# Journal: My first freshwater tank



## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Hello everyone, this is my first tank. After almost a year of research, I'm starting my first aquarium.


Equipment:

- Big articulated desk lamp
- 18W cfl bulb
- 25W eheim heater
- Heater guard to not to burn plants
- 20L (5 gal) cylindrical glass vase


Plants and stuff:

- Ludwigia Palustris
- Ceratophyllum Demersum
- Hemianthus Callitrichoides
- Eleocharis Parvula
- Rotala Rotundifolia
- Anubias nana
- Lemna minor
- Black 2-3mm gravel
- 70cm driftwood


In a few weeks I'll recieve the plants and I'll do an update.


Edit: I don't know why it didn't attach the photo, I'll add it tomorrow


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## stefant (Jan 7, 2018)

What's the diameter of the glass vase? Will you use dirt?


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## DutchMuch (Apr 12, 2017)

JoanToBa said:


> Edit: I don't know why it didn't attach the photo, I'll add it tomorrow


seems that tomorrow has flown by lmao :spy:


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

DutchMuch said:


> JoanToBa said:
> 
> 
> > Edit: I don't know why it didn't attach the photo, I'll add it tomorrow
> ...


Yeah sorry, I've been really occupied with exams &#128517;


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

stefant said:


> What's the diameter of the glass vase? Will you use dirt?


Diameter: 22.5cm

Yes, I will use dirt, I'm going to make a walstad aquarium &#128578;


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

JoanToBa said:


> Hello everyone, this is my first tank. After almost a year of research, I'm starting my first aquarium.
> 
> Equipment:
> 
> ...


Since I can't edit now, here's the pic


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE:

The plants arrived yestserday and today I planted everything

Here's how it looks














(I'll remove a bit of the duckweed bevause it's blocking too much light)

I'll update again if anything significant has happened since


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Looks nice, I would add Brazilian pennywort and some moss (stringy for example) and let it grow out of the water and all over the driftwood


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Oh god, am I disabled?

After having this vase for over a month I now realise it's actually 2.7 gallons and not 5 gallons.

Guess It'll just be a shrimp tank


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

2.7g should be enough for a group of tiny livebearers like least killifish for example.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

mysiak said:


> 2.7g should be enough for a group of tiny livebearers like least killifish for example.


Do you think so?

It feels a bit too small to me...

How many fish per gal/liter would you recommend?


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

You can never use "fish per gallon" as a criteria for the capacity of an aquarium. One fish per gallon might work if the fish are less than an inch long, but it certainly wouldn't work for 4 inch long Oscars. I once tried to figure out how to use both length and bulk of fish to determine the capacity of a tank, but it just doesn't work that way. Some fish need swimming room both end to end of the tank and front to back. Others do fine with very limited swimming room. I wish there was a good way to determine how many of each species will do well in a specific tank.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

I started with 5 Neoheterandria elegans in a 2.5g bowl and when I was moving them several months later, there were at least 15 of them (if I remember correctly). Now I have about 30 fish in 4.2g tank (technically it's 3.2g tank + 1g in built filter). They enjoy thickly planted nano tanks with weak water flow. For heated tank (~26-28C) I'd choose Neoheterandria elegans, for unheated tank - Heterandria formosa. They might enjoy shrimp though, despite their minute size. Especially once the colony of fish grows in numbers.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

hoppycalif said:


> You can never use "fish per gallon" as a criteria for the capacity of an aquarium. One fish per gallon might work if the fish are less than an inch long, but it certainly wouldn't work for 4 inch long Oscars. I once tried to figure out how to use both length and bulk of fish to determine the capacity of a tank, but it just doesn't work that way. Some fish need swimming room both end to end of the tank and front to back. Others do fine with very limited swimming room. I wish there was a good way to determine how many of each species will do well in a specific tank.


