# co2 what to what not to buy



## fishboy55 (Dec 20, 2004)

i am looking to buy a co2 set up just want to know what others have and what they think of it what to buy and what not to get thank you


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## SAWALLACE (Dec 24, 2004)

I have a jbj solenoid regulator/bubble counter, 5lb tank, and a ceramic diffuser. As far as the solenoid, it works great, and it was relatively inexpensive (off ebay that is). I've tried several different diffusers, i wouldnt recommend them honestly. I am in the process of buying a cannister filter and until i get one, the diffuser is the most cost effective/least space restricting. If you have a cannister filter of the appropriate size i would recommend an external reactor (Gomer has some nice DIY plans here http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3102)

One thing many hobbyists use is a ph controller. I don't personally use one, but i've heard they make things easier. I just hook the solenoid up to the light timer and haven't had any problems.

Other than that, a decent pH and KH test are essential.

HTH


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## trenac (Jul 16, 2004)

Here is a link to help make a DIY presurized C02 setup... 
http://sammyxp.tripod.com/html/id23.html

5lb C02 cylinder, US general regulater, Clippard needle valve, Hagan ladder (diffuser/bubble counter)


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## kmurphy (Dec 15, 2004)

Any reason you went wit the JBJ and not the Milwaukee regulator. I have seen the Milwaukee regulator for about 10 bucks less than the JBJ and it seems to have all the same features.


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## Momotaro (Feb 17, 2004)

The JBJ features a built in check valve, while the Milwaukee doesn't.

Mike


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## Raul-7 (Feb 4, 2004)

By Robert H


> The JBJ has a fixed working pressure, has nothing so to speak with the amount of C02 coming out of the needle valve. A regulator runs a a certain pressure. With the JBJ it automaticaly ajusts to the working pressure, with the Milwaukee you have to manually set it.
> 
> The JBJ also has a built in metal check valve. The Milwaukee has no check valve at all, so you need to add one. Cheap plastic check valves do not hold up well under pressure. They are actually made for air line tubing. Good quality check valves can run 30 to $75. There is only about a $10 difference between the JBJ and the Milwaukee. The best $10 you could ever spend.


Also, by John P.


> The (helpful) guy on the phone said "as long as I have you on the phone, let me tell you to put black tape over the gauge on the right." I asked why, and he responded that it:
> 
> -isn't accurate b/c of the low flow rate used in aquarium setups
> -that customers should use the bubble counter instead to gauge the amount of Co2 going into the tank
> -that customers should open (counter-clockwise) the needle valve fully, adjust flow with the main knob to get the fow where you want it, and then adjust with the needle valve. (All this b/c it seems the needle valve will yield inconsistent flow if it's used to contain too much pressure).


Good enough answer? :wink:


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## kmurphy (Dec 15, 2004)

Sold, JBJ it is.


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## www.glass-gardens.com (Jun 3, 2004)

The bottom line is that there is virtually no difference in quality between the two units, in fact some have questioned if they aren't made by the same company and JBJ and Milwaukee just rubber stamp a name on them, although both companies refute this.

As for the check valve issue, a decent, industrial grade check valve can be had for substantially less than $30 dollars so it all boils down to several things.

1) JBJ warranty = 6 months, Milwaukee 2 years

2) JBJ has a check valve, Milwaukee doesn't

3) JBJ has a fixed line pressure, the Milwaukee allows for adjustment.

Some people don't care if it's adjutable or not, some do. My experience is that having adjustable line pressure is helpful in tweaking a consistent bubble rate and it definitely doesn't make setup anymore or less difficult.


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## TWood (Dec 9, 2004)

Regarding the issue about the check valve. On the JBJ the check valve is between the bubble counter and the rest of the assembly. This seems like the best place since it will also keep the water from within the bubble counter itself from draining out into the rest of the assembly. Adding a check valve to the Milwaukee -after- the bubble counter wouldn't provide this protection.

TW


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## www.glass-gardens.com (Jun 3, 2004)

Two thoughts.

1) Unscrew the bubble counter and put the check valve between the regulator and bubble counter.

2) You're more than welcome to come over to my place and you can watch me blow water through the JBJ check valve, it's not all it's cracked up to be


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## TWood (Dec 9, 2004)

Have you ever removed the Milwaukee bubble counter and done that? It's my understanding that it will break before it comes off. But that would be a good solution. Can you sell them disassembled with an appropriate check valve at a competitive price? Not an inline check valve either, one that screws in place.

