# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Need opinions on my 5 gallon tank *updated*



## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

This is my 5 gallon tank.

Somehow, it doesn't have the feel of a professional tank that I see in aquarium stores. Is there something wrong with the arrangement or the type of plants? I am using an ordinary fluorencent lighting. I know it's only 5 gallons, but I have seen very beautiful 5 gallon tanks!

















Also, what do i have to do to get this sort of dim atmosphere? I feel that my tank is a little too bright...









[This message was edited by IIIUSION on Wed July 23 2003 at 07:47 AM.]


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

This is my 5 gallon tank.

Somehow, it doesn't have the feel of a professional tank that I see in aquarium stores. Is there something wrong with the arrangement or the type of plants? I am using an ordinary fluorencent lighting. I know it's only 5 gallons, but I have seen very beautiful 5 gallon tanks!

















Also, what do i have to do to get this sort of dim atmosphere? I feel that my tank is a little too bright...









[This message was edited by IIIUSION on Wed July 23 2003 at 07:47 AM.]


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Hello Illusion,

There are a couple of really easy issues here. The biggest thing is that the layout has a "flat" feeling. In other words, there's no shape to either the plant groupings or the substrate.

Here's what I would do to fix this little tank. Sword plants are out of the question-- never mind 2 of them. Those plants would out grow a 55 gallon tank, so they'll need to go soon. Generally speaking, stem plants, epiphytes, and Riccia lend themselves best to smaller tanks. Further-- Those types of plants are easiest to "sculpt" into contours that will ultimately make your tank more interesting.

Hard decor, or essentially the rocks and wood, are as important to the overall impression of the tank as the plants are. Additionally, they provide a substrate for epiphytes. There are some nice suggestions for hard decor arrangement in the "Aquascaping Principles" thread at the top of this forum which you should read.

The next thing is plant selection. Small tanks demand small plants. Also, you'll be much happier with just a few species in larger groups. Think of a small tank as a piece of a larger one as you'll never be able to achieve the same diversity of plants in this kind of confined space. Stems are perfect due to their upright growth habits and the other reasons outlined above. You'll want to make the plantings in the finished product as dense as possible.

As far as the substrate goes, it's tough to get a real shape in a tank this small. If you do decide to go with alot of stems, you may want to consider reducing the amount of gravel to increase the space in which the stems can grow. Further, it would increase the time between trimmings slightly-- A real bonus.

If you were to get the planting very dense so that the substrate was covered, it would dim the tank considerably. The reflection of light off of the white sand makes the tank very bright. Red plants will also darken a tank more than green.

I hope this gets you started.

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

Thank you so much for your thoughts wheeler!

Ok, forgive me but I am quite new to aquascaping. So are you saying that I have too many plants for my 5 gal tank? How many species would u recommend? I agree that there is a lack of open space in my tank. Perhaps I was a little over ambitious on the amount of plants species. But wouldn't a densely planted tank of just a few species look boring and awful?

Your theory on making my tank dimmer does make sense but then why does the tank in the second pic(not mine) look so dim even though it is not densely planted at all?

Finally, if I were to transfer my present entire setup to a bigger 13 gallon tank, would it look much better?

[This message was edited by IIIUSION on Sat July 19 2003 at 09:34 AM.]


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## Pedro (Jun 11, 2003)

Not to discount the importance of rocks/wood in an aquascape, but it can be difficult to work them into a small space. Many of the points John makes about plants also apply to wood/rocks. Keep them small and few in a small tank. One well placed rock or piece of wood in a small tank should be plenty to creat a focal point. 

Or... It is possible to omit the rocks/wood and use a specific plant or grouping of a single species as a focal point. For example, a grouping of red plants acts as a focal point among other green plants. This technique works particularly well in smaller tanks.

P.S. Using darker sand will help make the tank appear dimmer.


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## Jim Miller (Feb 3, 2003)

I really liked the look of Onyx sand when I had it in my 3 gallon. Not real dark, but a neutral slate grey that was pleasantly dim and didn't compete with the plants or fish for the eye.

jtm

Tank specs in profile


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Hi again!

Illusion writes:
>>Thank you so much for your thoughts wheeler!<<

Certainly-- It is my pleasure to try and help.

>>Ok, forgive me but I am quite new to aquascaping. So are you saying that I have too many plants for my 5 gal tank? How many species would u recommend? I agree that there is a lack of open space in my tank. Perhaps I was a little over ambitious on the amount of plants species. But wouldn't a densely planted tank of just a few species look boring and awful?<<

It is possible to use only 1 species of plant and make a visually stunning aquascape. There are a few ways to go about all of this:

What I do is to arrange my rock and/or wood in an interesting way. Automatically the 'scape is appealing. There's an excellent possibility that any 'scape with interesting static features will be interesting when plants are added.