Oh yeah yeah, you're totally right, it's just more for orientative measures than anything else.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

mysiak said:


> I started with 5 Neoheterandria elegans in a 2.5g bowl and when I was moving them several months later, there were at least 15 of them (if I remember correctly). Now I have about 30 fish in 4.2g tank (technically it's 3.2g tank + 1g in built filter). They enjoy thickly planted nano tanks with weak water flow. For heated tank (~26-28C) I'd choose Neoheterandria elegans, for unheated tank - Heterandria formosa. They might enjoy shrimp though, despite their minute size. Especially once the colony of fish grows in numbers.


Urrgh, damn that sounds tempting bro


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

I see my planted tanks as natural communities, with fish, plants, shrimp, snails, and tiny organisms living together in close to a natural environment as practical.. I don't always achieve this. 

But given that objective, I limit the number of fish - small, guppy-sized fish - to 1 or 2 per gallon. It may not at all as spectacular as more heavily stocked tanks, but to me, it's a lot more interesting.

Bill


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE:









Some things have changed in the aquarium:

Bad things:
-Quite some anubias leaves melted
-All of the Hemianthus Callitrichoides melted
-The Ludwigia Started to lose all of its leaves

Good things:
-Bacopa Monnieri growing nicely
-WOAH WOAH WOAH, I REALIZED RIGHT NOW THAT I HAVE NO IDEA OF WHAT THE STEM PLANT IN THE FRONT IS 
-Mistery plant is growing well
-Rotala Rotundifolia is quickly adapting to being submersed
-Propagated backup carpeting plant (Eleocharis Parvula)

Parameters:

Hardness looks like it may have gone down (I think it's because of tannins), same goes for pH.

Nitrates: 10 ppm
Nitrites: 0 ppm

Animal life:

I added MTS on the second day and it also looks like I have some pond snails? that hitchhiked with the plants.

I've ordered 4 Neoheterandria Elegans that will arrive in two to three weeks and also 10 cherry shrimp (will arrive with the fish)

Pics:

Mistery plant 







~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Rotala Rotundifolia (+ anubias in the back and eleocharis on the ground)







~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bacopa Monnieri (+ hornwort)


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## DutchMuch (Apr 12, 2017)

mystery plant looks like L. repens (definitely a ludwigia if not repens).


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE: The fish have arrived!!

They're incredibly tiny, there's one (pregnant?) female and three males.

With them also came the cherry shrimp, which are also looking good.









Plants:

Anubias nana completely melted, so I replaced it with java moss. 
The rest of the plants need a trimming but I'll have to wait until I recieve my scissors (today or tomorrow).


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Looking good 

Adult females look pretty much the same for the whole life - they're practically always pregnant (superfetation). You should see a tiny fry every now and then. Also they react very good to live food, I see more fry when feeding freshly hatched brine shrimp. 

I wouldn't trim the plants yet, let them grow out of the water - it looks nice and has many benefits for the tank.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Nice tank. Cute fish and shrimp!

You have provided a perfect example of why it important to start out with a wide variety of plant species.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Aww thanks! 

You're totally right, if it had not been for the book, I wouldn't have a carpet now.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE:

I just did some testing and it looks like I have about 1ppm nitrite, so I have to be a bit careful on the feeding.

Apart from that there's not much more to say


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Nitrites might come from nitrate respiration. The easiest fix is doing more frequent water changes and/or add floating plants (which you can remove later, once tank stabilizes). Nitrate uptake anion exchange resin might help too, though they are harder to come by.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Does nitrate respiration occur only in anaerobic conditions? Is this a rare thing, or something that we should be watching for? Maybe this isn't the best place to ask?


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

mysiak said:


> Nitrites might come from nitrate respiration. The easiest fix is doing more frequent water changes and/or add floating plants (which you can remove later, once tank stabilizes). Nitrate uptake anion exchange resin might help too, though they are harder to come by.


Yesterday i did a water change and i think that I'll also do another one today. The fish are looking good and I've now spent half an hour observing them (￣∇￣)


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

hoppycalif said:


> Does nitrate respiration occur only in anaerobic conditions? Is this a rare thing, or something that we should be watching for? Maybe this isn't the best place to ask?


