****ie/a70_tests


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## captain (May 12, 2006)

I just recently bought the Canon Powershot s40 but I was considering the A70. As I recall the s40 has more features and is 4megapixels instead of 3. You can find the s40 for the same price. I wimped out and bought mine at Wolf Camera for $499. Personally I think you can't go wrong with the Canons. If you go to Canon's Powershot web site (http://www.powershot.com/powershot2/home.html) you can see all the features of the different Canon cameras. At http://www.dpreview.com/ you can read reviews of digital cameras.

Just realized that I missed you are in Canada. So the price comparison between the A70 and s40 I gave is useless.

-Steve
See profile for tank info


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## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

ekim,

The best cameras I've seen in terms of features for cost are from Fujifilm. They are often missing a few features and they aren't necessarily the easiest to use, but they often come out with the lowest price you can get for a given image size and optical zoom.

My very cost-conscience coworker just spent a few months shopping and bought an HP digital camera. It had a very good combination of features, ease of use and reasonable price.


Roger Miller


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Thanks for the replies guys!

I can't really find any other camera in this price range that is even close to this one, for options!

Roger you mensioned Fuji,
the fuji A303 is the same price here so I checked it out,
it has lower movie resolution & no sound,(not realy important)
doesn't mension focus type & no manual focus! 
no Manual White Balance, only 1 ISO setting vs 4 of the A70, no ajustable exp. range,
no Spot Metering, No Aperture Priority, No Shutter Priority, No Full Manual Exposure.


What HP model did you friend get?
Any sugestions as to what options you think are most impotant?

Thanks for the help,


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## IUnknown (Feb 24, 2004)

for the contest I plan to rent a really good camera, just to get some good shots.


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

this is my excuse to upgrade!!


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

I bought a FijiFilm Finepix 2800zoom. I love it. Its only 2mega pixels but that's better then you would need for viewing on your computer. Most home printers will not print higher than 600x600. BUT! I think I am going to trade it in for the Finepix 3800zoom 3.3mega pixels. Its then same camera with more features, Like adding lens and filters. The battery life is fantastic. Both camers have allot manual setting that is a must for taking Aquarium pictures. The last time I looked it was $340us something. One of the best things I like is I set up a card reader/writer thru my USB port. Down loading and editing pictures are a zip. Its like having a another hard drive.

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Hawkeye, 
you should (if you haven't already) check out the camera I posted above (a70)
It's about the same price as the finepix3800 but has a lot more extra features, 

manual focus, 
4 different ISO setting, 
manual white balance + 8 settings, 
Spot Metering, 
Shutter Priority, 
Full Manual Exposure

Just incase you want more control over the camera.


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

ekim, I think I will do that. What I found out after buying my FinePix 2800zoom was all the things I wanted to do but couldn't. The features I want most is to add different lens and an external flash along with manual control of the camera.

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

I have never seen a digi camera with external flash below us$ 500 (nikon 4500).

correct me if there is one out there with lots of functions and a hotshoe (external flash)

75 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
Mike's Canadian Aquatic Plant Page
A Canadian's Plant Traders website


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## captain (May 12, 2006)

You can buy devices that allow you to add an external flash to a camera that doesn't explicitly support it. The device will set the external flash off when it detects the camera flash go off.

-Steve
See profile for tank info


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

Yea, after searching around a bit I see if I want a external flash I am have to spend some big bucks.

Captain, Do you know where I can buy can buy a devices that allow you to add an external flash to a camera that doesn't support it. I would like to read up on it.

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> the fuji A303 is the same price here so I checked it out, it has lower movie resolution & no sound,(not realy important) doesn't mension focus type & no manual focus! no Manual White Balance, only 1 ISO setting vs 4 of the A70, no ajustable exp. range, no Spot Metering, No Aperture Priority, No Shutter Priority, No Full Manual Exposure.


That's a lot of nos. It sounds like a fairly stripped-down model.

I have never used the movie or sound capabilities in my camera. Manual focus is important for very close shots and macros. You want more than one manually selectable white balance setting. Multiple ISO settings are helpful but not necessary. If by exposure ranges you mean the ability to shift the autoexposure setting to get a lighter or darker image then that is important. You can work around a lack of spot metering. The partial automatic and full manual exposure settings are useful but they aren't essential if you can adjust the autoexposure.

The cameras I had in mind were the Fuji Finepix line that Hawkeye mentioned.



> quote:
> 
> What HP model did you friend get?


I can't remember, and right now and she isn't around to ask. Her price range was higher than yours and she got a camera with 4 megapixel resolution and an 8x zoom. Her shopping process was pretty organized and took 2 or 3 months. First she set her price range. Then she read up on cameras and talked to camera owners, then she looked at a few cameras in stores where she could get her hands on the cameras. She also gave a lot of thought to what kind of pictures she wanted to take. After all that she prioritized what she wanted in a camera (in her case, maximum optical zoom with a long lens, 3+ megapixel resolution and ease of use) and made her selection based mostly on owner comments on some web sites. She didn't really care about close ups -- certainly not about macros; she didn't care much about color saturation or other picture quality or optical quality measures; features like sounds and movies were a waste.



