# Fresh start and how too?



## Joeymozzer (Jun 21, 2014)

I currently have an established 13G tank w gravel, it's already planted and had been running for over 5 months. I purchased a 20L and I'm waiting on my finnex planted+ I got a aqua clear50 too. Now I've been aiming at adding soil under either new or existing gravel. I've read and researched but very confused and don't want to regret it.

I won't be adding C02 any time soon, I have used excel and flourish but I think the excel is causing pin holes in my Hygro sunset and java fern. Any help on setting up? Soil? Low budget friendly, existing or new gravel? Thanks


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

If you're taking the 13g down when you put up the 20 long, then I would use the nice dirty gravel as my cap. It's already covered in good bacteria. And the accumulated mulm will just help enrich the soil.

CO2 may not be a problem. The soil will produce a good amount with all it's decomp. However, the pinholes sound more like potassium deficiency or pleco damage than Excel.

For the soil, just make sure you prep it first.
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...-mineralized-soil-substrate-aaron-talbot.html


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## Joeymozzer (Jun 21, 2014)

Tugg said:


> If you're taking the 13g down when you put up the 20 long, then I would use the nice dirty gravel as my cap. It's already covered in good bacteria. And the accumulated mulm will just help enrich the soil.
> 
> CO2 may not be a problem. The soil will produce a good amount with all it's decomp. However, the pinholes sound more like potassium deficiency or pleco damage than Excel.
> 
> ...


I have both pleco and excel, I stopped w excel and see if it gets better. So if I use the same gravel should I rinse it first? Run the old filter along w my new one on the new tank? Any suggestions on which soil to use?


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## Skizhx (Oct 12, 2010)

In my experience H. sunset will show potassium deficiencies earlier than most other plants.

It's not the excel, and if stopping excel resolves the issue then it is only because the plant is growing slower from having less available carbon, and is requiring less potassium (which I would not count on happening because I don't think deficiencies even work that way).

Some plants (like vals) don't do well with excel, but java fern and Hygro. 'sunset' appreciate it.

I agree on reusing the gravel if possible. Keep it wet, don't let it dry out.

I also think an aquaclear 50 is an unnecessary amount of water flow for a dirted 20gal. I would be concerned about it outgasing your CO2 with the surface turbulence. You barely need much circulation in a tank that size. If it was a little smaller you could probably get away with leaving it stagnant. 

Also, unless you're overstocking the tank, you don't need that much space for filtration media either. Overstocking creates issues I'd rather avoid too, though.


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## krissy (Jun 3, 2014)

Maybe it's me but excel always cause me issues. It also melts some species like anacharis, downoi.. when I do use it, i use half of the recommended dose once in a blue


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

I don't use co2 or excel in any of my planted tanks. I tend to think what you are seeing is a nutrient problem. Even moderate dosing of fertilizers seems to help a lot. Really it all depends on the plants you choose.

As for the substrate a simple potting soil capped with whatever you prefer seems to work fine. Read the el-natural soil thread. 
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/el-natural/84918-suitable-soils-walstad-method.html


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