If I'm not mistaken, it happens in case of anaerobic conditions and abundance of nitrates in the substrate (artificial fertilizers), mostly happening with freshly submerged commercial soils - at least around here you can't really buy an "absolutely clean soil", it always contains some kind of "initial" fertilizer. Once these nitrates in soil are exhausted (few days to a couple of weeks), there should be no nitrite peaks observed anymore. It is mentioned also in the book, but I don't have it at hand right now, so hopefully I remember it correctly (it corresponds to my experience though).


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

JoanToBa said:


> Yesterday i did a water change and i think that I'll also do another one today. The fish are looking good and I've now spent half an hour observing them (￣∇￣)


Fish usually do not show discomfort with increased nitrites right away, but it can have detrimental long term effects. Some are more sensitive than others, water chemistry playing its role as well. I happened to have similar involuntary nitrite spike with Neoheterandria elegans in hard water and they seem to be quite resilient to it, no visible impact even after few months later. Only two oldest females passed away recently, both showing symptoms of damaged osmoregulation (kidneys failure?). Although no idea if it was caused by nitrite spike several months ago..


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

hoppycalif said:


> Does nitrate respiration occur only in anaerobic conditions? Is this a rare thing, or something that we should be watching for?


Yes, nitrate respiration is very common under mildly anaerobic conditions (my book p. 65). Nitrate is the next best thing to oxygen for bacterial respiration. Thus, almost all bacteria species can use and will use nitrates when oxygen is scarce. Takes place in upper layer of soil, anaerobic pockets in a biofilter or just "gunk".


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

dwalstad said:


> Yes, nitrate respiration is very common under mildly anaerobic conditions (my book p. 65). Nitrate is the next best thing to oxygen for bacterial respiration. Thus, almost all bacteria species can use and will use nitrates when oxygen is scarce. Takes place in upper layer of soil, anaerobic pockets in a biofilter or just "gunk".


Why doesn't the bacteria that are converting nitrites to nitrates work on that nitrite, too?


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Lil update:

Another shrimp down 😞

The nitrites seem to still be at around 1ppm.
Will do another small water change today


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Lil update:

I just did the water change and nitrite is down to 0.5 ppm.

pH at 7.6
GH at 10°
KH at ~10°
Nitrates at 10 ppm

Water is a lot less cloudy now! (bc of water change)


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

hoppycalif said:


> Why doesn't the bacteria that are converting nitrites to nitrates work on that nitrite, too?


Interesting question that opens up a "can of worms." Bacteria do use nitrites. Here's one explanation from the scientists*:

"Anthropogenic and agricultural activities result in increasing amounts of nitrate entering terrestrial, freshwater, and marine systems (63). In the environment, nitrate levels are influenced by the microbially driven processes of nitrate reduction, whereby nitrate is reduced initially to nitrite, which subsequently can be reduced by denitrification (the stepwise reduction of nitrite to dinitrogen gas) or via dissimilatory nitrate reduction to ammonium (DNRA). Recently, anaerobic ammonium oxidation (anammox) in marine and estuarine systems has been shown, at some sites, to remove significant amounts of nitrite and ammonium, resulting in the formation of dinitrogen gas (12, 35, 61)."

*From: Smith CJ _et al_. 2007 Diversity and Abundance of Nitrate Reductase Genes (narG and napA), Nitrite Reductase Genes (nirS and nrfA), and Their Transcripts in Estuarine Sediments. _Applied Environ. Microbiol._ 73: 3612-22.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

JoanToBa said:


> Lil update:
> 
> I just did the water change and nitrite is down to 0.5 ppm.
> 
> ...


I'm wondering if that wood isn't causing problems. (That's a lot of wood, which can rot, in a relatively tiny volume of water.) I would pull it up and see if it's not rotting underneath where it contacts the soil.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> JoanToBa said:
> 
> 
> > Lil update:
> ...


