# What a mess....



## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

Ok, so I've had my 72g bowfront running for about a year and a half now and I've managed to avoid any real algae problems. The biggest issue I'm having is the algae that grows on the glass. I bought this scouring pad on a stick and it's quite difficult to get off....I could live with that, but it grows back within the week. Here's my setup:

72g bowfront
3/4 eco complete
1/4 pool filter sand (split setup)
Lots of narrow leaf java fern and a some patches of moss sprinkled about.
No ferts (except once in a blue moon, when I feel bad for the plants)
No CO2
130w of Coralife light (I believe 6000k)
Rena Filstar xp3

I feed the fish about once every 3-4 days. I also have a bunch of Amano shrimp in the tank.

What is the easiest and longest lasting solution to get rid of the algae.

Help me out please.

Tanks a lot! (cheesy, I know)


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

bumpin it up......


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## Dryn (Sep 6, 2007)

Moss and java grow very slowly and don't use very much fertilizer. My experience with algae is that it won't grow if the fertilizers are not available (with an 8hr light period). Your water may have some ferts in it like phosphate (like mine) plus the fish plus the fish food may mean that there are some excessive ferts still in the tank despite your lack of fertilizing. Irregular fertilizing schedule may also play a role. If you want to limit the algae growth try adding fast-growing plants or maybe a sump with plants in it. I've used a hang-on filter box "sump" filled with some soil and planted with peace lilies to "eat" up excess algae in an expiramental "plantless" tank. It worked rather well until the peace lily outgrew the box and slowed down it growth... anyway you could also add a UV filter but they run about $50-80. My petsmart has one that hangs inside of the tank that was pretty cool... I hope this rambling reply can help you, or at least get someone else to reply...


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

I can live with the expense of the UV filter if it means I dont have to break my back scraping the glass, but I dont want to take on the extra expense if it wont work...



Dryn said:


> anyway you could also add a UV filter but they run about $50-80. My petsmart has one that hangs inside of the tank that was pretty cool... I hope this rambling reply can help you, or at least get someone else to reply...


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## Alex123 (Jul 3, 2008)

UV filter works great if you can get the algae and pathogen into the uv filter itself. It serves two main purposes prevent spread of diseases and keeps the water clean. It would not remove algae on the glass but it will help reduce it in that any algae spores in the water will be killed also when you do clean the glass, the algae becomes free floating and thus will go into the uv filter and get killed. There is lots of benefit to having uv filter if you don't mind the expense.


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## lildark185 (Jul 7, 2006)

Since you said it was difficult to get off with the pad, I'm assuming you have green spot algae. If that were the case, you could purchase a couple of zebra nerites which eat the algae.


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## Indignation (Mar 9, 2008)

I've read that increasing phosphates keeps GSA at bay, but I would assume that is part of an overall fertilization routine. I don't know if I would try it without the rest of the ferts. Maybe someone else with experience could comment.
For manual removal, one of these will make your life much easier.


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

Thanks for the tip on the MAGFLOAT....I already own the large one. It does ok, but still doesnt remove it all. I'll start looking into a UV filter. I already have a Hydor in line heater, is it ok to put the uv spliced into the outflow? or what should I do?


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## Indignation (Mar 9, 2008)

crispo069 said:


> Thanks for the tip on the MAGFLOAT....I already own the large one. It does ok, but still doesnt remove it all. I'll start looking into a UV filter. I already have a Hydor in line heater, is it ok to put the uv spliced into the outflow? or what should I do?


I would make sure the UV sterilizer will actually eliminate the algae you're dealing with- Green Spot Algae. I've heard it works well with green water and Green Dust Algae, but these are both free-swimming algae, which can be addressed through in-line UV sterilization. Maybe do some searches on here for Green Spot Algae, or GSA and see what has worked for others. Good luck, let us know what you find.


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

I'll post some pics tonight or tomorrow and maybe someone can help me figure out exactly what I'm dealing with....I just might go with the UV anyway.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

I have a 72 bowfront also with a UV. I had terrible green dust algae on the glass for months until I did one simple thing- I cut back the lighting by one hour. The GDA is 99% GONE! And it happened virtually overnight. Give it a try.


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

I'm on 9 hours a day....so if I cut back to 8....that would help?


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

It's an easy thing to try! Honestly I was shocked that it made such a difference! Go for it & let me know if it worked for you.


