# Need some advice



## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

I have a 20 long setup. I am having significant green dust algae and some thread algae issues that I can't seem to get under control.

I have pressurized CO2. I've been running it at about 3bps. Any more and the drop checker turns bright yellow. However, there is no sign of any distress in the fish. I have a KH of 9 and a starting pH of 7.6. At the end of the day, the plants aren't pearling at all but the algae is and the pH is around 7.0-7.2. Again, if I go any higher on the bps, the drop checker turns bright yellow.

Lighting: I am using a 30" Finnex Planted+ 24/7 HLC over the front and 2 32W 48" T8s over the back. I have tried on top of the tank (10" above substrate) and 13" above substrate. I am running them for about 10 hours a day.

Ferts: I've been dosing PPS Pro for about 3 weeks. My TDS stays right at 100 higher than tap.

I have it heavily planted with Ludwigia repens, Hygrophila pinnatifida, some Hydrocotyle, Rotala ramosior and Eleocharis.

I have an Aquaclear 50 HOB filter for now. I am finding that the flow in the tank is not good at the opposite end of the tank from the HOB. This is with it on the back at one end. I have read that poor flow with the CO2 could cause problems. Should I move the filter to the end of the tank where it flows the full length? I know a canister would make this easier but that is not in my budget right now.

Just not sure if and where the imbalance is and/or what else I can do to take control of this situation. Photo attached to see some of the problem. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

You are probably using tank water in the drop checker. If you are, it won't work for measuring CO2. You need to use distilled water with nothing dissolved in it by sodium bicarbonate, so you can set the KH you want to use. With that you can use the drop checker color to get a reasonable idea how much CO2 you have. See:


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

hoppycalif said:


> You are probably using tank water in the drop checker. If you are, it won't work for measuring CO2. You need to use distilled water with nothing dissolved in it by sodium bicarbonate, so you can set the KH you want to use. With that you can use the drop checker color to get a reasonable idea how much CO2 you have. See:


Actually, I'm not. I'm using 4dkh drop checker liquid.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

How are the plants? healthy?
Algae is natural in any ecosystem. You see these beautiful algae free tank pictures, it's because people clean off the algae every week. The only maintenance free tanks are the jungle tanks that blocks out a lot of the light to the bottom of the tank.

Having a A-team (algae eaters) will help. The green dust is actually pretty btw.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

mistergreen said:


> How are the plants? healthy?
> Algae is natural in any ecosystem. You see these beautiful algae free tank pictures, it's because people clean off the algae every week. The only maintenance free tanks are the jungle tanks that blocks out a lot of the light to the bottom of the tank.
> 
> Having a A-team (algae eaters) will help. The green dust is actually pretty btw.


I've got 5 otos and 4 mystery snails that are always eating. The plants look good for the most part. The Ludwigia gets more algae than everything else and I just gently clean it when it starts to bother me. I have some Anubias nana petite up high on a piece of driftwood that stays covered and looks bad. I'm starting to see green spot algae on the Hydrocotyle. If I take out the rocks and scrub them and do a heavy glass cleaning (mainly the rear glass), the tank looks pretty good. But it doesn't take long for everything to be green again. Since dosing and starting the CO2, the plants are growing like crazy. The problem is the algae is growing right along with them.

Should I kick up the CO2 more and watch the fish and push it as far as I can?


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Try reducing the light intensity or photoperiod. That's usually the cause for algae. 8 hours seem to work.

Don't bother pushing the co2 to the limit. Us old timers know that just leads to fish deaths. 15-30ppm of co2 is enough to grow any plants.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

Ok. Thanks.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

If you have bright yellow with a good 4 dKH standard water in the drop checker you have around 100 ppm of CO2, but that would cause a drop in pH of about 1.3. That would cause your pH with CO2 on, and stabilized, to be about 6.3, not 7.0. Something isn't working right.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

Thus why I'm asking for advice.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

Today, my starting pH was 7.69. My kh is 9. Here is my drop checker at end of day and my pH is 7.1.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

donh1298 said:


> Today, my starting pH was 7.69. My kh is 9.


Your tank water is highly buffered. pH drop is slight. There's no way to guess on your CO2 from tank water pH. Your drop checker is more accurate.

I've been doing some CO2 research... If you want more CO2 available for plants, you should add RO to bring down the pH & kH. Less than 7pH, and less than 2 kH. Do this instead of pumping in more CO2 that'll kill your fish.
When pH is above 7ish, only about 50% is CO2. The other is converted to bicarbonate, HCO3.

Lowering your lights is the first step for algae control though.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

mistergreen said:


> Your tank water is highly buffered. pH drop is slight. They're no way to guess on your CO2 from tank water pH. Your drop checker is more accurate.


Ok. Thanks. That's so odd. I don't add anything to the water. I do have some rocks in the tank but I can't imagine they are limestone. They are smooth river rocks that have a sandy feel to them. It is well water. Could the well water be buffering it that much straight out of the tap?


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

I've added more info to the previous post about water chemistry.
Could be your tap. Test your tap water. You could be sitting on top of a mountain of limestone.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

mistergreen said:


> I've added more info to the previous post about water chemistry.
> Could be your tap. Test your tap water. You could be sitting on top of a mountain of limestone.


Gotcha. We definitely have a lot of lime and iron in our water. We get the typical white crusty buildup on things and the red ring in the old toilet bowl. Can I use distilled water for now? An RO unit is a little out of my budget and I would have to drive an hour and a half to get to any.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Yup, distilled will work as well. Do it gradually, fish really hate water parameter changes. They'll die.

You can also only grow plants that like CO2, HCO3 and not worry about messing with your water chemistry.

There's a cheap way to alter water chemistry. In a separate container, add hydrochloric acid to the water. It'll react to the Calcium carbonate, to lower pH and kH. I don't know the exact ratio. Let it sit for a few days.


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## donh1298 (Aug 4, 2011)

mistergreen said:


> Yup, distilled will work as well. Do it gradually, fish really hate water parameter changes. They'll die.
> 
> You can also only grow plants that like CO2, HCO3 and not worry about messing with your water chemistry.
> 
> There's a cheap way to alter water chemistry. In a separate container, add hydrochloric acid to the water. It'll react to the Calcium carbonate, to lower pH and kH. I don't know the exact ratio. Let it sit for a few days.


Ok. Sounds good.


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