Hadn't thought about that... I should definitely check that


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## terryna (Mar 16, 2018)

Loving this thread! indeed


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

terryna said:


> Loving this thread! indeed


Thanks!!


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE:

(Response to Mrs Walstad) I lifted the wood a bit to see what was under there but ithere wasn't any rotting. It looked just like this








The bacopa is growing out of the water right now, the rotala is adapting very fast to being submersed (it already has long leaves), limnobium is growing nicely and the rest of the plants and animals haven't changed much.

pH 7.8
GH 10°
KH ~10°
Nitrites >0.5 ppm
Nitrates 25 ppm

It looks like nitrates have increased and nitrites have decreased, I'm guessing that by reducing the amount of food given and changing the water a bit, bacteria have been able to decompose the NO2


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Wood looks fine. More nitrates and less nitrites could mean that the little tank is cycling nicely with increased nitrification. 

I would keep doing what you're doing. Measuring and changing water...

One thing that might be fun is to attach Java fern or similar plant to the wood and let it grow emergent. Small houseplant with roots in the water would also be interesting. Both of these measures would help with waste recycling.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> One thing that might be fun is to attach Java fern or similar plant to the wood and let it grow emergent. Small houseplant with roots in the water would also be interesting. Both of these measures would help with waste recycling.


I initially had an anubias on the wood right under the surface so it could grow emersed but it melted almost completely (even the rhyzome was rotting) so I had to remove it. I replaced it with some java moss (i bought it with the fish).

I'll probably send a full tank pic this evening so you can all see the progress.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Pics 😉

Edit: No pics because it didn't attach them. Tomorrow then


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Nitrites 0 ppm
Nitrates 25 ppm

(The rest is pretty much the same)


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

That's encouraging! Whatever you're doing, keep doing it...


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> That's encouraging! Whatever you're doing, keep doing it...


Thanks!

Here are the pics




























(Quite some growth from the rotala)


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Another shrimp down, seven to go


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## zolteeC (Dec 26, 2017)

JoanToBa said:


> Another shrimp down, seven to go




Maybe the shrimp went in too early? I have 15 liter tank where I used commercially available dirt that contained artificial nutrients. I had to wait like 4-5 weeks before it was OK for shrimp, but after the waiting period its all OK and full of RCS and plants. (Now this tank is like 1.5 years old) .


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

zolteeC said:


> JoanToBa said:
> 
> 
> > Another shrimp down, seven to go
> ...


I don't know, I bought a cheap soil without additives, I have emersed and floating plants on the surface, and not big of a bioload. I'm not too sure if that could be the problem, but it is always a possibility nevertheless. Although an interesting thing is that the fish seem to be doing really well (active, colorful,...), so one theory of mine right now is that it could just be a bad batch (i hope).


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

Sometimes things just happen without any obvious cause. We don't know the reasons for everything.

You're doing well; keep doing what you're doing.

Bill


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## zolteeC (Dec 26, 2017)

aquabillpers said:


> Sometimes things just happen without any obvious cause. We don't know the reasons for everything.


Yes, this is very true especially when it comes to tanks .

By the way, do you think the heater is needed? I don't heat the tanks which have RCS only on room temperature (around 21C). Your jar looks great, but maybe it would look even better without the heater.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Let me step in about the heater - JoanToBa has Neoheterandria elegans fish which need higher temperature. If they're kept below 25-26C long term, they are much more susceptible to diseases. I keep them at 26C during winter (with heater) and at ~28C during summer (no heater). Shrimp certainly do not need temperature this high and they probably would like it cooler, but fish would succumb at standard room temperature (21C). Heterandria formosa are more suitable for unheated tanks.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

mysiak said:


> Let me step in about the heater - JoanToBa has Neoheterandria elegans fish which need higher temperature. If they're kept below 25-26C long term, they are much more susceptible to diseases. I keep them at 26C during winter (with heater) and at ~28C during summer (no heater). Shrimp certainly do not need temperature this high and they probably would like it cooler, but fish would succumb at standard room temperature (21C). Heterandria formosa are more suitable for unheated tanks.


