# First Question From Me - Soil Type...



## Kosh42|EFG (Jul 4, 2007)

Well, I know I should just wait until my copy of Diana Walstad's 'Ecology of the Planted Aquarium' to arrive from Amazon, but I'm already researching lots on the net and mooching around the fresh water section of the local shop...

My main concern at present is getting the right soil into the substrate. I've found a product in the local fish shop called "pond compost". Its basically for potting up pond plants, so was wondering if this would be a safe bet to use in a Walstad tank, and cut down on the risk of adding something nasty...

I'd probably add a little topsoil still for the bacterial colonies, but not enough to leech too many toxins should any be present.

If I should just go for topsoil, I wonder if anyone from the UK can point me in the direction of a brand they've had success with...

Many thanks for your help...


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Success with soil may depend more on how you use it than what the soil is. You can start with an "ideal soil", but if you use a too deep soil depth (>1.5 inches), plant only a few weak plant species, have poor lighting, or use strong lighting but without emergent plants, the tank may do poorly.

In my opinion, almost any normal soil will work fine provided that that the hobbyist understands something about aquatic plants and aquarium ecology.

My advice is to do a Bottle Test. If the soil doesn't cloud the water and make a pea soup and/or release tons of ammonia, then it is probably fine.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

And stay away from ones that realease tons of hydrogen sulfide gas too (rotten egg smell)... A little is ok, I guess.. I had a soil that kept stinkin' for months, so I threw it away.


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## Tony65 (Jun 3, 2006)

I used Westland Topsoil, from a local garden centre, mixed with garden soil (heavy clay) in my first NPT (80:20 ratio) (Here's an example supplier showing a picture of the bag)

This is just a sterilised loam, clay, and sand based topsoil with no "extras".

You will get an ammonia spike from it. 
Mine soaked in the tank for a month without plants while I was away - ammonia and Nitrite were cleared by the end of this time, most probably due to the additional live soil.

The mixture gassed CO2 bubbles for a few months but not excessively. The tank has been planted up since October 06 and is doing fine.

I'm setting up a soil-based planted shrimp tank at present, but using just the garden soil as I'm no longer afraid of it :mrgreen:


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## Kosh42|EFG (Jul 4, 2007)

Thanks for the pointers will look out for Westland Topsoil at the local Wyvale or Homebase... My garden soil is a bit iffy, as no-one has ever looked after the garden in this house and I'm halfway through redoing it, so there's a real possibility of sawdust, fence stain, etc in there...

Just had a thought... I have a pot in the pond contailing soil... Could this be used to seed the sterile soil with bacteria and cut the cycling time in the tank?

And I plan to read the book a few times before setting up the tank to make sure I have the principles firmly in my head before I start


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## flagg (Nov 29, 2004)

Kosh42|EFG said:


> Just had a thought... I have a pot in the pond contailing soil... Could this be used to seed the sterile soil with bacteria and cut the cycling time in the tank?


I don't see why not. I'd mix it in with your "sterile" (is soil every REALLY sterile?) soil and see what happens.

Good luck with your setup and keep us posted!

-ricardo


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## Kosh42|EFG (Jul 4, 2007)

Hi all, just a quick update on the tanks and a new query... Sorry its been a while, but in the time since the I set up the tank in May, I've had spinal surgery, got married, and turned thirty... I have been busy!

The tank set up fine and had fish in soon. Then the algae started, and the tank looked like pea soup with green water algae. That went after a few weeks to be replaced by slime algae that smothered everything... That disapated, but I've had non-stop blanket week problems since... I'm pulling a fair amount out of the tank weekly...

I thought the problems may be caused by my tap water nutrients, so switched to pond (rain) water. The problems have eased since the switch, but are still there... Think it may be my choice of soil, as my dad has a tank using different soil and rain water and its thriving and clean.

Any ideas gratefully welcomed...

Here's a few pics:




























Ariel growth is not an issue here!


















However, the oddest thing is that soil seems to be making its way above the gravel. I have syphoned this out, but it keeps coming back. Its very fine soil and quickly (two weeks) gets to be easily half inch deep. And there are no burrowing fish... Any ideas on this one too?










I'm tempted to strip it out and start again with new soil, but am looking for ideas of how to not have to take this drastic course of action...


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

In most of my tanks the gravel drifts down through the substrate and ends up on the bottom. 
My local soil does not work (too much clay, and does not settle down) so I am using other materials. 
If the disturbance does not cloud your water too much try lifting the pebbles up through the soil, not vacuum away the soil. Ultimately you would be removing most of the soil! Hopefully as the soil matures it will sort of glue itself together with all the microorganisms and the gravel will sit on top. 

I do not use gravel as a cap, but just as decoration, a handful or two here and there as if the rushing water from the river deposited it in certain places and washed it away from other places. I pull it back up whenever I replant.


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## aquabillpers (Apr 13, 2006)

There are a number of opinions as to what makes the best substrate in a NPT.

All agree that there should be some kind of "soil" at the bottom, and most (but not all) cap it with gravel to keep the soil from muddying the water.

My approach is to start with cheap, unenriched bagged top soil. I soak it for a few weeks, changing the water several times. I put about a half inch of this in the bottom of the new tank, add (very carefully) about an inch of 2mm - 3mm gravel, add water, and plant heavily.

I do get a little algae but never enough to worry me, and what I get is easily managed. My main problem is that the plants grow too fast, and I don't like to prune. The result isn't pretty. 

As I said, others take somewhat different approaches and are successful.

Good luck.

Bill


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Your plants look great! Whatever your algae issues are now, this tank looks like a "keeper".

Sometimes an organic soil, which is lighter than gravel or sand, can migrate up to the top. [That's what happened in my recent setup of a 50 gal.] It also could be that you've got some harmless aquatic worms. I'm not sure that I would be concerned. I've run tanks without any gravel layer without problems. Just think of the natural sediments where aquatic plants grow.

You don't say when you set up your tank? If its within the last 3-6 months, a little algae is not unusual. I suspect that the soil you used was fairly nutrient-rich.

I would be patient and enjoy what you have.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

adding clay to the soil might help this settling problem?
if the soil is dense enough or the clay binds the soil, the gravel or sand might not settle through the soil.


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## Rusalka (Jun 11, 2008)

This one is for those who don't use a gravel to cap their soil. Do you think bare soil would be bad for bottom feeders like kuhli loaches? Even my guppies like to pick food off the bottom. I'm interested in trying this in my next tank.


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## tames (Apr 18, 2008)

I have a tank that only has soil at the bottom (15 gallon). It has been setup for about 5 years, and all the gravel went to the bottom. The water is always muddy looking since the fish seem to love to stir it up. This is a species only tank with a nice colony of very active Limia tridens. The fish are thriving so I just leave it the way it is. I used cheap plain topsoil in this tank.


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