# Riiver silt plus Soilmaster



## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I like trying something different, and I want my tank to be a lower light, lower CO2, lower growth rate tank, in keeping with my increasing laziness. Tom Barr has suggested mixing soil with sand as a substrate, so, since sand and soilmaster are both inert substrates I figured a mix of soil and soilmaster could work well. When I mentioned the idea to Tom, he suggested that I use river silt instead of garden soil. Since I live right behind the levee for the American River I have access to lots of silt. A week ago I dug about 2 gallons from the river bank - no, not from the levee!

I soaked it with 2 gallons of boiling water for three days in a row, then drained it and partially dried it. Yesterday I rebuilt my tank, a necessity when changing the stand, and I used this system for a substrate.

First I put about a quarter inch of silt in the bottom, added an equal amount of SM and mixed them well. (An oddity is that adding nearly dry silt to wet SM liberates lots of water - I expected it to absorb not liberate it.) On top of that I added about two inches of about 3 parts SM to 1 part silt, and contoured it to get a central valley running diagonally across the tank. On top of that went another inch to two inches of SM. I used the removed SM from the original tank setup, without washing it at all, and added about two cups of mulm too.

I should admit - this stinks!! I mean it stinks like a swamp! I suspect that means there is still ammonia in the silt, but 16 hours later, no green water.

To plant this, I added just enough water to get about a quarter inch depth in the valley, then planted everything - with my face down in the swamp! On filling the tank and adding the fish back I had a very, very hazy tank of water, so hazy I couldn't see any fish. I use a continuous water change system, so I increased that flow to about 5 gallons per 4 hours, to start getting rid of the surface scum - did I mention the scum? Well I had more scum that I have ever seen before.

This morning the water is just a bit hazy, still not green water, but otherwise it looks like it may work. See my thread in the DIY forum for what it looks like now.

to be continued:


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## bpimm (Jun 12, 2006)

Should work good, I use topsoil instead of the silt with good results. Keep us posted.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Today, after my continuous water change system replaced over half of the water in the tank yesterday, I reduced the water change rate, put the lights on an 8 hour schedule - 72 watts over 45 gallons. And, I am dosing about half of the EI dosing schedule, but pre-mixing them and dosing them every day so the total after a week will be about half of what EI recommends. I have 2 dKH distilled water in the drop checker now, and it is green, with CO2 running 24 hours a day. The water is almost perfectly clear now! The critical time has now started. This is a quick photo - learning to photograph an aquarium is another skill I need to learn.


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## K20A2 (Aug 12, 2006)

All looks good man. 

I'd like to thank you as well. It's mostly been your discussing of soilmaster in other threads that has persuaded me to try it out in my upcoming 75. A much cheaper alternative then the other substrates I might add.

But I'm curious as to why you mixed the river silt in with it?


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I mixed in the river silt because Tom Barr some months ago was very enthusiastic about mixing soil with sand as a substrate - not a layer of soil with sand on top, but a mixed substrate, with a little sand to cap it. I like the look of SM, so I reasoned that it is just sand, when you come down to it. My goal was to get lower maintenance, by using the rich substrate to supplement the water column dosing, then dropping the amount of fertilizer dosing. I also wanted to avoid the big day-night-day swings in CO2 ppm, just in case that encourages algae to grow. So, I dropped my CO2 concentration to about 15 ppm, which allows me to run it 24 hours a day. And, I added a black background to stop the sneaky sun light from starting blue green algae below the substrate at the back. Edward got me a bit interested in using lower fertilizer levels after reading his PPS pro writeup. All of this together led to the tank being as it is.

The water is almost crystal clear today, the third day!


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

I wonder if you will need to fertilize at all with the river silt. You don't think that it will provide enough nutrients, especially with your lower light levels? 

AaronT has had great success with soil, CO2, higher light and no dosing. I don't know how river silt compares to soil, nutrient wise, but I recall that Aaron has said that if he doses, it triggers algae. 

Good luck with this one! I will be watching this thread.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

I think I need water column fertilizing for my anubias/Java Fern Windelov log, on the right in the photo, since those roots are only slightly in the substrate. And, stem plants seem to be largely water column feeders, with the roots just acting to anchor the plant. At least that is my impression. So, by doing more dilute water fertilizing along with the rich substrate I figure I get the best of both worlds. But, this is pretty new to me, so I won't be surprised if I am wrong. If we all learn from mistakes, I should be a walking encyclopedia by now!


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## Haeun (Oct 19, 2006)

I guess the idea is that silt has a lot of nutrients to it. I am interested to see how this works out. As much as I'd love to use Aquasoil in all of my tanks, my wallet won't let me, so I may have to compromise with this mixture (if it works out) in my "lesser" tanks.


