# Guppy with worms? (see pics)



## maestrale

This morning I have isolated the sick fish and could get a sample of the white string. I saw it under microscope (x300 - x900) and noticed a lot of balls inside the white thing, possibly eggs. As you can see from the pics, the white string looks segmented.
So it seems to me that the guppy is hosting a worm, which in time extrudes its tail out of the guppy to spread its eggs.
I also noticed planaria in the tank a while ago, but I think this fish had worms when I got it and the other fish in the tank never seemed to be affected by worms.
Do you agree with this theory? If so, which medication would you recommend?


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## mudboots

I've never seen anything like that before, but please keep us posted on what you do and how it works.


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## neilshieh

frankly that looks disgusting, but i'd say try using dog deworming powder or liquid. it should contain this ingredient: Fenbendazole
i'm not too sure on dosing, but it should kill any worms including your planaria.


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## Red_Rose

I've seen fish with that type of stringy stuff coming out of them when they are infected with Callamanus nematodes. If that is what your guppies have(hopefully for you and your fish, they don't!) then you will want to get some Levamisole quickly.

Here's a site of where you can buy it and there are some pictures at the bottom of the page that shows what fish infected with this nematode look like.

As bad as it sounds, I just wouldn't go by his dosing instructions. I think it's way too strong for such small fish so if you do have to treat them with this medication, please use the dosing instructions on Loaches.com.

The Fenbendazole that another member here suggested is only good if it's ingested and it can be hard to tell if your fish are eating enough of the medication but if they are still eating and you want to use the Levamisole as a last resort, then you can follow Diana's instructions on how to make a homemade food that contains Fenbendazole for your fish. It worked for her so it could work for you too! Just try to get it in liquid form as it mixes better with the food then the powdered kind.


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## Franzi

I would just flush the fish and worm down the toilet. Save yourself the trouble.


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## vicky

Wow. Very bad idea. Perhaps euthanize it by freezing and then compost it - but never down the toilet. I hope I am misreading an attempt at humor - but that is just a very bad idea.


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## neilshieh

+1 on what vicky said. this isn't finding nemo. the toilet doesn't go to the ocean. i'd say if you're going to kill a fish, get a cup or small container and let the fish live out the rest of its life in isolation.


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## maestrale

I want to do my best to cure the fish. I just don't want to kill the poor guy because of a worm.

I'm treating him with the Epsom salt method (http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=339364 )and will use a medication if this fails.


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## vicky

Sorry to seem insensitive. I really wasn't suggesting you give up on your fish and I'm pleased that you are trying to treat it. You will certainly learn something by doing so and you may save its life, and those of other fish, too. I wish I had a suggestion for treatment, but it is outside my area of expertise. 

I'm just really against flushing fish and plants. Even dead ones. They belong in the compost, not in the sewer.


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## Red_Rose

Good for you, maestrale! You obviously care about your fish unlike some of the people who have posted in this thread.

Try the medications I recommended in my previous post if the epsom salts don't work. Levamisole is a powerful dewormer that's used for farm animals so it should definitely work for your fish. Medications like Jungle's Parasite Clear along with the anti-parasitic food made by the same company may even help so you don't have to resort to using a stronger medication.

As for euthanizing, again please DO NOT just put them in the freezer or just flush the fish! People don't seem to understand that when you flush a fish, you are putting whatever has infected that fish into the water system! It's not just disappearing off of the face of the earth. By adding these parasites and bacteria to the water system you are taking the chance of not only infecting your own fish again but other people's fish as well. Also, a fish can live for several days in the septic tanks. As for freezing them, again it's not a good thing because it's not an instant death. The fish is alive for several hours while in the freezer before it finally dies. Both deaths are very painful so it's not a smart thing to do. If you wouldn't subject a kid or family member through anything similar to that then don't do it to an animal of any kind.

Below is how to humanely euthanize a fish using Clove oil. If all else fails and this is something you have to resort to, then please follow the instructions below. Do not listen to anyone who is quick to say flush it or freeze it.

*"Clove Oil and Tank Water Method

Buy pure clove oil. You can get it at a health food store for under $10 for a � ounce bottle. Put the fish in a medium sized mixing bowl in his own water from his tank. In a small jar or something with a lid (I use a cleaned out jelly jar) mix the clove oil with tank water. Put the lid on and shake it like crazy over and over until the liquid in it is white. Then pour a little into the mixing bowl with the fish. Swirl it with your hand. The fish might fight it just a little bit and then slow down. Then pour a little more in and swirl again. He should just go to sleep and appear dead. If he doesn't, try a little more of the clove solution, always shaking very well before an addition to the bowl. When he goes to sleep, leave him in the solution for a good 10 minutes and then put him in a small cup or zip-lock baggie and put him in the freezer. Pain free death. Very humane. We should all go so easily."*


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## Newt

I can send you some internal parasite food by Jungle Labs.