> quote:
> 
> Any sugestions as to what options you think are most impotant?


I stress picture quality. In detail I think that means image size (more megapixels, useful uncompressed images), good optics (big zoom, acurate focus, lack of distortion) and good color rendition (bright, accurate colors under a wide range of lighting).

For aquarium photos you *must* be able to turn the on-camera flash off. Apparently some digitals don't allow that.

A range of autoexposure options is important, but there is overlap between the effect from different options, so if your camera is missing one or two of the common options then other options will usually let you get the photo you want anyway. Manual exposure is not that important as long as the autoexposure is sufficiently flexible. Manual focus is important in close-up work and a lot of aquarium photos are close ups.

For my purposes, sound, movies, digital zoom, panorama modes, remote operation, low-quality compressed image formats and a host of fairly common on-camera menu options are just a waste of time and money.

Once you get into it a little more there are a few other things that might make a difference. For instance, cost and availabiity of lens attachments and flash attachments. For my camera any lens attachment fancier then a new lens cap is prohibitively expensive. Same thing for the flash attachment. My camera uses a non-standard socket to plug the flash attachment into the camera. As a result I can't use any standard external flash attachment. The flash attachment sold for the camera costs more than the camera itself. They don't sell many.

I think all of the best photos I've seen taken with consumer-market digital cameras have been taken with Canon cameras. Even their fairly low-end cameras seem to take excellent pictures. They aren't inexpensive.

Roger Miller

[This message was edited by Roger Miller on Mon April 14 2003 at 10:09 PM.]


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Yeah Hawk,
the Canon A70 has different lenses avalable and full manual control but no external flash!

Captain's devices might solve that problem though!


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## captain (May 12, 2006)

Hawkeye, this link, http://photography-on-the.net/forum/viewtopic.php?TopicID=8157, talks about adding an external flash to the s40. The same thing can be used for any camera. I have never tried it. Its just something I found while doing my camera research. Looks like a cheap solution.

For those interested, if your camera doesn't have fittings for add on lenses there is a good chance that a company makes a device that will allow you to add lenses. For the s40 I have, which we bought because it was fairly compact and had all the extra features, you cannot just add an external flash or extra lenses. But a third party company makes a device that will allow you to add lenses. There seems to be a lot of nifty devices out there if you look around.

-Steve
See profile for tank info


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Roger, thanks for all the info, much appreciated!
I might have to ask your help in the future about some settings, as i'm coming from a really basic point and shoot camera!

Thanks again


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## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

ekim,

This is one field where I *know* that other people here know more than I do. But if noone else answers then I'll do what I can.

Roger

[This message was edited by Roger Miller on Tue April 15 2003 at 05:47 AM.]


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

I got this link from someone in the old forum. I am surprise no one keeps it in their favorites.

Camera settings

As for that external device.. it is not really a device. it is a built in senor in the flash that detects the flash going off from the built in flash. Or he could be refering to a slave drive setting which is almost the same thing where the flash feeds off of the internal flash

However, this doesn't really serve the right purpose because you want to keep the internal flash off to avoid the glare you get from the glass.

Does anyone have any info on which flash to get? I haven't pay much attention to it and don't know how the guide calculation works

75 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
Mike's Canadian Aquatic Plant Page
A Canadian's Plant Traders website

[This message was edited by EDGE on Tue April 15 2003 at 01:05 AM.]


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## captain (May 12, 2006)

Edge, I am not exactly sure what the 'device' is. Its just something I ran across. I don't know what you do with the camera's built in flash. I suspect you have to cover it up but making sure the sensor from the external flash can see when the flash goes off. It definitely sounds like a DIY project.

I found an online digital photography course that covers the basics. For someone new to photography, like myself, I found it informative.
http://www.photocourse.com/contents.htm

-Steve
See profile for tank info


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Thanks Edge, I think I read that one before!
I'm not sure how good it is for us "high light tanks" , i'm not sure how important external flash is when there is lots of light in the tank! I'm a amature so I don't know that much!


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## Roger Miller (Jun 19, 2004)

You don't need an external flash to get good aquarium photos. An external flash is good for very close-up shots. External flash adds a dimension to full tank photography, but it isn't something to worry about as a beginner.


Roger Miller


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

If you dont mind getting it from ebay, the prices seems to have drop dramatically in the last week.

75 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
Mike's Canadian Aquatic Plant Page
A Canadian's Plant Traders website


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## Guest (Apr 15, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Roger Miller:
> You don't need an external flash to get good aquarium photos. An external flash is good for very close-up shots. External flash adds a dimension to full tank photography, but it isn't something to worry about as a beginner.
> ...


