# Survival rate from LFS?



## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

Just trying to get an idea if I'm doing things right because I've had a couple fish pass on me.
A few weeks ago I decided to change my bass tank to a community tank.
So I've bought 7 glowligths, 3 corys, 8 ottos and 20 ghost shrimp.

Within three days one glowlight died. One of my ghost shrimp died about one day after putting him in. Three days ago I bought a couple more corys and now it looks like one is about to die. 
All 8 ottos seem to be eating well with fat bellies.

I've been doing at least weekly water changes of 30%, after the glowlight died, I did daily water changes for a few days just in case of ick or the such.
My Ammonia and nitrite read zero, the pH at 8.0, temp at 70 (I don't have a heater in it) and KH at 12 degrees.

I put the new fish in a container and over a couple hours slowly added water from my tank.

Far as plants and such, you can find them on my journal 
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/35886-my-55-river-rock-journal.html?

Does it look like I'm doing any thing wrong?
Thanks
Philip


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## anonapersona (Mar 11, 2004)

*clean gravel?*

did you clean the gravel really really well prior to restocking? Cories are sensitive to nasty gravel. Particularly if the gravel is sharp, like most is. I always had a hard time keeping them for very long, and I attribute it to lack of gravel cleaning in the planted tank.

Also, the pet store is always suspect. Most have large combined filtration systems so that any disease brought in with new fish is rapidly spread to all tanks. Find out how the store handles new fish. If they float the bag in an existing tank, then dump the contents into the tank, you are probably seeing diseases. If they keep a single tank of a species and contain new shipments in separate tanks until they are healthy, you get healthier fish.


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

I have a sand bottom and I've had plants in this tank for years so there is tons of plant debris left over. If this is bad for coryies, then this could for sure be the problem.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

I have good survival rates from our LFS, but I look the fish over very carefully before buying to be sure they are healthy, active, don't have sunken bellies or spinal deformities, and that there aren't other sick fish in the tank.
Not that that's going to mean you aren't going to bring something back into your tank, so a q-tank is always recommended.

One thing that jumps out at me is your not having a heater. They really like it warmer than 70, and if they were weak to start with, that is going to stress them more.

Also, you could have pockets of anaerobic bacteria in your substrate if you don't vacuum it, and with the Cory's poking around in it, they may have released some of the gasses into the tank and that's hard on all fish.
IMO, tons of plant debris isn't a good thing either, since it's going to break down and pollute the tank.
Even if you don't do a deep vacuuming, you should at least skim over the surface to remove the excess debris.

What are your nitrate readings in the tank?


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## anonapersona (Mar 11, 2004)

One last thing, I've heard a lecture by the owner of one fish store in town who says that city water is not fit to raise fish in, he runs the entire store on RO water. Adding that to a story I just heard about a local dry cleaner who was caught many years ago dumping excess chemicals into a ditch and thus polluting an entire neighborhood that depends on well water... and served no jail time at all. And one other fish keeper that was instructed by the store to run all water though a carbon filter prior to use -- I bought her fish and while she had some fish 12 years old, they died in my tank, I was not using that filter each time.

So. while you do need to clena up that tank quite a lot, you might also invest in a $17 RV water filter from Walmart for water changes. I have gone back to using it, now that I have only 2 tanks.


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

anonapersona said:


> Adding that to a story I just heard about a local dry cleaner who was caught many years ago dumping excess chemicals into a ditch and thus polluting an entire neighborhood that depends on well water... and served no jail time at all.


This is so odd you mention this, the dry cleaners is "Bell Cleaners" and the subdivision is where I live. The state checks our water every three months, but our well has not come up contaminated, even though houses fairly close by have been tested positive. Because I've only had two fish out of 18 die, its hard to put blame on the water conditions. Maybe not having a heater might be a bigger factor, since the fish died within three days of me getting them. Guess the one positive thing about living in Houston, just wait a week before buying any more fish because it will be back in the 80's 

Thanks again for "yalls" suggestions
Philip


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

anonapersona said:


> So. while you do need to clena up that tank quite a lot, you might also invest in a $17 RV water filter from Walmart for water changes. I have gone back to using it, now that I have only 2 tanks.