Next, depending on the size of the tank, I decide about what kinds and number of species of plants I wish to keep. There is a special feeling that an aquarium with a few species of plant yields as well as an aquarium with many species. The more interesting or intricate my hard decor is, the less plant species I'll use as a rule. I suggest you read up your Nature Aquarium World books by Takashi Amano-- especially book #2 which features small aquariums.

>>Your theory on making my tank dimmer does make sense but then why does the tank in the second pic(not mine) look so dim even though it is not densely planted at all?<<

The second pic has an aged substrate and won't reflect nearly as much light. I'd also suspect that that aquarist is using less light in general. The dim look can easily be achieved by reducing the total amount of light on your tank, or by using dark plants, substrate, etc.... I like your bright tank, personally, and would concentrate on getting dense plant growth. That oughta get you there









Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

Thank you all for all the replies. 

May I know where I could get list of links of pictures of small aquascapes less than 10 gallons? I am sure I would be able to learn something...Thanks again


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

AGA Contest - Index of Entries: Aquatic Garden < 70L

This is the best spot I know of to view lots of small tanks.

ALl of the above comments are dead on. The hardest part about micro tanks are that the best plants for them take time to grow in. A 5g really is a bonzai tank. Be patient. Fast growing plants aren't suited to a small tank. They outgrow it too fast. This also means that your best plants may take months to grow in properly. If you are impatient, buy more of the plants.

As the tank grows, see how the plants you have work out. Plants that grow too fast should be pulled from the tank.

Your foreground is very sparce. As it grows in and covers the white gravel you will see that tank will dimm.

Take the plants that grow well for you and group them, so that they have a greater visual impact. Color will also add an entirely new dimension to the tank. For aquariums, color is the fourth dimension.

When taking pictures make sure to fill the tank. The air gap at the top is very distracting.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Fast growing plants are appropriate for a small tank if the owner is willing to maintain them. Weekly trimming in a tank that small is a trivial task compared a larger tank that needs trimming every 4 weeks. You could trim a 5g tank full of stems in mere minutes. 

Slow plants are good for any tank where the owner doesn't care for tons of maintenance. Most hobbyosts will be somewhere on the middle and will wish to use some of each. Frankly, fast growers will make tank upkeep easier as they will be a better weapon on the algae front. IME, smaller tanks have a harder time dealing with nutrients, and thusly, algaes.

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

For prunning of stem plants, is it necessary to uproot it before cutting off the bottom?

If I am not wrong, cutting it without uprooting it will cause it to branch out.

If the 1st statement is correct, then it must be a nightmare pruning a large tank


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

It really depends on the plant, Illusion. The vast majority of stem plants will branch at the cut where they had been trimmed. This is a great way to get more plant mass for free, and it creates dense, bushy growth. Just make sure that you toss the bottoms if they become too algae ridden and just keep the tops.

Just keeping the tops and throwing away the bottoms is a great way to constantly replenish your plants. The bottoms are the oldest growth, and will have the most attached algaes. 

Some stems don't tolerate this treatment well, although I've heard about success with nearly all of them. I lost a beautiful stand of Rotala wallichii because I trimmed it back too many times, and each time it got a little weaker before failing to return. E. stellata is one that is quite difficult to propagate in this manner.

Large tanks filled with stems are a real maintenance chore. Small tanks are as well, but it alot less work more frequently.

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## Tenor1 (Mar 3, 2003)

Hello Illusion,

There are many FINE things about your tank. The plants look extremly healthy and I don't see any type of algae problems with it.

James referrenced a great site to see small tanks. I have a 6-gallon tank and will attempt to e-mail you a picture (is your address available?).

When I was designing my tank I used the parts of James tank I liked the best. No it's not a copy of his by any means. But I did try for a mix of plant colour and texture. It's more about scale when planning these little tanks. What I would recommend in your tank is adding some red plants.

My 3 main plants are dwarf hairgrass, Mayaka and ludwigia repens. I trim all of them @ every 2 weeks. I have not replanted the Mayaka or the Repens yet, but know one week that will need to be done.

Maybe I can convence James to post a picture here







if I send it to him.

Regards,
Carlos

==============================
I try to keep the tank plain and simple but it never stays that way!


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Send away

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Here's for Carlos;

















*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

Wow! Carlos, it's gorgeous!!

