# Narrowed it down to two



## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Alright, I have to buy a UV sterilizer. GW is killing me.

After all kinds of searching, reading, and deliberating, I have narrowed it down to two

The Coralife Turbotwist 9w or the Current USA Gamma 8w.

I do not plan to use this inline with my filters, but would rather make a portable, powerhead driven setup.

Here's my dilemma. There is more info (at least that I can find) on the Turbo twist. But, the CurrentUSa setup looks like it has all of the parts/pieces needed to run it HOB style. If that's the case, and it does a good job, I'd rather not have to make 15 trips to the hardware store to get the parts to do the same with the TurboTwist.

Any experience?


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## bradac56 (May 9, 2007)

Sounds like you've already made your decision.

- Brad


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

I've had the 9w turbo twist on my 72g now for well over two years running 24/7. If you have a cansister filter I would run it inline. Your basically setting it and forgetting it with the exception of changing the bulb once a year or so. You could always put it on a timer or plug it in when you want to use it if you don't want it running all the time. BTW the turbo twist comes with a bracket to hang on the tank as well.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

If I were you I would find the source of your GW before buying a UV sterilizer. It will only be a band-aid.


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Where would you suggest looking for the source of the GW? I think I have tested and tried just about every recommendation I have heard of.

I have cut back on light. 

I have tried blackouts more than once.

I have tried multiple 90% Water changes back to back.

I have cut back on ferts both individually, and in total.

I have tested water until I'm blue in the face.

I have even (in a moment of desperation) tried algae destroyer advanced. 

I have put willow branches in my tank.

I would have danced naked around the tank during a lunar eclipse if someone said it worked for them.

I don't know what else to try. But if you have other suggestions, please let me know.

Tank is 75 gal. Pressurized CO2 on a pH controller and AM 1000 reactor. Ferts are EI and TMG. Lighting is a 4x54w HO t-5 Tek that has never been on more than 10 hrs/day and is currently only running 2 bulbs for about 6 hrs/day. Filtration is 2 Rena Xp3's which are cleaned on an alternating week schedule. Heavily planted.

pH typically 5.5, KH 3, GH 3.
Last water test Nitrates 10, Phos 1, No Detectable Ammonia or Nitrites.

The really weird thing is this. I started this tank with low light, no CO2 and went from there. GW first reared its ugly head after I went to CO2 and better light... no surprise. But the tank was doing quite well until I used some Excell to get rid of a tenacious case of BBA on my slow growers. Haven't been able to shake it in the last 8 months


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

What is your dosing regiment?

What type of plant (bio) mass do you have?

Let's start with that.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

I don't promise to get rid of your GW but the more info I have the better the chances.

What type of substrate?

What type of hardscape?

What brand of Ferts?


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Another question: have you used ferilizer sticks or tablets in the substrate, and which ones?


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

OK first, have never used any fert spikes or root tabs of any sort.

Substrate is Eco-complete.

Hardscape African Swahala driftwood.

Dosing as per EI. Ferts are all from Greg Watson.
Day 1,3,5 3/4 tsp KNO3, 1/4 tsp KH2PO4, 1/4 tsp K sulfate.

Day 2,4,6 15 ml TMG. Occasionally supplement with Flourish Iron as well on trace days.

Day 7 nothing

50%-60% water change every 7 days. Also add an additional tsp K2SO4 on water change days.

Plant mass has changed recently as I was within an inch of completely dry-docking this tank or taking up raising cichlids who like lots of rocks.

But at the height of the GW problem I had lots of Green Hygro, Wisteria , Red Ludwigia, Crypts, Huge Java ferns and Anubias nanas... Plus some others I can't think of right now.

I scrapped most all of the plants except for the Java Ferns and anubias, and right now, I'm essentially doing nothing with the tank. 

I'll see if I can find a pic of it when it looked good.


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Lets see if this link works.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/yourtanks.php?do=view&id=143


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

Have you seen this thread?

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...warning-contaminated-eco-complete-market.html


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

Just so I understand completely:

As of right now, The tank only has Java fern and Anubias. Also has green water now and you are currently not doing anything as far as water changes and dosing....Right?


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Yes, I remember when that was all going on. I checked very carefully to make sure that the bags I recieved were not the ones described....

But even if they were, wouldn't that problem have started up right away, and not a year later?

I mean the tank went through it's various "maturing" stages and so did I. Adding things as $$ allowed. With CO2 first, then ferts, lights, and all was well for quite a while. Then the wheels fell off.


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Well, theres some crypts in there as well as a few spiral vals.

I pulled the CO2 system out, quit ferts, cut the light to 2x54w x 6hrs..

I also pulled all the fish and hardscape, drained and refilled the tank twice trying to get a foothold. 

I know, probably not the smartest move, but I really was ready to chuck it in. 

The Java Fern and Anubias take up about 75% of the space in the tank though.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

I have had friends who have expierenced the same thing you are describing with the Eco problem. It did always start right off the bat.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

dogdoc said:


> Well, theres some crypts in there as well as a few spiral vals.
> 
> I pulled the CO2 system out, quit ferts, cut the light to 2x54w x 6hrs..
> 
> ...


