# wall cabinets for a stand?



## Dr. Tankenstein (Oct 28, 2006)

I was wondering if anyone had ever used standard wall cabinets as a tank stand? I'm looking for a new "furniture grade" stand for my standard 55 gallon tank. I found a kitchen wall cabinet made out of red oak that measures 24" long x 12" deep x 30 inches high at Home Depot for $68.00. I was thinking of screwing two of them together. The problem with my existing Perfecto (I think) stand is that it won't hold a 10 gallon or 15 gallon tall tank in it. I'm building out a discus tank and want to age/heat my water changes ahead of time. They (the new cabinets) are definitely as strong as my existing stand and ataching two toghether would provide for an excellent brace down the center. I figure, top it off with piece of stainable birch plywood, a little millwork for trim and presto! A cabinet quality stand for well under $200. Thoughts?!?!


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## onemyndseye (May 12, 2006)

I use a wall cabinet probably very much like the one youre talking about for a 10gallon stand... its about 22" long (came from HomeDepot) and it is indeed very sturdy

Its probably very doable  Though you could probably build a nice stand for less.... Unless you are "carpentry challenged" like me 

Take Care,
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## Dataseeker (Sep 3, 2006)

Although these type of cabinets will certainly hold a weight of approx. 500 lbs. vertically, especially since you are fastening two together, you will need to be careful about horizontal pressure like accidentally bumping the sides of the full tank if the unit will be free standing. In use as a wall cabinet they do not have any lateral pressure. The back panel is usually either thin plywood or a finished masonite. Depending on how the cabinet is constructed you may want to consider adding a thicker panel to the back from either outside or inside. It should look very nice when you are done.


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## werner (Jul 6, 2006)

I'm planning to do this sort of thing for a bigger tank using base cabinets. Ikea also has reasonably priced cabinets as well as drawers/racks for organizing your ferts, etc.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

You might also consider adding 2x4 vertical studs inside of the cabinets where the four corners of the tank will be. It should work find though.


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## JERP (Feb 4, 2003)

Cabinets aren't nearly as strong as tank stands. If you look at a stand, it is either solid wood or heavy framing with MDF covering. A kitchen cabinet is usually unreinforced MDF and is not designed to carry a load. If you really want to use a kitchen cabinet, I would reinforce it. BTW, you might be able to have a cabinet maker build you a nice one for a somewhat reasonable price.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Cheap kitchen cabinets are made of particle board, as are cheap aquarium stands. Particle board absorbs water, swells by about 50%, and never shrinks back, and the swelled particle board is not at all strong. But, higher priced kitchen cabinets may be made of MDF, which is not affected to any great extent by water. If you used two wall cabinets as you described, with a sheet of almost any plywood across the back of the combination, it would be stronger than almost any stand you would buy at the LFS. I don't think any internal reinforcement would be needed, and I wouldn't add any. One possible internal brace that could be useful is across the top of the front openings of the cabinets. That would give more resistance to racking in the front of the assembly. But, if these are face frame cabinets they already have that.

When you check further into this I think you will be astonished by how high the price of kitchen cabinets is. Learning a few woodworking skills looks like a great idea after that.

One more thing: most face frame style kitchen cabinets have the face frame edge extend a bit beyond the sides of the cabinet, so the fit together easier on the wall. So, you can't just attach two together unless you use a shim between them to make up for that extension of the face frame. Or, if you are handy with a plane, you can trim off the extension of the face frames flush with the sides.


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## JERP (Feb 4, 2003)

Atlanta a metro area, so you should some good LFS. LFS rarely stock the nice stands. Nice stands are more expensive and slow to sell. Ask to see the catalog for furniture grade stands.


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## schaadrak (Aug 18, 2006)

Most metro areas have stores that buy "unsellable" products (out of production, slightly damaged, incorrectly colored, overstocked, etc.) from the local stores and sell them for much cheaper. We have a couple here in Jacksonville. If you know of one near you, that would be a cheaper alternative to Home Depot. Sometimes if you're lucky they've got a couple higher-end pieces that were rejects from a custom job.


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

I can agree with most of Hoppy's statemments but MDF does reacti in a similar way as particle board unless finished properly. If a good finish is applied you should have no worries using MDF. 

