# Help with tank needed



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

Piscesgirl,
Help!! My plants are rotting away just one week after planting them! Here's what I have, 4 gallon nano, normal looking gravel (3cm in depth), purple looking lights, a bunch of 'nana'(that's a plant's name right?), tiny fern stuck to a small rock, a tall grass-like plant, another one with single round leaf on a long stem, an air curtain (slow fine bubbles) and a normal filtering system. I've tried CO2 tablets from my LFS but my plants are still 'yellowing'. I must have done something wrong. Please enlighten me? Thank you very much.

The very inexperienced
Jillis


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

Hello Jillis, glad you found APC. My first thought is the 'purple' lights -- do you know if this is a fluorescent light fixture or not?


----------



## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

I bet it is. I have a NOF tube from an All-Glass fixture that is quite old and looks purple. Time for a new bulb! 

Oh and welcome to the party, Jill.


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

:razz: Hey thanks for replying. I have no idea if it is flourecent, it came with the nano. And I left out in my last mail, I have 50 neon tetra. Tank temperature is always at 29 degrees. The guy at my LFS said to look out for 3 things in order for plants to thrive. They are temperature, CO2 level and proper plant lights. Is that right?? :-s


----------



## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

He forgot fertilizers. We can probably help you out with those as well, but we'll need some specifics about your tank (size, total amount of lighting/watts, water parameters, etc.).

What nano did you buy?


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

Hello again, Jillis. 

I think you mentioned your tank is 4 gallons, but does that mean have 50 neon tetras in a 4 gallon tank? That seems like an extraordinarily large biomass in a 4 gallon tank. 

Are you aware of the nitrogen cycle? Would you happen to know if you have an Ammonia reading?


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

Hi all,

Oh dear this is so embarrassing! I am sounding like an idiot ](*,) . I'm not aware of nitrogen or ammonia level. In fact of any other readings I should know. Is there a formula for setting up a proper planted tank(with a lot of neon tetra)?
Please explain like I am a 3 year-old. Should I reduce biomass? How many fish should I have then? 
I really appreciate your help. Wish I could buy you guys a cuppa but Singapore is just not that near. But if you do come here, you know who your tour guide is!

The Thankful 
Jillis


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

I wouldn't say there is a formula per se in setting up tanks, but I certainly 50 tetras is a lot of fish even for a larger tank. It is important for you to test Ammonia and NitrIte. Are you doing water changes for this tank? How frequently?


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

Hi Piscesgirl,

How do I tell if I've got enough ammonia and nitrite? I plan to transfer 10 of those neons to another smaller tank. Will update you again if things start to look up. Thanks for your time, appreciate it.  

Happy scaping,
Jillis


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

And oh yes, I am changing 20% of water once a week.


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

Glad to hear you are transfering some of the fish out. One doesn't want any detectable Ammonia or NitrIte in a tank -- it is toxic to fish (Ammonia is not toxic under 6.0 ph, but let's not consider that right now). 

I'm trying to give a very shortened explanation here, so forgive me if I'm not that specific -- please feel free to ask me to explain better.

Fish produce waste - i.e. Ammonia. There are beneficial bacteria (generally called Nitrifying bacteria) that help break down Ammonia (which is toxic) into NitrIte first (which is toxic), and then to NitrAte. NitrAte is considered basically 'safe.' A fish tank goes through a cycle, called the 'nitrogen cycle,' in which the Ammonia is converted, but this can take some time. Fish often die during this time frame, and we tend to call it "new tank syndrome." There are ways to cycle fish tanks without fish, but that is another topic altogether, and that is called "fishless cycling." 

Plants can use Ammonia, to some degree NitrIte, and NitrAte. Sometimes planted tanks do not ever show Ammonia/NitrIte readings because of this. However, in a small tank with a large bioload of fish, this would probably not be the case. One might consider it almost like 'pollution,' which would not be a healthy environment for the fish or the plants. It is nice to strive for a sort of 'balance' in the tank, whereby there is never an Ammonia or NitrIte reading detected when tested, although NitrAte exists (and in Co2 enriched tanks, often it is necesarry to add additional NitrAte in the form of fertilizers). 

I don't consider myself a good judge of the amount of fish one can keep in a tank -- so others might can give you a better idea. I personally like larger tanks and small numbers of fish (although honestly my 55 gallon is probably overstocked). Personally, however, I would consider even 10 neons to be a lot of fish for a 4 gallon tank. Again, that is my personal belief. Others might can assist us in a good number for your tank. 

I hope this helps. Please feel free to ask me to elaborate. I tried to be very basic and general (I'm not very scientific to begin with!). I hope we can help you get your tank where you want it to be


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

Another thought that comes to mind is Chloramines and Chlorine that may be in your water -- which would need water treatment to remove. Are you treating the water with anything?

You may want to do more frequent water changes for the bioload of that tank...


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

Hey, thanks for the thought. Will digest your instructions. It's bedtime in Singapore now so nite nite ;-)

Happy scaping
Jillis


----------



## Jess7 (May 3, 2005)

Is there anyway you can return some of those fish, or even all of them? I personally would do a fishless cycle if possible, and later get only a couple of small, slower moving fish (no goldfish) The neon are schooling fish and need a min. of six to be happy but 6 is too many for a tank that size. 
You can buy ammonia and nitrite test kits at any local fish shop. How long has the tank been up and running?

Not trying to tell you what to do. Just my 2 cents


----------



## Jillis (May 11, 2005)

Hi all,

Thank you all so much for having extra patience on me. :razz: Now the picture is much clearer. I am using salt and Ocean Free's Anti Chlorine each time I change water.
Here's an update of my still overloaded 4 gallon nano.( My other tank is a 4 litre mini! Can hardly house 6 neons) This morning, I noticed one tiny snail on my my CO2 monitor. And my neons are pecking on it. And my plants have stopped yellowing. Co2 monitor shows a dark green color. But the water is yellowing this time. Will go get test kit for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. 

Please advise, thanks.
Jillis


----------



## Piscesgirl (Feb 25, 2004)

You actually shouldn't need salt for neons -- but if there is NitrIte, it might be helping protect them from NitrIte toxicity. Good about the anti-clorine. Glad to assist, hopefully you'll be where you want to be in no time!


----------