But I think it needs a trim soon


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## Tenor1 (Mar 3, 2003)

Thanks James for the posting and thanks Illusion for the Wow. The tank got a trim last night. What I wanted to show (other than the tank, lol) was the scale of the plants. I based it on James beautiful tank. Unfortunately, the Luwigia doesn't like it's picture taken making it difficult to see the nice red leaves. The pictures always are too bright in the upper portion. There's almost 5WPG on the tank.

There are basically 3 plants in the tank. You may want to consider removing some of the larger growing plants in your tank as some get fairly large. The roots on the swords are quite invasive and will overtake the tank. How much light does your tank have? When your plants start to bend at the water line it will look darker immediately. Although my picture looks too bright the tank in person seems normal even with 5 WPG. 

Just thought of something...I should adjust the exposure on my little camera. The actual tank isn't as bright as the exposure on the pictures.

Good luck,
Carlos

==============================
I try to keep the tank plain and simple but it never stays that way!


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## charels363 (Sep 16, 2004)

i have a 5gl plant tank. i only use java moss as a carpet and a lot of rocks. a small tank like that, i don't want to use too many different speices of plant. there are some really big plants in your tank (they will grow very fast and tall), like the warer sprite the one right behand the wood, and the one at rare right coner. if you have enough light you may can try Glossos a very frone grow plant for the whole tank with some rocks or you may want to try all the low light plants like java moss and java ferm and anubia nana.


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by charles yan:
> i have a 5gl plant tank. i only use java moss as a carpet and a lot of rocks. a small tank like that, i don't want to use too many different speices of plant. there are some really big plants in your tank (they will grow very fast and tall), like the warer sprite the one right behand the wood, and the one at rare right coner. if you have enough light you may can try Glossos a very frone grow plant for the whole tank with some rocks or you may want to try all the low light plants like java moss and java ferm and anubia nana.


I would love to get some java moss but I can't seem to find any in and around my area.


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

You can't find java moss in Singapore?! 

It was my understanding that there are LFS's in S-pore like we have gas stations or convenience stores over here-- sometimes more than 1 on each block. I would think that in a competitive business structure like that, any LFS would be happy to bring in such a common plant for you. Have you asked?

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## Tenor1 (Mar 3, 2003)

Singapore supplies our Los Angeles fish stores will LOTS of plants and it is extremely rare to get Java moss. Go figure, lol.

Regards,
Carlos

==============================
I try to keep the tank plain and simple but it never stays that way!


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

Hi guys!!!

I took all your advice and suggestions, looked up countless fish mags at my library and decided to do a complete overhaul of my 5 gallon tank(posted above) complete with new driftwood and black gravel.









Without fish









With fishies

I must admit it looks absolutely wonderful! Much better than my old one. Thanks again for all the encouragement. Off to enjoy my new tank! Cheerio!


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I REALLY like it.
I can't wait to see it grow in









*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

James, I remembered to fill it to the brim before taking the picture. Come to think of it, the tank did look awful when 3/4 filled


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Wheeler:
> You can't find java moss in Singapore?!
> ...


Sorry, but what are LFS?


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Local Fish Store










Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

By the way-- The new tank looks great, Illusion. Be sure to post us some pics in 2-3 weeks so we can see the progress, OK?

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

What is the plant behind the Lileaopsis and in front of the wood? The one with round leaves-- Is it some sort of Crypt?

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Wheeler:
> What is the plant behind the Lileaopsis and in front of the wood? The one with round leaves-- Is it some sort of Crypt?
> ...


I have no idea









And yes, I can't wait for the tank to mature!

[This message was edited by IIIUSION on Wed July 23 2003 at 05:46 PM.]


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

HAHA!! You don't know?!

Was there a common name that it was sold under? My guess is that's it's either some sort of immature sword or a Crypt that I don't know of.... C. lingua maybe?

Any other guesses? It looks neat.

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## ckll (Jun 20, 2003)

Just to rub it in .. yamato shrimps (C. Japonica) are S$1 each locally .. abt 60 US cents ..

Sorry .. can't help it


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by ckll:
> Just to rub it in .. yamato shrimps (C. Japonica) are S$1 each locally .. abt 60 US cents ..
> ...


Yeah, and they die rather easily too


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## gnome (Jan 27, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Wheeler:
> Any other guesses?


If the petiole were not so long, my guess would be a baby melon sword, but honestly, I've never seen anything like it, either. Then again, I would have guessed that the foreground plant was C. parva, not lilaeopsis. I definitely need to get new Rx glasses







.

