# Expired fish food and NPT.



## Evil-Lynn (Apr 6, 2009)

I just realized I have been feeding my fish 8 month expired food for the last 5 months. Yeah I bought one of those large Nutrafin Max boxes for small tropical fish. I kept the food in a dry, fresh dark place all of this time: no access to humidity or sunlight. The fish are healthy, as I read in some sites expired food doesn't cause much harm to them.

I also read that that fish food truly expires when it doesn't stink anymore. Mine stinks horribly as usual. Why is that? are nutrients somehow related to the stench? How would "expired" food affect the ecology of the NPT? Would plants be getting less nutrients? Mine seem to be doing good. I really wouldn't like to throw away all this food specially if it still smells nasty.


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## Jane in Upton (Aug 10, 2005)

I'm not too sure about the "nasty" smell being a good thing or a bad thing.

Some foods, like some of Ken's blends ( http://www.kensfish.com/ ) come with instructions to freeze the bulk of it, and re-fill a smaller container to keep handy (and at room temp) as you use it. This is so that the fish oils don't go rancid, and the moisture doesn't cause decomposition to get very far.

A rich, fishy smell is a testament to the ingredients that the food contains. But, if you're smelling something, that means that volatile compounds are being released (and no longer in the food), or others are decomposing.

Some vitamins, like Vitamin C, will deteriorate over time. Some fish foods claim to contain "stabilized Vitamin C". But I doubt you're doing any harm to your fish or the bacterial load in the tank. And, I think the "expiration" date is a VERY conservative date (in order to sell more fish food). I wouldn't use stuff that is of undetermined age; it always cracks me up when a listing for used aquarium equipment lists all the foods included.... a dusty jar of food of unknown age not something I'd keep, IMO.

My best guess is that your fish food is still fine. You might want to freeze the remainder, and take it out as you need it. If you do, be sure to defrost the portion in the Fridge for 24 hours - going from freezer straight to room temp, the warming material may absorb quite a bit of moisture, which would hasten the deterioration.

I've stopped buying larger quantities of fish food, tempting as it is when you calculate the cost per ounce (with the exception of the Ken's stuff, which only comes in larger portions, and which I freeze). I would figure about a year past the expiration is still usable. But that's just my opinion. Also, I like to mix it up a bit, feeding a variety of foods and some blanched veggies, figuring if one is deficient, another may have the missing nutrients. I like variety for them.

If you're really worried, get a supplemental food to alternate feedings, or add some fresh veggies. Some fish (goldfish, and some livebearers) are very fond of the pith from citrus fruit. But excercise caution when introducing these types of foods! Feed only TINY quantities until they learn to eat it, and remove it after 1 hour, otherwise it just decomposes.

Hope this helps!
-Jane


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## Forgotten Path (Apr 3, 2009)

As far as I know, most fish foods take a long time to go bad in the traditional sense (hazardous to health), but it doesn't take very long after the manufacturer's date for the vitamins and nutrients in the fish food to start breaking down...

Since your fish are still alive, I'm guessing that the food isn't complete trash yet, but your fish may not be benefiting at all from eating it... If you have fish food with a lot of color, I've heard a sure sign it needs to be replaced is the color fading out.

Freezing your food is a great idea. Actually, I keep all my foods in the fridge constantly, even though I buy small containers, as an extra precaution because I am a frugal feeder (I only have one NPT right now, and gravel vac'ing isn't one of my favorite activities)... Just make sure your fridge isn't real humid first (shouldn't be, since its cold). The cold slows down the breakdown of all the good stuff, maybe not as much as freezing, but you don't have to go through thawing it out.

At a recent WNCAS (see sig) meeting where we covered fish nutrition, the presenter said after 6 months with refrigeration was a good time to get rid of it (disregarding the manufacturers date). But he didn't give any evidence to support that, so I think it was more of an experience/opinion type statement...


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## Evil-Lynn (Apr 6, 2009)

Jane: I agree with you that manufacturers might indeed exaggerate expiration dates just to sell more products...Specially when it comes to dry foods. Also, they sell sometimes brands that have no expiration dates. Those jars could be on shelves for years! So apparently my food is still good because it still smells like proper fish food. Thank you for the freezing tips, I will try that out.

Brent: Thanks for your input regarding the color of the food. Mine has like small pellets of different colors: red, brown, green, orange, blue etc. They seem pretty intact so I suppose the food is not turning into trash yet. Thank you for that link in your signature, it kind of reminds me of this program I watched on TV on how the introduction of Plecos in Mexican lakes has destroyed native fish species, leaving thousands of fishermen jobless.