Thanks for the info, I keep the tank at 25C tho I think that just to be safe, I'll have it at 26C


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

I'm setting 26C mainly because I count with measurement error of thermometer. At 26C, difference +-1C won't matter much  If you have accurate and calibrated thermometer, 25C should be fine.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Another shrimp down, six left


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

JoanToBa said:


> Another shrimp down, six left


Make sure that your shrimp are getting enough vegetable matter. Too much protein will cause a slow-die-off. (Excess protein interferes with their molting.)

I wouldn't jump to conclusions that temperature or nitrites is the problem.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> Make sure that your shrimp are getting enough vegetable matter. Too much protein will cause a slow-die-off. (Excess protein interferes with their molting.)
> 
> I wouldn't jump to conclusions that temperature or nitrites is the problem.


Hmmm, well that would explain why they're dying. I'm feeding tropical fish food,I thought they would compliment that with the algae and organic matter in the tank.

Time for some boiled spinach I guess!


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Do a water change in case there's some toxin in the tank. Feed them seaweed if you can. It's shrimp superfood.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Shrimp are much more sensitive to nitrites and ammonia than fish. I agree that more frequent water changes are helpful if you're able to detect them. Another thing which shrimp don't like are heavy metals in the tap water - if you're not sure if there are any, better be safe than sorry and use some water conditioner (Seachem Prime for example, it will last you ages) during water changes.

Excess protein intake will impact molting - usually seen as a white patch between the head and the body. Another sign with molting issues are teared molts. Healthy molt is a one piece of shrimp "skin". Missing mineral content might be the issue as well - adding "shrimp stones" or powder could help (e.g. mironekuton, montmorillonite,..) and will be appreciated by fish too.

I am too lazy to boil vegetables daily, so I just feed bought shrimp pellets - complete commercial food or just processed pure spinach/stinging nettle/pumpkin/etc. Livebearers in general should have food with high algae content too, so you might want to switch to spirulina flakes, tablets or complement their usual food with pure spirulina powder. Neoheterandria elegans are so small, that sometimes even crushed flakes are just too big for them. Powdered food and freshly hatched artemia are IMHO more suitable for them and can be readily eaten by shrimp too.

Example picture of molting issue:


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

mysiak said:


> Shrimp are much more sensitive to nitrites and ammonia than fish. I agree that more frequent water changes are helpful if you're able to detect them. Another thing which shrimp don't like are heavy metals in the tap water - if you're not sure if there are any, better be safe than sorry and use some water conditioner (Seachem Prime for example, it will last you ages) during water changes.
> 
> Excess protein intake will impact molting - usually seen as a white patch between the head and the body. Another sign with molting issues are teared molts. Healthy molt is a one piece of shrimp "skin". Missing mineral content might be the issue as well - adding "shrimp stones" or powder could help (e.g. mironekuton, montmorillonite,..) and will be appreciated by fish too.
> 
> ...


They don't seem to have the molting problem. I also use prime to the water I change. I have been doing small water changes, everything seems to be normal. The rest of the shrimp are doing well.

Although it's interesting how the all of the shrimp look healthy, even when they're dead (apart from looking... dead).


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Wow! Fantastic picture. I've heard about molting issue, but this picture "brings it on home". Thank you for providing it for us. 

I had shrimp (two species) die off one-by-one over a year. I'm almost certain now it was because I didn't take the steps you have taken to feed them vegetable matter. Once my shrimp had cleaned the algae out of the tanks, they just didn't get enough green matter for their needs. 

I also had some early deaths with otherwise very healthy adult guppies. They looked like they died of severe constipation-swelling up and in pain. I've now included vegetable pellets in their diets. 

