# going topless with cats?



## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

Hi everyone!
We recently purchased the new Satellite Plus PRO for our 40g. bowfront. Currently we have a generic aquarium hood with the lights on top of the clear top. There is half a roll of duct tape sealing the lid of the hood. We have a ... drum roll... naughty cat. He likes to go fishing when I am not around. He has gotten quite good... sadly. He can steal a neon in under 10 seconds. 


I want to go topless ~ yep should have seen hubby's face when I announced that one 

has anyone been successful with open top lighting and cats? 

Photo of said perp... caught red handed.


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## BruceF (Aug 5, 2011)

My experience is that it all depends on the cat. One cat we had would try to catch every fish he saw. One day he started leaping off the bed at the tank, smashing his head against the glass. Next day he was on top of the tank trying to reach inside. Another cat we had would drink from the tanks and never even seemed to notice the fish inside.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

BruceF said:


> My experience is that it all depends on the cat. One cat we had would try to catch every fish he saw. One day he started leaping off the bed at the tank, smashing his head against the glass. Next day he was on top of the tank trying to reach inside. Another cat we had would drink from the tanks and never even seemed to notice the fish inside.


As can be seen by the photo I was not blessed with an "indifferent to fish" kind of cat 
i was hoping someone with my same issue came up with a solution (which does not include hurting said cat) so we can have a topless tank for the lights without the massacre of neons. Acts of genocide have occurred and I want to prevent future generations from the same fate.


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## TropTrea (Jan 10, 2014)

I have not had cats in some time now. However when I had I never encountered one going fishing. They all used to love watching the fish for hours on end and occasionally trying to catch them through the glass which was funny to watch. Nope I never had tops on my tanks other than Canopies which were more decorative than anything else. Basicly a frame around the tank with couple rails on the ends to hold the lights higher above the water surface.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

I have had an open top for almost 5 years. 3 cats, never any problem with them trying to go fishing. When a fish leaps out though, there's always a cat there to tell me.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

You could try using a screen.
BulkReefSupply has a kit:
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/diy-aquarium-screen-top-kits-1-4-netting.html

Or just the netting if you have the tools/parts:
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/clear-netting.html

How-To video





This wouldn't give you the full, open top look/feel. But it may be a compromise that works.


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

BB gun.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

Hi jrill, 
For the most part, people here like animals (especially cats if they are watching this thread) and don't think shooting a cat with a BB gun is funny in the least.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

vancat said:


> Hi jrill,
> For the most part, people here like animals (especially cats if they are watching this thread) and don't think shooting a cat with a BB gun is funny in the least.


Thank you. I volunteer with one of the top cat rescue groups in our country. I heal and raise kittens who have indeed been shot with BB guns along with many other abuses. If you stay up all night holding a 2 week old kitten, feeding it from a bottle and wrapping its wounds due to being target practice that kind of thing .. yeah not funny... and I am usually a funny kind of person

If you look at the photo (taken when he first started this new fishing hobby) he is in the process of flipping the little front lid up. Once he gets it up he will jump up on the top and stick his paws in.

Rome (said naughty cat) had one of the worst starts in life. It was bad... really bad. Due to this he does not like people... who could blame him. While working with him he and I developed a strong bond. I am mama cat and he adopted me. I don't have foster fails but he is my foster fail. 
I just wish the cat of my heart was better behaved! He flips the lid of the hood up and goes fishing. Duct tape is working right now but I want the pretty topless look. I might try a screen though.

Thanks for that screen idea!


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

My fosters are great with the tank. they like to sit and watch. it is fun watching them try to catch the fish through glass. Sadly Rome, the beastie from hell, is way too smart for his own good! 

Here are pics of my last fosters, chicken Nugget and Tokyo (both adopted to GREAT homes), playing with the fish.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

those are some cute kittens.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

About a year ago, my wife convinced me to have us start fostering cats too. I love me a cat (except the hairless, I only like them). I thought we were weird doing this, I'm glad there are some others out there doing it too.


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

vancat said:


> Hi jrill,
> For the most part, people here like animals (especially cats if they are watching this thread) and don't think shooting a cat with a BB gun is funny in the least.


Oh lighten up for gosh sakes. Nobody in their right mind thinks I was serious or thought the op would do it.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

oh, I didn't think you were serious.


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

vancat said:


> oh, I didn't think you were serious.


