# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Quiet cooling fan (80 mm, 92 mm, etc)



## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

*UPDATE: Go down about 10 or 11 posts and look at hte discussion from there on. That's where the Silencer 80mm fan was first posted. SOmeone bought it and it's quieter than anyone could probably have imagined.*

After looking at another thread whihc wanted a quieter cooling fan, I reembered back in my days of car audio that they created a fan to suit the bill. I found an example of hte style of fan here:

http://www.electronixwarehouse.com/car/accessories/fans.htm

I am currently trying to find dB levels on these fans as compared to others and will post links when I find them.

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

[This message was edited by kherman on Tue May 20 2003 at 11:02 AM.]

[This message was edited by kherman on Fri May 23 2003 at 07:44 PM.]

[This message was edited by kherman on Sun July 27 2003 at 02:37 PM.]


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

*UPDATE: Go down about 10 or 11 posts and look at hte discussion from there on. That's where the Silencer 80mm fan was first posted. SOmeone bought it and it's quieter than anyone could probably have imagined.*

After looking at another thread whihc wanted a quieter cooling fan, I reembered back in my days of car audio that they created a fan to suit the bill. I found an example of hte style of fan here:

http://www.electronixwarehouse.com/car/accessories/fans.htm

I am currently trying to find dB levels on these fans as compared to others and will post links when I find them.

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

[This message was edited by kherman on Tue May 20 2003 at 11:02 AM.]

[This message was edited by kherman on Fri May 23 2003 at 07:44 PM.]

[This message was edited by kherman on Sun July 27 2003 at 02:37 PM.]


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Found a bunch of them made by Stinger. I still am having trouble finding dB levels though









http://www.stingerelectronics.com/sting_products/fans.asp

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## aquaTony (Apr 5, 2003)

Hi,

I'm new to this group, and relatively new to high tech planted tanks. Anyway, when I bought my light strip 6 months ago the fan was quite annoying and I pulled it out quickly. My intention was to replace it with a quite one, but I haven't gotten around to it. I'm sure I'm buring through my bulbs quicker than I should.

Anyway, my reason for posting, you might want to consider some PC fans. When I did a search 5 months ago on Google I was able to find quite a bit of information regarding noise levels and reviews of fans. There is quite a bit of interest in noise levels for PC fans and it is increasing as people are building PC to use with home theather setups. You don't want a noisy fan while you are watching some great drama sceen with your wife.

I'm interested in what you find as it is getting warmer in my house and I'll need to cool off the top of the tank soon or it will get too warm.

Later,
Tony

P.S. Please excuse an spelling or other mistakes. This was a quick write.


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## Doomer (Feb 2, 2003)

Get one with a rheostat then you can find a happy medium between max cooling and max noise.


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## Ptahkeem (Feb 16, 2004)

if youre looking for quiet fans why not consider computer case fans? there are some computer modding websites out there that list the db levels of the fans that theyre selling and the amount of air movement they make. one of the websites is sidewindercomputers and plycon. im not exactly sure if the sizes are what youre looking for but just to give you an idea an 120mm fan is a little bigger than a audio cd. hope this helps.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

You can get really good PC fans in both DC and AC. I would caution you to double check the noise levels. there is good information on the net for most fan manufacturers.

One note is that larger fans push a much larger amount of air. A 120mm fan can replace 4 80mm fans, but you have to be carefula bout the noise.

I am curently running a 120mm set up to a dimmer switch. By lowering the speed 1/3, the fan is 60% quieter. I use it to remove the heat from 330w of light in a semi open hood. When blowing onto the water it can lower the water temp by 10F compared to without it.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

How would you hook up those PC fans to a normal outlet? Would you hook them up to the ballast? How did you hook up a dimmer on the fans? The fans there listed on these two web sites


> quote:
> 
> one of the websites is sidewindercomputers and plycon


 came with a three pin hole adapter? How does this hook up to the ballast? I have the AHsupply ballasts. I am not very electrical smart. And would two 120mm fans be enough to cool down PC on a 100gallon tank? Thanks


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## Heady (Mar 4, 2003)

AH Supply didn't Supply a cooling fan with my 2 sets of 2x55W lights. Do I need a cooling fan? If so, can I attach it somehow to the ballasts for power? I have no idea how this would work and I'm fresh out of outlets. The lights will be mounted 5" above my 100 gallon acrylic tank.