Vegetable matter stimulates good bacteria in the human gut and has been found to improve general health. There's no reason--as I see it-- why this same concept would not apply to shrimp, livebearers, and all omnivores.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

Just to be clear, that's not my picture, I take no credit for it. But it is a very good example showing molting problems and I saw it with my shrimp in the past too. 

I'd say that livebearers and shrimp have very similar diet, so adding food with higher algae content is a good idea. I'm usually feeding 1:1 ratio of algae based food (spirulina tabs) with high protein tabs or freeze dried food. It's probably not 100% ideal as fish fry and adults have different needs, but it's the best I can provide in a community tank.

Also I supplement fish/shrimp/snails with dried Catappa leaves - they nibble on them occasionally and use them as a hiding place. Leaves initially release a lot of tannins though, so if you are not after the aged water look, soak them in a bucket for a few days first.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

This is what I feed them


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

JoanToBa said:


> This is what I feed them.


Ordinary fishfood usually contains a very high amount of protein. If you want to keep shrimp, then I would seek out specialty fishfood for shrimp. The depicted fishfood sold with a carnivore Angelfish is not a good sign. I understand that the fishfood you use may not be the problem, but why not feed your shrimp more vegetable matter?


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

A good way to supply vegetables for shrimp, live bearers, and plecos is to slice a zucchini or other summer squash and bring it to a boil for a minute (parboil). This softens it and makes it sink. Within minutes the shrimp and plecos will be all over it. Extra parboiled squash will keep in the refrigerator for at least a week.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> Ordinary fishfood usually contains a very high amount of protein. If you want to keep shrimp, then I would seek out specialty fishfood for shrimp. The depicted fishfood sold with a carnivore Angelfish is not a good sign. I understand that the fishfood you use may not be the problem, but why not feed your shrimp more vegetable matter?





Michael said:


> A good way to supply vegetables for shrimp, live bearers, and plecos is to slice a zucchini or other summer squash and bring it to a boil for a minute (parboil). This softens it and makes it sink. Within minutes the shrimp and plecos will be all over it. Extra parboiled squash will keep in the refrigerator for at least a week.


This past week I've fed them boiled carrot, although it looks like shrimp were not interested in it at all. In the end, only snails bunched up and ate it in a few hours


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

That's also been my experience with cooked fresh vegetables. Over the years, I've tried to tempt fish and shrimp with microwave-cooked squash (originally frozen slices), canned string beans (French Cut), etc that everybody swears by. Only the snails went after it Maybe it requires more persistence? 

Now, I feed my adult guppies Sera Gran Veggie Granules, which seems to be designed for feeding vegetable matter to guppies. Fortunately, the guppies really like these pellets.

For your shrimp, it may be a matter of just trying a few things.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Great advice, thanks!


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Little update pic:

It looks a bit messy but it just needs some cleaning, trimming and replanting. Although I'll do it later on when plants are will grow bigger.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

It looks like a nice little setup for shrimp and floating plants. 

The rooted plants may need a bit more light. If there's some way you could get light in their direction, even for just a few hours a day, it would help them. (Ideally, if you're using soil, you want rooted plants to grow well and get the substrate aerated properly.)

But all-in-all, not bad for a first try!


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

dwalstad said:


> It looks like a nice little setup for shrimp and floating plants.
> 
> The rooted plants may need a bit more light. If there's some way you could get light in their direction, even for just a few hours a day, it would help them. (Ideally, if you're using soil, you want rooted plants to grow well and get the substrate aerated properly.)
> 
> But all-in-all, not bad for a first try!


At first I had imagined that 19W (allegedly) for an 11L setup would be enough, although I hadn't considered tannins and the driftwood being in the way. Do you think that it would be a good idea to remove the be driftwood? (It would bother me much to take it out as it didn't cost me much, only 15€, ~17$)


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## Dude (Nov 14, 2018)

What about adding a small light pointed at the bottom of the tank?