OK then. Sorry if I made you feel bad.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

vancat said:


> those are some cute kittens.


Thank you! Fostering is something my entire family loves doing! Granted it can be really really hard at times but the successes make it worth while. A couple of my kittens have been adopted by NFL players ... and noooooo not Vick HA HA HA good NFL guys 

We only foster 1 litter at a time because we believe the babies need as much attention as possible to make for great pets. Besides fostering though I help out by taking photos of the kittens we have available to adopt. I am not a professional photographer but long time hobbyist.

jrill, I didn't know you and aren't familiar with your personality. Sadly there are millions of people who would have posted what you did and were serious  there are so many out there that are cat haters and would love to play target practice on them. I see it alot. Sorry if you were kidding around, I didn't know.

This baby was found in a bucket of recycled motor oil at the dump. Someone threw him and his siblings in the oil to drown them and left. This little guy held on, scratched his eyes horribly due to the oil burning them. He clung to life on the side of the bucket, body burning and sore from the oil hitting flea bite areas. He was 4 weeks old. 
Thank goodness someone found him! My family raised him and healed his wounds. It was NOT easy! Some people really suck, ya know?

On a happy note this little man healed up and was adopted by a VERY VERY nice family. He lives in a million dollar house with 4 cat condos to himself... he is spoiled rotten. No this is not one of my fosters that went with an NFL player =)

Just the right photo does wonders for these little guys  hard to say "no" to this


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## THE V (Jul 3, 2009)

A topless tank thread converts to one about pussycats... so many jokes that would end in banning...


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

THE V said:


> A topless tank thread converts to one about pussycats... so many jokes that would end in banning...


Lol.


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## vancat (Nov 5, 2004)

guess I'll unfollow this thread now.


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## Michael (Jul 20, 2010)

Stop the anti-cat and suggestive jokes.

To return to the original subject of this thread, you have a cat with a high prey drive, and the fishing skills to go with it. I think you will need to keep a sturdy hood or canopy on the tank.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

Michael said:


> Stop the anti-cat and suggestive jokes.
> 
> To return to the original subject of this thread, you have a cat with a high prey drive, and the fishing skills to go with it. I think you will need to keep a sturdy hood or canopy on the tank.


Thanks. 
I did some more reading ... oh so much reading since I started this tank. Anyway, I am going to go to the pet store and buy one of the screens they use to house reptiles in aquariums. They are a metal screen mesh. I can duct tape this screen and the holes are small enough so he can't get his paws through and more importantly SNAG the screen with a stray claw. The duct tape will detract attention away from the plants but not as much as a cat swimming in said tank would 
It won't be a fully topless lighting job but still better than a hood i would think.

My hope is after he sees the screen, tries unsuccessfully a few 100 times to open it he will get bored and leave the tank alone. Once he stops trying to break in I can sneak the screen off without his noticing.


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## wrenn420 (May 17, 2014)

Are we talking about cats or aquariums here?


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## PhilipS (Jan 14, 2014)

Screens and glass tops may encourage climbing and sitting.

Your husband should be happy you choose to go topless. One less area to dust off every week.

My 12 gallon long is a very expensive water dish for my Bengal girl. Doesn't harass the fish.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

wrenn420 said:


> Are we talking about cats or aquariums here?


cats getting into the tanks and stealing fish so really BOTH as is stated on the title.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

webskipper said:


> Screens and glass tops may encourage climbing and sitting.
> 
> Your husband should be happy you choose to go topless. One less area to dust off every week.
> 
> My 12 gallon long is a very expensive water dish for my Bengal girl. Doesn't harass the fish.


The store didn't have the size I needed. I may end up having to order it. I think it will work because if he can't get into the tank he will eventually get bored and find something else to get into.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

I would think a reptile lid would block too much light.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

Tugg said:


> I would think a reptile lid would block too much light.


I can't find one to fit my tank anyhow.

I am in the process of brain storming plan B. I am thinking of getting a sheet of plexiglass and having dear old hubby cut a hole in the plexiglass the size and shape of my light. That way the light can get to the plants unfiltered and the fish will be safe from cats. I am working how to make sure the light doesn't slip into the tank if a human dork or cat dork accidentally moves it the wrong way. I am thinking about those light mounts on the back of the tank but not sure as then cat would go ice fishing through the unprotected hole.

