# Using flash or any other light source for aquarium photography



## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

Dear All,

I have just purchased a Canon EOS 400D (which is launched as Rebel XTi in US) with an 18-55 lens. After a few trial shots using aquarium top lighting only (with no flash as it is built-in), I found out that the light source would have never been enough for taking very good photographs if you really want to catch a good field of depth choosing a high aperture and fast shutter speed by using manual settings. I have also gone through some information on the net under "let there be light" topics. So I decided to go with it.

Is it the best way to use some external master and slave external flashes set on the top of the tank, in combination and syncronised by the camera or do any other sources give better results? Your feedback at that point will be highly appreciated.

Which source? How many? How powerful? Any other tech specs I must pay attention to?

My tank size is 90*60(h)*45 cm.

Many thanks.


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## HeyPK (Jan 23, 2004)

If you have one flash, you can try illuminating a lot more of the tank than you could by having the flash sitting on the glass top, by using a cardboard box on top of the tank, painted white on the interior, and pointing the flash to illuminate the inside of the box.


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

The most economical option for you is to get a 430EX flash with the ST-E2 controller. That's about $400-$450 to get you off camera flash.


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## bigstick120 (Mar 8, 2005)

You dont need the ST-E2 you can get a cable as well http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/12972-REG/Canon_2391A001_Off_Camera_Shoe_Cord.html

A generic one is a little cheaper. Or a generic wireless transmitter from ebay, but you lose ETTL


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

I just don't think the 2ft extension that gives will be enough freedom. You'd have to find one with more range, possibly as long as 10ft (3m) depending on the way you are shooting.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

turbomkt said:


> The most economical option for you is to get a 430EX flash with the ST-E2 controller. That's about $400-$450 to get you off camera flash.


Firstly, thanks for all the comments. I think it is a better option for me to go with a long communication cable. I don't want to repent of buying a generic type flash either as I will not be able to have all the features the camera sync will provide. I can only set up the camera approximately 3 feets away from the tank due to the lens DOF and angle (18-55) and limited space constraints.

Turbomkt,

Do you think that this set you recommend is quite enough to illuminate 3 feet long tank or shall I need to soften the intensity by a kind of screen?

Many thanks,


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

I'm not sure about that. Now you'll need the opinion of one of the experts like Paradise or Jay Luto. I'm great on theory (thanks to SLR film), but until I bite the big one and get the 40D later this year I'm guessing on needs for shooting tanks with dSLR.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

Many thanks to turbomkt for addressing this issue. I think I will pm them to inform about this thread.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

I could not reach to Jay Luto. I hope Paradise receives my pm on time and type some feedback. The urgency of the matter is that my brother will be in NY this weekend to buy a dSLR for himself. If I can get this feedback on time he will buy the recommended flash kit or whatever is needed for me too.


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## paradise (Jan 13, 2006)

Tutku, both Jeff and Mike are right. You need to take the flash off the camera, and there are two ways to do this. 

1. Synch cord. I am not a big fan, they do not give you the flexibility and only work on a small tank where you dont have a lot of forward - back and left to right motion. But on a budget they are what you have to do.

2. STE2. Yeah, it's about $250 or so , but you dont want to lose ETTL, trust me. It's like buying a Porche and putting bicycle tires on it. 

I have not tried third party ETTL flashes (only get ETTL) I would rather recommend you getting a used 420ex (btw, if you want I may be selling mine, which is my backup flash, but I am not trying to hard sell you on it). Canon has made a variety of flashes that work with STE2, the big difference between the lowest (420ex) and the best (580ex II) is the build and power. (580ex II also has better waterproofing). Your flash choices are (in order from worst to best) : 420ex, 550ex, 430ex, 580ex, 580ex II.

I hope that helps. STE2 should be your first priority IF you specifically want to shoot aquatic. Then get a cheap flash like 420 or 550ex. Then later when you can, get a 580 or 580 II and make the first one your fill- or backup flash.


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## wiste (Feb 10, 2006)

> the big difference between the lowest (420ex) and the best (580ex II) is the build and power.


That is the big difference that you are using.

The biggest difference that you are not using is that the 580ex II can be used as a master. If you are using the STE2 you are not using the master feature of the 580ex.

Is the 580ex II as powerful as 2-430 ex flashes? The 580ex is almost twice as expensive as the 430ex.

If you are saying the 430ex is better than a 550ex, then why are you recommending the 550ex which is more expensive than the 430ex?


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

Thank you Edward for your quick reply as well as all you people for your comments.

