# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Q"s about lighting: WPG, mini twist flourescent



## Rob A (Jun 26, 2003)

Hi Folks,
I've been thinking about the lighting I'll be needing (sorry, no tank dim yet). 

1)I've read that it should be about 1-2WPG for low, 3WPG or so for medium and 4-5 WPG for high, But no mention of "K" ratings. Should it be between 6500K and 10,000 K at the WPG rating?

1)I've seen the flourscent twists and the mini flourescent twist lights, screw in type bulbs at wal mart and such. Are any of these any good for planted tank? The only ratings I've seen on them are life and lumens, No mention on K ratings.

Thanks for your thoughts and opinions,

Rob A
30 gal hex community
30 gal african cichlid, 4 saulosi


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## Rob A (Jun 26, 2003)

Hi Folks,
I've been thinking about the lighting I'll be needing (sorry, no tank dim yet). 

1)I've read that it should be about 1-2WPG for low, 3WPG or so for medium and 4-5 WPG for high, But no mention of "K" ratings. Should it be between 6500K and 10,000 K at the WPG rating?

1)I've seen the flourscent twists and the mini flourescent twist lights, screw in type bulbs at wal mart and such. Are any of these any good for planted tank? The only ratings I've seen on them are life and lumens, No mention on K ratings.

Thanks for your thoughts and opinions,

Rob A
30 gal hex community
30 gal african cichlid, 4 saulosi


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## Justin Fournier (Jan 27, 2004)

I would consider minimum lighting to be around the 1.5-2 WPG range, depending on the tank size. The larger the tank the more flexible it is.

Running around 3WPG is a pretty safe range. Higher then that is great.

Going as high as 5WPG is questionable.

As far as K goes, I prefer the 6500-6700K range. Plants can be done as high as 10,000K I have heard.

As far as the screw in tanks go, I am assuming in your post your talking about a small tank, 10G or so. There are bulbs made espicially for planted tanks at 6500K.


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## Jon Mulzer (Mar 9, 2003)

Most people recommend 5000K-6700K but Marcel Lemay on The Planted Tank board strongly recommends a 9325K bulb he uses.

Someone on the board used the screw in PC's with great success (was it ekim?). Perhaps they will chime in and tell you more.

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15XH, 36W PC, XP-1, Onyx Sand, DIY CO2

Crypts spiralis, ciliata and wendtii bronze and red, pennywort, wisteria and java fern and moss.


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## Justin Fournier (Jan 27, 2004)

All Glass CF fixtures come with a 9300K bulb, IME many have tried them and none have had any sucess with them. From about 15 or some people I know personally they have become known as the algae bulb.


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## Jon Mulzer (Mar 9, 2003)

http://www.plantedtank.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1963

He has a gorgeous tank, and no apparent algae. I believe he is talking about a specific brand and type of PC bulb though. You can check out his tank in the photo album on that forum if you wish.

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15XH, 36W PC, XP-1, Onyx Sand, DIY CO2

Crypts spiralis, ciliata and wendtii bronze and red, pennywort, wisteria and java fern and moss.


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## 2la (Feb 3, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Justin604:
> All Glass CF fixtures come with a 9300K bulb, IME many have tried them and none have had any sucess with them. From about 15 or some people I know personally they have become known as the algae bulb.


I guess I'll play the role of lighting renegade again and respectfully say that while it is unfortunate that your acquaintances have not met with success using these bulbs, their experiences do not represent a guaranteed or even likely consequence of using these bulbs. Locally there are numerous examples contrary to this, including my own experience. My recommendations for this particular color temperature bulb (though keeping in mind that the color temperature is NOT the important spec here) long preceded Marcel's, but his is the better documented case and does a reasonably good job of comparing the effects of different tubes (since I've never used anything else as the main lighting element in my planted tanks).

As said many times over in this forum, algae outbreaks are due to an imbalance in _something_. Perhaps that something was indeed these particular light bulbs in your friends' cases, but that doesn't mean that other parameters couldn't do with some tweaking to get things back on track. They work for the folks around here, and I don't see why the can't work elsewhere as well. That said, please don't mistake this for a call to change your ways. It's foolish not to go with what YOU know works for YOU, but I really want to avoid falling into the trap of touting generalities as eventualities, when the facts suggest that they are more likely to be case-specific. Personally I've got zero arguments against using the 9325K bulbs, CF or NO or otherwise...


















 
(Click for pics)


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## Rob A (Jun 26, 2003)

Thanks for your replies. This gives me some things to think about and a place to start.

Thanks again

Rob A
30 gal hex community
30 gal african cichlid, 4 saulosi


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## Vicki (Jan 31, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Personally I've got zero arguments against using the 9325K bulbs, CF or NO or otherwise...