6 outlets available - 2 heaters, 2 filters, 2 ballasts. No more outlets...








Please help.


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## walpurgis999 (Feb 6, 2003)

Its not possible to connect a PC fan to a normal outlet. PC fans do not run at 120V like normal outlet.

Im an English teacher in school, not in this forum. Hence, I spell, you spell, we all spell bad.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

You shouldn't hook them up to your ballast. The ballast makes a lot of changes to power the lights. You wouldn't want to connect the fans into it.

To power PC fans all you need is a small 12vdc power supply. Radio shack is the best place to look. It should only cost $8-14.

120VAC fans could be hooked into into your electrical power anywhwere. To egin with I just attached a two-wire appliace cord to it and plugged it into a power strip. Later I got a light dimmer for it. I can only drop the power about 40% of the fan does not start, but 30% will drop the noise by 50% and still provide hugh air movement.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

I think I've found a VERY quiet fan!

It's been decribed as whisper quiet.

The stats:
75 mA current draw
27 CFM of air flow
*20 dB* sound level.
runs on 12 volts.

Costs $8 each. That's a very good price.

So, what model is it?

Silencer 80mm Cooling Fan

Only took me a week to find!

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I think my AC is around 140cfm, but 45-50db.

Most PC fans are around 38db (I think). THe quietest are ones with ball bearing shafts.

If I rebuild my hood I would get 6 of the 80mm model and put one at the base of each light. Maybe alternate a few in and the rest out.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

Okay, i just ordered three of these fans 92 mm Fans, the guy told me that I had to hook them up to a 12VDC battery if I wanted to use with AC power and not the computer. James, you said


> quote:
> 
> To power PC fans all you need is a small 12vdc power supply. Radio shack is the best place to look. It should only cost $8-14.


 Now I looked at radio shack and this is what I found 12V AC to DC  and 13.5/30v AC to DC are these what you meant. And if so, to power three of these fans, i would need one 12v adapter, and one 13.5/30v adapter? Or can I hook them all on one adapter? Is this correct. Thanks and are they pretty easy to wire up?


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

When purchasing a power supply, you have two things to worry about.
1) voltage
2) current draw.

So, the transformer you get from Radio Shack has to be able to do the following.
1) Supply the proper voltage
2) Be capable of supplying enough current.

In your case, you need a power supply that meets the following requirments:
1) Supplies 12 volts DC.
2) Supplies a minimum of 255 mA (3*85 mA)

So, something like this:
12V/1000mA AC-to-DC Power Adapter
will fit the bill perfectly.

If you choose a different model, be sure that it is capable of supplying 12 volts and atleast 255 mA of current(1000 mA in the adapter I pointed out).

An idea is to get a variable voltage adapter. Something that rates 3-12 volts and atleast 255 mA. That way, you can run the fans slightly slower by selecting 10.5 volts (this would be quieter, but it also moves much less air this way).

And of course, when you get this working, please let us know if these fans are as they are rumored.

Karl



> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> Okay, i just ordered three of these fans http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/alarmandaccesories/silencerfan/index.htm, the guy told me that I had to hook them up to a 12VDC battery if I wanted to use with AC power and not the computer. James, you said
> ...


 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

In regards on how to hook the fans up, use one adapter only! You can hook all three fans up to the one adapter. Since you seem new to this, the adapter I recomended in my previous post is more than adequate(sp?). I can save you a buck or two if you'd like by recomending a diffferent adapter. With the adapter I recomended, you could easily run 10 of the fans off of it (due to the current rating of 1000 mA), so adding in the future isn't much of an issue.

I'm not sure exactly how much you know about electronics, so let us know and we should be able to walk you through figuring out what wires go where. Some cutting of wires will be involved.



> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> Okay, i just ordered three of these fans http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/alarmandaccesories/silencerfan/index.htm, the guy told me that I had to hook them up to a 12VDC battery if I wanted to use with AC power and not the computer. James, you said
> ...


 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

*In regards to the 80 mm fan*
I managed to track an owner down that is an audiophile. I forgot to post the correspondance earlier, so here it is:

I asked:
[/QUOTE] Hi,

I'm trying to track down a "quiet" cooling fan. my number one concern is dB levels.

You used the Silencer 80mm Cooling Fans and which is listed as a 20 dB fan.

That's pretty good.

If the fan is on by itself and your say 5 feet away, is it audible?

Do you know if there are any fans out there that are substantially quieter?

Thanks,
Karl
[/QUOTE]

And I got the following response:


> quote:
> 
> I would say it's slightly audible at 5 feet. But that's counting the
> cooling fan AND the power supply to run it. If it's in a cabinet and the
> ...


To avoid confusion, the owner has a PC power supply and one of the 80 mm fans running next to each other. She uses the PC power supply to power the 80 mm fan, and some video game systems (nintendo, etc)

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

Thanks for the advise, so I need to get just one and use it on all three fans. Do I need to install anything else with the adapter? Like a adapter plug that I plug into the fan? I got the three pin connection on the fan.

i will definately give my results of the fans. I am installing them in a canopy that I am building for my 100 gallon tank.

Do you think two fans blowing in, and one fan blowing out would work? I am thinking about installing them in the back of the canopy and have two of them on each side blowing in and one in the middle blowing out. Just a thought. But thanks for the help. I will write if I need help.

Mike

[This message was edited by mkam15 on Thu April 24 2003 at 04:48 PM.]


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> An idea is to get a variable voltage adapter. Something that rates 3-12 volts and atleast 255 mA. That way, you can run the fans slightly slower by selecting 10.5 volts (this would be quieter, but it also moves much less air this way)


Would this be what you are talking about 3/12v 800ma fan

Thanks.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

That's a better power supply than I even expected them to have









DC fans are aeasy to hook up. You can either buy adapter plugs (guess where







) or cut the adapters off and just wire them together. Its really easy. Red to red. Black to black.

I also found a second manufacturer for the fans... vantech

They have the stealth fans at 20db, but also have temperature sensitive fans that run a little noisier
Stealth Vantec 80x80x25mm Smart Fan, Retail Box 

Vantec Thermoflow 80mm Temperature Controlled Fan, Retail Box 

I have almost committed to building a new hood. If so I'll go with these.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

In regards to dB levels. it's been a while, but I almost positive on this. For every 3 dB of increased sound level, the human ear pertains things as twice as loud. So a 23 dB fan is twice as loud as a 20 dB fan. Still, when we're talking about these low levels, it's probably not perceivable.

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> 
> ...


Yes, this is what I was referring to. You can still set it at 12 volts, but you always will have hte flexibility to use a lower voltage like 10.5 volts.

Actually, if you get that model, you'll still have 800 mA which is mor than enough(will still run up to 9 of those fans if you add more later), and you can always drop the voltage to 10.5 volts and you will save about $5 over the model I recomended.

What you selected is better in every way.

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

How you set up the fans is totaly up to you. In my experience, it is best to set all the fans up blowing air out (exhausting). This is a general obpservation though. It truely depends on how you lighting fixtures/canopy are set up.

It really matters where your air leaks are in the canopy. If it's has alot of large air gaps all over the place, I'd put two on one end pulling air out and one fan on the opposite end blowing air in. If the canopy is fairly air tight, I'd put all three on the same end sucking air out and make a hole on the other end that is big enough to easily allow air to enter. Maybe a 4"x4" hole. or 2"x8" hole.

What you really have to do is look at your canopy and figure out how to best get the hot air out of your canopy.

Looking at your proposal, I'd actually do the exact oposite. I'd blow air in from the middle and have the two outside fans pull the air out. An option would be to add a fourth fan (which you could) and have two fans blowing in from the middle and each end having one exhause fan. That way, you would get good air movement and 54 CFM (cubic feet per minute) in and 54 CFM out. This would provide god air movement throughout your canopy.



> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> Thanks for the advise, so I need to get just one and use it on all three fans. Do I need to install anything else with the adapter? Like a adapter plug that I plug into the fan? I got the three pin connection on the fan.
> ...


 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

I am going to have about 5" of open space on the back side of my canopy going across the whole back of the canopy. I was going to place the fans on the back side about 15" apart from one another. This will give circulation throughout my canopy. I don't want the fans on the side of canopy, I don't like how that looks. I also think with the fans in the back, they will be alot quieter then having them on sides. I am going to attach my ballasts to rear of the canopy. The top will fully open so I can get access to the tank. It is going to be 14" high, 12" off the tank with the lights hanging down 5" off the glass. The fans will be blowing directly on the lights and cooling them. I will post pictures when this is complete.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

AAhh, so there is a large opening in the back. 5" by 4 feet (assuming 4 feet due to 15" spacing). I would start by having all the fans actually pushing air into the canopy. That will cause air to circulate throughout the canopy. There will be plenty of gaps in the back to allow the air that is pushed in to be naturally pushed out.

IMHO, having all three fans push air in at the 15" gaps you mention would probably be the best way to keep things cool.

And I agree, keeping them in back will be quieter and more attractive.



> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> I am going to have about 5" of open space on the back side of my canopy going across the whole back of the canopy. I was going to place the fans on the back side about 15" apart from one another. This will give circulation throughout my canopy. I don't want the fans on the side of canopy, I don't like how that looks. I also think with the fans in the back, they will be alot quieter then having them on sides. I am going to attach my ballasts to rear of the canopy. The top will fully open so I can get access to the tank. It is going to be 14" high, 12" off the tank with the lights hanging down 5" off the glass. The fans will be blowing directly on the lights and cooling them. I will post pictures when this is complete.


 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

Well, I just hooked up three 92 mm fansto the 3 to 12V Adapter and I could not even hear them. They are pushing a good amount of air. I did not install them into my hood yet, I am still working on the hood. If I knew that the fans were going to be this quiet, I would have order 2 more. I will keep everyone posted.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by mkam15:
> Well, I just hooked up three http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/alarmandaccesories/silencerfan/index.htmto the http://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F004%5F001%5F001%5F000&product%5Fid=273%2D1667# and I could not even hear them. They are pushing a good amount of air. I did not install them into my hood yet, I am still working on the hood. If I knew that the fans were going to be this quiet, I would have order 2 more. I will keep everyone posted.


This is VERY good news! I'm glad to hear that they are extemely quiet!

 MY Web Page - go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.


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## aquaTony (Apr 5, 2003)

mkam15,

Please be careful when you are putting these fans together. The instructions mentioned here are pretty good, but I'm not clear how much experience you have with wiring and electricity. I don't want to see anyone get hurt. You might want to ask your friends and see if anyone has any experience with wiring, lights, appliances, etc. There is some risk here, not the least of which is electricution (sp?). It is probably impossible to really hurt yourself with 12 volts, but it still exists. There is a much greater risk when working with any wiring that has 120 volts AC. You want to make sure that whenever you are working on the wiring that you have everything unplugged. That means from the wall or battery as well. In addition, you are working in a wet environment, this signficantly increases your risk. You should build and test everything away from you tank. Do NOT wire the lights and fans up while they are on top of the tank. Once you are done, double check your connections and make sure that the are well insulated, (wrapped with electrical tape or other means). If you are unfamiliar with electricity and wiring, please get help. There are more things I could write about safety, but that is for another tread. If you have questions please ask here, but it is your responsibility to decide what is safe, not the people who contribute here

For others that have contributed here, I think you have given solid advice, please feel free to comment about what I have said. I'm not trying to invalidate your contribution, I'm just concerned that there are people that will read this tread and possibly hurt themselves or their fish. 

I appologize for not participating sooner. I've been working some crazy hours finishing a project.

