# high lighting with NPT?



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

I've recently picked up walstads book and have Bren diving into it the past few days. I'm very intrigued to start a NPT, might even tear down my 10 gallon to try it. 
As the topic suggests... is it possible to have a NPT with high lighting? say anywhere between 4-5 watts per gallon? the growth should be great from the soil itself, and walstad even talks about giving the tank direct light for a little bit of the day. would the high lighting cause a huge algae bloom? I'm assuming co2 would probably need to be injected which would deviate away from the whole low tech aspect. any feedback and comments are welcome. thanks in advance! 

cheers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

High light and CO2 greatly accelerate plant growth, meaning that the plants will deplete all the nutrients from the soil, and probably will not get enough from fish food/waste. They will develop deficiencies.

So you will need to add more nutrients in some way, the easiest being water column fertilization. But if you fertilize the water column you may exceed the ability of the plants and biofilm to remove excess nutrients. So you will need to do frequent water changes.

The tank will be on the edge of instability, and any little hiccup will give you an ammonia spike, algae bloom, pH crash, or something.

So you will wind up having a high tech tank, with all its advantages (insanely fast plant growth) and disadvantages (tendency to crash). Low maintenance planted tanks (NPT, El Natural, Walstad) are about balance. If you over-drive one of the essential inputs (light, nutrients, CO2) the balance will most likely fail.

I don't want to discourage you from experimenting. But I suggest you try a NPT with low to medium lighting first so you can see how it is supposed to work before you hit the gas pedal (light) too hard.


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

Michael said:


> High light and CO2 greatly accelerate plant growth, meaning that the plants will deplete all the nutrients from the soil, and probably will not get enough from fish food/waste. They will develop deficiencies.
> 
> So you will need to add more nutrients in some way, the easiest being water column fertilization. But if you fertilize the water column you may exceed the ability of the plants and biofilm to remove excess nutrients. So you will need to do frequent water changes.
> 
> ...


I'll definitely take all this into consideration. your response was definitely the answer I was looking for. thank you

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## nebusa (Mar 16, 2010)

What you describer here is pretty much what I did to my tank. I have about 30 inches total of fish in a 46 gallon tank. 

I have twice the amount of light recommended by Walsted. When I started I just wanted things to grow in quicker and appear very lush. 

The additional light quickly caused problems with algae. 

So I added two diffusers hooked to DIY co2 2 litter bottles. This did the trick. For months my tank was lush and very healthy. Every plant I had in there was doing very well and it was the jungle that I wanted.

Then after about a year of being up and running All of sudden certain plants really started to struggle and algae and diatoms again took over... So I've cut the light and co2 in half. Increased the amount of fish and I feed them more frequently. 

Things have appeared to stabilize but I lost many of my plants. 

I would suggest following her method to a tee. I'm considering pulling everything out and starting over. 

I have a 10 gallon tank that has been up and running for the same amount of time with very little effort. I've never added more light or co2 and it gets daily sunlight. I've never changed the filter and only done about a %50 water change once. The rest of the time I just add water as it evaporates. I left the 10 gallon filter running but there is no filter media. I did this just for water movement.


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

I have 6+ WPG over my 60 gallon tank, I expeieriance very little algae (some green spot on the glass and black beard in areas with little light). The plants grow very fast and I keep up with CO2 and extra nutrients by over feeding and having a tonne of MTS to eat it all. I don't fo waterchanges often, every few months. grows quite well.


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

nebusa said:


> What you describer here is pretty much what I did to my tank. I have about 30 inches total of fish in a 46 gallon tank.
> 
> I have twice the amount of light recommended by Walsted. When I started I just wanted things to grow in quicker and appear very lush.
> 
> ...


I think this is the same idea I had in mind. I want to see lush and powerful growth fast, because I'm impatient for the tank to grow naturally. I feel the right thing would be to more closely follow walstads method. it just sounds more logically correct.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

mthom211 said:


> I have 6+ WPG over my 60 gallon tank, I expeieriance very little algae (some green spot on the glass and black beard in areas with little light). The plants grow very fast and I keep up with CO2 and extra nutrients by over feeding and having a tonne of MTS to eat it all. I don't fo waterchanges often, every few months. grows quite well.


that's good to hear. people don't really like to hassle with the tank too much, but for some odd reason I do. I feel more involved with the growth of the plants if that makes sense. however, if or when I start a new tank I will most likely keep lights 2-3 watts per gallon. (which is a little higher than what walstad suggests)

how would the more demanding plants do in a NPT? such as HC or the Walichii?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

I'm currently trying wallichi, I don't expect it to stay red though. I've grown lindernia sp. varigated, rotala colorata, rotala sp. green, blyxa, HU, mermaid weed and a few others I didn't expect to survive let alone grow and they did! I haven't tried HC though, I use glosso to carpet.


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

mthom211 said:


> I'm currently trying wallichi, I don't expect it to stay red though. I've grown lindernia sp. varigated, rotala colorata, rotala sp. green, blyxa, HU, mermaid weed and a few others I didn't expect to survive let alone grow and they did! I haven't tried HC though, I use glosso to carpet.


oh wow that's awesome! any pics of the tank? maybe the wallichii would redden a bit closer to the surface? I like the looks of the walichii when it is tall and lanky looking.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

No pictures sorry, I'm not happy with how it looks yet, I'm going for dutch style, I might switch to EI dosing though if I can't keep my plants red, I have all te hferts and a 6kg cyclinder lying around.


----------



## frroK (May 9, 2011)

Great thread. I'm actually interested in doing the opposite. I want to add CO2 to my low-medium light NPT. And up my dosing a bit... But not too much. Once a week NK and traces. Fish food for phosphates. Right now I have a 10g NPT with very slow growth I just want to help my plants a bit.


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

It used to look like this:








I just replanted it yesterday after someone turned the heater up to 34 degrees while I was on holidays killing most plants  Extremly bad picture, very hard to get pictures of it during te hday. You get the idea though, the glass is clear, isn't green like in the pic lol.


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

mthom211 said:


> It used to look like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


tank looks great! that's unfortunate about the heat though. I recently came home to some melting plants. not the best feeling.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

Thanks, I'm not really happy with how it looks at the moment, I'm buying some more plants for it and waiting for it to grow in some more. I got some slightly better pictures tonight. 

















I think my tank is more of an exeption rather than the rule otherwise other peopel would be trying it.


----------



## singolz (Oct 27, 2011)

mthom211 said:


> Thanks, I'm not really happy with how it looks at the moment, I'm buying some more plants for it and waiting for it to grow in some more. I got some slightly better pictures tonight.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


tank looks great, you definitely must be doing somthing right.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## mthom211 (Sep 3, 2010)

Thanks, it never comes out the right colour though, the water is clear, so is the glass, its not yellow :/


----------

