# Rock positioning



## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

What do you guys think about my scape? Do I need more variaties of rock?

John


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## LukeG (Mar 8, 2005)

I really like the fact you went with all the same type of rocks, I think it looks more natural. The positioning looks good also. There are only two things I could suggest but they may not be possible.

1. The two stacks are very similar is size, is it possible to vary them a little? Once the plants grow in you may not notice though.

2. Do you have some small pieces of the same rocks you could add around the base? Some very small pieces would be a nice detail to add. They would look like fragments of the rocks that settled after a land slide.

Just a couple suggestions. Your stacks look great.  Make sure you post some pictures of the tank once you get them in.

Luke


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## jsenske (Mar 15, 2004)

I think you have done a great job- you are on the right track. Is that a native stone/something you collected yourself? It looks very interesting.


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Looks good so far. I'd personally like to see some smaller stones to soften the large ones. And ya...where did you get those rocks!


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## SCMurphy (Jan 28, 2004)

When you get them in the tank with a substrate I would do a couple things.

I would make the substrate higher on the right side than the left.
I would keep the left grouping close together, like you have it, and centered (front to back) in the tank.
I would move the majority of the right group towards the back of the tank, and bring the front stone towards the front of the tank. Making a triangle of sorts with the stone groupings. 

I think the right hand group has more power than the left, but the larger mass on the left throws the balance off, which is why I would make the right side 'taller' with the substrate.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Alright you guys thanks for the suggestions, if you guys have seem Oliver knott's aquascapes, he uses the same rocks I have here. Jeff, like your rocks at they came from China. I do have a lot of smaller rocks that I plan to use but they are soaking to get a little algae on it so they weren't used.I bought all this for less than 5$ at my LFS. Yes I know I have to have a sloping with the substrate, higher in the back lower in the front.


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Can you PM me the LFS so that I can make a run over LOL.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Clear some space Gomer!!


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## richy (Nov 8, 2004)

rocks from China? the only ones i ever see at my lfs are the "bowl rock" i have a few small pieces, but not nice enuff to put in my tank to do any kind of scaping. i'd like to get a few of those pieces myself, but it'd be too costly to ship to norcal. =(

i like the 2nd formation better. looks more natural, altho i agree that they should be spaced out and not clumped together.


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## Praxx42 (Mar 4, 2005)

Am I the only one who regularly raids stone yards and landscape contractors for rocks? LFS prices are WAY too much.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

It was labeled "natural rock" in two different lfs.


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Space has been made. Thanks!

I actually found a source that looks exactly like "dragon stone"...I'll have to pick some up...price permitted, and test it out for pH/GH/KH effects.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

can you now in turn pm that "place" Gomer?


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

LOL..Will do. ...although I might buy it all out . I need to look up the address again. I'll try and head there sometime this week and report back (know the location, not the name and address)


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Alright, no rush since I got these rocks, just looking for a variety for another ADA tank


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Nice rocks, guys. [jealous]


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

John since you live in so cali too come up here and get some only a 2 hour drive


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## IUnknown (Feb 24, 2004)

ADG mentioned they might be carrying ADA layout material sometime in the future. It would be nice to finally have a good source for the stuff, although shipping rocks from Japan would probably be expensive.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

probably Jeff has connections


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## defdac (May 10, 2004)

I would do something more like:









(size down the right part and increase the inclination of the left rock a bit)


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Oh! very nice! Thanks for the suggestion!


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

defdac said:


> I would do something more like:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice work!


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Ok, what do you think about this? This is going to be a low light moss tank, the green is the moss.


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## |squee| (Feb 3, 2005)

Could you do that? As in... the sizes of the rocks were edited. Not sure how you're going to make the left side look smaller. , bury in gravel?

The one above definately looks better, has a sort of sanzon iwagumi concept in it. Your version is good too, so just see which one you will like.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

I can get smaller rocks which I have or, lay the rocks on their sides.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

how about now? I got smaller rocks, which I think will sub the middle sized ones, the left will be a little bigger. the right side i plan to push back and the left in the front, 3-4 inch slope in the back and 2 inch in the front.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

The height of the left group is to uniform. Overall the 2 groups need a little adjustment to tie them together. I think 2 of the rocks from the left need to be bigger and the whole groupis too circular. Also,a group of 4 is bad...creates 2 much tension. Try using 2 groupings of 3 rocks each on the left side, each set of 3 should form a triangle adn the 2 triangles should overlap to create one grouping. In the right group, the tall skinney one pointing to the right does not fit with the rest of te rocks or the layout... too distracting. As has already been mentioned, when you do the actual layout make sure to bury some in the substrate and mound it to help vary the heights of the rock. Make sure the rocks and substrate look natural together...don't bury the rock too much but don't leave them laying on the substrate either. You want it to look like the rock has always been there and that the substrate has weather around and from the rock. If you have any chips of the rock use in in between the mountains like boulders in canyons.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

alright, I'm pretty set on this, should i use a moss foregrond or microsword or hair grass?