I agree with Roger.

I have yet to use external flash and I'm satisfied with my pictures taken with G2.

499CAD is about ~350USD. Not trying to push it but for $430USD you could by brand new G2. Camera which I use and Birgit. Give it a thought and you won't regret









Those are taken with different settings:

-macro/no macro
-different settings of white balance
-var. aperture
-manual/auto focus
-var. shutter speed
-spot metering

Cichlid tank:
160Watts (4xT12 NO)




























Planted tank:
160Watts (4xT12 NO)



















Join as at www.njas.net


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

a G2 is a little too much $$$ for me








You seem to have a better price than around here $999.99 CAD


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

brand new canadian warranty coolpix 5000 for c$ 773 (include tax, s/h, xtra 32 meg card ) from a store in Toronto on ebay. It should arrive at the end of this week.

75 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller 1 bps, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
Mike's Canadian Aquatic Plant Page
A Canadian's Plant Traders website


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

After search for the best deal for the money I keep coming back to the FujiFilm FinePix 3800 Zoom. With 6X optical zoom its hard to beat. The price is dropping $340 plus or minus. BUT I have all so been watching the FinPix S602 Zoom. It all so has a 6X optical plus more manual setting along with a flash shoe. Its going to take all summer to convince my fiancÃ© manager (wife) into getting a new camera so if the prices keep dropping I might get the FinPix S602 Zoom. It has all the features I am looking for.

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

Antonio, you might feel differently about all the features if you had a digital camera with full manual control! I can't say much myself as I have never used one though, maybe you have!








Most of the amassing photo's I see on the net were taken with higher end digital cameras that have full manual control! I don't mean to bash any cameras that don't have full control though!
It's just something that I am interested in!

thanks


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

As bad as would like a new camera now my FinePix 2800Zoom will do for now. I am going to keep an eye on the FinPix S602 Zoom. I bet it will be below $500 by December. 

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## ekim (Jan 31, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by EDGE:
> brand new canadian warranty coolpix 5000 for c$ 773 (include tax, s/h, xtra 32 meg card ) from a store in Toronto on ebay. It should arrive at the end of this week.


lucky guy, I can't wait to see your pics!
that's a steal, was it a demo?
I saw a price for $1100US dated for 2001.


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

Not refurbished or demo. It is fresh from the factory with 1 year waranty. Authorize dealer too. It is a very large and old company.

just type nikon 5000 in search at www.ebay.ca

They are averaging around us$ 650 on ebay. About c$ 1150 at retail store in town.

Only this store is willing to sell it brand new with no reserve. I got it asap because I wasn't sure if the store is going to put a reserve back on in the future

75 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller 1 bps, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
Mike's Canadian Aquatic Plant Page
A Canadian's Plant Traders website


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## António Vitor1 (Feb 2, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by ekim:
> Antonio, you might feel differently about all the features if you had a digital camera with full manual control! I can't say much myself as I have never used one though, maybe you have!
> ...


...
yap you may be right, but I do think that my finepix have enough manual controls...that is the reason I bought it.

the most important feature that my camera don't have is manual focus...even without that I am able to control "manually" the focus...
(the locking "trick")

the other stuff (aperture, shutter speed, light), we can get some manual control with my fujifilm camera... (99% of the time I don't use those manual controls)









6x zoom optical, extension capabilities and price were more important to me...

Of course there are better cameras out there...and having more manual controls is better than less control.

Regards!
AntÃ³nio Vitor

[This message was edited by AntÃ³nio Vitor on Fri April 25 2003 at 07:26 AM.]


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## imported_ReefJones (Apr 23, 2003)

I sorry to ruin your guys fun w/ the camera jargon, but... I`m new to photograghing my tanks and fish, and all I have is a 35mm cam. I plan on getting a digi cam soon but I would like to research it 1st. I tried to decipher all the camera talk but it`s all greek to me! is there anyone who can tell me what I need to look for in a digi cam. to take close up shots of fish and plants, and to take full shots of my tank. (please keep in mind that I am a poor college student who will upgrade to a better cam later. also I dont understand anything about cameras, besides that taking pics w/ my 35mm sucks and gets expensive!) If there is anyone who was once in my shoes, please drop some knowledge on me that I will understand! Thanks in advance! and sorry to everyone else, who might read this and unappreciate the lamen terms I need to hear sooo bad.







Thanks again
Reef

ReefJones
--we with the wet thumbs, rule the waters--


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## Hawkeye (Aug 20, 2004)

Check these sites out. Lots of good info.
go here

go here

go here

go here

Hawk

Trust But Verify Â«*Â»Â®


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## imported_ReefJones (Apr 23, 2003)

Thanks Hawkeye, they look helpful, anyone else?