Tony


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Tony,
We're glad to have you here.
I'll add a ditto to what you have reminded us. Reminders are always welcome. Sometimes those of us who have done these things regularly, take it for granted that we take special precautions everytime we do it. Since we comment and not write manuals the reminders should apply to us all.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

Tony, 
Thanks for the advice. I have already worked up and tested the fans. It was actually pretty easy. I have 6 92mm Silencer fans running off a 3 to 12 volt AC/DC adapter with a 800ma rating. I just cuting the adapter off the AC/DC adapter, figure out which was postive and negative, used a conection adaptor and hook all six fans up to the adapter. No problems. I used electrical tape to cover the connections and they work great. No sound, no sparks, no fire. I was pretty impressed on how easy it was. I will post pictures when the hood is completed. Sometime next week. 
Once again, thanks for the advice and concerns.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

It's good to see things coming together for you. So, you upped the total to 6 fans. Nice









The best way to tie the wires together is with wire nuts. YOu can get them really cheap and they are easy to find (Home Depot, etc). Radio shack might have them to.



> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Mike K:
> Tony,
> ...


http://www.geocities.com/kfh227- go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

*I am probably going to start work on my stand for the 100 gallon tank in about 2 weeks(May 22). Pics coming soon







*


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## Mike K (Mar 27, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> So, you upped the total to 6 fans. Nice


Yes I did. I figure that if you can't hear three fans, why not add three more. So I going to have four of fans blowing in, and the two fans that are on the edge of the back blowing out. I am at the stage of sanding and staining the hood. I will post pictures as soon as it is completed.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I too have added 6 of the vantec stealth fans and have the radio shack 800ma converter. The fans a re silent. 
I have 5 of the fans installed and am almost ready to fire them up. I just need to get some more connectors for the final wiring.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Found a fan comparison. Take it with a grain of salt though. This place sels them, so there may be bias. Not to mention that I also don't like the test methodology much.

Anyways, here it is:
fan comparison
They ranked the silencer in 2nd place, so it is somewhat of a vindication









http://www.geocities.com/kfh227- go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

*I am probably going to start work on my stand for the 100 gallon tank in about 2 weeks(May 22). Pics coming soon







*


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Just a note, the 80mm fans are on sale right now. I just bought a dozen for $7.12 each with free shipping.

Moderator










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Rex,

*Good catch!!!* Did you just find this sale while surfing the net?

Anyways, here's a link for everyone:
fan price list

Price for everyone's viewing (80 mm silencer):

Quantity Sale Price Original Price
------------------------------------------
1-3 $7.40/each $10.00/each
4-11 $7.12/each $9.50/each
12-31 $6.98/each $9.30/each
32-99 $6.82/each $9.10/each

*FREE shipping via FedEx Ground!!!!!!!*

Rex, I think you actually paid $6.98 each









Anyways, thanks for the catch! I'm off to order right now!

UPDATE: Just ordered a dozen!!!!! _(







I think this means I officially started my 100+ gallon tank that I'm asking advice for all of the time







)_

http://www.geocities.com/kfh227- go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

*I am probably going to start work on my stand for the 100 gallon tank in about 2 weeks(May 22). Pics coming soon







*

[This message was edited by kherman on Fri May 23 2003 at 07:58 PM.]


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Actually I was going to buy some fans and saw they were on sale. And you are right. I was going to buy 10 and changed it to 12 and did not notice the price drop. It's an awesome price for sure.

Moderator










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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Rex,

I ordered my fans about 9 days ago and they still havn't gotten here. Actually, I havn't even got the typical "we just sent your item" e-mail.

Have you gotten your fans?

Karl

http://www.geocities.com/kfh227- go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

*I am probably going to start work on my stand for the 100 gallon tank in about 2 weeks(May 22). Pics coming soon







*


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Matter of fact I was wondering where my fans are. I may or may not have gotten the email. I have had a little problem with email and it could have gotten lost. I'm going to call them today and see where the fans are. I'm about ready to start cutting on the canopy to mount the fans and it would be nice to have them. For my 55 gallon I'm going to mount two in-flow fans on each end and three exhaust fans in the top. That will give me air flow over each bulb and pull the heat out of the top of the canopy.

