# My Co2 cylinder doesn't long run!!



## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)

Hello,

I've a 53 US Gallon tank, with Co2 set.

I've a DIY Co2 reactor which desolve Co2 100%.

And my Cylinder is 2.700 Kiloo, my bubble conter set to 2bps.

Last time i got filled the cylinder on 18 / april, and today i found it empty!!!!

I shutt off it at night, and i'm sure there's no leaking. i tested it when i operated it..

So, what do you think guyz?

Is that happeing also with you?

What do i need to do to make my CO2 system run longer and longer.....

How about DIY electrical CO2 production?

Any other ideas?? most welcom...


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## ianmoede (Jan 17, 2005)

Well, if you'er positive there are no leaks, they must've underfilled it. See how this cylinder cycle goes and get back to us. If it runs long enough for you, great, if not, you shoulda leak tested better last time.


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## furballi (Feb 2, 2007)

Use dishwashing liquid and water to check for leaks around ALL CONNECTORS. If okay, then you may need to dip the whole rig including hose, tank, and regulator in the bath tub to check for leak. Put the regulator in the sun for a few days to dry out the gauge(s).


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## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)

furballi said:


> Use dishwashing liquid and water to check for leaks around ALL CONNECTORS. If okay, then you may need to dip the whole rig including hose, tank, and regulator in the bath tub to check for leak. Put the regulator in the sun for a few days to dry out the gauge(s).


I've done all that when i connected it first time... i dipped all the connectors in a water tub, and it was no leaking....


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## Muirner (Jan 9, 2007)

But you could develop one since the first time. Try to leak test it again upon hookup and explain your issue to your filling shop, that's muy not cool


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## tazcrash69 (Oct 24, 2005)

Ack, double post. Sorry.


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## tazcrash69 (Oct 24, 2005)

When you had it refilled did you use a new washer when you re-attached the regulator? 
Unless it's a perma-seal washer, they should be replaced each time. 
Also, depending on the washer you need to go back, and re-tighten it again after a couple days. 
You said you dipped all he connectors, I hope you didn't dip the regulator especially if you have a solenoid on there.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

The last time I refilled my CO2 tank, after it didn't last as long as I expected, I noticed that the connection of the regulator to the tank wasn't nearly as tight as I expected. So, when I reconnected the filled, and still cold tank, I rechecked that connection after an hour. It was loose! I retightened it, again using a 12 inch wrench. An hour later I rechecked it again, and again it was almost loose. It was night by then, so I checked it again the next morning - loose again! Finally, after a couple more hours when I rechecked it, the connection was still very tight. And, the next day, the same.

So, I suspect that we need to retighten that nut several times when we install a still cold refilled tank. Either the extreme cold is causing the connection to loosen as it warms up again, or the nylon sealing washer is deforming more as it warms up, allowing it to get loose. All of this means that passing a leak check right after installation isn't adequate for ensuring that the connection doesn't leak. Retighten the sucker again and again!


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## Muirner (Jan 9, 2007)

You have to replace the plastic ring every time?? I didnt know that, but thanks for the heads up!


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## Nevermore (Mar 26, 2007)

HOW big is your CO2 cylinder? 2.7 kiloo?


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## DonaldmBoyer (Aug 18, 2005)

I heard that electric carbon plates don't work very well. It is expensive to buy the carbon plates, they don't last very long, and they aren't very efficient. I would stick to your cylinder once you figure out what is wrong. It'll be a few more years, I guess, before someone comes out with inexpensive, efficient electric carbon plates for CO2 production. Right now, I believe they are more trouble than they are worth.


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## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)




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## tazcrash69 (Oct 24, 2005)

DonaldmBoyer said:


> I heard that electric carbon plates don't work very well. It is expensive to buy the carbon plates, they don't last very long, and they aren't very efficient. I would stick to your cylinder once you figure out what is wrong. It'll be a few more years, I guess, before someone comes out with inexpensive, efficient electric carbon plates for CO2 production. Right now, I believe they are more trouble than they are worth.


That plus they play heck with your hardness, It produces CO2, by using your KH and raising the water's total dissolved solids by producing by product from the chemical reaction. It will stop working when all the KH has been stripped from the water.

FWIW, Also after seeing the pic of your tank it looks like you have Teflon tape on the threads. If your tank is an American tank (not sure based on the Kilo weight), with a CGA 320 fitting, it does not seal on the threads. It's a flat compression based seal. On most regulators the nut is freely sliding on the stem of the regulator. 
Teflon tape will not make an airtight (CO2 tight) seal on the threads, the seal needs to be in the regulator.


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## Squawkbert (Jan 3, 2007)

2 problems w/ tub-testing
1) not good for the hardware - you can't get the water out of all of the nooks and crannies. Dilute soap solution will evaporate off faster.

2) what if you bump something on the way back from the tub? It's best to test in situ.

Also - test the tank's main valve & its attachment to the tank body. Some mains leak less if you (gently) open them all the way (like the water faucet in my garage). Grrr.