Most swords do get too big for a tank this size - I learned the hard way. When I started my first planted tank in a 5.5-gallon, I accidentally bought an Ozelot sword, thinking it was a C. wendtii (yes, in the *very* beginning... Ha-ha). It grew and grew and I had to get rid of it, but by this time, the roots had reached clear across to the far extremes of the tank. So basically, once I uprooted them, I had to replant everything. However, the one sword that can be worked in beautifully in a 5.5-gallon tank is Echinodorus parviflorus 'Tropica.' Again, the roots will easily creep into the far extremes of the tank, so you want to be sure that where you place it is where you intend to leave it. And of course, E. tenellus is a great "grassy" sword in any-size tank.

This brings back so many memories from two years ago, when I started with plants. I managed to stick like a dozen different species into my 5.5-gallon tank. I was more interested to see if they would even survive. I didn't realize that doing something as simple as adding CO2 and having 2.5 wpg of lighting would pretty much assure the survival of *any* species, and actually make many of them grow so FAST! I was just trying to keep up with maintenance and after some months, I was blessed with BGA. I say "blessed" because it made me have to stop and rethink my strategy...









Now my favorite planted tank is my 2.5-gallon. It's nothing to look at, but I've finally got it down to four distinct species, and I'm discovering that less is more. It's actually good to have at least one stand of a fast-growing stem plant to act as a nutrient sink, especially if you have fish in the tank. Just place it somewhere so that when you do go to trim and/or replant, you can do so without disturbing the neighboring plants too much.

This aquascape is very nice. If you do decide that you want to add something red, do try Rotala indica. Of if you want to go with a red rosette, try Cryptocoryne wendtii 'Tropica.' The regular wendtiis will get really big (another thing I learned the hard way







).

-Naomi


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## ckll (Jun 20, 2003)

Totally agree on the nutrient sinker .. I let my difformis do the job. But since it takes root very easily, now I tied them up and stick them on the tank (side) wall with a rubber suction cup..

So, when the root grow ugly, I just trim them away and keep the new shoots, re-tie and re-stick them .. no need to uproot and mess up the gravel ..


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

I've got a question. Is the plant on the left behind the stump a Limnophila aquatica(giant ambulia) or is it the dwarf ambulia? If it is the former, then I wonder if gettting the latter would be a better as it's growing too fast for me.

Also, I am thinking of adding some glosso(if I manage to get some) in front of the tank. Do you think it's a good idea?


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## ckll (Jun 20, 2003)

I'm not good at plant id .. can't help you there .. but if you are trying to make the tank look bigger than it is, small leave plants are best ..

It's not difficult getting glosso in lfs here .. but do you have enough light ? With insufficient light, they tend to grow vertically upwards ..


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by ckll:
> 
> It's not difficult getting glosso in lfs here .. but do you have enough light ? With insufficient light, they tend to grow vertically upwards ..


Do u think MY tank has enough light to support horizontal glossos?


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

Hi again guys!

This is my latest update. I have added some glosso on the left side of the tank. Actually, I am not 100% sure if the plants are indeed glossos. Can someone confirm it? If it is, I hope it grows well and carpets the gravel soon.
Wish me luck.

The pot of glosso(i think)









The planted area


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Yep...That's Glossostigma, alright.

Best wishes,
John Wheeler


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## ckll (Jun 20, 2003)

Wow! You worked fast!









I have 2.7 wpg and they grow pretty vertical. They start to "sag down" when they are abt 2.5 inch tall.


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by ckll:
> Wow! You worked fast!
> ...


What do u mean by sag down? Btw, I made sure I had enough light by getting two 15 watt fluorescent lamps. That gives me 30/6= 5 watts per gal. If this doesn't work, I don't know what will!


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## ckll (Jun 20, 2003)

meant to say that after growing vertically for 2.5 inch, they decided it's time to grow horizontally by shooting out roots at the nodes to pull the plants down ..

Yeah .. at 5wpg it'd better start growing horizontally ..


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## 2la (Feb 3, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by IIIUSION:
> I've got a question. Is the plant on the left behind the stump a Limnophila aquatica(giant ambulia) or is it the dwarf ambulia?


It is probably the latter. Good looking plant and you've got the lighting intensity to keep it from getting leggy (hopefully!). The hammered-leaved plant is almost definitely an Echinodorus species, though I'm not sure which one. Seems too small to be a radican, and doesn't quite look like a melon sword as Naomi mentioned...

 
(Click for pics)


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## IIIUSION (Jul 19, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by ckll:
> meant to say that after growing vertically for 2.5 inch, they decided it's time to grow horizontally by shooting out roots at the nodes to pull the plants down ..
> ...


I'll keep you guys updated on their growth...wish me luck









[This message was edited by IIIUSION on Mon August 04 2003 at 02:27 AM.]


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