# Ich: Max Temp. That Won't Kill Live Plants?



## christinamac910 (Jan 15, 2016)

I am treating two goldfish that have ich in an established 75 gallon aquarium with live plants. Since they are both eating like normal, I'm feeding them *API General Cure* (metronidazole + praziquantel) soaked in *Seachem Garlic Guard* with *Seachem Focus* and *Seachem Kanaplex* for good measure (one of them may have dropsy).

I'd like to raise the temperature of the water to at least 86 degrees Fahrenheit for 10 days if possible. This is the temperature that the ich parasite stops attaching to hosts (fish). If existing parasites in the water won't attach to the goldfish, then they'll all die off naturally. They higher temperature also speeds up the ich's life cycle. Meanwhile, the metronidazole in the food will treat the ich already attached to my goldfish and kill any ich that bite them.

From what I've read the max temperature that most tropical plants can tolerate is 82 degrees Fahrenheit. Has anyone had success keeping live plants at higher temperatures through an ich treatment like I just described? Would live plants survive 86 degrees Fahrenheit for up to 14 days or so?

Plants in my aquarium: Anubias, Java Fern, Jungle Vallisneria, Water Sprite, Cryptocoryne Wendtii Green, Alternanthera Reineckii (Telanthera Rosefolia), Pothos roots submerged, some variety of Ivy Plant roots submerged

Of course, I'll keep an eye on the goldfish too to make sure they tolerate the higher temperature. My aquarium is really well aerated. At least I can get some immediate feedback from the goldfish if they aren't tolerating the temperature well. I want to avoid having all my plants melt 2 weeks after the fact!


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Metronidazole should kill any ich. High temperature usually just speed up ich's life cycle.


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## christinamac910 (Jan 15, 2016)

I am only treating metronidazole by giving it to the fish in their food. That still leaves ich in the Aquarium for me to get rid of somehow. 

Perhaps if I keep feeding medicated food long enough to all the fish (2 atm) then all the ich will die without a host?

I was hoping I could raise the temperature of the water in addition to feeding medicated food. Raising the temperature to 86 F would prevent ich from biting so they wouldn't be able to complete their life cycle. This would make all ich in the tank eventually die off. 

My question is, will my live plants survive 86 F for any length of time? Has anyone had success with this?


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Getting rid of ich with heat will take about a month. Your plants should survive the heat.


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## t2000kw (Jul 29, 2006)

christinamac910 said:


> I am only treating metronidazole by giving it to the fish in their food. That still leaves ich in the Aquarium for me to get rid of somehow.


You're probably playing it safe with your method but have you considered malachite green?

https://www.thesprucepets.com/malachite-green-1379925

It can be used in a separate quarantine tank to take care of what's on the fish. While you treat the fish, you can treat the main tank. By the time the fish are ich-free, the main tank should be back in order.

You may not want to use malachite green (you may have special restrictions of some sort to deal with). It's up to you. We've used it with great success without a quarantine tank (we're but one data point, however), but whatever you do, I suggest following the directions that come with the package.

Donald


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## TAB (Feb 7, 2009)

i am not a fan of cranking up the heat to kill ich, remember the hotter it is, then less oxygen there is in the water. 86 is getting close to the dangerous point for that. I have always found treating the tank is the best method. ich is every where. water, gravel, filters on your plants etc. I would just treat the tank and be done with it.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Provide lots of aeration when you're up there at 86F. Discus thrive at that temperature but you have to provide O2.


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## tiger15 (Apr 9, 2017)

Don't raise the temp or use salt that are stressful to plants and soft water fish. Use proprietary remedy containing malachite green and formalin. They are harmless to plants and fish at the recommended dosage. Do not over dose or under dose. MG can kill active infection on the body and formalin kill the larvae. Formalin, chemically similar to Glut, is a carbon source and an algaecide.


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## christinamac910 (Jan 15, 2016)

Thank you for all of your replies. I have been reading them via email as you have been replying. Sorry for the late response.

Long story short--I did not go with the method I described in my original post. I fed General Cure and Kanaplex mixed in food with Focus for about 5 days. Secondary infection(s) developed so I stopped feeding medicine and dosed the tank with General Cure and Kanaplex following their instructions (dose, wait 48 hours, 25% WC, repeat dose, 25% WC). Between Metronidazole, Praziquantel, and Kanaplex I figured all my bases were covered. These are all relatively gentle medicines for fish. After the water treatment with these three active ingredients the fish were still progressively getting worse and the ich was more pronounced. I decided to try Paraguard next (started on 6/24/19). One goldfish died the next morning (I thought he might he was pretty bad off). I euthanized the other goldfish yesterday (with clove essential oil) after finding him sucked against the filter intake. 

I should note that I was doing 10-18% water changes vacuuming the substrate every other day to reduce ich tomites at the bottom of the tank (but timing WC's so as not to interfere with medication dosing instructions).

Now my 75 gallon aquarium is empty except for live plants and a bomb-proof Nerite snail that has survived it all for 2-3 years. Here is a new thread I started on where I should go from here. Would love some advise!


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

hmm, Ich doesn't kill that quick. There must be something else along with it.


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## tiger15 (Apr 9, 2017)

Metronidazole Is used mainly for internal parasites, and Paeaguard contains malachite green and glutaldehydel. I don’t know of the ingredients in the other two remedy. It seems like you are switching from one medicine to the other without giving the opportunity to wait for one to work. Curing ich needs patience as it takes 7 to 10 days to see results and longer to root out ich.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Any chance that you can buy Esha Exit? Esha is well known German brand widely available in EU, probably not so widespread in the US. Exit is extremely efficient Ich medicine, it kills Ich of all stages/forms in just 3 days, doesn't need temperature increase, degrades biologically, safe with all livestock.. I had a small Ich outbreak about two years ago and it worked like a miracle.


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## safina (Jan 20, 2014)

christinamac910 said:


> Thank you for all of your replies. I have been reading them via email as you have been replying. Sorry for the late response.
> 
> Long story short--I did not go with the method I described in my original post. I fed General Cure and Kanaplex mixed in food with Focus for about 5 days. Secondary infection(s) developed so I stopped feeding medicine and dosed the tank with General Cure and Kanaplex following their instructions (dose, wait 48 hours, 25% WC, repeat dose, 25% WC). Between Metronidazole, Praziquantel, and Kanaplex I figured all my bases were covered. These are all relatively gentle medicines for fish. After the water treatment with these three active ingredients the fish were still progressively getting worse and the ich was more pronounced. I decided to try Paraguard next (started on 6/24/19). One goldfish died the next morning (I thought he might he was pretty bad off). I euthanized the other goldfish yesterday (with clove essential oil) after finding him sucked against the filter intake.
> 
> ...


Unfortunately, neither feeding general cure (active ingredients: metronidazole and praziquantel)nor the use of kanamycin for 5 days was an effective treatment for the parasite itself. Metronidazole is a very ineffective anti-parasitic when it comes to ecto-parasites ( especially the Ich parasite). What the larger problem was in feeding metronidazole ( like you mentioned) is that it was ineffective at killing the parasite in its vulnerable stage: the free-swimming stage.

I would recommend, next time, using Paraguard ( or a proprietary blend that contains malachite green or Victoria green) immediately when you notice an Ich infestation. The reason I recommend it is because of its active ingredients: malachite green ( anti-parasite), formalin (anti-fungal), and acriflavine ( anti-bacterial). 
When have an Ich infestation they are one of the easiest illnesses/conditions you can treat in the aquarium; but, must act fast and use the proper treatment.


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