He is the smarted but most misbehaved cat on earth... which is sad as I train cats and dogs for the SPCA HA HA


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

We finally found a solution. I don't know why I didn't think of it before. We cut out the plexiglass insert that came with the hood and put the LED light on that hole and secured to the tank rather than the hood. I know can go topless with confidence


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

A better shot with the night time setting on.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

light with "sunset" on.


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

The tank does look very nice. How long has it been set up? I am going to guess not very long. Seems like a lot of light. Do you know what PAR that is.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

jrill said:


> The tank does look very nice. How long has it been set up? I am going to guess not very long. Seems like a lot of light. Do you know what PAR that is.


I set it up 2 months ago but only started adding plants a month ago. I am not sure of all the lingo so what is PAR?

The LED system is the Satellite Plus PRO. It does all kinds of cool light effects. As I said on another post I wish I could say I added the light for plant health or for scientific reasons... I just thought it was cool as hell in my living room. It does lighting for storms as well!

They have suggested presets for different type of aquariums. For the heavily planted tank they have a full spectrum very bright light. They also have a preset sunrise and sunset so you can change the intensity of light all day long.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

Here is a video about it if your interested.

I am not endorsing anything, or sell anything. Hell I am not even sure if there is anything wrong with using that bright of light as I am a newbie. HOWEVER my tank is in my family room where everyone lingers. Due to this I am very watchful of aesthetics as well as hobby. I don't want wires, tubes or bulky equipment hanging everywhere when people come over. This light is super thin and looks great. Great conversation piece.


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## jrill (Nov 20, 2013)

PAR is a measure of light that is usable by the plants. Different than say lumens which is what we see. Do a Google search on your light and you should find it. PAR is a good tool to help determine if and when you will need CO2 and ferts. If you go high light and CO2 do yourself a favor and research EI (estimative index). Live by it and simplify your tank life. There is also a guide for ei low tech which is cheaper in the long run than using bottled products.


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

jrill said:


> PAR is a measure of light that is usable by the plants. Different than say lumens which is what we see. Do a Google search on your light and you should find it. PAR is a good tool to help determine if and when you will need CO2 and ferts. If you go high light and CO2 do yourself a favor and research EI (estimative index). Live by it and simplify your tank life. There is also a guide for ei low tech which is cheaper in the long run than using bottled products.


it has [email protected] 12" 36, 
PAR 18": 28, 
PAR @24" 21


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## jrIL (Apr 23, 2005)

A user who goes by Hoppy has done some good useful writing on par. below is taken from some of his work. I have found it to be a very helpful guideline.

Low light – 15-30 micromols of PAR – CO2 is not needed, but is helpful to the plants
Medium light – 35-50 micromols of PAR – CO2 may be needed to avoid too many nuisance algae problems
High light – more than 50 micromols of PAR – pressurized CO2 is essential to avoid major algae problems


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## praline3001 (Dec 29, 2014)

jrIL said:


> A user who goes by Hoppy has done some good useful writing on par. below is taken from some of his work. I have found it to be a very helpful guideline.
> 
> Low light - 15-30 micromols of PAR - CO2 is not needed, but is helpful to the plants
> Medium light - 35-50 micromols of PAR - CO2 may be needed to avoid too many nuisance algae problems
> High light - more than 50 micromols of PAR - pressurized CO2 is essential to avoid major algae problems


The tank did start getting some brown algae this week. I was dosing 1/2 dose of excel as I always side with caution when it comes to my houseplants. After reading a VERY LONG thread here on Excel I dosed 2x the daily yesterday and again today. The brown stuff is almost gone and whats there is dying off. I have been reading up on co2 and most likely will add that to the tank setup. I just want to makes sure I know what I am doing before i do it!


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## TAB (Feb 7, 2009)

i have a cat with on;y 3 working legs, she likes to drink out of it, every once in awhile she will fall in ( always at night) its a loud splash .


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## abrooks12376 (Jul 22, 2014)

The satellite plus pro is far stronger than its baby brother. The par values provided earlier are for the plus not pro. The pro is more like 100 @ 12". Algae farm territory if not properly set up


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## AEWHistory (Jul 6, 2008)

Tugg said:


> I would think a reptile lid would block too much light.