That's alright...It sounds like a great time to re-do this tank. Now that you have all the equipment to do a high tech tank right out of the gate.

In my years in this hobby, I have found that the main culprit of GW is a plant/light/nutrient imbalance. Having the right amount and type of plant mass to match the amount of light and nutrients given. The higher the light, and having the right amount of faster growing type plants, the EI method works well. I personally do not use the EI method. I believe that tanks should be balanced enough so that you can go on a 2 week vacation and come back with little to no algae problems. I dose only Flourish comp on a daily basis and I forget to do so most of the time. I dose Nitrogen and Potassium only when I feel the plants need it. I use the minimum amount of light to control the rate of growth and there-fore dosing everyday is not needed. From the looks of your tank in it's prime EI method would be too much nutrient and the amount of light was also too high. This may work for awhile but eventually the imbalance will show up in some form of algae.


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Well, after the GW struck, I played around with all sorts of dosing schemes. I let the Hygro and Wisteria clog the tank and cut way down on everything including light. Like I said, I even tried a few blackouts of 7 days duration without success.

I can understand what you are saying about EI and it makes sense.

But, the big question is still looming.

Now that I have this darn GW, How do I get it to go away?

Oh, one other thing before you answer. I live in Sheridan WY. We have one LFS and a Walmart. The LFS knows nothing about planted tanks. They still try to sell UGFs to all of their customers. Most everything that I have on this tank has had to be ordered online. I can get some new plants this weekend while I'm in Billings MT. But probably only have access to what their Petsmart has on hand. And shipping anything here right now is out of the question. We had a "high" temp of -2 F on Monday.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

dogdoc said:


> Well, after the GW struck, I played around with all sorts of dosing schemes. I let the Hygro and Wisteria clog the tank and cut way down on everything including light. Like I said, I even tried a few blackouts of 7 days duration without success.
> 
> I can understand what you are saying about EI and it makes sense.
> 
> ...


Well, in my opinion now that there is no live stock in the tank and little plant mass, I would start all over and remove the Eco. get a new batch of it, call Carib-sea and they will send you replacement bags for free. Tell them your problem and I'm sure you are not too late. Don't tear your tank down until they send you the replacement, just in case. I would also do a light bleach wash in the tank as well before adding the new substrate.

If you decide to do this, I would load that tank up with as many fast growing stem plants as possible. When I start a new tank it is packed with plants. For instance, If I want a large bush of Rotala rotundifolia in a back corner I will start with 100 or more stems. Waiting until it fills out with clippings can take a while and balancing the tank can take much longer.

If on the other hand you do not want to tear it down I would at least do a good washing of the Eco. I would also still pack it with fast growing stem plants. Also a foreground plant like Dwarf Hairgrss or Glosso or both. Both of which can grow very quickly and absorb a lot of nutrients. I always start with a 6 hour photo period and only dose Flourish Comp for the first two months. After two months I then gradually increase the photo period up to a maximum of 9 hrs. and start to dose Nitrogen and Potassium. I never dose Phosphates, there is enough of it in my fish food.

Lastly you could buy a UV sterilizer...lol


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

dogdoc said:


> Oh, one other thing before you answer. I live in Sheridan WY. We have one LFS and a Walmart. The LFS knows nothing about planted tanks. They still try to sell UGFs to all of their customers. Most everything that I have on this tank has had to be ordered online. I can get some new plants this weekend while I'm in Billings MT. But probably only have access to what their Petsmart has on hand. And shipping anything here right now is out of the question. We had a "high" temp of -2 F on Monday.


I would keep an eye out for folks here selling a mass quantity of stem plants. Or mutiple members selling the same type of plant. You could also post a WTB thread and state your desired quantity.

It is so difficult to balance a high tech tank with a minimal amount of plant mass. I started my first tank that way and fought every type of algae known to man.


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## Roy Deki (Apr 7, 2004)

BTW I apologize for directing your thread in a different direction. I only mean to help and I sensed your frustration. I have spent a lot of money on equipment too and later learned that finding and fixing the cause of the problem is always the best route, instead of a quick fix.


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## dogdoc (Feb 3, 2006)

Ooops, I mis-spoke. I did take out all the fish and hardscape to do my major drain and fill. But they are back in there now.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

First off, I do agree with Roy on trying to find the inbalance in the tank, but if you have tried and tried sometimes it's just not worth the fight. There are just some unknowns in this hobby that we can't always identify that can cause GW or other problems. Maybe there's some organic in your water supply, maybe it is the Eco who knows, but sometimes balance is hard to achieve in a small closed system like an aquarium. I have four tanks and only one has a UV. It just so happens the tank with the UV has Eco-complete and I did have a bout of GW a few years ago. After trying some of the approaches you took I put the 9w turbotwist on it and never looked back. I find no downside to it. I also have an extremely low flow rate on the tank so I get the added UV benefit for the fish as well. The interesting thing is that I have a few tanks with Aquasoil one I have been playing around with moving things around and anyone who has AS knows the mess that makes. The tank is also highlight (4 wpg / 46g) and I have no algae issues and there is no UV. So go figure....


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## mikenas102 (Feb 8, 2006)

Just another vote here for the Turbo Twist. Been running mine about 2 years and wouldn't think about starting another tank without one.


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