# Anyone know what this is?



## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Definitely a wetland plant. Not 100% sure that all this growth is submersed, but this was found in a mat, no more than 2" tall, in 1"-6" of water in a well-established wetland in SE Texas. The people at the site wanted to call it a Lindernia. The pic with the ruler will give you an idea of the small size of this stem plant. Small buttons are what I am assuming to be the fruit capsule. It "almost" has a fuzzy appearance...but I'm not going to say for sure...I'll give it a look under a lense when I get a chance next week.


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

Looks like an _Elatine_.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Hmm...I looked at Elatine and it looks similar to _E. brachysperma_ or _E. minima_...except I have no idea what the flowers looked like. Since it's already set fruit (and I believe these are annuals) I suppose I need to let them dry up so the seed can mature. I doubt the stems I took pics of will live much longer since the process has already begun?

The only thing is that _minima_ is supposed to be much farther North...so I don't think that's what I found.
http://www.rook.org/earl/bwca/nature/aquatics/elatinemin.html


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## asukawashere (Mar 11, 2009)

You might be able to use the fruit itself to get an ID if you can find a reference to compare to. It'd be quicker than waiting to grow and flower a new plant.

Definitely not a Lindernia, though - the fruit is all wrong. Cavan's almost certainly right to call it an Elatine.


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## mudboots (Jun 24, 2009)

I have a key in my office with some descriptions on that genus; send some pics of the goodies if you are able and when I get back from the southeast I can take a look.


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## Lakeplants (Feb 21, 2011)

It definitely looks like an Elatine sp. It doesn't look like E. minima, which is a more northern species.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks guys. I'll see if I can get some pics through a lens of the fruit and maybe some seeds. I wouldn't bet on it though...the camera I have for use at the office is not that great at macro-shots. Stay tuned...


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

The camera has a decent zoom afterall. The fruit is right at 1/16th of an inch. That's the only measurement I can take with my crude tools. The lens I an taking the pics through is a 10x and the camera has a "30xOptical zoom" but I have no idea what "x" you are looking at in these pics because I also cropped them a bit. If you click on each picture, you can zoom just a hair tighter.

*Side view of fruit*









*Frontal/top view of fruit*









*Fruit split open with detail of seeds*









*Just a bit closer view of the seeds*


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

That's definitely an Elatine. Elatine have those comma shaped seeds like that. 

My guess would be Elatine brachysperma. Was there more than just that little bit?


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

I believe it is _E. brachysperma _as well based on the overall size, the leaves, and the fruits/seeds. Mudboots has a good key and said he'd key it out when he gets back from his trip. 
and the location (Southern US).
There was a decent amount...I'd guess about a 15 sq.ft. mat in a couple spots (all together) with a few straglers here and there. I knew I'd be out most of the day so I only took a tiny bit in case I were to kill it all.

My concern is that it may be on its way to death since it has already begun seeding...but I have read that this may not be the case. Anyone experienced with this one?


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

davemonkey said:


> I believe it is _E. brachysperma _as well based on the overall size, the leaves, and the fruits/seeds. Mudboots has a good key and said he'd key it out when he gets back from his trip.
> and the location (Southern US).
> There was a decent amount...I'd guess about a 15 sq.ft. mat in a couple spots (all together) with a few straglers here and there. I knew I'd be out most of the day so I only took a tiny bit in case I were to kill it all.
> 
> My concern is that it may be on its way to death since it has already begun seeding...but I have read that this may not be the case. Anyone experienced with this one?


The only way to know is to try it. Many Elatines aren't difficult, but the minima we collected has proven tough.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

AaronT said:


> The only way to know is to try it. Many Elatines aren't difficult, but the minima we collected has proven tough.


Well, consider it being tried out. I put it in a semi-emergent state in a covered tank. It works out well because I found a Polygonum (Persicaria? Which is correct?) mixed up with some _P. hydropiperoides_ yesterday while seed collecting that I want to try out (_P. opelousanum_)...but I want to get a decent group of stems to grow from it before submerging.


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

davemonkey said:


> (Persicaria? Which is correct?)


_Persicaria_. _Polygonum_ was pretty much a wastebasket taxon.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Cavan Allen said:


> _Persicaria_. _Polygonum_ was pretty much a wastebasket taxon.


Thank you!


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

So, is this one growing?


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

AaronT said:


> So, is this one growing?


Yes!! The leaves are a little larger (well, a lot larger depending on what your standards are) than HC, which I'd say is a negative. But, it's still a very small plant...tiny by most standards...and is slower growing, which I'd say is a positive given all teh complaints about maintaining carpet plants.

I was able to trim it yesterday. I only got about 6 cuttings...about .25-.5" long, but since it's all new growth and looks very healthy, I'm pleased with it. I'd love to go back and get more, but finding time to do that is a problem.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

Sounds a lot like how minima looks grown submersed. Pics?


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

Yeah, if it looked like _E. minima_ but didn't eventually rot from the bottom up, it could be a great plant.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Here's a bit I trimmed off. The lower 2 sets of leaves are old (from when I collected it, and you can see a seed pod still at the bottom) and the upper sets of leaves are new. They look brighter green and somewhat larger (maybe because of less light in the aquarium).










For size reference, those are 'petite' Anubias growing adjacent:










Another one growing just in front of a blyxa seedling:


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