Do you mean one of those lids that is a metal mesh screen inside a metal frame that fits over the aquarium top? I think that's a reptile lid, but I'm not sure. If that's what it is, why would that block too much light? Granted, the mesh will block some light, but the holes in the mesh are pretty big overall, no? If I get a chance I will experiment with this on one of my 5s. I have a 5G cover like this and could see if there is much difference to the eye (I don't have a PAR meter).


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## TropTrea (Jan 10, 2014)

jrIL said:


> A user who goes by Hoppy has done some good useful writing on par. below is taken from some of his work. I have found it to be a very helpful guideline.
> 
> Low light - 15-30 micromols of PAR - CO2 is not needed, but is helpful to the plants
> Medium light - 35-50 micromols of PAR - CO2 may be needed to avoid too many nuisance algae problems
> High light - more than 50 micromols of PAR - pressurized CO2 is essential to avoid major algae problems


I don't know if I would compare light levels to algae growth. Algae is more of a product of excessive nutriments in the tank which the plants cannot use up fast enough. However different levels of lighting are needed by different plants. Think if the plants are native to open shallow pools near the equator where they get loads of sun or are the plants live in small pools in the triple canopy jungle where they get very little light in nature.

CO2 is is another thing that may or may not be correlated to lighting levels. If you have a plant that requires a PAR of 50+ to survive the addition of CO2 will help it survive at 75 PAR and it will grow faster. But it will not reduce algea if all your your plants require only a PAR in the 20's.

Personaly when I did reef tanks I aimed for PAR reading in the 100+ range at the substrate. Now that I have switched to fresh water planted tanks again I finding that the ideal is the closer I nan get to 50 PAR withouth going over by much. But more important than PAR is the balance of the light spectrum. Plants need red and blue light yet PAr also measures green light the advantages of PAR over Lumens is that LUMENS wrights green light heavier than red and blue because the human eye is more sensitive to green light.

But the fact is this thread started on how to keep cats from eating fish how did we get to discussing lighting needs?


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## PhilipS (Jan 14, 2014)

So how is your cat treating your tank this week? Pic taken moments after she was caught slurping tank water. Hey, anything to avoid a girl getting a UTI.


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## Jane in Upton (Aug 10, 2005)

Hey Praline,

if you decide to go with a clear acrylic or plexiglass top for the whole tank, rather than the top that came with it, there are some clips that are clear plastic, onto which the acrylic/plexi lid sits. I think I got some from AquaVibrant (Finnex) direct online shop, but there are several places which have them. They're intended for rimless tanks, but perhaps your industrious hubby could fashion something similar for your bowfront. Do a search on Aquarium (or Fish Tank) Cover Clip, and you'll come up with some images to get the idea across. 

I've found this look to be almost as nice as an open-top tank. That said, I'm not sure if they would hold the weight of a cat if he were to get on top of it. Your cat looks like he might have some Bengal in him, or maybe its just the active stance in your "red-handed" photo. 

I keep a nano tank on the dining room sideboard purposefully uncovered, as our rescue calico likes it far better than any water in a ... *shudder* bowl. Also, I think adding Equilibrium (Calcium and Magnesium GH booster) makes our low pH, very soft well water more palatable to her. 

I can relate to your not wanting to subject the fish to such a GreatStripedHunter. Sheesh, I've never heard of a cat catching neons, especially in such a large tank. 

-Jane

ps - thank you for your service to rescue; our 2nd cat Boris ('meezer) was helped SO much by his foster, and we're forever grateful for all she did for him. He was a mess when he came in to rescue - still has residual emotional baggage, but he's some so very, very far. He's learning to be a pampered housecat.


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## dirtmonkey (Mar 12, 2007)

I've been thinking about this lately too. I want to set up a 40B open top with pendant lights and some emergent growth. My cat doesn't do more than watch the fish, because as soon as his paw touches water he jerks it back and licks it all off; but he messes with the hoses and cords and anything else in his way when he tries getting in to drink. 

I used to have a motion detector hooked up to a sprinkler to keep raccoons out of a backyard pond (after they had several very expensive sushi dinners). It did help with them some, and all the cats started staying far away. I've wondered if something hanging over the tank that works in a similar way could do the trick. Just the hiss and drops from a small mister nozzle would probably stop my cat from getting up on the tank and not make a big mess.

I think a small powerhead wouldn't tax one of those floodlight motion detectors, and I could mist the above water growth with a wave of the hand...


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