# Setting up an EI program



## iris600 (Feb 12, 2004)

Ok. I've got the chemicals, now I need to figure out what to mix with what, and how to estimate the ppm for my tanks. I am going to start off doing the EI on two tanks, both high light and Co2 injected- one a ten gallon, one a 20 high, both heavily planted.

These are the products I have on hand (I had been dosing flourish, but am switching to Watsons dry chems)...

*Iron Chelate 10%(I want extra iron in my tanks, when I dosed flourish iron it really made the red plants pop)
*Magnesium Sulfate
*Potassium Phosphate
*Nitrate
*CSM Plantex+B

I 've read the post here on EI, as well as the post from the Barr Report here: http://www.barrreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1 but I'm not sure what it means by teaspoons... what I mean is, you aren't adding these ferts to your tanks dry? Don't you mix up a bottle and dose it that way? Do you simply take the weekly amount of ferts, add them to a bottle, and divide it up into 7 parts, giving some each day? Do you dose the phosphate on a different day than the traces/iron? 
Ack!!

Help! Where do I go from here? What can be mixed with what, what should be dosed each day? I really appreciate any help I can get. I don't want to overdose and kill the fish, but I don't want to underdose and exacerbate existing algae issues/stunt plant growth.

I'm also going to be doing some form of EI dosing on a low tech tank, about 2.5 watts per gallon, crypt/java/easy stems only tank, but that is not as much of a priority right now, that can stay on the remaining flourish. Greg Watson referred me to a wonderful article on low-tech at: http://www.barrreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=395


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## iris600 (Feb 12, 2004)

I should say, also, I don't understand at the bottom of the forum's EI sticky, it says ferts can be added dry, but it states that the CSM+B is often wetted, at so many mls of water plus a tablespoon of CSM+B is equal to a lesser amount added dry? This doesn't seem to make any sense? Or does it mean you need to ad a tablespoon per so many ML of liquid in order for the solution to be added in the same volume measurement as the dry CSM?
Bah!
So here's my dosing schedule
10- 20 Gallon Aquariums
+/- 1/8 tsp KNO3 (N) 3x a week 
+/- 1/32 tsp KH2PO4 (P) 3x a week
+/- 1/32 tsp K2SO4 (K) 3x a week
+/- 1/32 tsp (2ml) Trace Elements 3x a week
50% weekly water change


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

iris600 said:


> I 've read the post here on EI, as well as the post from the Barr Report here: http://www.barrreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1 but I'm not sure what it means by teaspoons... what I mean is, you aren't adding these ferts to your tanks dry? Don't you mix up a bottle and dose it that way? Do you simply take the weekly amount of ferts, add them to a bottle, and divide it up into 7 parts, giving some each day? Do you dose the phosphate on a different day than the traces/iron?
> Ack!!


You can add the macros either dry or diluted. I find it easiest to measure them out dry and keep a day's worth of ferts in each cell of a 7 day pill box. Some people make up a solution. It's all preference.

CSM is usually dosed in solution as the quantities are much smaller.

It's generally expected to dose iron and PO4 separately as they can react and precipitate out.

As for how much and when...Tom's example in the article you reference is for a 20g tank. Do half that for the 10g.

If you do 50% water changes each week you won't overdose anyone.



iris600 said:


> Help! Where do I go from here? What can be mixed with what, what should be dosed each day? I really appreciate any help I can get. I don't want to overdose and kill the fish, but I don't want to underdose and exacerbate existing algae issues/stunt plant growth.


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## plantbrain (Jan 23, 2004)

Look EI is very simple but you can complicate anything.

Do not do that.
Add dry ferts, I think that is clear enough on the site.
There are several examples of what to add dry.
I cannot really get more simple than a recipe style routine. 

If you want to, as noted, you can dilute and use mls etc.
They just need to be equivalents to the dry dosing.

It's up to you.
It's an added step.
Some folks like more complicated for whatever reason/s.

Some have strange notion that fish might eat the ferts or believe it's more accuracy that will make or break their tank(which is never true).
Some just have added it liquid as a matter habit and want to continue.

