# Dream Fish



## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

Does anyone have any "dream" fish? By this I mean fish you've always wanted to put in a planted aquarium but couldn't find/afford. I know that I personally have always wanted to try out Xiphophorus malinche and some of those awesome Rasboras that are being discovered in Asia.


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## Steve Pituch (Jan 25, 2004)

*Endler's livebearers*

From what I have have heard, I would like to have some Endler's livebearers someday. Apparently most people have ones which only have a few color characteristics of the originals. In order to have the fish as colorful as in nature, you either need to get them at their natural source, or collect many specimens from different collectors throughout the world and then try to mix them up again. Apparently the ones in the pet stores have been interbred with guppies and are not a true strain.

It would seem to be a nice challenge and I've got about 200 gallons of heavily planted tanks to breed them in.

Steve Pituch


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

I have fish from the Endler's population at Laguna de Patos. They're descended from the original fish collected by Endler, and as far as I know they have never been line-bred or crossed. They are also known as Endler's "Orange Population".

They're nice fish.

But really, I think they're probably just guppies. Langhammer thinks so too.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

My dream fish would have to be Ram's. 
It's not that I can't get my hands on them, it's just that I don't have water to suit their needs without going to great lengths, and I don't have time for another time consuming task. :roll:


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## niko (Jan 28, 2004)

I'd say that pretty much any fish is great if they can show their potential. For some reason even in a perfectly balanced planted tank the fish usually don't show their best colors.

Two good examples would be Rasbora heteromorpha and Trichogaster leeri - both fish usually look very nice but it's pretty rare to see them in their full glory.

I think that besides the obvious things feeding has a lot to do with how the fish look.

--Nikolay


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

Niko,

I know what you mean. My pearl gouramies don't seem to be that happy all the time.

They usually perk up when the temp goes up, they probably need higher temps. I've found that most labyrinths do well in the heat.

JanS,

I keep Rams in hard water without any problems. They seem to be very adaptable. Do you have especially strange water?


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## Kevin Jones (Apr 4, 2004)

most of the pearl gouramis in the store i work in never really caught my eye, until we had a batch mixed in a 108 gallon discus tank in our fishroom. The water was around 86 degrees. The reds and blues that appeared on those pearls were amazing (the heavy frozen food feedings probably helped as well).


As far sa my dream fish goes, I would love to get my hands on a non-matricidal pair of Pelvicachromis taeniatus "nigerian red" The pair of these guys i had about 9 months ago spawned a few times before the male killed his mate and all their juvenille offspring in less than 1 day. 
This colour morph displayed VERY well in their planted home and got along with their tankmates decently (even the tasty shrimp that were in the tank)


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## fishfry (Apr 15, 2004)

I really want a large planted tank with a group of red asian arowanas...


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

Kevin,

Yeah, a lot of the morphs of the Pelv. species are spectacular. I myself want to try and get ahold of some P. taeniatus 'Moliwe'. They're so pretty!


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## Corigan (Mar 15, 2004)

Error said:


> Yeah, a lot of the morphs of the Pelv. species are spectacular. I myself want to try and get ahold of some P. taeniatus 'Moliwe'. They're so pretty!


They are indeed awesome and quite pretty and colorful. They are also really peaceful fish in a community tank until spawning time, and then they clear out a part of the tank. I have a pair of moliwe's in my 55g. They spawned a month or so ago and had about 20-25 little fry running around that got bigger. I was feeding them micro flake and some other foods and they were definately growing, and the parents were great. They would take turns guarding the brood while the other went on patrol/eating and then they would dart back and take turns. Unfortunately all of my fry died. I am not quite sure why. It could have been due to high nitrate levels in my tank. I'm not quite sure how high they got. After my tank cycled and went through it's phase it bottomed out on nitrates pretty heavily. I then started dosing nitrates on a daily basis, without any changes on my test kits (which are accurate). I then just started getting lazy and dosing daily. Eventually my tank did catch up and nitrates wearn't being used up as immediately, and I assume the levels got rather high. Tested 10-15 after a 50% water change, so who knows. I also run Pressurized co2 24/7 with an airstone at night (rather high fishload). Not sure if the co2 levels got too low during the night (though I have stayed up and monitored and not seen problems). So I'm waiting for my moliwes to spawn again. The female is already blimping out again, and both her and the male are doing the mating shimmy at each other. So I guess it's just a matter of time till they try again. I have recently setup a 30g tank and a 1g that are still cycling that I am going to use to possibly try to breed em in. I'm planning on trying to put a divider up in my 55g next time they spawn and give them an area where they don't have to be so aggressive at chasing away other bottom feeders. I'm also going to make sure nitrates stay low, and possibly turn off the co2 during the evenings. Any other advice from hobbyists with similiar experiences would be greatly appreciated. I've read that the fry grow faster with their parents so I want to try to leave them with the parents. Who knows, maybe I can get this right and a few will survive and then I might have 2 pairs who can mate and then I can ship out the extras to hobbyists (that's the plan atleast).