I've just realised that I misinterpreted some of the comments (fully or partially). That is why some of my posts seem to be conflicting with each other and stand out strange. They might have misguided you. But I will not disclose them here as it shames me.

Anyway, my last decision is to go with 430EX flash with the ST-E2 controller since this flash stands at the middle within the range Edward recommended and having a ST-E2 seems to be very reasonable for aquatic photography. Maybe I will not need any more flashes? I'll experience.

I am looking forward to sharing the photos of my tank in the near future just after the last setup matures a bit and flash kit gets delivered.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

wiste said:


> ...The biggest difference that you are not using is that the 580ex II can be used as a master. If you are using the STE2 you are not using the master feature of the 580ex...


Sorry wiste, I could not see your post since you posted it while I was typing my last post. Using master and slaves is just for communication of flashing timings, right? Is there any other advantage?

... and if I purchase 430ex with ST-E2 controller, I can still add an extra flash in combination, can't I?
I think your comments are regarding the cost effectiveness of the issue.

This is a very important issue, guys, for a potential expansion in future. I am going to request you to address this please. I am a little confused now, to be honest.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

If I buy a 580ex (which is almost equal to "430EX flash with the ST-E2 controller" in price) I will not need an extra controller. In addition, I will combine extra flashes to 580ex body. Am I right?


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## wiste (Feb 10, 2006)

> I can still add an extra flash in combination, can't I?


Yes, I use two 430ex with the STE2.


> If I buy a 580ex (which is almost equal to "430EX flash with the ST-E2 controller" in price) I will not need an extra controller.


The STE2 is desirable even with the 580ex to avoid the glare on the aquarium that comes with using the flash on the camera. The 580ex can be mounted on the camera and used to control other flashes set to slave mode but this is generally not desirable due to flash glare on the glass from the flash of the 580ex. The advantage of the STE2 is that it controls the external flash without generating a powerful flash that will cause glare.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

wiste said:


> Yes, I use two 430ex with the STE2...


So, you are using both flashes by installing on the top of the tank with some angles.

Are you softening the intensity by any means - indirect lighting using umbrellas, or screens b/w the flash and the tank? I am asking these questions so as to understand whether or not I need something further.

If you are using two flashes that means one flash is unlikely to be sufficient for my use either. Adding another one later on might not be convenient in my situation. I think I'll just buy the same things like you have. Last comments please? Thank you for your time to enlighten this issue. Really appreciated.


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## wiste (Feb 10, 2006)

> If you are using two flashes that means one flash is unlikely to be sufficient for my use either.


The tank that I desire to photograph is 8' x 2' x 2' and it would seem that two 430ex flashes are insufficient for this purpose. I have been using the two flashes at angles on the tank.

Constructing a cardboard box with reflective material with a single flash may work for your purposes as your tank is less than half the size and more shallow.
My intention is to use this method but the tank is still in development.
There is a description of how to construct such a box at cau-aqua.net.

You might wish to investigate further and seriously consider the advise of people more experienced in photography than me. (E.g. Paradise,aquatic-photography.com and Jay Luto).


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

Thank all of you very much for your valuable comments. I have already subscribed a thread in aquatic-photography.com on the same date with this thread. But still no reply yet in spite of 42 views as of today. The general framework is determined now and I will decide the number of flashes considering the total cost. Most probably it will be one 430ex with ST-E2. I will continue writing the results under this thread to provide other viewers needing suggestions with some feedback.


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## rs79 (Dec 7, 2004)

So use a longer shutter speed and rely on the lights you have. The color may not come out the way you want but you can correct this in photoshop.


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

rs79 said:


> So use a longer shutter speed and rely on the lights you have. The color may not come out the way you want but you can correct this in photoshop.


So, does this mean it might be better if I use a different kind of light source such as spot lights OR using flashes always give the best results in spite of the drawback you mentioned above?

It is important for me since the contests apply some rules of editing. I think color correction and increasing the saturation are of these rules which are strictly forbidden.


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

I wouldn't really consider existing lights and a long shutter. You will add noise to the picture and will have motion blur.

While the 580EX (or II) can act as a master, you can't use it off camera without something to trigger it. I really think you're better off with the 430EX plus ST-E2 to start. Add a used 420EX or 550EX and you've got a good setup for most small tanks for less than $600.

BTW...paradise is the one that actually started aquarium-photography.com


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## tutquarium (May 27, 2005)

Thanks Mike,

I have already ordered one 430ex with ST-E2. After a few trials with those, I will consider whether or not I should upgrade/add more.


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

Congrats! The good news is a second flash can be at the 430EX price again


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