PM me if you want to try it.


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## Diana K

When one fish is showing something like this, then any other fish in contact with this fish, even by the sharing of equipment from one tank to another may be infested. 
I would treat all your tanks with the same medicine at the same time. 
Perhaps use both medicines, but at separate times. Run a course of Levamisol (per Loaches) then a course of Fenbendazole.


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## neilshieh

Red_Rose said:


> Good for you, maestrale! You obviously care about your fish unlike some of the people who have posted in this thread.


please don't judge us on our opinions, its not that we don't care about out fish we're simply bringing up other options, though one of us may have been a bit rude about saying just flush it. We certainly don't kill every fish that has a problem, but then again it'd be like not culling defective bettas from the spawn, getting rid of unwanted ugly hybrids, keeping a person alive even though he or she is a vegetable, etc. i'm not saying what a person should do but there is a point where letting go is better than going through more crap than it's worth, but of course its all in personal opinion. so please next time don't make it seem like some are ruthless people just killing off the useless or hampered. thank you.
if i misinterpreted your intentions then please correct me.


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## Red_Rose

neilshieh said:


> please don't judge us on our opinions, its not that we don't care about out fish we're simply bringing up other options, though one of us may have been a bit rude about saying just flush it. We certainly don't kill every fish that has a problem, but then again it'd be like not culling defective bettas from the spawn, getting rid of unwanted ugly hybrids, keeping a person alive even though he or she is a vegetable, etc. i'm not saying what a person should do but there is a point where letting go is better than going through more crap than it's worth, but of course its all in personal opinion. so please next time don't make it seem like some are ruthless people just killing off the useless or hampered. thank you.
> if i misinterpreted your intentions then please correct me.


The section you quoted of my post was mainly directed towards the person who said to flush it although many people don't classify freezing a freshwater fish as a humane death. That's why clove oil is most often recommended.

I can understand some of your points but think of it this way. Doesn't it seem extremely lazy to take the easy approach all of the time when it comes to taking care of anything? For example, the lazy(or easy) approach to how to deal with this sick guppy would be to kill it. Why not try to get him better? It could very well take no time at all to help the little guy so why not give it a try? It could also take a lot but at least in the end, the caretaker could say that they at least tried to help him/her. You said that "we don't kill every fish that has a problem" but that's one of the first things that was suggested from some of the people here. If the guppy had Dropsy or fish TB where there is no medication to help him either slow down the illness or cure him completely then I could understand euthanizing him but what he has could be easily cleared up if given the chance.

Another thing that irks me about all of this is how so many people are so quick to just kill off a sick animal because they don't want to be bothered with trying to help it yet G-d forbid they consider doing that to a human of any age. That's what really bothers me. It's acceptable to say euthanize it when it's an animal but completely wrong if it's a person who's putting their family into debt or possible bankruptcy because of the treatments and procedures they need. It would take a whole lot less time and effort to help the animal then the human. You also can't compare culling fry to pulling the plug on someone who is a vegetable. Most people would have no problems culling a fish for whatever reason it may be but would go to Hell and back to help the vegetable knowing there is a little to nil chance of recovery. Pulling the plug on them is often a very last resort so it should be the same for a sick animal.

As for culling fry because of genetic defects, I understand why breeders do that. I have a friend that breeds fish and I have no problems with him culling some of the fry. They want good genetics in their fish so that the people who buy them are getting the best of course, those fish can still get sick at any point down the road. It's funny, isn't it? Breeders want good genetics in the fish they breed yet if they had a defective or deformed child, it would be a different story.


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## maestrale

I think the Epsom salt solution worked. After a couple of days from cure start the guppy got rid of a piece of the worm. The following day he ejected I think the rest of the worm. I didn't see any white poop since then. I'm still keeping the guppy in a breeding net to check him closely, but I'll probably release him into the main tank soon.

I'll write an update if I notice the issue again, but if you don't see updates on this thread it means that the cure worked.

Thanks all for your suggestions. I highly recommend the Epsom salt method . It's not as toxic as the other medications and seems to have done its job.


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## vicky

Glad the little critter is doing better. Let's hope it is all gone and doesn't spread.


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## maestrale

Yep. If it spreads I know the cure now


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