Having worked as a cabinetmaker for several years, the grade of materials usd in the cabinets sold at most home stores leaves a lot to be desired. Most "home center" cabinets are not made to take any type of "lateral" stress as Dataseeker pointed out. The cabinets are usually held together with hot melt glue and staples since this is very quick to do on an "assembly line" in a factory. While the knock down (KD) type of fasteners usually supplied with aquarium fasteners leave a lot to be desired, they are a much better alternative to holt melt glue and staples. 

You can scre the cabinets to the wall studs but I would still replace or reinforce the back of the cabinet before attaching it to the wall. If you plan on using any type of HOB filter on the tank, you are going to need more room behind the tank than the 12" deep cabinets will provide. Screwing it to the wall will not be possible without constructing some sort of bracing/attachment system to allow room for the HOB filter.

If you really want a decent stand for a low price, try finding someone who works in a local cabinet shop and ask them to make you a stand as a "side job". Most cabinetmakers/carpenters can build a basic stand in a couple of hours as long as you will apply the finish yourself. "Finishing" a cabinet can take as long as "building" the cabinet so keep that in mind. In the cabinet shop I worked, the standard rate for "side jobs" was $125 per cabinet. This may vary depending on where you live and would of course be dependent in size


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I'm not sure there is a standard for MDF. I once used "medical grade" MDF for someone worried about the fumes given off by the MDF sold by Home Depot, for example. That stuff worked much differently from what I was used to.

One summer I used long strips of scrap MDF as bean stakes. They survived the sprinklers running every day all summer, and the end being buried in the ground. No swelling, but they did warp. Again, almost all exterior "wood" strip siding is now made of MDF, so it can't be very sensitive to water. It definitely isn't just particle board.


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## JERP (Feb 4, 2003)

Hoppy,
The exterior siding you are referring to may be cementious fiberboard. I just installed some on my home. It is made from the same stuff as hardibacker that is used for tile underlayment. It is not MDF and can't take any kind of load. Cementious fiberboard is quite brittle.

I strongly recommend using real wood, or even Plywood rather than MDF. Many people like to attach screws and stuff to the stand on the inside and MDF just doesn't like that.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

No, it is MDF - it is easy to recognize MDF when you cut into it, and I looked it up when I was wondering about using it, thinking it couldn't possibly be weather proof. Since then I have noticed the growing use of MDF for all exterior trim. It isn't perfect, by any means, primarily because it has little bending strength, and will assume a bow shape if stacked on saw horses. But, if you use the right techniques with it it is good for load bearing cabinets. Having said all of that, when I made a 120 gallon stand, I used 3/4 plywood, just to be safe.


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## Dr. Tankenstein (Oct 28, 2006)

Sorry I've been away from this thread for so long, out of town. I'd like thank everyone for their input. I'll take a closer look at the construction of these units to see how they're fastened together. Honestly, I tought about horizontal force, but forgot about vetical forces like "racking". The LFSs in Atlanta (or even online/catalogs) want WAY too much for stands. My current stand (bought at an LFS in Pittsburgh 10+ years ago) is a commercially built unit, probably from All-Glass, it doesn't even have a back on it! However, all the vertical members are made of wood wood. The problem is, I'm going with discus in this tank and would like to preheat/pretreat my water changes (probably 3x a week) beforehand. This stand won't hold a 10 or preferably a 15 gallon tank inside it. Stay tuned....I plan to post a journal of this build, mostly because I could REALLy use the advice. Again, thanks for your responses. 

P.S. Does anyone know of a cabinet maker in the Atlanta/Marietta area?


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## MoonFish (Feb 12, 2006)

I would add some vent holes. If you have a tank in a cabinet with a closed door it will absorb a lot of moisture. That normally wouldn't be so bad but with particle board and 80 degree water it would be a lot of humidity in there.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

MDF is not particle board. (I just had to post that!)


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## RoseHawke (Jan 4, 2005)

hoppycalif said:


> MDF is not particle board. (I just had to post that!)


No, it's Medium Density Fiberboard. Cardboard some people would call it. Although it might be more accurate to say that MDF is to cardboard, like a diamond is to coal.

Of course, when you get right down to it, a piece of _paper _is usually made of wood.

Great things, trees.


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