# Water changes



## mshi (Jan 12, 2007)

In her book Diana Walstad says avoid frequent water changes and says she changes about 50% every 6 months. What indicators are used to determine a change is needed. If it is nitrate levels at what level is a change recommended. I don't want to wait until it appears the fish are stressed. Also any input on carbon use. I know she doesn't use it on a regular basis, but when should it be used in this low tech method. I am used to the high tech (marine) side of the hobby and it is hard breaking old habits.


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## littleguy (Jan 6, 2005)

Great question... I've wondered about this too. Here was a previous post on the subject, but not too much info there....

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/el-natural/18533-wet-thumb-forum-what-signals-the.html


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## onemyndseye (May 12, 2006)

"....With good plant growth in an established aquarium, water changes may be unnecessary...."

The only reason to change the water is if something is not quite right. Plant growth slowed, plants looking deficient, water badly stained by tannins, because ya want to 

Unless water testing shows a big Nutrient buildup or something else out of wack...and If your plants and fish are happy and your water looks and smells clean there is no reason to do a water change.

Take Care,
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## mshi (Jan 12, 2007)

Any opinions on carbon use - when if ever to use it with a low tech set up (under normal conditions - I am not refering to removing medicines)


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

I'm not sure there's any reason to add activated carbon under normal circumstances. I've added it to help control algae, but it doesn't really seem to make any difference.

I would save it for unusual circumstances and emergencies when you need to remove excessive dissolved organic carbon:


extreme water discoloration from soil releasing humic acids
lots of dying plants (e.g., a "Cryptocoryne meltdown") releasing their "innards"
filter malfunction where all the bacteria died releasing their "innards"


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## Emily6 (Feb 14, 2006)

Hi, I'm new and recently converted to "El Natural." On the subject of water changes, my tap water has ridiculously high phosphates in it (it's community water). I've been using a phosphate sponge in the filter but it causes the phosphates to swing dramatically. Oddly, even after lowering the phosphates, they perk up again on their own yet I can't find the source. I've kept fish happily for over 7 years without a record of over feeding. :-/ Any advice appreciated.


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## Squawkbert (Jan 3, 2007)

IMHO - periodic water changes are a good thing, even in a planted aquarium. 

Why?
Because there is some junk that even catfish won't eat. 

It builds up over time and if it reaches critical mass, you come down with "old tank syndrome" when the wrong parch of gravel/sand gets disturbed. Some detritus won't hurt anything, but you shouldn't just let it build up. Maybe certain tanks don't have this problem, but I suspect that these tanks are a lot larger than those found in all but a very few homes (and even the 1600g tank Tom Barr posted about has a lot of automation built in - for water changes).

There are tanks that have gone for years w/o water changes and they look OK, but I doubt that they're as stable as tanks that receive regular attention. I have a relative w/ 6 African Cichlids & a pleco in a 45g corner. He doesn't change the water. The fish stir stuff up now and then (probably the only reason he hasn't had a serious problem yet), and they allow a little algae to persist in places (just enough to keep the NO3 at tolerable levels), but I'm waiting for a "What do you think happened?" call...


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## nswhite (Aug 25, 2006)

The carbon will do nothing for your planted tank the only thing carbon does is it can be used for taking out medications or chemicals that have been added to the tank. And about the water changes I would just test the water levels and make your water change schedule based on that.


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## dymndgyrl (Jan 22, 2007)

Squawkbert said:


> IMHO - periodic water changes are a good thing, even in a planted aquarium.
> Why? Because there is some junk that even catfish won't eat.
> It builds up over time and if it reaches critical mass, you come down with "old tank syndrome" when the wrong parch of gravel/sand gets disturbed.


Maybe, but you're talking about gravel vacuuming, not just water changes. In a true NPT you don't disturb the gravel, and the 'junk' eventually gets broken down and becomes part of the substrate. (This being fish food, fish waste and dead plant material, what else is there?)

I think the original poster wants to know why even bother doing _any_ water changes. What are the indicators? Diana answered this in the link that littleguy sent - guilt (in other words - if the tank is stable, there is no reason to change the water)


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

I don't do water changes per se in my natural tanks. Ever.

Perhaps every month or two I do siphon out excess mulm and other debris and replace that water, but it's never more than 5 to 10 percent a month.

Bill


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## furballi (Feb 2, 2007)

Water change happens all the time in the real world...it's called rain. The only exception would be a covered pond. The smaller the aquarium, the greater the need for a water change. 10% water change each week should be beneficial to both plants and fish.


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## sb483 (May 29, 2006)

furballi said:


> Water change happens all the time in the real world...it's called rain. The only exception would be a covered pond. The smaller the aquarium, the greater the need for a water change. 10% water change each week should be beneficial to both plants and fish.


In the book _Ecology of the Planted Aquarium_, a tank setup is described where aquatic plants grow in soil from a garden, and water changes are kept minimal (like 25% every 6 months or so). Plants consume fish waste and CO2 and release oxygen, Dissolved Organic Carbon, and other things that are beneficial for fish and plants; removing these things by frequent water changes or activated carbon can actually be detrimental to the tank.
For more detail check the book, or the stickys above. In this type of natural planted tank, a water change every week may not be as good as a water change every year or so.


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## Grayum (Jun 14, 2006)

dwalstad said:


> I would save it for unusual circumstances and emergencies when you need to remove excessive dissolved organic carbon:
> 
> 
> extreme water discoloration from soil releasing humic acids
> ...


I know I sound like a broken record, but if im ever looking to get clearer water, I use Seachem Purigen instead of carbon. does a much better job, lasts for months, and can be regenerated.


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

furballi said:


> Water change happens all the time in the real world...it's called rain. The only exception would be a covered pond. The smaller the aquarium, the greater the need for a water change. 10% water change each week should be beneficial to both plants and fish.


Many ponds do not get water changes. They have no significant outlets. Over the course of a year, precipitation replaces the water that evaporates, and the biological processes in the pond deal with waste material that remains, just like in a Walstad-type environment.

Bill


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