Matt


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

With cichlids, I always take the fry out once they're free-swimming. It's just too much of a hassle to lose entire spawns because someone let the TV got too loud and it spooked the parents.

I had some Cryptoheros sp. 'Lake Yojoa' (most people know it as Cichlasoma cutteri) that were eating their spawns. I took the fry out and sold some on Aquabid once they got bigger  That was my first (and probably only) experience with selling fish online. What a PITA.

I'm waiting for the fry from my Thorichthys sp. 'Mixteco Blue' to grow to be free swimming. Each time they've spawned, the fry have lasted longer. This last batch lasted until they started bouncing around inside the flower pot.

If anyone wants any of these fish (I still have some of the Cryptoheros sp. fry), I can probably ship them through FedEx at no charge other than shipping and a few bucks for the box. They leave plants alone, for the most part. They do dig very shallow pits, however...but usually only where there's room.


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## nonamethefish (Feb 25, 2004)

Error: Do your endlers show the variability of the normal populations?


I've currently got Xiphophorus montezumae 'Ivory'...I assume you(Error) have nezzies?

Though I only have a cruddy photo in a museum paper...I think it would be cool to keep either X. birchmanni(I would dub it"sailfin swordtail" or something similar) or X. nigrensis.


I'm hoping to get a hold of some Ennecanthus gloriosus soon.


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

I have two populations of X. nezahualcoyotl and two of X. montezumae. I also have X. malinche, X. mayae and X. evelynae.

My Endlers do show a little variation. I've only seen two generations of fry since I got them in March, so it's hard to tell yet. I'm tubbing them soon so we'll see.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

Error said:


> I keep Rams in hard water without any problems. They seem to be very adaptable. Do you have especially strange water?


Oh, don't be telling me that now.... I'm going to the ACA convention in Denver next month and I didn't have Rams on my list... :roll:

We don't have strange water (it's a nice clear free flowing well), but the pH is around 8 and I've always heard Rams need something in the 6 range. It's not really hard either, with a GH of around 8. Think that would work?


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## Kevin Jones (Apr 4, 2004)

I've kept most of the pelvicachromis species and morphs that are available to aquarists. in my experience the only fish I have had any "problems" if you would like to call them that with are the "kienke" variety (little terrors and violent as hell) and the subos i have at the moment which are IMO the most furtive dwarf species i have ever kept. They are almost always hidden from view and are spooked by almost every dither i have tried. To this day cardinal tetras worked the best.


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

JanS,

My pH out of the tap is 7.6. I doubt 8 would make much difference. If it does, just add something simple to drop it a few tenths. But, like I said, I doubt you'll have any problems.

Another dwarf you can try is Apistogramma. Some species do very well in alkaline water. Many people assume that all Apistos (for that matter, all South American fish) need acidic conditions, but that's not always true. There are several (like A. cacatuoides) that can actually be found in alkaline environments.


Kevin,

Have you kept P. rubrolabiatus? In the pics I've seen, they've got amazing color, so I'd like to hear about them first-hand if you've got any experience.


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## jimjim (Jan 25, 2004)

*Dream fish*

I've found that the Juliochromis Sp(malerii and transcriptus) are really good fish to keep in with slightly brackish water or high Ph plants. Theyre like little torpedos floating around all the plants, right side up or down or sideways. Peacefull to most everything except what eats their eggs. The young ones help raise the next group and so on....Jimjim


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## nonamethefish (Feb 25, 2004)

Error: Mind telling me what to populations of montys you've got? Your livebearers list is pretty impressive! In fact, I just noticed 4 juvenile X. malinche on aquabid-the auction was in flames and the fish were going over 10 dollars each!