Your motivations there are your own, I see no need personally. 
Look at the examples and you can reduce the frequency of dosing with less light, maintain it for higher light.

It does not say to mix the Traces and PO4 on the same day.
Most don't but you can get away with that if you use something like TMG for a trace.

Hope this helps.
You are making it more complicated than need be, the routine is very simple and easy.


Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## nasfish (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi,

I like to add the macros diluted simply because I love those ADA bottles. At least I am contributing something to the environment by recycling those bottles. 









Thanks


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## plantbrain (Jan 23, 2004)

I like the labels

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

Back when I only had one tank, I dosed ferts dry. Once I acquired a couple of different size tanks it became confusing on how much dry to add to each tank. I ordered some dosing bottles and made solutions for each macro. I then listed on each bottle how many ppm each ml of the solution would add to each tank. That kept me from having to carry around a piece of paper or remember how much to add to my tank each time I dosed.

Since a pic is worth 1,000 words, here is a pic of my KNO3 dosing bottle:


As noted making up a solution is an extra step and leads to possible errors in measurement and calculations. I would've remembered (eventually) how much to add to each tank but this made it much easier for me in the beginning.


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## iris600 (Feb 12, 2004)

I'm dosing the macros dry, and I'm mixing up the micros right before I use them.
Question. Since the CSM+B no longer has an added iron formula, and I like to dose extra iron (when I would dose flourish iron, my red plants would look fantastic) how much would you add to a 20 gal dose of csm+b (1/16 tsp)?

Thanks Tom. I am trying to keep it simple, and when I reread the article the next morning it made more sense. I got the package on a day when I was quite worn out, but I wanted to figure out the dosing that evening. Bad idea. Nothing was making sense and I just wanted to sleep.


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## plantbrain (Jan 23, 2004)

I'd just make up a 500ml batch (2 tablespoons of CMS+B + 500mls of DI water) and for the 20 gal tank and dose 5mls 2-3x a week, or if you want to do daily, 2-3mls per day or so.

Might be easier than 1/16th of a teaspoon for you. 

Regards, 
Tom Barr


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

MatPat said:


> Back when I only had one tank, I dosed ferts dry. Once I acquired a couple of different size tanks it became confusing on how much dry to add to each tank. I ordered some dosing bottles and made solutions for each macro. I then listed on each bottle how many ppm each ml of the solution would add to each tank. That kept me from having to carry around a piece of paper or remember how much to add to my tank each time I dosed.
> 
> Since a pic is worth 1,000 words, here is a pic of my KNO3 dosing bottle:
> 
> ...


I finally understand the deficiency in my fertilizer dosing. Tom's EI writeups have always left out the Campbells soup part of the dosing. So....does it matter if I use a generic soup mix - it's cheaper. And, how long does a can last? I really, really want to get my dosing right...


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## MrSanders (Mar 5, 2006)

Don't forget salt and pepper to really make your plants happy!


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## MatPat (Mar 22, 2004)

hoppycalif said:


> I finally understand the deficiency in my fertilizer dosing. Tom's EI writeups have always left out the Campbells soup part of the dosing. So....does it matter if I use a generic soup mix - it's cheaper. And, how long does a can last? I really, really want to get my dosing right...


#-oWhen SWOAPE did a group order on some dosing bottles some folks wanted to know how big the bottle was. I took a pic of the one I had and put a Campbell's Soup can next to it for reference...I wonder if the soup, along with the salt and pepper would help any :hungry:


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## iris600 (Feb 12, 2004)

Thanks! That would be much easier. 
I assume I can use the same solution for the ten gallon, but use only 2.5 mls 2-3x a week? That would be much easier than 1/32 of a tsp!
I am using the EI dosing schedule listed.



plantbrain said:


> I'd just make up a 500ml batch (2 tablespoons of CMS+B + 500mls of DI water) and for the 20 gal tank and dose 5mls 2-3x a week, or if you want to do daily, 2-3mls per day or so.
> 
> Might be easier than 1/16th of a teaspoon for you.
> 
> ...


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