# Brainstorming a multiple barrel patio "pond"



## jhays79 (Apr 22, 2012)

I came up with this idea I would like to put together. My idea is a three half barrels (sort of like whiskey barrels) stacked two on the bottom, one staggered on top with somekind of hidden support to hold it up.

crude drawering 









My local Tractor Supply store has these barrels made of heavy duty plastic, that are made to look like wooden whisky barrels. I think they're about 20 gallons a piece. I would like to have a pump circulate the water from the bottom to the top, with some kinds of waterfall back into the bottom two. How would I calculate the gpm or pump size I would need, so that none of the barrels run dry or overflow?

I plan on planting it wiht a bunch of different aquattic plants, and maybe put a few fancy guppies in their.

Any thoughts? Thanks!


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

I'm not an expert, but a thought would be... just buy two pumps with the same gph and make the waterfall at the level you want to keep the water level at for the top barrel. i don't think there's much calculation for gph to do... i may be wrong.


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## kimcadmus (Nov 23, 2008)

if you stagger all the barrels, meaning one is lowest then you only need one pump going to the top then each barrel waterfalls into the next. Aesthetically it would be pleasing to have all three at different levels.


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## Daniil (Oct 30, 2009)

Connect two bottom together with 1" or 2" pipe and use one pump. 


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## vicky (Feb 18, 2010)

If they are plumbed right, they will overflow, which is what you want, right? The overflow makes the waterfall. The gallons per hour determines whether you have a trickle or a Niagara Falls effect. Unless they leak, they cannot run dry. The problem would be if an overflow clogged, and the water ran out somewhere else - not into the tub below. I agree three levels will look and work best, but two levels would work if you plumb the bottom two together with as large a pipe through the sides as you can. Then, a submersible pump can return the water to the top tub. With a backflow preventer, when the pump is turned off, the water level in each tub remains the same. It seems to me the tricky part is keeping the plants (and fish) out of the overflow, perhaps with some type of screen or foam. Will you angle the tubs and let the water spill over the side or drill the side and insert a tube of some kind?

Sounds like a fun project! Can't wait for photos.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

I do several of these things every year, and in practice the type of arrangement you have in mind will be difficult. The problem is preventing leaks, clogs, spills, too much splash, etc. It is really disappointing to walk out with your cup of coffee to look at the pond, only to find the plants dried out and the fish twitching in an inch of water on the bottom. I've been there!

If this is your first patio pond, try something simpler. Maybe one large container, with one small one completely surrounded by the big one. You can raise the small one above the rim of the large one by setting it on concrete blocks. Then pump water into the small one and let it run over the sides. This way no matter what accident may happen, you can't pump all the water out. And unless the large container leaks, you won't loose water that way.

But don't be discouraged! These things are lots of fun, the plants grow like crazy and the fish will breed like, well, guppies!


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## jhays79 (Apr 22, 2012)

Still going over the idea in my head, I might just start with one or two barrels and mess around with them for awhile. Michael, I like that idea of having a smaller container surrounded by a larger one. I will post pics if I commit to the project!


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## h4n (Dec 23, 2005)

Thats looks like a cool idea!!!!

I always wanted a barrel pond!


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## iamivan90 (May 31, 2012)

Interesting idea, good luck!I'll be checking for pictures incase you go thru with it.


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## GOJIRADOR (Dec 22, 2011)

this looks pretty simple to me, just make a divet on the sides for the water to trickle down. if its leaking then readjust it or add a lip so the water shoots out farther. you don't need to drill anything either just connect both hoses to a pump and put the return at the top- no calculations needed. you don't need our help just do it!


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

You can practice with just about any sort of container, no need to make the commitment to buy the special containers until you know you have the bugs worked out. 

Simply stacking them is not enough. The water will sheet down the side and go wherever it wants. You need enough of a lip to direct it where you want. You can prove this to yourself in the kitchen. Try to pour water out of a coffee cup without it clinging to the side of the cup! Now try a measuring cup with a pinched area that directs the water, or a pitcher with a special lip. See how much easier it is to keep the water from seeping along the sides? When you pour too slow, however, even the containers that are designed to make pouring easier can allow water to seep along the side. 

Now to design something like that for your stacked barrels that will work even if the water flow is slower than you thought. The ideas above, some sort of tubing that is large enough to carry some serious flow and aimed right so the water cannot flow anywhere else is the right idea. 

Simpler, of course is the smaller container inside the larger. Like most tiered fountains it will work at any gallons per hour. 

Optimum gph: If you were making a waterfall over the edge of a flat rock, then I would say a minimum of 1000 gph per foot width of the rock. That is, a waterfall a foot wide requires a minimum of 1000 gallons per hour to look and sound right. So, if you stack a small container, say 1' diameter above a larger, and you trim the rim of the upper container so all the water would flow out over about 1/3 of the circumference, so 1000 gph minimum. I am not sure how many gph you need when you are shooting it out through a pipe. 

If you have several pumps, power heads or filters you can test the idea. 
To find out how many gph you are really getting from any of these devices you can get a rough idea by setting them up to either empty or fill a 5 gallon bucket, and time it. 

Then see it a certain design will work for you.


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## jhays79 (Apr 22, 2012)

I wimped out and just bought one container. Gonna see how I make out with this one for awhile, and then maybe add another!


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