# Seiryu rocks



## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Well, after seeing how everyone up in San Francisco was talking about Aqua Forest, I decided to drive up there and take a look for myself and get some ADA stuff too. I bought out most of the rocks that day(sorry if I bought the rocks you wanted..) I couldn't help myself. Now my backyard collection of "Amano rocks" has piled up more. The rocks costed a lot but it was worth it.










Comments? Suggestions?


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## bpm2000 (Jul 5, 2005)

Comments? Send some my way!  Should be good material to work with!


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## trckrunrmike (Jan 31, 2005)

Mind if you tell us how much you spent?


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Mind telling me your address and if you have dog(s) or not in your backyard?


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

I bought the Seiryu and Ohko rocks at 3.99 per pound if I remember correctly, I was also looking for Manten rocks but it was empty. It seems like they have raised the price, maybe due to high demand? Was is 1.99 mike? The story was top quality, rare fish/plants, finally a lfs that deals with rarer fishes like boraras and darios. The prices were high but I was willing to pay. ADA stuff all over and rare plants. Their show tanks were also nice. Go pay them a visit, more rocks will come in January according to them, hope you guys beat me to buying them out . I spent around 100$.. early xmas for me. Well here's the rocks in the tank, now try to imagine white sand, Aqua soil Amazonia, 12 Red Axelrod Rasbora (everyone loves my current cardinals so I might not be able to swap them), an Eheim 2213 with ADA lily pipes, inline heater(?), taiwan moss and bits of hc, and weekly dosing of ADA liquid ferts. I might do diy co2 under the 28 watt coralife fixture(thanks to bigals free shipping).










and don't worry Gomer.. I'll get some dogs just for you


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## JaySilverman (Jun 19, 2005)

Man, I never thought someone would actually buy rocks of zero value. This rock hobby is getting way out of hand. The prices are jacked up so bad its funny.


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## SnyperP (Dec 10, 2004)

Don't worry Gomer, I know where it is! Just bring some doggie kibble to distract any dogs. Operation Stone Quarry is a go!

Lol. J/K. Let me know if you plan to head to AF again in the future. 

Great rocks. =D


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Haha, anti-gomer/snyper dogs immune to your doggy bits haha. Yea sure, maybe sometime between January and March for sure. I didn't go up there just for the rocks haha, cousin's graduation at UC Davis and paid my aunt a visit.


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## brianclaw (May 17, 2005)

I love the rock arrangement, but the tank seems a little too deep. Have you thought of using driftwoods as the main decoration and the rocks as accents around the woods instead?
You seem to have a natural talent for rock work... I can never arrange my rocks as nicely.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

What do you mean by too deep? Wood and rock is nice but I don't have any branches on hand. I love rock scapes that's why I do them the most, but I will try different scapes too.


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## brianclaw (May 17, 2005)

turtlehead said:


> What do you mean by too deep?


The height of the tank is too far away from the top of the highest rock. You'll have a more balanced look if the highest point in the rock arrangement is roughly 2/3s the tank height.
Take for example your first pic... See how the top of the highest rock is roughly 1/3 away from the top of the frame? It doesn't look quite as flat.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Yea, I didn't have enough substrate to make the rocks a little higher, but then I will still come short, I will have to think of either a higher hill or taller rocks. But thanks for reminding me.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)




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## Robert Hudson (Feb 5, 2004)

I like the umbrella, how much did that cost you? [smilie=l:


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## aquaessentials (Dec 15, 2004)

JaySilverman said:


> Man, I never thought someone would actually buy rocks of zero value. This rock hobby is getting way out of hand. The prices are jacked up so bad its funny.


I disagree that rocks have zero value. OK, they exist naturally but as soon as anyone decides to export anything, a price tag is attached. Don't forget these rocks have been selected, cleaned and shipped (the last one really bumps up the price). I actually think the price of $3.99 a pound is pretty good - it wouldn't be that cheap in the UK so I think you're on to a pretty good thing.

Regardless, quality hardscaping items are priceless IMO


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## random_alias (Nov 7, 2005)

Hardscape items are the hardest and rarest to find. They occur naturally and their shapes, sizes, colors and textures are difficult to impossible to change.

Often, a rock will have one, maybe two good sides that can be used. If exposing these sides changes the shape or texture of the rock in a way that does not fit the aquascape, then that beautiful rock is useless. You can fracture a large rock into smaller rocks, but then you amplify the number of useless sides because of the unnature appearance of the fracture damage. Finding enough useful rocks of the same color, texture and appropriate variations of size is very difficult.

Much of the same is true for wood, although it is often more forgiving because it doesn't have to be as dominant and exposed as rock and you have more freedom as far as orientation and placement are concerned. Wood is also easier to cut to size or shape.

I have adopted a new strategy for my aquariums. I will no longer buy an aquarium in the size I want it and then face the problem of finding a hardscape that fits into those dimensions. Now, I find a hardscape that I like and I take those dimensions and look for a tank that fits around them well.

You see, it's easy to place and trim plants to get the size, shape, color and texture that you are looking for. It's easy to order a tank in most any size. Lighting isn't that hard either. There are lots of options on all this equipment, but the random luck of the draw that is often the case with stone and wood _should_ make them your number one priority because they are going to be your most limiting factor, and your greatest headache if you save them for last.