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## chipster55 (Apr 21, 2008)

I fought this problem for a couple years. I did not have a planted tank at the time. I got rid of mine by removing phosphates from my water. In fact I had 2 tanks that started getting GSA at the same time..My source of phosphate was in our city water supply..Hope this helps because GSA sucks and is a pain in the ass to get off tank..I was using a straight edge razor every three weeks...Good Luck


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

heck I was using a metal Proscraper like DAILY until I cut back one hour on the lighting...then it quit like magic (knock wood, it's been a few weeks now)


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

Ok, I just did a water change, recharged my purigen, changed out my filter pads in my xp3 and cut my light cycle by one hour.....I'll repost on Monday with a progress report.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

wellllll.......any difference?


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

Well, I learned one thing.....I cant do math !!! I wanted to change the photo period two ways....1) shorten it, 2) make it later, so that I could still enjoy it. So when I shifted the hours, I miscalculated and didnt actually shorten the period. So, I fixed it last night. Let's see what happens in a few days. I'll give it till Wednesday or Thursday before I really expect to see any changes. Stay tuned !


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

the suspense is killin' me.


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

well, Wednesday came and passed, Thursday...ate some turkey, watched some football, Friday....took the day off and went fishin (too cold, seasons officially over for me), and when I woke this morning...NO CHANGE. The shorter photoperiod does not seem to be workin for me. I'll give it till next Wendesday and if I cant see any real difference, I'll have to give another option a shot...I'll repost with the results...


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

bummer.


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## Naja002 (Nov 15, 2005)

GSA= Low C02 and/or low P04

You have a fairly low light tank. Since it's been running (I assume about the same as it is now) for 1.5yrs--I would suggest that you feed your fish more often. That will increase the N, P, K, Fe and everything else that your plants need--slightly, but your tank probably doesn't need much more then it has...

You said you cleaned the filter et al. So, if feeding the fish more often and cleaning the filter doesn't do it. Any chance for a substrate vaccuuming? The mulm buildup in your filter and substrate may currently be producing more nitrates then in the past.....if so, this would use up more P....causing the P shortage and the onset of GSA.

In other words, A) You may just need to add a bit more nutrients....which you might be able to pull off by simply feeding your fish more often. B) The waste buildup in the aquarium may currently be producing more N which is depleting the P.

Any decrease in cirulation for any reason....like plant growth?

Anything we don't know? Like a new light, new light bulbs, lighting change--Higher light, longer photoperiod...?



HTH


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## bgzbgz (Jul 6, 2007)

You are getting good advice, I also live in Brooklyn and also used to have the same algae. Add a TINY amount of po4 2 or 3 times a week and your algae should go away (you will need a scale for this). Also if youre not already doing so some potassium might be benificial as well.


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

no change in the setup since inception. I will say that my cleaning regimen has definitely slowed with time. When I first set up the tank I was doing 40% changes at least once a week, with a substrate vaccuum each time. Sadly, as with most things, life catches up and that "new car" smell wears off and it doesnt command my undivided attention anymore....I probably do a 50% water change one a month now with a substrate vacuum. Oh, now that I think of it, I recently removed a ton of plants. I used to have a lot of Rotala, and Ludwiga which I removed...I now only have a few anubias, crypts and a lot of Java fern narrow. I really dont add any ferts because I have 80% eco-complete and the majority of my plants are not "ground" rooting. Any thoughts with this new info?


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## Naja002 (Nov 15, 2005)

Honestly, the added info just confuses me. Without knowing what the tank looked like before v. now....I cannot seem to piece it together. From the sound of it--circulation should have increased. You swapped out fast growers for slow growers. It seems as though nutrients should be building, not depleting. The only thing that makes possible sense is that the glass may be getting more light--even to start the GSA. May be without the faster growers it's getting light from a window behind it, next to it or across from it. Guess is that your fish food based fert system is now outa whack with the slower growers and maybe the glass is getting more light. Sorry, I can't be of more help, but let me know what you think and may be I can offer something more valuable. :-s

Try to look at the tank (circulation, light et al) and see how taking the old plants has changed it to the new setup....


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

the slow growers lined the back of the tank. I had a lot of them. So their departure definitely allows a lot more light to hit the back glass. I attached a couple of pics. Imagine the right side branch missing and the entire back glass lined with Ludwiga and Rotala. And as you can see, the entire back glass is covered with GSA.


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## Naja002 (Nov 15, 2005)

Ok, this is what I'm getting out of all of it: From the plan'ts perspective--you've increased the light by removing the stem plants. I'm going to assume that the slower grows are/were growing well (slow, but seem happy, growing.) If this is correct, then they may have depleted the P04. The slower growers have now been stepped up a bit by the higher light availability. Do you have any test kits or means (LFS) to check the N and P? Checking both will give a much better idea of what's going on...fert-wise.

