# Psuedomugil gertrudae



## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

My LFS has about 10 of these little fish at $1.80 each. Any thoughts on these fish for a 29 gallon? The other fish will be Corydoras pygmaeus and possibly lemon tetras.

Here is a link to google photos:
http://images.google.com/images?q=Pseudomugil+&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&start=20&sa=N

and a snippet from varoius online articles:
"Pseudomugil gertrudae is a dwarf rainbow from northern Australia and southern New Guinea. The fish are mainly found in small creeks with mud bottoms and abundant vegetation. Adult P. gertrudae reach a top length of 1.5 inches with the females being Slightly smaller than the males. The variety we are working with has a body color of white to silver with fine black spotting (in rows) on the fins. Adult males and females can be easily sexed - the males show elongated dorsal and anal finnage. The pectoral fins of males show an orangish-yellow edging."


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## david lim (Mar 30, 2004)

Great fish! I've kept them. The females will shoal/ school together while the males will make smaller territories. I've heard they also breed fairly easily in slightly acidic water. I don't know if mine bred, because if they did I figured the cherries would've eaten the eggs. Good community fish that isn't aggressive.

David


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Dennis, you're lucky to get those fish! I can't find any nearby. They are like what David said, nice fish.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Awesome, thats great to know. David, about how big did yours get? My water is hard, Gh of 23 but the kH is low and my pH with CO2 is 5.9.


What about the lemon tetras, will the rainbows be OK with the lemons?


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## czado (May 26, 2005)

I had six from RareFishatLAX/Tanner on AquaBid, and they grew to like an inch max. Paid ~$35 for 6 but he gave me extras: you're getting a great price. They do breed fairly easily: I found a fry in my sump without doing anything. I lost mine over the course of a few months, and some sites calling
them "annuals" due to their short life span turned me off.

Like David's, mine loosely shoaled for me and the males fought over a rock/cave thing. They are really cool fish that will look right at you, and kind of look like insects when under plants.

I believe part of my issue was that I tried keeping them in a River Tank (as you probably know they are native to Giddy River in Australia), when they actually appear to like less current. I also had a few major tank issues during that time, including a cracked tank. I am thinking about trying P. furcatus though.

Here's my log on another forum about them. There's many great links included after a lot of searching, including:
http://members.optushome.com.au/chelmon/Gertrud.htm
http://users.kent.net/~lisab/Pgertrudae.html

HTH


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Thanks for those links Joe. Nice writeup


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## Aaron (Feb 12, 2004)

P. gertrudae will do well in a planted tank, though i am not sure lemon tetras are the best cohabitant form them. they might be a little to robust for the little blue eyes, especially at feeding time. 

They are easy to breed and if kept in their own tank, young will show up. water parameters, as long as kept away from extremes will suit them fine. Flake food is sufficient.

These are not "annuals". I've had some linger for about five years. They do come from Giddy River in Australia, and they are also found in every other river/ creek/ billabong in the area, including a few locations in Papua New Guinea. Each look a little different. the Giddy River gertrudae is a nice one. SEA fish farms also produce these, but I think they are not that nice... the finnage is lacking on these.


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## shadow (Jan 21, 2005)

These are really great fish one of my personal favorites, I rather keep them by themselves or with fish from similar environments and size ie I.werneri. They are a great schooling fish and really seem to love hanging in and around any floating plants. There come from a wide variety of areas in the top end of australia and can be differentiated by the finnage. I've kept many varieties, cadell river and myall creek are my personal favorites. At 1.80 a fish is a great price even in australia there considerably more than that.
There is a school of thought on the lack of finnage, is that there is linkage between salinity and finnage, some breeders add salt to the water to promote finnage growthto the fry ( I tend to support this theory as the fish i get from these breeders are fantastic). I tend to steer clear of this as I have plants in all my tanks.


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## david lim (Mar 30, 2004)

I think they'd be fine with lemons. Just make sure that they get to eat, and that you give plenty of room for them all to move around . 

I had mine for about a year, but lost them due to some emergent H. balsamica !!! I was pissed ( I didn't know it was H. balsamica). My fish grew about 1". The males are beautiful (esp. when displaying) and the females have a more subtle beauty. 

I hope you enjoy them dennis. Let us know how things turn out!

David


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

I went to the store to get them on Saturday but ended up getting Green Fire tetras instead. I have more Green Fire tetras on order (will total a school of ~12) and I ordered 6 more Corydoras pygmeaus. After looking at the dwarf rainbows I wonder if they will be happy in my setup. The flow is a little strong and they seem pretty small. I definately want one or two strong schools in this tank and the P gertrudae may not be what I want. They make me want to set my 2 gallon nano back up though


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## ranmasatome (Aug 5, 2005)

Green fire tetras? as in Aphyocharax rathbuni?? These are nice definately.. they school rather okay as well.. i've had about 15 of these in a tank before.. Nice bunch with a tad of red..which makes them sweet. Their cousins (Aphyocharax paraguayensis) however are a different story and just a nightmare... very fast and nippy scale eating freaks!! even really aggressive fish about 2-3times bigger were afraid of them..

The P. gertrudae i've just bought from a LFS here last month or so but they didnt fit my tank layout so i sold all 30 of mine for $15bucks..lol.. too bad i'm so far from you Dennis.. If you're worried about flow..then dont.. i have them in a 15gallon with a 2028 attached... They are fine and feeding well even. I find that they dont really shoal, the males like david mention set up small territories and the female just dither around.. didnt really enjoy them in the way they were ment for my tank. I think i'm going to use the money to buy 30 hyphessobrycon amandae (ember tetras) instead.


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## tao (Jun 15, 2005)

I had more problems with mine swimming up the outflow of my HOB filter.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Yep, A. rathbuni indeed. I have checked with various online searches to confirm this. Pretty little things. I have 4 at the moment and this morning they were schooling with the 3 Corydoras pygmeaus. The 4 A. rathbuni spend almost all their time together in the middle half of the water column abd don't seem to mind the high flow although they prefer to stay in the vicinity of the Cyperus helferi stand. They fit the colors and layout of my tank perfectly.


I still don't know if I will get the P. gertrudae or not. Like you ran I don't think they will fit into my layout and I don't think I want anything that will not school.

Hyphessobrycon amandae are definately beautiful fish and I wish I could find them locally. They are a bit bold for my taste/ layout though and I fear they would spend all their time near the bottom and my tank is pretty high visually (30x12x18in).


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## ranmasatome (Aug 5, 2005)

The A. rathbuni seem to take to your tank quite well.. even schooling with the pygmaeus.. thats good. Would you happen to have a photo? i'm just curious as to when this tank is ready for a shot... i'm just eager to have a look.haha..

Good point there on the ember tetras spdning time on the lower portion of the tank... i need to check that out..hmmm..


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Check out my thread in the aquascaping forum "Dennis's 29 gallon Journal" I have a photo of the fish (thaough not a good photo) plus some shots of my tank. I will update that thread as time goes by.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

What about green neon tetras? I hardly ever see those used in an aquascape. Granted they can be hard to locate.


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## nellis (May 6, 2006)

i don't know if you're still thinking about those gertrudes, but i work at a pretty decent lfs with a lot of rare stuff and generally very good prices. anyway, i wanted to get some gertrudes but they were retailing for 8$ each. i think you've got a steal there.


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