So, sure, wood and stone are everywhere. But the right group in the right color, shape size and aquarium-safe composition is much much rarer. Having them found in another part of the world where they are native, cleaned and shipped to you, that's pretty much priceless.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Shoot... the umbrella costed a few cents when I ate some jello with my dim sum.


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## soyadude (Dec 17, 2005)

You just have to take a nice walk through nature to get what you need...

Like I just have to dig somewhere nearby to get laterite for substrate . Rocks are a little harder to get espescially those with natural look of being eroded over thousands of years to form their shapes. 

So I agree and disagree with it being worth the price those rocks were at. You can go to the nearest river/waterfall and look for interesting things to add to your tank (might be illegal in some places) or you could conveniently walk into a designer aqua-plant shop and pay a hefty price for it. It's all up to the individual.

Interestingly to me though, I saw auctions of endlers fish for sale on aquabid for USD 20.00 a piece. I can buy three bags full for a dollar. Sure they're wild caught.. but unless you're running research on the genetics of the fish, you don't really need to pay like that. Feeder endlers here are equally attractive.

Just my 2 cents.


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## aquaessentials (Dec 15, 2004)

soyadude said:


> You just have to take a nice walk through nature to get what you need...
> 
> Like I just have to dig somewhere nearby to get laterite for substrate . Rocks are a little harder to get espescially those with natural look of being eroded over thousands of years to form their shapes.
> 
> ...


Maybe Malaysia is more plentiful for hardcsaping products, but if I dug some earth up, it would most likely be full of rubble and gravel and the rocks, well I wouldn't even give them a second thought - they're far from ideal and would make an unattractive aquascape no matter how skilled you are. You've got to pay for quality...


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## random_alias (Nov 7, 2005)

Yeah, I've been to local rock places and purchased rocks by the pound, total crap in an aquarium. Too flat and unnatural. I visited the local river too. No driftwood at all, but if you're interested in some slightly used car parts or contraceptives...

Take my time, my gas, my frustration, divide it all by 3.99 a lb and you get a pretty darn good deal on something I can't pick up during a casual stroll through nature or even an intense searching mission.

I could have purchased a plane ticket and visited the mountains of Japan, but that doesn't really add up next to $56 with shipping.


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## plantbrain (Jan 23, 2004)

Try and raise one of the rocks on the right side up higher.
The first pic out of the tank looks better.

Two scenes are nice like this.
I generally work with one scene and go from there, unless I have the room.
Generally 3-4ft or more.

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## soyadude (Dec 17, 2005)

Yeah i'm lucky to be in a tropical environment where it's easy to get materials to work with. I don't have many good rocks to work with, but wood's aplenty. Don't have any petrified wood though. People from Arizona USA have one of the best sources of petrified wood.

Can't afford to buy petrified wood .


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

What do you guys think about the rock I added on the left? Useful or useless?


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## random_alias (Nov 7, 2005)

On the righthand side, there is a distinct visual "space" between the back stone and the rest in the forefront. It is easy to see the depth of the scape. On the lefthand side, my eye easily follows from the top of the large "peak" stone to the large back stone but I don't perceive "space" between the two. IMO, the way these two stones run together causes the tank to lose depth.

To me, the righthand side looks several inches deeper than the lefthand side because of this. I can almost imagine that the back left stone is against the back glass and the back right stone is sitting behind the tank. That righthand side arrangement does a very good job of showing depth. It may just not be possible to match it on the left while the tank is bare.

If you are going to plant something between these stones that will grow up and break up the way the tops of these stones run together then that would probably work to solve the problem without having to change the stone arrangement. Those two stones are in good places based on their sizes and shapes, they really belong on the lefthand side where they are. Just make sure that once the planting is done they don't end up causing a loss of depth.

I like it.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Experiementing now since everything has been delayed...









What do you think?


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## JaySilverman (Jun 19, 2005)

I like that. Looks like a volcano kinda


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## brianclaw (May 17, 2005)

Oh.... I like this a lot more... You definitely have a natural talent for rock work.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

This is more of what I had in mind with ADA soil.


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## brianclaw (May 17, 2005)

Daaammmnn..... I think you've really out done yourself with this one. What are you planning on putting in this?


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

another try...








HC or Taiwan moss for plants.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Well after watching me scape the rocks, my mom decided to jump in here's hers vs my final one:








VS








It's hard to choose... I'm going for all HC now.


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## Overfloater (Apr 2, 2004)

The last one is my favorite. I would raise the stone furthest in the back right a little bit though. Maybe get some more substrate under it. Nice work regardless.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Well my ADA soil came today, so I will be doing that. Thanks.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

The bottom one is better overall, expecially the left side. The right sod eof the top one is a tad better because the stones match better and have a good flow. Making sure to use plants between the right grouping will help seperate them visually (at least for photography) and add more depth. same for the left side of course although the most important part there will be making sure the photo shows some green between the layout and back glass. This will also add depth, just make sure you don't add too much depth to one side making the other look flat and disjointed

Very nice and I can't wait to see this planted. As fo rthat, I would start with only HC as it will be easy to add some moss ro riccia or dwarf hairgrass in the back for "volume" The HC will definately take the longest to fill in and the whole look can change once it is filled in. You don't want faster growing plants needing a serious uproot and trim before the HC is filled in.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Yea, I know what you are talking about Dennis, I will add other plants after the HC has filled in, since plants liek riccia and hairgrass grow way fast than HC.


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