# Most efficient diffusion metthod of CO2



## lenosquid (Oct 9, 2006)

Hooking up the CO2 directly into a canister filter or using a glass diffuser. Right now I am running the line into my powerhead for now and I wanted to see when I get my canister filter which method is the most efficient. thanks


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## plantman (Nov 26, 2006)

i would go with the glass diffuser. im useing an ada pollen glass and would not swap it for nothin


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## AMP (Nov 11, 2006)

This Link http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...lf/14453-diy-co2-guide-with-pictures-and.html

Has some great useful info on DIY, I plan on going to a pressurized system after the holidays, I am going to stay with the power reactor I built, with my DIY CO2 I am getting 15-18 PPM now with it, Very fine bubbles are being produce by it, so apparently I am getting good saturation with it, I can hardly wait to go pressurized...

this links shows you how to build the powered reactor reactor DIY CO2 System for Planted Aquarium


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## plantman (Nov 26, 2006)

pressurized is the way to go it would help to get your co2 level up mine sits at 30 ppm


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## lenosquid (Oct 9, 2006)

Im sorry I forgot to mention. I already have the pressurized system going at the moment with an azoo reg and a 10 lb tank. i wanted to know if it would be better to hook it straight into a canister filter vs a glass diffuser. I don't have either one of those so that is what I am trying to figure out. 

I have a 55 gallon tank with hang on aquaclear 110 right now


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## David W. A. (Aug 22, 2006)

I built something different - it appears to diffuse 100%

I tried hooking into a cannister but it bubbled up inside and cavitated the pump after awhile. When it wasn't cavitating it was making noise. Instead of buying a "diffuser" I made a contraption.

You know those plastic bin holders that hold little screws and things? about 1" high/thick and various sizes like 4"x8" and bigger like 10"x20". Come in all sizes. 

Well I took a bin that is about 10"x16" rectangle and 1" thick and ran the power head/tube into the bottom bin row so the bubbles collect and work their way to end where there is a hole to the next bin level above. The next bin row has a hole on the other end, so the bubbles have to zig zag their way to the top, 5 rows total, where finally I have a small power head forcing discharge. 

The bubble accumulate through out but never come out. They appear to just soak in. I am speculating that I am getting 100% absorbtion 

the contracption is flat so it hides well in the back behind bog wood and plants. Its clear so I can see the bubbles. Cost about $15 for all the parts. It does take some finess to get the set up to work right - used about 100 zip ties to keep it together. 

I tried several home made diffusers and this one appears to be the trick.

David A.


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

David, sounds interesting. A picture is worth a thousand words, if you could post one...


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## apistaeasy (Jul 16, 2004)

amen, I want a pic!


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## David W. A. (Aug 22, 2006)

couple photo's coming right up, later tonight.


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## K20A2 (Aug 12, 2006)

Anyone using the Hagen ladder and a hob power filter wish to share how they achieve decent diffusion? As of now, I just can’t get the bubble to get caught up in the outtake flow from the filter. The bubbles just pop at the top so I’m really loosing half of each one.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

It's funny that nobody mentioned an in-line reactor. What - people don't use these any more? It's at least as good as anything else and ridiculously cheap and simple. Getting CO2 to dissolve in water isn't hard - it's getting it distributed evenly around the tank that is the trick. Whatever your method is, if CO2 bubbles are making it to the surface of the tank some of the gas is being wasted. If none of them do, then you must be getting 100% effeciency out of whatever widget you're using.


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## David W. A. (Aug 22, 2006)

*My diffuser*

Picture tells a thousand words,










If the photo above doesn't work, my web page has the same photo - see the link in my signature below.

What you can not see, there are little zip ties, about 5 per row that keep the lid of the bin tight so bubbles don't just leak out the edges easily. I also have the power heads secured with zip ties and the tubes are tight so the unit stays together as a..... unit. The bog wood leans against it so the bin stays level, because the bubbles actually make the bin float out of level a little bit if left unchecked.