Moderator










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Rex!

I got my fans!!! I only have a 9 volt AC/DC converter right now, but I hooked one up and put my ear next to it. I literally heard nothing!!! The wind hitting my ear from 2" away was the only thing that made any noise. *I truely can't beleive how quiet these fans are!* You are going to love them!!!! From about a foot away I couldn't hear a thing.

One side note though:
I could only hook them up to the leads in one way. If I swapped the wires, the fans didn't run. Odd, but if at first you don't succeed, you might want to reverse the polarity.

Take Care,
Karl

http://www.geocities.com/kfh227- go there and see my future fish section to see what I have planned for my next 100+ gallon tank.

*I am probably going to start work on my stand for the 100 gallon tank in about 2 weeks(May 22). Pics coming soon







*


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

My fans were hiding on the porch behind a mat. I have installed seven fans in the canopy of the 55 gallon tank. Two on each end blowing air across the bulbs and three in the top pulling hot air out of the canopy. It was 90 here today and the house got up to 84, normally this would cause the tank to hit at least 86, but the tank is steady at 80. I can live with that.

Moderator










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## Jack11 (Mar 30, 2004)

Karl,
What do you and other electrically smart individuals think about the following set-up. I have purchased eight of the Enermax 80 mm fans for two hoods I am planning to construct. Four will go in one hood and two in another. I am looking for options on AC adaptors. However, I am not very experienced with electronics (set up two AH Supply kits). I don't see information on the ma stats for the Enermax fan. Also, the site for the adaptor states, "adaptor requires 120 volt AC voltage at 60 Hz." Will I meet these requirements with 4 and 2 of these fans? Here are the links:
Enermax Fan
12 Volt DC Power Adaptor

Ah Hah! You're supposed to put the plants IN the water...


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

You should be fine with the comonents you picked although I do not see the actual amerage of the fans. Most fans are 100-200mA. The adapter you have there is 800mA.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
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## McKee (Feb 7, 2003)

The fan's amp requirements are on the sticker on the face of the fan. I have an Enermax here that lists it at .17 amps ("DC12V 0.17A").

These really are great fans, very quiet. I have discovered that the next hood I make will have an extra inch of height to compensate for adding fans later. As it is now, I need to pull the top off the hood and do some creative carving/inletting so it will close over the cover/filter thingies.

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## Jack11 (Mar 30, 2004)

So, what is the relationship between 0.17A and 200mA? Or, 0.17A and the 800mA that my transformer has? Sorry, I'm an electrical buffoon! 
Jack

Ah Hah! You're supposed to put the plants IN the water...


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

.17A = 170mA

Add then up until you are close but not over the total.
4x170=680 <= 800

You can power 4 fans but five would be too many.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Doomer (Feb 2, 2003)

My experience has been that the more air a fan moves, the noisier it is. Simplistic I know but a good rule of thumb.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Jack11:
> So, what is the relationship between 0.17A and 200mA? Or, 0.17A and the 800mA that my transformer has? Sorry, I'm an electrical buffoon!
> ...


Ahhh, just got back from the honeymoon. Do I have to go back to work? The thing I miss the most: "not having to deal with CT drivers". The drive back from the airport wasn't fun at all.

I was going to explain how to do unit covnersion, but for hte purposes of the covnersation, I think the answers prvided are sufficient.

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Karl's Parts And Construction Journal


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## imported_caffeine (Jul 11, 2003)

This is a good thread, but there's a few things I would like to add. I'm a computer geek before aquarium geek, so maybe I can help out for a change









Sound measured in dBA doubles every 6db, not 3. So a fan rated at 30dBA would be twice as loud as a fan rated at 24dBA. Also, multiple fans will of course create more noise than a single fan. Two fans of equal loudness will not double the total but there is still an increase. There's a formula for figuring out total loudness from dBA ratings, but I can't remember it off hand. Anyway, it's hard to tell someone how quiet a fan is, the loudness depends on who is listening to it. At least fans are cheap enough that if you get a few you simply cannot stand, you can replace them with quieter ones relatively cheap.