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## Natalia (Sep 15, 2008)

I do not understand why you want to keep expired food? It would cost less than $5 to buy a couple of different small packs of food so that you can feed different food every day. I would never feed my fish the 5 month old food. Most of the vitamins oxydize withing 6 weeks of opening the pack and the food will be of very little nutritional value even if it does not kill the fish. I usually buy only small packs of food but several different brands to make sure that if something is missing in one food will be provided in the other. With so many pet food recall stories you really never know what you buy. I change all my food every 2 months and store the opened packs in the freezer. In addition to dry food, I feed frozen daphnia, brine shrimp and bloodworms, cooked peas and zucchini at least once a week.


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## Evil-Lynn (Apr 6, 2009)

Natalia said:


> I do not understand why you want to keep expired food?


Because I don't think that throwing away food (whether it's for humans or animals) that is perfectly in good conditions is morally right. You have lakes and rivers so polluted that fish are dying because their sources of nourishment are all contaminated or simply have disappeared. The same happens in the Ocean. So flushing food down the drain just because it said on the jar it's "expired" makes me feel guilty. 
Yes I know I won't solve all the problems fish have to deal with finding food in nature these days but it's a matter of principle.

Plus, I don't feel like making manufacturers richer for no reason just because they want me to buy their product every 5 months when the smell and coloration of my "expired" food tells me it's not expired at all...But that's just me.:wacko:


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## Elliabel (Jun 3, 2009)

Lynn:
If your food smells like a fish market then you are good. If it smells bad, not like fish then I'd be worried.
Incidentally, I have a friend who works at this fish place in Tucson that has all kinds of freshwater fish for show and educational purposes, ya know schools and such. They buy their food in bulk from a dealer. After opening the containers, they store the food in a storage room that is 100 % dark with AC.

My friend tells me that they wait 2 to 3 years to discard the food after the containers have been opened and their fish grow healthy. So I assume your food is OK. But again this is Arizona and the weather is EXTRA DRY. It says you live in NYC where it gets very hot and damp this time of year. Unless you run the AC in your apt 24/7 I suggest you place the food in the fridge. No light, cool ambient and dryness will help your food keep all nutrients for a longer time.

But I suggest you don't get too paranoid about your food. Take a closer look at your fish instead. It's normal for most fish to have a slightly round stomach, depending on species of course. If you notice that your fish's bellies are looking too flat and sunken in and that they develop a curved spine then I would immediately switch to new food. Those are signs of malnutrition! 
Hope that helped.


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## Evil-Lynn (Apr 6, 2009)

Elliabel,
Indeed my food smells like fish. I called it nasty early on because...well it ain't the smell of roses if you know what I mean!
I find what you say about your friend in Tucson quite interesting. I guess living in the desert has some advantages! Yes NYC in the summer is pretty gross. I have already placed the food in the fridge 
Your are right, I forgot about the most important thing : the fish! I have zebra danios and they have a bit of a belly and their spines are perfectly fine. From that it seems they are getting their nutrients just fine.

Thank you all for your help!


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## Forgotten Path (Apr 3, 2009)

Jane said:


> And, I think the "expiration" date is a VERY conservative date (in order to sell more fish food).





Lynn said:


> I agree with you that manufacturers might indeed exaggerate expiration dates just to sell more products...


Rather like manufacturer recommendations to change filter cartridges/sponges once a month... Something I don't think I have EVER done! To much money going from my pocket to theirs...


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## Natalia (Sep 15, 2008)

Evil-Lynn,

I did not suggest you to dump your fish food into the river. I hope you discard all your waste, not just fish food, in eco-responsible manner. In fact, I suggested exact opposite. Buy smaller packs and share with your friends, so hopefully you do not have leftovers beyond the expiration date.

It is easy to say that the manufacturer is just after your money when he stamps the expiration date on the pack. It is not that simple. There is a research process involved that determines the shelf life of the product in a standard storage conditions based on the chemical analysis and not based on whether the smell is nasty or not. I would not brush that aside so easily.

How many of you would eat the food that is 5 months beyond the expiration date? Likewise, I did not see many cat/ dog owners that would deliberately feed expired food to their pets. Yet when it comes to fish, there are different standards. Let's try and see if the backs get bent and bellies get swollen! Well, if your fish get to that point it will be too late to change the food. Nutrient deficiencies do not appear overnight but rather accumulate over time, but when they become apparent it is the point of no return.

There are many ways to take care of the environment. Perhaps, take a public transportation instead of driving, do not leave your water running unnecessary, go by stairs instead of taking the elevator, etc. 

Feeding your pets expired food or not doing enough water changes in the name of saving the environment is a sick philosophy.


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