TW


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## www.glass-gardens.com (Jun 3, 2004)

TWood said:


> Have you ever removed the Milwaukee bubble counter and done that? It's my understanding that it will break before it comes off. But that would be a good solution. Can you sell them disassembled with an appropriate check valve at a competitive price? Not an inline check valve either, one that screws in place.
> 
> TW


Yes, you can break the bubble counter if you're not careful due to the thread lock they use, a heat gun will help, just use it carefully and it does come off.

As for your idea, that sounds like something I could and should do. But to be honest with you, I've had two MA957s with the check valves installed after the counter for a while now with no problems at all, I'm sure water can backflow, at least when the valve is shut, but the valve would stop it from actually getting anywhere it could do damage.

I've discussed the check valve issue with Bryan at Milwaukee before, and never has he indicated that lack of a check valve is an issue as far as damaging the unit (at least in a freshwater tank) and he's stated he's never had one come back damaged due to lack of a check valve.


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## TWood (Dec 9, 2004)

Thanks,

BTW, what do you think of this weird advice given by JBJ? Aren't all CO2 connections the same, using one washer and no teflon tape?


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## www.glass-gardens.com (Jun 3, 2004)

I think opinions are as plentiful as people.

I once set down a Cherokee 160 in a beanfield thanks to teflon tape so I'm no fan of it as a rule but it has it's place, the connection between the regulator and tank not being one of them.

All one has to do is look at where the tank and regulator actually make physical contact to realize that:

1) One washer is all that's needed.

2) Teflon tape on the threads wouldn't do squat to help it seal.

However, I think some people say it helps for the simple fact that it lubricates the threads, making it easier to tighten without thinking it's going to break, which is probably why some have said adding it stopped the leak, they really just cranked it down more than it was.


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## discus (Jul 20, 2004)

*CO2*

I have a Milwaukee bought from our sponsor. Im very pleased with it and the service is what won me over. The guy offered to draw me my own personalized diagram of how to set it up. Answered about 15 emails from me over 2 days, never gave up on my questions. and to top it off wished he could be of more help. 
Thanks Troy service was awesome


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## pineapple (May 4, 2004)

Azoo is a good regulator so far for me and my next will be an Aquamedic. The Azoo has the best needle valve, as regards sensitivity, out of JBJ, Milwaukee and Azoo.

Andrew Cribb


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## Rolo (May 12, 2004)

TWood said:


> Regarding the issue about the check valve. On the JBJ the check valve is between the bubble counter and the rest of the assembly. This seems like the best place since it will also keep the water from within the bubble counter itself from draining out into the rest of the assembly. Adding a check valve to the Milwaukee -after- the bubble counter wouldn't provide this protection.
> 
> TW


Well, I disagree. =) I have a Milwaukee and investigated this throughly. The water in the bubble counter just won't back up against a fully pressurized CO2 bottle. Plus there has to be a pressure forcing this water thorough. A check valve after the bubble counter offers this protection.

I've also put water in the bubble counter when the regulator was detached from the CO2 bottle - so there is no pressure stopping the water from entering. But water still would not pass into the regulator. The little weight there is can't force it. I've open the solenoid and the hole in there is extremely small - about the thickness of 0.5mm lead.

Just one reason I picked a Milwaukee over JBJ: 2 year warrenty + awesome service. Troy and Bryan @ Milwaukee have solved every concern and question very fast. E-mails are usually answered with in a few hours.


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## TWood (Dec 9, 2004)

Thanks Rolo,

I've been stuck about this issue for a while. Except for this concern, I really preferred the Milwaukee over the JBJ anyway. Did you buy direct from Milwaukee?

TW


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## Rolo (May 12, 2004)

TW-

Nope, I bought it from Troy (Glass-Gardens). Milwaukee will still provide complete customer support wherever it was bought from. =)

Chris


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## www.glass-gardens.com (Jun 3, 2004)

I often refer customers to Milwaukee for support if I can not answer their questions, as far as I'm concerned, their support is second to none.

When I get the new site up, it will have a support section specifically for Milwaukee products with installation and trouble shooting sections, but I can guarantee that with all the experience Bryan has with the products, he will always be my best last defense when problems arise I can't cover.


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