# My first 30L tank



## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Hello! This is my first tank ever and I thought I could share my experience with you. I also watched Foo the Flowerhorn's videos and this is what made me to think about it. I've seen after that many beautiful tanks and I definitely wanted to start one. 
Unfortunately though I've studied a lot I 've done many mistakes so please bear with me. 
My tank's diamensions are 40x26x30. I use 1 CLF 11W 6500 12-14 hours per day (when my timer arrives I'll use the 'siesta' method). Heater 50w. I used 1-3 mm gravel because I thought it would be ok but I also think it cause me many problems. Maybe I should have chosen something bigger. I had a very hard time planting in the first place because I think the gravel could not hold the plants? and some of them were floating constantly. I added some more because it was not enough the first time. I did my best though and I think they are ok now.
The plants I used:
Rotala, Limnophila Sessiliflora, Java moss nano stone, Ludwigia Mullerti, Eleocharis acicularis, Najas major, Cardamine Lyrata, Salvinia Natans, Bacopa Caroliniana, Bacopa Australis, Egeria densa, Ludwigia Repens Rubin. 
I thought it was ok to heavily plant from the start but because I ordered them (due to covid) I wasnt sure about the quantities and they turned out to be maybe too much. I mean I think it's looking good but I am not sure if it's going to be useful. The water was a bit cloudy at first but now (day 5-6) it's very clear. A bit of algae too. My parametres are ok for now (NO3 almost 10, NO2 almost 1) but I used test strips because I am still waiting for the liquid tests to arrive. I hope they improve. I did one big water change when I planted and one small (1-2 liters) yesterday to help me remove bio film too.
I am not sure about the final placement of the tank due to limited space so I am sorry for all the random stuff around it.
I saw some white dots moving, maybe worms? and noticed yesterday some wild snails 4 I think. I don't know if that is good. Does this mean I can add livestock? I was thinking just a shrimp for now to eat the algae.
I would love to get some advice. I don't know if I did good but for my first try with tanks I can't complain.


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## Daz (Aug 15, 2020)

The gravel you chose seems to be fine and the density of plants does not seem to be excessive. It's not uncommon for some plants to take a while to adapt to a new tank, so don't be discouraged if you see some plants not progressing and some algae blooms. In my last tank, it took over 3 months for some of the plants to start growing.
Snails are always welcome in my tanks unless they start damaging the plants. Most snails are harmless though, and very rarely you come across species that actually eat healthy leaves.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Looks like a very good start. Your tank is densely planted, and has a variety of floaters. This will help your algae situation (as long as you keep up with feeding your plants). I would not hesitate putting in livestock. The plants will appreciate the fertilizer produced by them.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

This is a great example of a new, densely planted Walstad tank! Too few plants is a common mistake. After the tank matures a little, you can thin them for appearance if you like, but right now it is perfect.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

What is that Big floating plant?


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Thanks a lot for your replies! I' ll add a shrimp to eat the dead leaves an maybe one guppy for now. I ll keep an eye on snails to see if they are eating plants. One of them was resting on the heater! It was cute. 
The floating plant was part of the "floating mix" I got. It must be Salvinia Auriculata or Salvinia Natans.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

Salvinia?


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Did I say it wrong?  I checked that's what it is supposed to be.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Looks like 3 floaters in there, as you mentioned. Probably Salvinia natans, S. minima (or similar small Salvinia), and duckweed. Maybe a fourth one? (Hard to tell. But I like that mud you have.)


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

This guy. What is this?










I know the little plants are salvinia of some sort.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Yeah that's what I meant. The store called it Salvinia Auriculata or Salvinia Natans. So I guess this is also a different type? Take a closer look, you can identify it better than me.  I though I was going to get only the small leaves! I didn't expect something like that.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Oh, the insides of leaves reminds me of salvinia. Why it so big? haha.
Was it grown in a cup?


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

The owner of the store grows and sells his own plants  He sells imported plants too but except from egeria densa all of the plants I bought were raised by him. I don't know much but he said they are cultivated isnide water and not emersed. His store is pretty popular here in Greece especially about those plants.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

hmm, I'll have to get Salvinia Auriculata and coax it to grow big and close together.

***
Actually I just googled giant salvinia and came up with
Giant salvinia (Salvinia molesta)... This looks more like your picture.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

S. natans is also one of the large species. It’s similar in appearance to S. molesta, but apparently doesn’t invade as much. As far as I know, only S. molesta is on the noxious/invasive list.


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

Γεια σου Άννα, καλωσόρισες στο φόρουμ! Πολύ ωραίο το ενυδρείο!