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## bpimm (Jun 12, 2006)

hoppycalif said:


> I think I need water column fertilizing for my anubias/Java Fern Windelov log, on the right in the photo, since those roots are only slightly in the substrate. And, stem plants seem to be largely water column feeders, with the roots just acting to anchor the plant. At least that is my impression. So, by doing more dilute water fertilizing along with the rich substrate I figure I get the best of both worlds. But, this is pretty new to me, so I won't be surprised if I am wrong. If we all learn from mistakes, I should be a walking encyclopedia by now!


I have had Java fern and Anubias in soil tanks without needing water column ferts, Stem plants have done well also.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Eleven days after the tank was set up, and it is doing beautifully. Everything is growing, looking good, and growing better than when I had just SM as a substrate, with more fertilizing and more CO2 during the photo period. It can still all crash at any time, but for now I couldn't be more pleased. Note, if you compare this photo with the first one, the substrate contouring is collapsing just as it does with most substrates.


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

hoppycalif said:


> It can still all crash at any time,


Love the positive mental attitude Hoppy!!!  
Reminds me of that saying, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you"!

The plant growth's looking great and I'm sure it'll continue to do so.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

ed seeley said:


> Love the positive mental attitude Hoppy!!!
> Reminds me of that saying, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you"!
> 
> The plant growth's looking great and I'm sure it'll continue to do so.


Yes, I am paranoid and the Anti-Aquarium Gods are all out to get me!

Seriously, my only point in saying that is to avoid anyone thinking that a 11 day test is definitive. I am, as I said, absolutely pleased with it, but there are still things I haven't done. For example, I need to start pruning very soon, and if I pull up a stem plant I might run into a problem, even though I don't expect to. Then, there are the algae, none of which is now a problem, but I have been down that path before! If I can keep this going well for at least 6 months I will be ready to recommend that others try it, but not before.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

It has been 16 days now, and this is still a fantastic setup! Yesterday I pulled out a Lobelia Cardinalis, small form, and replanted it further back. All that happened was a very small cloud of silt that immediately settled. I have pruned twice now, replanting about half of the cuttings, also with no problems. Everything is growing very well with very good color.

No green water after disturbing the substrate, no GDA, no BBA (some minor spots on some leaves have vanished), and only a tiny bit of dark green spot algae on older Annubias nana, petite leaves. This has been the most successful start up of a tank I have ever had, so far.

My continuous water change system is steadily changing about 5-10 gallons of water per day, which translates into 2 50% water changes a week. That could be cut back, but I still need the drain water for patio plants, so I have left it alone.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Three weeks after being set up, the first real algae problems have surfaced. Last night I found I had GSA and very thin GDA on the glass. I scraped it all off, added some more phosphate, and decided to increase my dosing to full EI amounts. Then this morning I found a little new BBA on a few leaves. I will be doing the 2X Excel treatment this afternoon. And, I am trying to decide whether or not to up my CO2 dosing back to 30 ppm, with the CO2 shut off at night. But, with all of that, this is by far the most success I have had with a tank.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

Thanks for the update, Hoppy.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

This has been about 5 weeks now, and the tank is the best one I have ever set up. I'm ready to say that SM mixed with river silt, topped with more SM is a superb substrate!



















Unless something drastic happens, unlikely as that is, this is my last report on this.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

Hoppy, it looks beautiful! This tank looks like another convincing argument for the power of a nutrient-rich substrate. This shows that you don't need aquasoil (and a huge bank account  ) to build a great substrate. Nice job!


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

Wow Hoppy, great result! Glad to see it all worked out so well. Would love to see a future update, maybe after three months or so, if possible, just to prove the longer term success I'm sure you'll have!


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

My 7 week report: The idea of reduced fertilizer dosing with lower ppm of CO2 hasn't worked out well. I started getting some BBA on the small Hygro "carpet" and no amount of Excel seems to have affected it much. In addition I added a powerhead at the back causing a circular water circulation around the tank, in addition to the top to bottom circular circulation, hoping that would help stop the BBA. It had little effect. So today I upped the CO2 to 30 ppm, but I'm turning it on 4 hours before the lights go on, to be sure the concentration stays very steady during each day. Part of my problem, if not all of it, is the plant growth getting so successful I had trouble keeping up with my pruning, and the plant mass was blocking a lot of circulation. I think I have that taken care of now too. But, I'm still very pleased with this as a substrate. It is extremely easy to plant in it, compared to just SM, and the plants all develop good root systems quickly.


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## j_m_lizard (Oct 16, 2007)

As you know, I'm using just river silt/sand in my nano, so I'm really excited to see that other than some expected new-tank-algae, the river-silt mix is working out in this tank. good luck combating the algae. Do you have any fish/shrimp to eat it?

-Jared


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

My algae eating crew is 4 otocinclus and an unknown small number of cherry shrimp who now spend their days hiding out from the yoyo loaches. My algae problems, small as they are, are largely due to the success of the tank. The plants just grow so fast and thick I have a very hard time keeping them pruned back enough often enough. And, that restricts the water circulation too much.


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