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## furballi (Feb 2, 2007)

Squawkbert said:


> 2 problems w/ tub-testing
> 1) not good for the hardware - you can't get the water out of all of the nooks and crannies. Dilute soap solution will evaporate off faster.
> 
> 2) what if you bump something on the way back from the tub? It's best to test in situ.
> ...


Hmmm...I take it that you didn't graduate from Pomona with a degree in Mechanical Engineering? There's nothing wrong with dipping electro-mechanical devices in water for cleaning. That's how dirty motherboards are recycled in the PC industry. About the only moving part in a CO2 rig is the solenoid, needle gauge, and bourdon gauges. A few days in S Cal's summer sun will fix any moisture problem. One could always bake the regulator assembly in the oven for several hours at 150 to 180F.

We're not taking about a 1/2 hour salt bath. A 15 seconds dip will quickly isolate ANY leak. If the regulator assembly cannot handle a minor bumb, then it's a POS.


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## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)

hmmm, i'm wondering how long your Co2 Cylinder long lasts???

Maybe the answer will help..

Also, about leaking testing,, i'm sure that was no leaking,

maybe 2.7 kilo with 2bps doesn't long last for 53 US Gallon tank.

Also i shutt of the system at night,

I'm concerning about Co2 production, not inside the fish tank, but a separetly tank, like a cylinder,
that you produce pure Co2 gas and you control the injecting into the fish tank. same for Co2 cylinder with regulator,,

I think it would be an great idea if it happend and inexpensive for long run. the you save more with no Co2 refills anymore...!

But i need many ideas about that..

I can't wait to get algae bloom in my tank because of loss of Co2...


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## snoopy (Feb 8, 2006)

I have the CO2 like you, and use it for my 45 gallon tank, 2bps, 24/24h and it lasts for 6 months.

I think, you refill it again but in a different shop. After that check the leakage when u running it with your CO2 reactor. The reason for this check is your reactor may need quite high pressure to operate (like glass diffuser) hence all your valves running at this pressure too.


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## furballi (Feb 2, 2007)

snoopy said:


> I have the CO2 like you, and use it for my 45 gallon tank, 2bps, 24/24h and it lasts for 6 months.
> 
> I think, you refill it again but in a different shop. After that check the leakage when u running it with your CO2 reactor. The reason for this check is your reactor may need quite high pressure to operate (like glass diffuser) hence all your valves running at this pressure too.


That's why the OP should dip the WHOLE RIG in the tub if the leak cannot be isolated with soapy water. The tub will confirm the air-tight integrity of all components attached to the CO2 injection rig.


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## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)

snoopy said:


> I have the CO2 like you, and use it for my 45 gallon tank, 2bps, 24/24h and it lasts for 6 months.
> 
> I think, you refill it again but in a different shop. After that check the leakage when u running it with your CO2 reactor. The reason for this check is your reactor may need quite high pressure to operate (like glass diffuser) hence all your valves running at this pressure too.


I've a reactor DIY made. connected into filter intake, i work on 1 bar, i don't think 1 bar is high,

whatever high pressure or low, if there's no leaking, it wont empty fast i think..

you've Co2 cyilnder 2.7 kilo like me, and you use 2 bps 24/7 and last for 6 months???

why my cylinder doesn't last more than month,

I'm gonna to refill again, and will take 1 day for leaking checking and i'll see how long it will last,


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## furballi (Feb 2, 2007)

kamel_007 said:


> I've a reactor DIY made. connected into filter intake, i work on 1 bar, i don't think 1 bar is high,
> 
> whatever high pressure or low, if there's no leaking, it wont empty fast i think..
> 
> ...


1 bar = 14.7 psig. 10 to 15 psig is the nominal working pressure for a CO2 injection rig. Have the person put a tiny amount of CO2 in the tank, then release the CO2 to cool the tank. This will allow the CO2 tank to accept a full charge.


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## Muirner (Jan 9, 2007)

As furballi said, make sure your getting a full tank. This was a big problem when i played Paintball (for my friends that used CO2), they wouldnt get a full tank of air, and about 400shots early, the tank would die. Have them "charge" the tank so it can accept a full load. Make sure the tank is the proper weight. Put yourself on a scale with the empty tank, get it filled and weigh again. You should ahve 2.7kilos added.


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## kamel_007 (Jan 7, 2006)

Muirner said:


> As furballi said, make sure your getting a full tank. This was a big problem when i played Paintball (for my friends that used CO2), they wouldnt get a full tank of air, and about 400shots early, the tank would die. Have them "charge" the tank so it can accept a full load. Make sure the tank is the proper weight. Put yourself on a scale with the empty tank, get it filled and weigh again. You should ahve 2.7kilos added.


Well im understand what your talking about, as the factory that i deal with told me he doing that everythime,,

I'll make sure to next time to get the full tank charged,,,

Thanks for help,,


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

CO2 tanks are always filled by weight. There is no other way to fill them. When the tank doesn't last long you have a leak.


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