I hope it’s not against forum rules to welcome and greet in our mother language just once!

I love the density you have right from the beginning! I hope it does great all along!

Mistergreen, I happened to purchase the same looking plant from an aquarium store in Crete, Greece (named Misirlis) and it came looking this way for me too. It was listed as Salvinia auriculata, grown by the shop. Note that the daughter plants do not look the same, they turned out to have smaller leaves and not folded to each other. Just like the other Salvinia floating on Anna’s tank. Really healthy and fast growing nonetheless. I think it can double in 3 weeks!

Anna good luck again, the tank looks great! Enjoy!


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

zahtar said:


> Γεια σου Άννα, καλωσόρισες στο φόρουμ! Πολύ ωραίο το ενυδρείο!
> 
> I hope it's not against forum rules to welcome and greet in our mother language just once!
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info. So it's just the older plants that look that way.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

zahtar said:


> Γεια σου Άννα, καλωσόρισες στο φόρουμ! Πολύ ωραίο το ενυδρείο!
> 
> I hope it's not against forum rules to welcome and greet in our mother language just once!
> 
> ...


Σε ευχαριστώ πολύ! Το είχα άγχος πως θα βγει.
I am surpised to a fellow Greek here! It's nice to see that Walstad method is well known in Greece. 

I ordered the plant from the same store in Crete, glad to hear more info about it. I received it just like that, a little brownish on the ends. But I don't mind.

It's doing good at the moment. Some plants wont make it though, I can see that. Rotala for example is kinda yellow and losing leaves. Maybe that's why my NO3 is between 10-25. (To be honest I didn't really like it when I received it. It didn't have many leaves and it was like a big mass of roots ans stems. Maybe they wanted to get rid of it because they sent a big amount!  I added only the healthy parts but the plant looked weird in the first place.) It seems that snails have already eaten some. I'll add 2 shrimps to eat some of them and then I'll remove the whole plant. I try to remove some dead leaves and stems here and there but it's difficult to see everything. I also hope to see a difference in biofilm. Although I cleaned it, it does build up. Snails seem to love it though, they are eating it the whole time.

Thanks again for all the feedback!


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Hello again! 10th day update. 

I got my timer so I do 6h lights on, 4 hours break, 6 hours lights on. Is it good or should I change it the schedule?

I added 2 red cherry shrimps to help with cleaning and they do a nice job! Bio film has been reduced 70%-they are constantly eating it. I don't see algae anywhere. Snails have gotten much bigger in just a few days. When we bought the shrimps they were kinda pale red-orange. Now they are bright red so I guess they like it here. 

The plants generally are ok. I trimmed a bit egeria and bacopa and because they were so tall that reached almost out of water. I replanted their lower parts for a denser look. Rotala seems weird. I thought of removing it but now I see some new small leaves maybe it's doing better. Salvinia is lovely! As you can see some leaves just opened and some are still closed but seem new. I try to remove melting parts of the plants such as broken stems and leaves. I don't know if this is needed though since shrimps seem to eat almost everything. I tried to feed them some pea but they ignored it, I guess they find tastier stuff 

I haven't done a water change yet parameters seemed the same nothing too bad or good though. NO3 between 10-25 , NO2 almost 5, NH4NH3 0. The water is very clear, so I'll do a big water change in a few days.

I have a question. In day 1 when I planted all of the plants were pearling and now I don't see that. Does this means that water has efficient oxygen?

Feedback is welcome as always.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

A complete look of it.


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

Looking good! Lots of places for shrimp and snails to play and do their thing!

As long as you see no algae, I think you don’t need to worry, things are probably balanced!

Removing melted broken stems and cleaning should not be overdone, as melting and decomposing is part of the recycling process that happens within a NPT. Since the tank is new and the substrate is very rich, I guess there is no problem doing it, but all in all you don’t need to clean the tank too much. That means no gravel vacuuming as people do in other types of tanks.

The Salvinia is one of my favorites too! Especially when the roots grow longer and darker!

Regarding pearling don’t worry about it. I only notice it after pruning, that means when plants have “open wounds”. You can have an entire healthy aquarium with no pearling, despite being under proper light, with adequate CO2 and nutrients.

When you mentioned NO2=5, was that a typo? Perhaps you meant 0.05mg/L?. It’s a good sign that your NH4-NH3 is zero, but could you double check the NO2?