Anyone here kept lucania goodei or H. formosa in planted tanks? I picked up a single male bluefin killifish out of a feeder tank and he looks like a good inhabitant...lots of cool behavior.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

Thanks Error. 
I've already got Apisto's on my list for Denver since I did some research and found that some do much better in almost any water than others. Now, I have to resist adding a couple Rams to my list... :wink:


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

nonamethefish,

I have the Rio Gallinas waterfall population (the mottled ivory ones) and the blue/green strain (not sure on the locale--I think it may be the common form, if you know what I mean). My blue/greens are descended from the fish that won Best In Show at the American Liverbearer Association convention this year. It was near me this year but I didn't go, since I was broke 

I also have a local breeder who has the Rascom strain. He isn't impressed by them, though I am 


Jimjim,

That's interesting. I've always wondered how Tanganyika cichlids would fare in a planted tank. I'm utterly enchanted by the entire genus of Neolamprologus


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## fishyfishy (Jun 6, 2004)

Any of these (they range from 45 - 75 dollars):









































































Ok. Ok, so I'm obsessed with bettas...can you blame me? just look at those beauties! 
I know they're not the traditional aquascaping fish but they don't eat plants like crazy, they're easy to take care of and they are sooooo beautiful. I also like rasboras, gouramis, and smaller barbs such as the cherry barb.


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## fishyfishy (Jun 6, 2004)

Oh yeah. I have a thing for corys too...


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## tanVincent (Mar 19, 2004)

Hi,

I wanted to have a planted arowana tank. And maybe another tank full of wild discus.

Cheers
Vincent


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## Kevin Jones (Apr 4, 2004)

Nope, havent kept P. rubrolabiatus, but i have tried, and working in a fish store I have a little more opportunity than most


It is high on my list to try though


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## nonamethefish (Feb 25, 2004)

FishyFishy: Are those your pics?


Error: Not to sure...but on xiphoporus.org they is a montezumae from the Rio Gallinas which was collected near the city of 'Rascon'...I think Rascom is a typo

The ivory montys i'm not to sure whatsd going on with them. I talked with Marlin and a fellow hobbyist via email. And according to Marlin...

The waterfalls probably don't have a name...since the RioGallinas is pretty fast and takes plunges in some places the waterfall might not have been a true 'fall'...he said they were collected near the city of Tamascopo. The other hobbyist said that he remembered a type location of normal monties from this place. He also pointed out that the "Rascom" monty had a few spots on its flank...*groan*. Since this strain started from a single pair...I'd be willing to bet they were a variation or abnormal fish of some sort.

These guys have been selectively bred a bit for the black flank coloring. Original fish were mottled, but not as much as the ones you see now.


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## Sir_BlackhOle (Jan 25, 2004)

im a betta fan too! still havent been able to afford the "show" betta that i want though


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

nonamethefish,

I know Marlin. He lives a few miles from me. He's where I get most of my livebearers.

As I understood from him, the original fish he got at the ALA auction a few years back had the same mottling as the ones he's been breeding ever since. I don't know anything about selective breeding, since Al is the guy who has literally made that particular fish available...he had the only ones in the US.

If you see me refer to a local livebearer breeder, it's probably Al Klopman, AKA who you know as Marlin.


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## fishyfishy (Jun 6, 2004)

nonamethefish said:


> FishyFishy: Are those your pics?


unfortunatly no.  But I want them really really really bad. I just don't have enough room or money at this time. I got those pics from http://topbettas.com because they are like the best bettas I've ever seen and when I get room and cash, I'm gonna get some pairs from them.


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## jimjim (Jan 25, 2004)

*dream fish*

Error, I've had really good luck over the years (i'm older than dirt, started keeping fish in rock aquariums, Hard to see ;-) using Java ferns , certain crypts, Java moss etc in with Julies and lamps. DON"T use shell dwellers, biggest mistake I ever made, they rearange more than oscars. On the Lamps I just design to make sure theres equal hiding places for every one and plant to hide the rocks...Jimjim


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## nonamethefish (Feb 25, 2004)

Error said:


> nonamethefish,
> 
> I know Marlin. He lives a few miles from me. He's where I get most of my livebearers.
> 
> ...


Next time you see him in person, mind bringing this up(ivory montezumae sword location)? I have a few of his emails where he mentions selective breeding. But of course the internet isn't always the best way to communicate.


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## discusdave (May 24, 2004)

I have always wanted a large school of male Congo Tetras. I have about 30 in my 240 gallon planted tank, and am quarantining another 25 to put in there soon. 

I also have 6500K halide lighting on this tank, which shows their colors the best, besides natural sunlight.

Dave


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

No females? Won't they have more reason to display if there are? I don't really know. I have two females and 3 males in my 44. One of the females seems to get the short end of the stick a lot, but I'd guess that with as many of them as you have, that might be less of a problem. 

My dream fish is Rhadinocentrus ornatus. I obtained six last year, but they were never in really good health to begin with and eventually died.  In about 2 to 3 months, though, I'll have more. These will be the red variety, and in a tank with mostly green plants, I think they will look quite nice.


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