# Fuzz algae - don't know what to do anymore. Please help.



## aroos_apc (Oct 29, 2012)

Hi,

I am battling algaes for a while now, read though various forums and tried everything apart from chemicals. I know that to be successful with algae I need to get all in right balance, but I must be missing something, just don't know what. Please help if you can.

My tanks is fluval Osaka 85 gallon, rather deep 30 inch or so. Have been established for over a year.

Substrate Eco complete. Lights: 2 x kessil amazon sun.

I am dosing EI:

3/4tsp KNO3,

3/16tsp KH2PO4,

3/16tsp K2SO4 tree times a week

and plantex CMS+B 3/16tsp tree times a week.

I am also adding 15 ml excel daily.

Adding pressurized CO2 through inline diffuser around10-15 bps.

And doing weekly 50% water change.
















My parameters are:

Ammonia: 0

NO2: 0

GH:60 ppm

KH: 20 ppm

PO4: much more then 5

NO3: 100

PH: 6

Temp: 26

I know that phosphors build up is really high because even after water change it still test for maximum (5) that test I have measures. ( tap water I use for wc does have a little phosphors but test shows usually around 1)

I assume my plants doesn't absorb enough nutrients and that causes the build up.

Also I am getting fuzz algae all over the tank which I read somewhere that it's a sign that plants leak nutrients back to water.



























On various forums people usually point to CO2 being the main cause of algae. So I kept unceasing CO2 slowly to the point that one day I overdone it and it killed all my fish when I was at work. I don't have any fish since then - just 2 Amano shrimps which I manage to resurrected after that accident.

So I think my CO2 is pretty high.

Now, I am out of ideas as what to do. I must be missing something. Just don't know what it is.

Please help if you can.

Thanks


----------



## aroos_apc (Oct 29, 2012)

Forgot to add that my lights are on for 8 hours/ day.


----------



## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

This is interesting.

It is difficult to tell but the algae in your photos looks like very short hair algae. Though it might be black beard algae.

Can you get a clear picture of the algae only? Perhaps take a leaf and put it right up close to the glass where you can focus on it.

If it is BBA then flourish excel applied directly to the algae with a syringe will kill it. It is thought to be caused by high dissolved organic levels.

If it is hair algae conventional wisdom says it is cured by raising nitrate levels. In your case I don't think you should raise nitrates any higher. In fact, I think you should be dosing 1/4th as much as you are dosing now. 100+ nitrates and 5+ PO4 is very high. We generally try keep around 15 ppm NO3 and up to about 2 ppm PO4.

I think you should take a water sample (at least half a cup of water) from your tank and half a cup of water from the same water source you use for water changes and double seal them in two separate ziplock bags. Take the samples before you do a water change. Then post them to JeffyFunk on this forum. He works in a water testing facility and has recently started a new discussion thread where he is testing people's water and we are trying to figure out what causes certain species of algae. I think your water would be very interesting to look over.

Send him a message by clicking on his name and ask for his address.

Here is the link:
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/algae/89126-organics-analysis.html

Also, out of curiosity are you using carbon in your filter?


----------



## aroos_apc (Oct 29, 2012)

Thanks for reply Zapins!
No, no carbon in my filter. I just read the post you included. Interesting read. I will be happy to send samples of my water. Very interested in the conclusions of the research.
I do have BBA in my thank as well, but this one is less denser and it's easier to remove.
I am pretty sure algae is stunning plants growth to a point, but even when there wasn't much of algae yet, plants still didn't grow great either. 
With lots of nutrients and co2 I would expect new leaves every week if not quicker. 
My water is soft, I am adding equilibrium with every water change. Maybe need to increase GH or KH?
What are ideal GH and KH values? 
I am thinking that maybe my KH is too low and prevents plants from utilizing CO2 well. Would it be possible?


----------



## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

When I was dosing EI, this was always the first algae that popped up when my CO2 was too low. A little extra and a week later it was gone. So I really think your CO2 is not enough for the amount of light you use. If you already kill your fauna, than your CO2 is on his max. All you can do than is increase flow/distribution so CO2 gets supplied faster to the leaves and in every corner of the tank. If this still doesn't work, than you need to reduce light intensity. Those kessils put out way higher PAR than you would expect. Are those 150W? Eitherway, raise them or dim them by applying mosquito gaze over your tank (under the light unit).

About the KH, plants don't use KH, so no problems there (Amano uses the same value )

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


----------



## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

It is possible that the high nutrient levels are interfering with plant growth. There is a "normal" bell curve range for every parameter and once you start getting too far away from the middle it starts to affect plant growth. Many nutrients can inhibit the uptake of other nutrients if dosed in the wrong ratio and with such wild values you are likely seeing some of those interactions.

Before you change any parameters take samples of the water so we can get an idea of the conditions right now. You can store the ziplock bags in the fridge or freezer until you ship them out. Jeffy needs at least 100 mL of water for an analysis, so half a cup or more will be enough.

As for correct values look at the Fertilator (top left of this page) and check the recommended parameters at the bottom of the calculator. These are the recommended ranges or values for each nutrient. The exact doses for micro fertilizers are not recorded there because they are usually unavailable though we have made quite a bit of progress figuring out what the maximum values for those should be in another thread on this site (also a fascinating discussion).

The Fertilator
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/fertilator.php

Generally people prefer having a relatively low KH, the low buffering capacity of the water allows the CO2 to form acid which keeps the pH slightly acidic and helps dissolve many of the trace nutrients. KH values of 1-4 are ideal for the planted tank, while GH can range anywhere from 3-18 degrees.

Yo-han while plants do not usually use KH they can and do use it. It is called biogenic decalcification and some plants--though not all--can do it. Vals, hydrilla, elodea plants and anubias are all examples of plants that can split the carbonate bond and extract CO2 from it. This tends to happen when CO2 is unavailable and you can tell they are doing it because a white limescale like crust forms on their leaf surfaces.


----------



## Yo-han (Oct 15, 2010)

I know Zapins, but before they can use the carbonate they need to convert it to CO2 because they can't use carbonate directly. This takes much more energy and is not going to happen when CO2 is available, thus not relevant for Aroos.

Can you measure PAR? If not, I think it is smart to reduce light. I do agree that nutrients can antagonize each other but I think you're still not even close to those. Balancing CO2 with the amount of light is much more likely to improve with so much light.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


----------



## aroos_apc (Oct 29, 2012)

So I did couple of major water changes, got my nitrites down to 10 and phosphorates down to 2.5. 
Not dosing for now but still adding co2. 
I am hoping to find out what is the plant fert uptake till Sunday so I know how much to dose in the future. 

Keeping a water sample in my fridge. Will send it to JeffyFunk as soon as I hear from him.


----------



## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

Sounds good aroos. 10 and 2.5 is a much better ratio. Just try maintain those numbers and I think you'll see your algae disappear. 

Did you send Jeffy a message?


----------



## aroos_apc (Oct 29, 2012)

Funny enough... I have another 10 gal tank with no CO2 and strong lights. Adding just as much frets and levels are similarly high as in big tank. 
I am adding excel daily tho.
No algaes in that tank at all. 
There is no fish in that tank and it's running on small sponge filter.


----------



## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

Excel is a known algaecide.


----------