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Yeap I made a typo, I am still using test strips, I checked a again NO2 was 1 and NO3 10-25. Liquid tests take forever to arrive. It makes my life harder to identify the colors on test strips. I do not vaccum the gravel, but I remove broken leaves if I see them floating on the surface. Salvinia is so cute, always draws my attention.
I know my parameters are not ideal but I didn't want to cause more stress to shrimps so I didn't do a water change. I'll do one tomorrow because I am kinda worried. I am not sure actually when I need to change the water since it's still early for the aquarium and things are not balanced.


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

I know what you mean with the test strips and let's not talk about the courier services I've been waiting for too long for an order I made!!! :mad2:

ok, to the point, NO2 is high indeed. A water change should help, but I am hesitant to advise regarding the volume, I've never had NO2 problems with livestock in the tank. I think I should leave it for more experienced members to tell.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

I noticed 2 strange bubbles with mini bubbles in them? Are those some kind of eggs or something? Or maybe it's just my imagination. I have only shrimps and some wild snails.. I hope it won't lead to snail overpopulation..


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Likely snail eggs.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Hello again! Day 14
I finally received my liquid tests (thank god). So NO3 10 and NO2 0,5. 
I am not sure what to do now. Will it help if I dose with half amount of prime every couple of days or should I just do a big water change once a week (or more if needed) and just wait?

Snails seem to grow in numbers. Can many snails possibly be dangerous? Should I leave them just like that?

I also put in an Aegagropila linnaei. Shrimps like it, the moment I put it in they went to check it out. I tried to feed them again a pea. I removed the outer part, just in case it was hard to eat, minced it a bit and placed it on the moss ball. This time they ate it all (at least one of the shrimps).
Does this mean I have to feed them something everyday? I thought they could find alone stuff to eat at least for now. I hope they are not hungry  By the way all bio film is gone- they ate it all.

Plants
healthy and growing: Limnophila Sessiliflora, Salvinia Natans, Bacopa Caroliniana, Egeria densa
just ok: Java moss, Eleocharis acicularis, Cardamine Lyrata, Ludwigia Mullerti-Ludwigia Repens Rubin (No big changes, I expected more) 
not that good: Najas major ( maybe I should just let it float around, I couldn't plant it at all), Bacopa Australis (I removed some of it, so I have very little left), Rotala (again, removed some)

New plants: Limnophila aromatica (that's beautiful, I hope it grows), Aegagropila linnaei (funny to look at), Hemianthus Micranthemoides (I was expecting a bunch of short stems. I wanted to make a compact group of it but what I received was very tall and lean. Not sure if it will work the way I planted it)


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

Hello Anna!

Glad you received your order! NO3 is fine, no need to worry. Your plants might get it close to zero, but anything from 50 and below is acceptable as far as I can remember. NO2 is still a bit high, but since your snail population is rising, it is a sign that your fast growers are keeping toxicity in check. Since shrimp are doing fine (eating grazing etc) it is also a good sign. If you also dosed prime, that might have helped too. I’d say keep measuring every day (mainly for NO2) and see how it goes. Don’t expect values to reach zero, as this does not actually happen. If your nitrogen cycle is doing good, values could be at the lowest range, between 0 and something, or undetectable.

You can build a diy snail trap with a 500ml bottle of water and food and remove some. If you see snail eggs (my brother said they looked like a small transparent bunch of grapes) you can siphon them out. DO NOT use snail killer chemicals as they are lethal for your shrimp too. If things get out of hand, a snail trap helps you remove snails without affecting water parameters and/or endangering other inhabitants.

Thanks for giving feedback about plant progress! That’s always useful information. I was excited with Aegagropila linnanei too at first, but it seems that I gave it too much light and turned white-ish. Now it is shaded below the Salvinia and hidden among stems and doing much better. I just give it a little spin every now and then


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

annak said:


> Snails seem to grow in numbers. Can many snails possibly be dangerous? Should I leave them just like that?


I would leave the snails alone. Most benefit tanks by decomposing debris and dead plant matter. Many fish, including my guppies, like to eat them. I have always had snails (pond snails, Ramshorn, Malaysian Trumpet) in all of my tanks, and they have never caused a problem.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Thank you for your answers! Snails are welcome then 
I read that Aegagropila linnanei might lose its shape so I spin it every day too. I' ll try to put it in shade thanks for the info. Limnophila aromatica loves the light! I move the floating plants to make space for some extra light.
NO3 test is funny, I didn't expect to use powder too, I thought it would be liquids only. I'll check NO2 not to reach above this value at least. It seems that test strips were not inaccurate though.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Day 20 

I did a 50% water change two days ago because I noticed some ammonia. Probably my fault because I left some food for too long. I did some tests today ammonia almost 0 maybe 0.1?, NO3 0, NO2 0. I'll check again in 2 days. 