ReefJones
--we with the wet thumbs, rule the waters--


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## António Vitor1 (Feb 2, 2003)

Most EVF, or even the LCD display on most cameras, don't have enough quality...

when I lock the focus, I do have some problems, I have to take lots of pictures to insure that I get good end results, EVF and the LCD are only for guessing, they do not provide enough quality...

that is why I have more confidence on all the auto modes...

what do you think about this?

analog don't have this problems...









this guy have the same opinions towards manual focus than I...

http://www.characin.com/photography/web-show/D-02-techniques.html
taken from the second link provided by Hawkeye

when I see those lovely analog cameras with the focus control on the lenses, that is a decent manual focus. Not forgetting the true representation of what we get on the "infinite" resolution "display" of all analog cameras.

but...
there is no film on our cameras...this advantage beat everything (on my eyes) analogue...









[This message was edited by AntÃ³nio Vitor on Fri April 25 2003 at 07:18 AM.]

[This message was edited by AntÃ³nio Vitor on Fri April 25 2003 at 07:25 AM.]


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## sjogren1 (Feb 23, 2004)

Just picked up an Olympus C-4000 for $336.00 US at buydig.com. External TTL flash terminal; accessory lens compatible (after conversion lens adapter and step-up ring); 4 megapixal; macro and .8" super macro; good photo quality IMHO; F2.8 - F11. It's getting the job done.

** Roger S. **


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## Robert Hudson (Feb 5, 2004)

I'm also looking...

What would be the best digital camera under $1000 with a good telephoto lens for good closeups? Everything else can be automatic...I'm not a photographer, so I wouldn't know how to do a lot of manual settings anyway. I just want to be able to take good closeups. An easy interface with the computer would be important too. Any suggestions?

I am looking at the link Roger provided, and compring the Olympus 4000c to the HP Photosmart 850

http://www.buydig.com/shop.php?prod_id=HP850

http://www.buydig.com/shop.php?prod_id=OMC-4000Z

Could someone explain to me the differences of these two cameras, and what they mean?

Wow Jay! those are incredible pictures! I want to do that! What is this G2 camera you mentioned? I missed that.

Robert
King admin
www.aquabotanic.com

[This message was edited by Robert H on Sun April 27 2003 at 01:27 PM.]

[This message was edited by Robert H on Sun April 27 2003 at 01:31 PM.]


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## sjogren1 (Feb 23, 2004)

Have a peek at:

http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/bguide/0,guid,12,page,1,00.asp

You may find some of it useful.

The G2 is the Canon PowerShot G2 4.0 megapixal. Wonderful unit, as you can see. Buydig.com has it for $449.00 US.

** Roger S. **

[This message was edited by sjogren1 on Sun April 27 2003 at 02:52 PM.]


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Here's teh one I am looking at it;
Canon G3 @ Canon
Canon G3 @ BuyDig
Its the newest model compared to the G2 and ~$100 more.

I have a friend about to buy one so I will borrow/eval first, but the stats are impressive.

Stats on Canon G3 @ RitzCamera

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

One last check with everyone...

I think I am going to go ahead and order a canon G3 monday. Any pros, cons or favorite low prices?

I can order for $520($469 if you're REALLY trusting







) on ebay but don't like taking the chances with something like this.

BuyDig just upped their price and seem to be out of stock.

I am thinking about the following;
www.ButterflyPhoto.com $546.00 & 19.95 s/h
www.ibuydigital.com $547.00 & $24.90 s/h

Then getting extra from;
lensmateonline
G3 58mm (metallic gray) - $27.95
Hoya Close-Up Macro set (double coated) 58mm $43.95
Linear Polarizer (Double Coated) 58mm $20.95
Hoya UV filter 58mm $18.95

Then a good tripod. Skipping an external flash for now.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Guest (May 3, 2003)

James,

You are going to love G3 trust me. I can't get enough of my G2 after a year









Just curious. Why are you getting 58mm instead of 52mm ?

Butterfly review

I Buy Digital review

I check buydig and there is nothing about camera being sold out







. Are you sure ?

Your combo w/accesories from lensmate sounds like a killer. You know my opinion from other posts. Keep us posted.

Join as at www.njas.net


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Here's where experience would count ... if I had any with lenses and such.

58mm is the standard canon size and based on mechanics its easier to downsize with a ring than upsize. With opics, bigger is almost (..almost) always better for clarity, focus and range of adjustment.

That said it has the downsize of intrfering with the viewfinder, flash and autofocus emitter than the 52mm.
G3 Samples
That said, is it a good choice or should I just go with the 52mm.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

At G3 @ Buydig they have the G3 listed as;


> quote:
> 
> POWERSHOT G3 Digital Camera - 7 Days


On Shopper the instock flag was 'no'. I think they changed it to "yes' then added the 7 days to the title.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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