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

How tall are the rocks? E. Acicularis grows taller in lower light, so you may have an issue with the rocks getting obscured.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

about 5-6 inch is the tallest one, I am able to cut the hair grass to about 2-3 inches.


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## antreasgr (Nov 28, 2004)

these rocks are only 5-6 inch????i think that the rocks will dissapear in the hairgrass , especially the smaller rocks!same for the microsword.moss foreground its very good choice but you will need to cut it down almost 2 times a week , and its dificult to clean too since all the uneaten food stucks overthere..(i have mine and i know)if you have good lighting go with glossostigma.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

i will not leave the grass tall, I will be able to cut it down to 2 inches max. if any lower, then the rocks will look to bare.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Here is a whole new scap using the same rocks and some extras, is this better now?


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## tinman (May 11, 2004)

Can't see complete picture. But from what i can, it looks pretty good. Looks less chaotic than the other ones.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

should I scatter some smaller rocks around? And where should I scatter them.


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## dmartin72 (Oct 9, 2004)

It depends if you plan on a different foreground scape. If you make the front pretty bare or very shortly kept and you have similar medium sized rocks (6) as well as similar small sized rocks (12), do it. However if you plan on sticking with the hair grass, I would just use what you have.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

taiwan moss and hc, so the foreground will be pretty short.


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## RedBaron (May 16, 2004)

I wonder why having such beautiful rocks you haven’t created an aquascape yet. This very last rock positioning seems ok but it’s your aquarium and you should decide what you like. Remember, no one will give you a recipe for perfect layout. It’s all about making mistakes and with time your aquascapes should be better and better.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

well I haven't done it yet because I have school and work and I am in the process of receiving all of my plants. I keep changing my mind because everytime I mess around with the rocks, a new layout comes in place, I am pretty set on this one though.


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## Plattykins (Apr 3, 2005)

turtlehead, I especially like the central arrangement of rocks in your latest photo. I bet you could do without the other two sets of rocks. I particularly liked the set of rocks on the right in your first photo. They would look good in the center as well and without the others. Less is more.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Well, I guess it's time for me to rip out my beloved layout that I currently have and go ahead with this, I hesitatant, but I'll so it soon, work and school is in the way.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

I finally did it, the result I think are alright, I will now work on adjusting those rocks from where they are standing.


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## ScottH. (May 13, 2004)

I like it. I think those black rocks would be great for attaching moss for a carpet effect.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

In my opinion this layout looks too contrived. The big rock in the center is just that; in the center. 

My suggestion is to have the rock on the left moved farther right a little bit so it is grouped with the rocks in the middle. Now move that whole group over to the right side of the tank all still facing the same way. Now move the group that is on the right in the picture to the left side of the tank. Slope the substrate so that the ends and backs are higher, though still not the same height as each other. Does this make sense? Look at the one RedBaron posted recently to get an idea of what I mean. Not that you should copy his design, but he has a great sense of layout.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

I get what you are saying, I wanted to make the center rock more to the right but I think I messed up and made it too centered, so I am planning to move it a right a little more.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

repositioned them. Crossing fingers.


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## Plattykins (Apr 3, 2005)

WOW! The addition of the gravel sure made a difference. What an interesting composition! It is a bit reminiscent of Easter Island (?).


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## vafd (Apr 20, 2005)

turtlehead,

In your last picture the central rock is no longer in the geometrical center, but it is not in the visual center either. Which leaves somewhat "lost" impression.

Check out this thread and also take a look at what I mean in terms of your picture (I hope you do not mind that I have edited and re-posted it. Let me know if it is a problem.)

Regards.

Vladimir.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Its ok go ahead and edit my picture. So what should I do to create a better scape? adjusting the central rock?


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## vafd (Apr 20, 2005)

I would try to position it in such a way that the vertical red line will go through the rock's center. Maybe even move the whole central group to the left closer to the smallish left rock. So you will end up with kind of two groups: large and diverse left with large rock being a main focal point and it will be accented by this rock (or are there two) on the right. Sort of like this.

But this is just "how I would do it". But anyway I would put large rock right into one of the visual center points according to golden ratio rule. This will just make it look right in place. The rest is up to personal taste.

Regards.

Vladimir.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Alright thanks for your personal input I will keep this in mind when I have time to work on it again.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

I have to agree with Vladamir. Nice job with the visual there


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Ok, messed with it a little.
Took out the Riccia because I thought it would contrast too much with the dark moss green. And it was growing too fast, I will try again when the moss grows a bit thicker, which is already what it has done it just a month with out co2 and ferts, amazing. Hairgrass also has many runners now, a lot of the hc as been pulled out by shrimps, so I decided it to grow it out in a tank and then put in bigger clumps of it. So this is it of now.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Beautiful! The only thing I would change would be to move everything over to the left to bring the center rock off-center. Other than that--BEAUTIFUL!


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Here it is after so many months. The hairgrass has been taken out, the gravel was too big for it. The whole tank is now taiwan moss only. 2wpg excel once a week after a 20% water change. I now use seachem prime, I think the shrimps like it more than stress coat.


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