I see bubbles go in, bubbles accumulate but rarely see enough bubbles build up such that the discharge power head spits them out.

My PH is about 6.2 at the current bubble rate, normally it is exactly 7 out of the tap. I like that I can the bubbles all the time.

In order to make the tubes and fittings tight, I had to drill holes and carve things just right. I used a solder gun to melt the bin plastic also, to help seal up potential leaky spots.

The contraption is totally visable from this angle, but this angle is extreme side behind a chair, from the front the bog wood hides it 95%.

I know that you can buy diffusers for $20 and up, but a few I tried didn't work. I hate the research shopping dissappointment game. I like making things. FYI, I also rigged up a 1" ID pipe system that hooks into a 1-1/4" ID plastic tube that runs off a 950 gph pond pump. When I drain the tank to 50% it takes about 1 minute. When I fill it takes about 2 minutes. Weekly 50% water changes are a breeze now, this is a big deal on a 125 gal tank. The pump works so fast that I have to pre fill the tub with water to 90% and have the water running when I start pumping other wise I run out of water. It is very much a Tim Allen of Home Improvement moment..... arrr.... arrrr.... arrr... arrr.

any specific question - ?

David A.


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## onemyndseye (May 12, 2006)

Nice DIY 

Like a Hagen ladder on steriods 

-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

K20A2 said:


> Anyone using the Hagen ladder and a hob power filter wish to share how they achieve decent diffusion? As of now, I just can't get the bubble to get caught up in the outtake flow from the filter. The bubbles just pop at the top so I'm really loosing half of each one.


Got a hagen ladder with their Nutrafin Yeast system in the tank in my classroom. The kids love watching the bubbles dissolve (though they say shrink, but i'm trying to get them to use the scientific vocab!). By the time they get to the top the bubbles are tiny and going very slowly and must be a 100 times smaller (volume anyway) than they started.
I'm afraid i don't know the filter you're on about, i've got a eheim Aquaball whose outlet runs past the hagen ladder.
Hope that helps


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## K20A2 (Aug 12, 2006)

I do get the smaller bubbles as they travel up the ladder, as would be expected. But what happens after they are released from the ladder is what I’m trying to work on. My filter is a penguin bio wheel. I’m trying to position the ladder in such a way as to have the bubbles get caught up in the returning water and get smashed up real good. So far I haven’t been too lucky, I can’t get the positioning right and they just float to the surface and pop. 

I hope some of that made sense.. HAHA


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

Just worked out the slang HOB - Hang On Back filter!!!
Sorry a bit slow, but nobody uses them over here, it's internal power filters or canisters if you don't want undergravels or air powered foam!
Could you rig the ladder to put the bubbles under the intake so they get sucked into the filter and mashed by the impellor?


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## Dewmazz (Sep 6, 2005)

You could place a diffuser under the intake of the canister too...

I've HEARD that in-line reactors work great, but the ceramic diffusers are very asthetically pleasing, esp. if you decide on a high quality Dupla or ADA diffuser.


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## lenosquid (Oct 9, 2006)

These reactors can be made out of PVC pipe pretty easily... and these can be external correct? Just hook up the outlet of the filter from the canister to the reactor and then from the reactor into the tank. Is this correct? The ceramic glass diffusers do look cool and all but I think the bubbles are distracting. I think I'll try to figure the reactor out and do that. The less in the tank the more space for plants anyway. 

What type of glue/adhesive would be best for PVC piping? Not a plumber/engineer/mechanic so Im a newb


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

A PVC pipe reactor is very simple to make. The glue required is regular PVC cement, used for household plumbing. Any hardware store should carry it. It comes in different colors, so if you care how it looks, ask for the clear stuff.