Not only do I agree wholeheartedly, the All-Glass bulb (Actually the GE Aqua-Ray Freshwater/Saltwater 9325K pc) is hands down my favorite CF bulb, and the NO version as well--and like 2la, I've been recommending them for a long time. I love the look, and I love the results I get with the bulb. Red plants especially seem to respond well to the 9325 bulb, and it really highlights their colors. I like to use them in combination with 6700K bulbs in multiple bulb fixtures, but I have 2 55wpc retrofits in which I use them alone. I can testify that any algae problems that may have cropped up under this bulb were not the fault of the bulb, but as 2la noted, some other imbalance in the tank. I suppose it's not out of the question that the bulb could contribute to an algae problem, given certain parameters, but it certainly hasn't been my experience.

http://www.wheelpost.com


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## Ron Nelson (Apr 2, 2003)

Just to let everyone know I was searching for these bulbs and found a great deal on them at Superfishstore
$16.95 a piece!!! I've never dealt with them but at that price I gonna give them a shot...


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## Vicki (Jan 31, 2003)

Hmmmm...that's a great price, all right, almost too good to be true! The thing is I am not at all sure that's the same bulb. The bulb that I like, and that always used to come in All-Glass fixtures, is the GE Aqua-Ray Freshwater/Saltwater 9325K bulb. NOT 9300, and it's not a daylight spectrum. A year or so ago, when I ordered some new 9325s from--I forget, I think it was Pet Warehouse at that time--I got two 9325s and two bulbs marked "GE Daylight", which I think might be what this place is selling. There was no comparison in the two bulbs, I didn't like the daylight bulb at all. I pitched a fit, and they sent me two more Aqua-Rays. If the bulb isn't marked "GE A-R FW/SW", it's not the same bulb. But at that price, I might try one, just in case it IS the right bulb! The cheapest I've found them anywhere is $25.99 at That Fish Place.

http://www.wheelpost.com


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## Ron Nelson (Apr 2, 2003)

What made me think they were the right one is this bit on the webpage-

"THESE ARE THE BULBS THAT COME IN THE OCEANIC/ALL-GLASS PC STRIPS."

Not sure but I'm still thinking I'll give them a shot...


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## Ron Nelson (Apr 2, 2003)

I sent an email to Superfishstore about these bulbs and go a reply stating that they are now longer carrying them so I guess it doesn't matter how cheap they used to be or if they are the right ones...

Ron


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## Justin Fournier (Jan 27, 2004)

I am actually glad to hear that you two, 2la and Vicki have had sucess with these bulbs. This makes it much easier for me to get people CF fixtures because I no longer will reccomend people change the bulb, thus lowering the cost. 

Personally I put the bulbs over one of my tanks, replacing 6700K's and I got an algae bloom in 2 days. Switched back, never touched anything and the algae was gone within a few more days. That only confirmed what customers had told me. 

Keeping that in mind, I recently took my VERY pink bulbs (ZooMed's FloraSun) off my tank and replaced them with 6700K CF's. The new CF's do not show the red off like the old bulbs did, and the algae production has notably steped up from non existant to some fat algae eaters. 

Wondering if just the LARGE spectrum change is enough to cause algae outbreaks.....


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## Steve Hampton (Feb 13, 2004)

Hi Justin,

I too am a big fan of the 9325K bulbs. We are mostly a quiet legion LOL!

Regarding the algae problems, while I will often times say that lighting doesn't cause algae it's a CO2 or nutrient imbalance that causes algae...that phrase is always open for modification. A tank that's already teetering on the edge of being out of balance could very well be sent into algae land with a change of lamp type. But, I've never seen any evidence supporting a claim that a certain temperature (Kelvin) of light could favor algal growth.


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## countrymouse (Jul 6, 2003)

Rob, back to one of your first questions, the color temp of the spiral fluorescents at Walmart is 2700K. You may have noticed that the packages say "soft white." They're made to replace soft white incandescent bulbs. 

1000bulbs.com has spirals in 5000K and 6700K color temperatures, but it takes a while to get them in after you order them, because they have to wait for their supplier. I have GE daylight postlights (15 watts, 6700K, Lowes, $16) in 2 incandescent striplights (Petsmart, @$20) behind my twin-tube fixture on my 55g. I'm replacing them with 23 watt bulbs from 1000bulbs ($6 each plus shipping) to get 172 watts rather than 140. 

One thing I noticed about using the 2 incandescent fixtures on the back of the tank: the double socket sits in the middle of the fixture so that the 2 bulbs point outward from the middle. It eliminated the shadow that the reinforcing bar across the middle of the tank used to throw. When I had to set up a 10-gallon "sick tank" I opted for an incandescent over it with two 10-watt screw-ins; the light distribution seems to be better than it was last time I used a flourescent tube fixture over the ten.


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## Justin Fournier (Jan 27, 2004)

I guess I could consider my tank as being on the edge of "balance" I have very high nutrient levels, a lot of light and high C02. If my C02 goes out of wack, I will surely get some algae. Interesting. Perhaps maintaining a fast grow planted tank is teetering on the edge of unbalance. I would have to say it is because if any one nutrient or anything is removed, crash.

Getting back on topic. From what I have seen in my store (Big Al's) The 50/50 is not great for planted tanks. The Coralife Color Max is too purple, like a power glo by hagen and a All Glass screw in is 6500K, works good!


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