From the looks of the surface movement/spraybar setup--it would seem as though you are getting plenty of C02 into the tank. But with the "higher" light you may not be getting enough C02 from the atmosphere alone--the plants maybe wanting/needing/using more C02.

GSA is generally low C02, low P04 or both. And from what I understand--possibly from a change in circulation.

From Your OP:



crispo069 said:


> *The biggest issue* I'm having is the algae that grows on the glass.


Are you having any other algae issues--big or small? If so, are they new since the setup change or on-going from before the change...?



crispo069 said:


> What is the *easiest and longest lasting solution *to get rid of the algae.


That is usually decreasing the light intensity and/or photoperiod. Maybe another 30min-1hr reduction will do it. If the GSA is only/mostly on the rear glass then you can slide the light forward a bit (if possible) and get some of the light off the back glass? But sometimes the easiest and longest lasting solution is to do the work to locate the actual problem so it can be fixed.

Can You slide the light forward some?
How long is your photoperiod?
Can you check the N and P?


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## SnyperP (Dec 10, 2004)

It's been a few years since i last ferted. Tank is still cycling, but the general rule 2 years was to dose PO4. But you still have to scrape the glass to see any effect. It would only stop GSA from spreading. 

Actually, did you scrape it last when you reduced the photo period?


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## crispo069 (Mar 13, 2007)

NAJA002...now that you mention it, I did start to have a smaller algae problem some time ago. I noticed what I believe to be BBA growing on my spraybar...just flapping with the flow. Then one day it was gone. A few weeks later I noticed some tiny patches of it growing on my sand. It isnt anywhere else so I left if (I plan on removing the sand very soon and just go 100% eco complete).

To answer your questions:
Can You slide the light forward some? YES
How long is your photoperiod? Shortened to 8 hours from 9
Can you check the N and P? I have a kit, but I'm not sure if it has N and P tests, I'll check in the a.m.

SNYPERP...I didnt scrape when I shortened the photo period...I dont have easy access to the back of the tank where it is setup. I was hoping to stop its cycle and eventually it would just waste away. Is that likely?


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## Naja002 (Nov 15, 2005)

Ok, BBA=low C02. The dynamics of the system is controlled/determined by the light. So, basically, you can reduce the light or add C02. You may be able to adjust your spraybar (more or less surface movement-whichever one works) and get more (enough) C02 into the system again--maybe not. Excel may help resolve the issue--not from an algicide perspective, but from what's it's made for: adding carbon to the system. Otherwise, you can add DIY or pressurized C02, or keep adjusting downward the light intensity (if possible) or photoperiod. If the main GSA issue is just on the back glass then sliding the light forward a bit may help. However, it may also transfer the problem to the front glass--you'll just have to check that out to see how it goes....

I wouldn't think that removing the faster growing stems would cause a P04 issue, but--ya never know--the plant's growth (demands/needs) may have been stepped up a bit. Your OP says the main issue is algae growing on the glass. I'm assuming atm that it's the back glass. It's a low light setup and considering everything I am guessing that the removal of the stems has exposed the glass to "too much light"--changing the "balance". The change says that there is now not enough C02 for the amount of light. Again--light determines everything else. Providing more circulation along the back glass may help.

Your main concern with each "fix" is whether or not there is _new_ algae growth. If it's not growing/spreading then the fix may be enough. What's already present will hang around for a while, if you don't clean it up, but will eventually go away on it's own once the issue is located and fixed. So, whether you clean up what's present or not--no _new_ algae growth is what you are looking for. Cleaning things up after you've found the solution is not a big deal.

Without adding C02 (or excel) it's just going to take some time and tinkering to find out what needs to be done with the lighting, so patience is going to be a key player. Focus on the plant growth/health and no new algae growth. Again, without adding C02, I would suggest that you slide the light forward a bit and reduce the photoperiod another hour--if that does it, then increase the photoperiod 30 mins and see what the effect is. If it's good, then try another 30 mins. On a low light tank--you may be getting too much surface movement, but atmospheric C02 is what it is. It looks like you have plenty of surface movement, but less may turn out to be more--never know. I would suggest that you give it a couple of weeks before trying to determine whether or not any adjustment is helpful. Some times it takes a while for things to reveal themselves--especially in a low light setup.

HTH


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