People argue about the best way to construct it, what to put in it, how to connect it, etc. My advice is to use 1-1/2" PVC pipe for tanks in the 50g and smaller range. You want to connect it so that water enters at the top and exits at the bottom. It should be about 20-24" long to provide a good chamber for the CO2 to dissolve. Drill a small hole in the side of the pipe about 1/3 of the way from the top. If you make this just slightly smaller than the CO2 tubing it will form a seal when you pull the tubing through and you won't need any glue. I also recommend against putting bioballs or other media inside the tube. It works perfectly well without it and they only serves to restrict flow.

The reactor is usually placed under the tank in the cabinet. It works best if it's placed in-line with the canister filter tubing. Usually it's the last thing in the loop before the water returns to the tank.


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## vic46 (Oct 20, 2006)

*CO2 reactor/diffuser*

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/do-it-yourself/2958-diy-inline-reactor-plans.html

Gomer is a member of this board. His inline reactor is easy to build. It took longer to get the bits and pieces in hand than it did to do the assembly. A major plus for the in line diffuser is it is out of sight and is not taking up space in your tank. After all, you bought the tank to house fish, not hardware.


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## chinaboy1021 (Aug 2, 2005)

guaiac_boy said:


> It's funny that nobody mentioned an in-line reactor. What - people don't use these any more?


I was thinking the same thing. What's with these extra gadgets in the tank when you can get an inline for your cannister. :first:


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## Satirica (Feb 13, 2005)

A beautiful glass diffuser in an aquarium can be considered similar to a beautiful fountain in a garden. Relaxing to watch, too.

Of course, an inline system is the most efficient, but where is the fun in that??? :mrgreen:


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## vic46 (Oct 20, 2006)

*Co2*

A HOB and a CO2 system of any kind is not very efficient/effective. Dissolving CO2 in water is a difficult task which is aggravated by a HOB filter. The HOB creates surface disturbance when the filtered water is returned to the tank. This surface disturbance will very effectively off-gas the CO2 in your tank. To enhance your dissolved CO2 retention you should consider changing your filtration system to eliminate the surface disturbance.
Vic


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## K20A2 (Aug 12, 2006)

vic46 said:


> A HOB and a CO2 system of any kind is not very efficient/effective. Dissolving CO2 in water is a difficult task which is aggravated by a HOB filter. The HOB creates surface disturbance when the filtered water is returned to the tank. This surface disturbance will very effectively off-gas the CO2 in your tank. To enhance your dissolved CO2 retention you should consider changing your filtration system to eliminate the surface disturbance.
> Vic


If only I had this knowledge four months ago when I was buying equipment to set my tank up. I would have spent the extra cash for a canister filter.

It is possible to at least achieve some sort of decent diffusion with a HOB filter though isn't it? Maybe not within the preferred target CO2 range, but at least some to give the plants a little extra.

When I finally set a pressurized system up I was thinking of using a glass diffuser and ditching the hagen ladder. Will I be wasting my money by continuing to use a HOB filter? If only I had this knowledge four months ago when I was buying equipment to set my tank up.

It is possible to at least achieve some sort of decent diffusion with a HOB filter though isn't it? Maybe not within the preferred target CO2 range, but at least some to give the plants a little extra.

When I finally set a pressurized system up I was thinking of using a glass diffuser and ditching the hagen ladder. Will I be wasting my money by continuing to use a HOB filter?


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## vic46 (Oct 20, 2006)

K20A2 said:


> If only I had this knowledge four months ago when I was buying equipment to set my tank up. I would have spent the extra cash for a canister filter.
> 
> It is possible to at least achieve some sort of decent diffusion with a HOB filter though isn't it? Maybe not within the preferred target CO2 range, but at least some to give the plants a little extra.
> 
> ...


