# Otto death



## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I had just turned off the faucet and making the final check after the water cha nge before I walked away when I noticed my otto swimming around in vertical circles. I watched him for a second as they got smaller and more frantic, until it finally stopped and drifted down upside down on top of my blyxa. I watched as the area right behind the soccer go from red to purple. I assume this was the gills stopping and the blood running out of oxygen. No other fish are streesed that i can see. My Amano shrimp I can see looked find nibbling away on a dead blyxa japonica leaf.

What happened?

I havent tested anything in a while but there is no amonia, no nitrite and I ussually have nitrate in the 20s but I havent added any nitrate since it seemed to not need it. I add phosphate at about 3ppm per week and more when I see gsa. The plants seem to be doing poorly but I think they are still recovering from my 2 and a half week vacation that ended on the 7th. How can a fish survive what my tank whent through during those two weeks and not survive a water change?


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## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

Sudden changes of water parameters can stress any fish. Depending on how long you had your Oto, some otos are very easy to kill since they are typically purchase in poor conditions and take a long time to recover. Some otos are just damaged to begin with and never full recover and just seem to survive for awhile until that final blow. 

My guess the oto wasn't used to the new water, and didn't like it. Also maybe you forgot the dechlorinator? I have before, and I had quite a few fish deaths (including otos).

-John N


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I havent added dechlor in a long time. I guess that could be it but I doubt it. I have had 3 ottos since... october I think. They have all gone through a lot of problems and never showed any signs of stress. I just cant beleive how fast it died. I mean I literally watched it go from being fine to flipping out to dying. It was kind of wierd since I couldnt really do anything about it since I had no idea what was wrong. I just watched it instantly die. It didnt flop around a little or struggle for breath or even float around barely alive. The only other time I have had a fish die like this was when I had a rope fish. I fed it to many ghost shrimp and it either choked itself or gorged itself to death. 

I know it must have something to do with the changing water parameters since it happened right after a water change. I add the water slowly over a period of about an hour. The temperature did go down to 80 from 83 after the water change but I did that kind of on purpose I didnt think it would stress them that much. 

Thanks for the ideas. I had read that they often die right after purchasing for the same reasons you listed. I cant see that being a factor though since I have had them for months.


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## Laith (Sep 4, 2004)

Water utilities love to change sources of water and/or suddenly increase/add chlorine or chloramine without informing anyone...

And perhaps a weaker fish would be affected by it while stronger healthier fish would survive it.


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## Boz (Jun 1, 2006)

^I hear of that happening all the time, Laith. 

Can I ask why you don't use dechlor? Do you have well water? I'd love to be able to skip it, but my water smells like a swimming pool out of the tap.  

Chances are your oto was weak prior to the change, and that just pushed him over the edge. I'd keep a close eye on other tankmates to make sure there's not a community illness developing.


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## abnormalsanon (Jun 6, 2006)

In my experience, otos die at random. I have one little survivor who has been through literally everything and is still hanging in there, but his buddies died long ago, suddenly and without any cause that I could find


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## erik Loza (Feb 6, 2006)

Oto's are a fragile fish and I don't think they live terribly long even when healthy. I've had several that seemed to be doing fine for the longest time just turn up dead. It's a shame, but if you're otherwise taking care of the tank, there's nothing else that can be done. If you like the look of Otocinclus but want something bit more robust, try Paraotocinclus if you can find them. Hypoptoma ("Giant Oto") or some of the smaller Peckoltia's ("Clown Pleco") might be an option, too. Good luck.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I guess something happened because I just found one of my silvertip tetras floating. They have been showing up dead every once and a while but I assumed it was because they where attacking eachother. Always saw ripped fins and aggression. Then one would show up with most of its fins gone floating on the surface. This one though did not have any fin loss and looked healthy other than the fact it was floating. I am doing another 50% water change and using plenty of amquel hopefully this solves the problem. I will go test the water.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

Ok I think I found the problem. I have nitrite. After all the water changes I managed to rid myself of ammonia and Nitrate but not nitrite. I guess during my vacation either the feeder block or the decaying algae and plants cause a mini cycle that I must have stalled on nitrite. I got it down to .25 and put in 5 ppm of nitrate and will do another change tommorrow if my plants dont suck up the .25 that remains. I guess I should test more often. Thanks for the suggestions and the posts. I am sorry I wasted your time instead of testing my own water.


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## erik Loza (Feb 6, 2006)

0.25ppm of NO2 won't kill your fish. In fact 25.0ppm of NO2 probably won't even kill your fish. Testing water is good but changing water is better. And not over-analyzing a death here or there is best of all. Fish are both hardy and fragile creatures, subject to forces outside of your or my powers of observation for 90% of their lives. If the tank is basically healthy and most of the fish look fine, then don't worry about it. 

Oh, and there are some tetras that are pretty rough on each other, like Serpae's, but not Silvertips. Who else do you have in that tank?


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

Its the tetras I see them harrasing eachother. I have apisotgramma bitaeniata's but they never lunge at tany fish. I think they are responsible for the shrimp deaths but they are mild fish. THe tretras rip eachothers fins I watch them. 

THe nitrite is only .25 because of a lot of water changes. I also want to know how I ended up with 0 amonia (before adding amquel or a dechlorinator) and how I had 0 nitrate and some nitrite.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

If you have measurable levels of nitrite it is probably a leftover from a huge ammonia spike that happened when chloramines got introduced to your tank. Water companies often send a pulse of chloramine through the system once or twice a year (often in the hottest summer months) to clean out the system.

BTW, vacation feeder blocks are a bad idea. IMO, they're one of the worst products on the market. Fish can almost always go a week or so without feeding if they're in good condition. What makes it into those blocks is anyone's guess, but certainly a bunch of garbage is released into the water as the block slowly dissolves. A huge load of organics from the feeder block could also be responsible.

What test kits are you using? How old are they? Have you calibrated them against a known solution? I'm pretty skeptical of the results of most test kits.


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