I noticed 3 days ago one shrimp had a weird transparent-white line between head and back. No idea why it happened, maybe stress from big water change, nutrient deficiency or bad parameters ? I fed them some blood worms though the next day and they loved them. I am not sure what it was but I think it's gone now. I'll only do 25% water changes from now on in case this was the problem. I hope feeding them some vegetables twice a week will be enough, I don't want to pollute the water in any way. I also notice a white stripe across their bodies. I read that this is female trait. Snails should be happy though I see their nests everywhere.

Floating plants spread everywhere. I have to throw some away. Some plants need more light and maybe it's been reduced. Salvinia keeps growing too (I accidentally separated it). Do you ever cut some parts? Egeria is growing like crazy and rotala seems to have recovered. Once I cut the bottom parts it should look better than the start. I want to add some feeding rings to avoid moving the floating plants all the time and give some extra light to the plants that need it.


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

You can try smaller water changes, like 15%. Mark (the youtuber Marks Shrimp Tanks) suggests so.

A little floating plant removal is in order I'd say. Be careful as sometimes cherry shrimp hang in the salvinia roots, so pay attention not to throw any away! I dont cut the salvinia, I just remove those parts that have old melting leaves, no matter how big the connected plant is. It will grow back in less than 3 weeks or so.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

I'll do that especially if NO2 and ammonia continue to be 0. Yeah I've seen them many times hanging in the roots or hiding in the big salvinia! Adorable  
I remove brown floating plants but I accidentally cut a brown leaf from the big salvinia and it got separated. I can still see it producing new leaves. If it continues to grow like that it'll cover the whole surface.
I hope to be able to add more shrimp and some fish soon!


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Day 36

I've been doing frequent water tests all this time and parameters have been stable. Ammonia, NO2, NO3 all 0. 

Cherries are doing great. One of them has grown considerably and molted too. The other one is about to molt I think. So I decided to add fish! A week ago I added a single male guppy and since he was very happy some days later 2 females joined him (they were 3 but one seemed kinda sick from the start and didn't make it). He was more than pleased to see them.. 
I try to feed them responsibly to maintain the water clean and not to cause them any health problems. One female loves to explore, I often see her digging the gravel and playing with the plants!

I am pleased of how the plants are growing. I throw away large amounts of salvinia though since leaves are so many that stack. Rotala lost some leaves but I always see some new so I ll leave this plant as it is. I remove eleocharis little by little because it's brown now and I don't like it. Not sure if ludwigias are ok because they lose some leaves (which snails are eating all the time) but I think they grow taller overall. I thought Najas major wouldn't make it but it's also very tall now. I still have trouble replanting its parts [smilie=m:

Do you think I should trim more or remove some plants to give fish more space? Shrimp don't seem to have any problem with density but I wonder if fish can move around as mush as they want. The male seems to "scratch" his tail somewhere while following the females. I wish I had another aquarium to put all these plants I trim  

I also notice on the tank walls and hanging from some leaves, some white "spots" as you can see on the photo. I' ll try to post a better picture. I searched but I don't know what it is. Algae type maybe?
I hope it's not dangerous. They are not too many but I often notice them.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Wow! That's an awfully pretty tank. Fish look nice.

I don't think those fish are complaining, but if you prune any plants, be careful not to overdo it. I would not remove any more than 1/4 or 1/5 of the total biomass. Over-pruning can sometimes open the door for algae.

Many times around noon, I see my male guppies taking naps in dense forests of Vallisneria.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Thanks a lot Ms Walstad! Siesta lighting works amazingly for me. Lots of growth with no signs of algae all these weeks, so density definitely helps.

Angus trying to look cute for the shot which Rabbit didn't expect.








A closer look of these white spots








Limnophila already growing after pruning








Opal digging


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

I don't know what the white spots are, but they look like some kind of harmless fungus.

I really like your tank. Rampant plant growth, so many species.... You have made your focus the plants (not driftwood or rocks). 

That's cool that the Limnophilia is sprouting so fast after the pruning.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Day 37

I am so glad you like my tank Ms Walstad  
I am surprised that I haven't seen a plant die yet, except maybe eleocharis which I don't know if it was totally dead but it just wasn't looking good. 

Those white spots doesn't seem to interest snails or shrimp at all, they don't eat them. Everyone is ignoring them so I'll do the same since they seem harmless.

