# Substrate idea



## potatoes (Jun 25, 2010)

Hi,
I am not sure if this is an original idea or not, but i want to run it passed you guys before doing it because i have not seen it before. My goal is a NPT that will be low tech, have moderate lighting, and not require frequent water changes once establisher or need fertilizer supplements.

If i am wrong on anything i say, PLEASE correct me

i am in a sense combining the mineralized soul method with the walsted rich organic soil method.
From what i understand, you do not want organics in soil below 1" because they will decompose anaerobically and release hydrogen sulfide gas. not good. if they decompose aerobically, above 1", they release co2 and fertilize plants. good.

So, what i want to do is mimic the soil horizons in nature, and have a mineralized organic-free substrate at the bottom, with a organic rich (MGOCPS) soil on top. both about .5-.75" deep.

At the very bottom, i will sprinkle potash for P, then mix in cheap, mineralized topsoil that has been mixed with some red clay for iron. (should i put a bit of dolomite or crushed coral for calcium?)
On top of that, i will put Miracle grow organic choice potting soil which i have soaked several times and probably lost the soluble additives, such as the potash (hence the potash at the bottom) I have also removed about half of the bark that was in it to avoid excess tannins and TOO much organics. along the sides and on the top, i will cap with poolfilter sand or black diamond. 

I will add lots of fast growing plants like water wisteria and swords, as anything else i can get my hands on. 

How dose this sound? i hope that if it is too thick and there is anaerobic processes, it will be ok because of the lack of organics, and may even harbor denitrifing bacteria (?). 

Is this a good idea or an awful idea? 
thanks,
mike


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## HeyPK (Jan 23, 2004)

If I were you, I would skip the mineralizing and I wouldn't worry very much about organic matter in the soil. Anaerobic conditions in the soil do not bother most aquarium plants because their roots have air channels and O2 diffuses down the roots from the above ground portions of the plant. There will be a zone of oxidation around each root caused by O2 diffusing out. Of course, I wouldn't want a lot of organic matter in the soil that decomposes rapidly because that might overcome the aeration of the roots and cause problems for the plant. Peat does not decompose rapidly, and mixing peat with soil does not cause problems. Just to be sure, you can compost your soil in a covered storage box for a few weeks during which rapidly decomposing organic matter is taken care of, and then use it. If you are going to add nutrients, you might as well add them to the water column.


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## potatoes (Jun 25, 2010)

Thanks for the reply. I am scared of organics because in my 5gal npt, there are bubbles from the substrate (no smell, so i guess its not Hydrogen sulfide) and my water wisteria keeps rotting just above the substrate and detaching. any idea what is causing this so i can avoid it? admittedly, it is not STUFFED with plants, but there is water hyacinth floating with a *massive* root system (and i think it starved my floating wisteria, which died and the rotted and caused an ammonia spike, which i did not notice due to overwhelming school work, and i got some algae)

My goal is to never (or at least for along time not need to) add fertilizers. in order to accomplish this, what should i be adding into the soul from the beginning?
some things i have been considering:
red clay- iron
dolomite or pelitized lime or crushed coral (small amount, at the bottom, just in case)- calcium
epsom salt- magnesium
maturite of potash - potassium

am i missing anything? nitrogen and phosphate will come from fish food and waist, right?

i would sprinkle these on the bottom, then add the MGOCPS. clay would be mixed into the soil (?)

I have already started to mineralize some topsoil, but i have enough MGOCPS to just use the potting soil. would both ways work equally, or one better then the other considering the type of tank i want? if they both will work, i will try my idea just for funzies, but if pure MGOCPS is better, i will do that

sorry if my questions are novice, i have learned everything i know about plants from online research, this site, and ms.walsads book and the whole plant idea is only slowly coming together

thanks again\
mike


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

I think you have a good plan in place. I've tried out different natural mehtods and I prefer natural soil substrate (from my yard...but the "mineralized" topsoil is similar....soil from your yard will have already been mineralized) capped with sand/gravel/etc...because it is packed with micronutrients and some macros. Putting a layer of potting soil between them sounds like a good idea to me. In fact, my next tank will be something very similar to what you describe in your first post.

Oh, and +1 on HeyPK's post about aquatic plants being fine in anaerobic conditions.

And the gas bubbles from your substrate...if they don't smell bad, then it may be CO2, so that's a good thing.


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## potatoes (Jun 25, 2010)

Fantastic, thank you! Now that im more confidant in the substrate, i can start moving the buckets of soil offf of my moms porch [smilie=l:

do you think all of those additives are good? i just dont want to add something i will regret later

I just realized that the filter in my 5gal is not only blocking a substantial amount of light, but unnecessary because it is driving off co2 (and i am glad the bubbles are co2!). i am not worried about my fish suffocating because its a betta with a labyrinth organ  I am happy you are planning something similar, that also gives me confidence.
Thanks,
MIke


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

If the soil you are using is a high calcium soil, then skip the crushed coral/oystershell grit/dolomite. 

How to tell:
Put some soil in RO or distilled water. Shake it up really well. 
Test the water for GH. 
If there is enough to show on a GH test as more than just a degree or so, then assume there is enough for the aquarium plants. 

Another test: If the tap water has at least 5 German degrees of hardness for GH, then there will be enough Ca and Mg to last a long time between water changes.


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