I would suggest you run down a limewood diffuser (air stone). Limewood is citrus wood and it produces the finest bubbles of any "air stone" type device I have ever seen. Put the diffuser as low in the tank as possible and perhaps under the HOB intake. This will enhance the CO2 diffusion into the water column. Also make sure that your tank is always topped up to reduce the surface disturbance in the tank from the HOB water return. It is also possible to append a foam filter to the return of the HOB to further reduce the surface tension disturbance. If you happen to convert to a cannister filter at the time you upgrade to pressurized CO2 I would recommend an in line diffuser. They go in the return line form the cannister and are the most efficient diffusion method. They go under the tank, out of sight and not taking up space and sticking out like a sore thumb in the tank. This diffuser was designed by "Gomer" on this thread.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/attachment.php?attachmentid=471&d=1099597504


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> A HOB and a CO2 system of any kind is not very efficient/effective. Dissolving CO2 in water is a difficult task which is aggravated by a HOB filter. The HOB creates surface disturbance when the filtered water is returned to the tank. This surface disturbance will very effectively off-gas the CO2 in your tank. To enhance your dissolved CO2 retention you should consider changing your filtration system to eliminate the surface disturbance.


While this may not be the most effective way to dissolve CO2 into your tanks, I can personally vouch for the fact that it works. I have a 10 gal with an AC mini. The CO2 line goes into the intake of the filter. The water level of the tank is just above the outflow of the filter, so very little disturbance occurs. I have used glass diffusers in this tank thinking it would improve things over my 'filter injected method', and found neither an increase in growth nor an increase in CO2 levels in the tank using the same flow rates. And I had to deal with algae growing on the diffuser which I had to bleach out periodically. I am happily injecting it through the filter again. If you have a cannister filter instead, I wholeheartedly agree that an in-line diffuser will work better than injecting into the filter. My 2 cents worth. YMMV.


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

What did you do about the noise when the CO2 bubbles get chopped up with the impeller? I couldn't really justify spending $65 for each canister for my two 10 gallons versus $18 for a AC HOB filter. 

Did you have to drill a hole in the intake, too? I can't seem to find a good way to get the tubing past the intake strainer.


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> What did you do about the noise when the CO2 bubbles get chopped up with the impeller?


I haven't had any noise issues.  This tank is in a small room which I use as an office and except for the ocasional small 'burp', noise is not a problem.


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

epicfish said:


> Did you have to drill a hole in the intake, too? I can't seem to find a good way to get the tubing past the intake strainer.


Right now, I have a glass diffuser underneath the intake, but some of the bubbles are getting wasted and not taken in by the HOB.


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> Did you have to drill a hole in the intake, too?


Yes. The CO2 line goes in near the bottom of the filter intake tube. (Sorry I missed that question earlier)


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## K20A2 (Aug 12, 2006)

Bert H said:


> Yes. The CO2 line goes in near the bottom of the filter intake tube. (Sorry I missed that question earlier)


This is a good idea; I may just have to give it a try. I'm assuming that I should take my bio wheel off then?

Are you using a DIY set up or the real deal (pressurized)?


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## epicfish (Sep 11, 2006)

K20A2 said:


> This is a good idea; I may just have to give it a try. I'm assuming that I should take my bio wheel off then?
> 
> Are you using a DIY set up or the real deal (pressurized)?


Yes, take the Bio-wheel off. I have the real deal. I had DIY going into the intake before.


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

Pressurized for me also, though I started diy. I got tired of making yeast/sugar every two weeks real quickly.


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## jeff5614 (Feb 15, 2006)

Bert H said:


> Pressurized for me also, though I started diy. I got tired of making yeast/sugar every two weeks real quickly.


Same here. Pressurized is so much easier and the plants are liking it more also.


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## rrasco (Dec 15, 2006)

hey guys...i have just recently built an inline reactor out of PVC for my 55 gallon tank that will soon be planted. i had seen gomers post before about his reactor, i had also used another one i had found that was very similar. my reactor is simpler than gomers, although his may have features mine does not, i am not sure. i just wanted to show a pic of what mine looks like for further reference.

the co2 is not hooked up yet as i am building the hood to house my lighting, and there are no plants in the tank yet, i am still cycling it.


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