Guppies are so funny but constantly asking for food  They get more explorative as time passes by. I am guessing Angus is always concerned about his tail because he doesn't play around in the plants as much as the females. He tries though 

Poor shrimp must be sick  I can see something white on her nose but can't identify it 100% Maybe Vorticella or Scutariella Japonica? I don't know if the other one is infected too but I'll try a salt dip anyway. I also read that is better to remove the shrimp from salt dip by hand and not with net so the parasites won't stay in the net and be transferred again. That seems so hard though! I don't want to hurt her. I am worried because I don't remember if this was on her nose before molting. I didn't remove the molt so I have no idea if there are also eggs on the tank currently. I can't find the second one, I believe he was about to molt (kinda white eyes) but how am I supposed to remove the molt if I can't find it? Not sure if I have to treat the whole tank somehow. Will it help at all if I increase water changes (twice a week maybe?) for a while?


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

A salt dip is an aggressive means of dealing with an infection. As such, the salt solution will kill the parasites on the shrimp and shouldn't leave any on the net either. I think the net is safe to put in the tank after the salt dip. I'd happily receive corrective feedback on this.

Additionally, I don't think that grabbing a shrimp with our hands is advisable in any occasion, I consider it to be dangerous for the shrimp. There is also the possibility that the shrimp would flap/jump from our palm and end up on the floor where what's next? Pinching it with our fingers to pick up? I'd avoid this approach.

If after the salt dip you notice small white marks where parasites used to be, those could be eggs, not actual parasites. So you might want to examine the shrimp with a magnifying glass once back in the tank and see what remains on their head. A second dip will help only with remaining adult parasites, but not with the eggs! No need to stress the shrimp any more. If I understand correctly, the eggs need to hatch and be treated afterwards.

If you happen to find molts during the next 2-3 weeks, you should probably remove them (siphon out perhaps?). Besides food, it is also a way to recontaminate healthy/treated shrimp, as the parasites leave remains at the inner part of the "shell".


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

annak said:


> Day 37
> 
> Poor shrimp must be sick  I can see something white on her nose but can't identify it 100% Maybe Vorticella or Scutariella Japonica? ?


Honestly, the shrimp in photos look fine to me. Please don't panic. You may do more harm (via the stress) than good to your shrimp.

I'm sure that if I looked at my shrimp closely enough, I would see white spots on a few of them. But I figure that if the infected ones die out, that's just part of natural selection for the more fit individuals in the population.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Day 45

I've been running tests once in a week. Everything is stable.

I tried the salt bath for the shrimp. I didn't see any changes to their behavior and the white "cone" is still there. No molts either. The other shrimp seems to also have it? I need to check closely. I won't try anything else for now but I 'll watch them closely to check to see if this thing gets worse or not. Seems to be moving though, gross.
20% water change tomorrow. 

Sorry about the panic, I get very emotional with them. I don't want anything to suffer because of me.

I removed a bigger amount of salvinia this time. Cardamine Lyrata seems to appreciate the extra light so I am happy about it. Not very pleased with my Ludwigias. The bottom leaves tend to fall of, they need more light probably. Constant source of food for the snails though. The other plants are doing fine.


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

Hello, may I ask what concentration of salt bath you applied?

In my case, I remember the cones remained for the most part of the first week, but eventually did fell. A few white marks remained (possibly eggs) but eventually they cleared too. So maybe it is a matter of time.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Hello!
I used 1 1/2 tablespoon salt in almost 28L. I still check on them (applied salt last week). I saw some signs of possible molt in the next days? (transparent stripe between head and back) but I didn't found any molts to remove. I ll be patient for the results though since it's not a life threatening condition for shrimps yet.


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## annak (Nov 24, 2020)

Ok, so last night I examined the shrimps again after water change. I didn't see the transparent stripe on the big one so I thought she molted. I searched a bit and I found her molt behind aegagropila (this is were I found it the first time too) so I removed it. I don't see the cone on her nose anymore it was probably removed along with the molt. The smaller one doesn't seem to have molted yet, but I did a closer examination and no cone on (him ?) either. 
So everything ok at the moment. Thanks for the advice ^^


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## zahtar (Sep 29, 2019)

Nice! That is great news! Glad I could be of help  Keep in mind you might need to repeat the treatment after a while to eliminate the parasites that could come from hatched eggs (salt might not work with eggs, just like some medications). I repeated the treatment (with medication, not salt) after two weeks, that's two weeks after the last day of stage one treatment. Perhaps you might want to write down when things happened, so you can easily keep track of the whole procedure. Enjoy!


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