Not to veer off topic too much, but do the RV filters have a faster flow rate than the ones made for the kitchen, like PUR? I don't need it for freshwater, but I do run my water through it for the salt tanks, and it takes forever to get a bucket filled.

I'm glad that dry cleaner guy wound up in jail. How horrible....


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## anonapersona (Mar 11, 2004)

*RV filter*

The flow rate is OK, really good at first, then slows until I finally replace it. I guess I replace every 2 or 3 months, but then I was filling two discus tanks weekly and the planted tank less often for a total of 80 to 100 gallons or more through it a week. For $17 I think it is worth it.

And I heard the dry cleaner got a slap on the wrist, no jail at all.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

anonapersona said:


> The flow rate is OK, really good at first, then slows until I finally replace it. I guess I replace every 2 or 3 months, but then I was filling two discus tanks weekly and the planted tank less often for a total of 80 to 100 gallons or more through it a week. For $17 I think it is worth it.


Thanks for the info. That sounds better than what I'm using now. 



anonapersona said:


> And I heard the dry cleaner got a slap on the wrist, no jail at all.


Oops, I misread that. That's a shame....


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## eklikewhoa (Jul 24, 2006)

Seems as though your PH and KH is pretty high. 

But personally what I do with most LFS fish is when I see them in the store i make a mental note and come back a week later to see if they are still alive or how if they still seem peppy! Most places get the buy in bulk mass produced fishes which usually dont take well to all the transitioning/moving and will die and if you happen to be in the store the day of or day after you add more stress onto the fish taking them home. 

Where are you in Houston? Village Tropical and Fish Ranch usually have healthy fish.


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

You mentioned ammonia and nitrite are zero, but what about nitrate?
Fish can suffer if moved into high nitrate conditions from low nitrate ones. Just a suggestion!


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

Far as what a happened to the owner of Bell Cleaners, he died shortly after the discovery. Guess the stress got to him.
Environmental News Network - Today's News Full Story

And according to a article put out by Rice, most dry cleaners containment the ground water, so if you must use a dry cleaners, there are a few who are environmentally friendly. In that they don't use the very nasty chemical that most do, this chemical will stay in the ground water for hundreds of years. They say its very toxic also, so now I have to ask, why would you want to wear cloths that have been washed in it?
Rice University | News & Media


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

eklikewhoa said:


> Seems as though your PH and KH is pretty high.
> 
> But personally what I do with most LFS fish is when I see them in the store i make a mental note and come back a week later to see if they are still alive or how if they still seem peppy! Most places get the buy in bulk mass produced fishes which usually dont take well to all the transitioning/moving and will die and if you happen to be in the store the day of or day after you add more stress onto the fish taking them home.
> 
> Where are you in Houston? Village Tropical and Fish Ranch usually have healthy fish.


I use to love going into Village Tropical back in the years, this how I got started with my planted tank, they use to have a bunch of fully planted show tanks set up. This is back when they had an entire room called the "cichlid room"

Unfortunately I live on the north west side of town, I'm not sure where fish ranch is located but I think its also on the south side of town?
I will pay closer attention to the fish I'm buying.

My Nitrate tested around 5 ppm, what does this mean?


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## eklikewhoa (Jul 24, 2006)

From the readings it means you have pretty much perfect, cycled tank. 


Fish ranch is on the SW side of town and Village is suppose to be moving into a much bigger place so hopefully we will see more of everything!


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

This is good to hear, I've always thought Village was one of the best fish stores in Houston.


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## JanS (Apr 14, 2004)

anonapersona said:


> you might also invest in a $17 RV water filter from Walmart for water changes. I have gone back to using it, now that I have only 2 tanks.


Thank you for the tip on that! 

I picked one up last weekend and the flow rate is about 100 times faster than the one's for the kitchen faucet.

If you're so inclined, you could even use it with a Python, where that wouldn't work with the others.


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## Philip C (Jan 1, 2007)

By the way I a good deal of fish from Dan at GulfCoastDiscus.com and my survival rate is 100%, much better results than I've had from my LFS. Dan has very healthy fish and I think this has a large part of the survival rate.
Philip


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