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Sometimes its just a matter of aiming the light(s) you use a little differently. For example, the light over the bowl next to it could be partially aimed towards side of the tank and hit those rooted plants under the driftwood. 

Still not a big deal. The tank is fine the way it is.


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

UPDATE:

Since I bought the veggie fish food a week and a half ago, no shrimp has died and the fish also enjoy it. The tank looks decent, it seems as the dwarf hairgrass is starting to spread a bit and the moss is climbing up the wood.

I think I'll start to do regular water changes to remove tannins, this way the plants get enough light. I forgot to say that the light from the small bowl is led so I don't think it'd help much.

Interestingly, the female fish has been pregnant since the start, but I haven't seen anything being born, which is strange. Mysiak would probably know if it's that I still have to wait for any fish to be born or it's just that I haven't seen it.


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## mysiak (Jan 17, 2018)

With Neoheterandria elegans females you can't really say if they're pregnant or not. They always look the same.  Technically, they should be pregnant all the time and dropping one fry every few days, but this is probably happening only in ideal conditions. In my experience, to have fry I must feed fish with live food. As soon as I started with daily feeding with freshly hatched brine shrimp, I saw fry quite often. It is also essential to have enough biofilm and micro algae to support newborn fry as they can't accept even the tiniest brine shrimp yet. Layer of mulm helps to promote growth of this micro food (btw. this is needed for Limia fry too, even if they're born much bigger). In too clean/immature tank they won't survive. Also as you correctly mentioned, fry is tiny and sometimes easy to miss. They usually hang out either right at the surface hiding in roots of floating plants or picking mulm at the tank bottom. In a bigger colony they quickly lose their shyness. Slightly higher temperature (~28C or even 30C) can promote breeding as well. However at these temperatures Neocaridina shrimp might suffer and die prematurely (I guess that more fancy/inbred strains will have more problems than wild(ish) types).


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Another shrimp died 😞

It's interesting, it was at the bottom, it barely moved and it was on its belly.


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

JoanToBa,

I've been participating in this and other planted tank forums for decades. I have to say that this thread is the "nicest" that I recall ever experiencing.

Here there has been no arguing and no self-promotion, just good advice. And I think that you are the reason for that. You accept advice and criticism, act on it, and report back on the results. You set the tone.

You don't really need much advice any more, but I'll add something anyway: Lose the test kits and just look at and enjoy what you have created.

Lotsa luck!


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

aquabillpers said:


> JoanToBa,
> 
> I've been participating in this and other planted tank forums for decades. I have to say that this thread is the "nicest" that I recall ever experiencing.
> 
> ...


Aww, thank you, I appreciate it!

I'll definitely take a good moment to contemplate the tank this afternoon.

By the way, let me tell you a little secret, I'm expecting to move out in a few months for academic reasons, but when I finish studying in a few years, I want to make the best Walstad tank I can with a nice amount of saved up money. Expect to see me around in a few years &#128521;

Best regards


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

I have been rethinking your shrimp problem as I wade through a MOUNTAIN of scientific papers on inbreeding depression in fish and shrimp. This is all for preparation of a major article. There's so much evidence that inbreeding affects size, fecundity, vigor, and longevity of both fish and shrimp. We all know that many hobbyists mate siblings willy-nilly. So much continuous inbreeding... Bottom line: If any fish or shrimp are having problems, please consider that the animals are genetically defective to begin with.

That said, good luck with your plans and studies. Everyone needs a "tank break" once in awhile!


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## JoanToBa (Aug 23, 2018)

Very interesting, I hadn't thought of that. Can't wait to read the article!


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

Very nice 'Jar' tanks. I used to keep a small planted Betta Bowl.

I attached a fish load calculator. Its on a word doc.
Not sure how well it works.

<edit> Ooops, its way too big. I can try to PM it to you if you want.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I was able to find the web page for the Fish Load Calculator

http://www.aqadvisor.com/


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## adalah (Feb 10, 2019)

Looks nice...I love this thread


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