The rule typically is that the faster a fan spins the louder it is, as well as the larger the fan is the more air it will move. Of course, not all fans are created equal and there are exceptions to this rule. Considering you guys are mounting fans in fairly large canopies and the like, I would go with large (120mm or 92mm) fans that spin slow. They will move more air with less noise than multiple smaller fans (80mm).

Now for the silencer fans, I have a hard time believing those specs. They may really be almost silent and only 20dBA, but they're not moving 27CFM. Maybe 20CFM on a good day. An 80mm fan can't spin at 1600RPM and still flow 27CFM. If you want my personal reccomendation for fans, get some of these: http://www.svc.com/92zalzm.html with the resistor, they flow 38CFM at only 20dbA. I have some of these fans in my computers, I know first-hand that they are some of the absolute best fans you can buy. Also if you don't mind some noise, don't use the resistor and get a lot more airflow (and more noise).

Lastly, if you get fans that have 3 wires coming out and don't know what the white wire is for, it's an RPM monitoring cable. It won't do you any good, so just hack it off. However in a computer they come in handy so if a fan dies you can be notified without having to find out the hard way with an overheating processor







The 12V DC converters from radio shack are the best cheap way to do this, I've done it myself before. Getting one that allows you to change the voltage can come in handy as lowering the voltage will make the fan spin slower and create less noise. This will of course move less air, so you have to comprimise. Also if you have the voltage too low (usually around 1-5V) the fan won't have enough torque to get itself spinning and won't move at all.

I think that's it. Good luck everyone


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

Welcome to the forums!

That fan you pointed out is not bad for the price.

Anyways, from reading up on cooling fans, it seems to me that fan noise is mainly attributed to the ball bearings used. That's the main cause. Beyond that, fan design, air movement, etc comes into play.

I don't know if the statement of CFM rating being directly linked to dB is accurate. Most of the noise caused by air movement is due to the turbulence (or wake) that the fan's propeller causes. A well designed fan blade that moves 50 CFM should be much quieter than an equivilent fan with a poorly designed fan propeller.

Just an opinion though. You seem to have looked into the topic deeply and your input is much appreciated. I should ask around at work. Due to the nature of the business, we probably have researched this topic to death.

When all is said in done, either fan probably will be just fine.

Again, welcome to the forums!
Karl

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Karl's Parts And Construction Journal


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## Jack11 (Mar 30, 2004)

Karl et al,
I have a question on wiring my cooling fans  to this transformer. When I cut the wires on the transformer, what am I wiring to what? I'm a self-admitted electrical moron and ironically also a diy nut. I'd like to get this right and do so safely so, any advice you have would be greatly appreciated.

On another topic. I'm trying to run my lights through a timer as many others do and have done. However, the light power cord has a third, grounding connection/prong. The timer only has connections for two prongs. I have an adaptor to go from three prong to two but, don't know what the risks/consequences of this would be. I have also heard that it is possible to cut the grounding prong off but, this raises the same concerns. Thanks
Jack

Ah Hah! You're supposed to put the plants IN the water...

[This message was edited by Jack11 on Fri July 25 2003 at 01:28 PM.]


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## McKee (Feb 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Jack11:
> I'm trying to run my lights through a timer as many others do and have done. However, the light power cord has a third, grounding connection/prong. The timer only has connections for two prongs. I have an adaptor to go from three prong to two but, don't know what the risks/consequences of this would be. I have also heard that it is possible to cut the grounding prong off but, this raises the same concerns. Thanks


Buy a timer with the 3 prong plug type. Never cut the grounding plug off of a cord!!!! Doing this opens you up to all sorts of electrocution hazards! Without proper grounding a piece of equipment may find your body is the shortest distance to ground. That can be fatal... Even those pesky adapters can cause shocks, so getting the right piece of equipment will reduce your risks substantially.

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## ranchwest (Jul 17, 2005)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Jack11:
> Karl et al,
> ...


OK, I just wired my fans today. I'll tell you what I did, but I admit up front that this is probably overkill.

I went to Radio Shack and bought a Multi-Voltage 800 mA Power Adapter, 273-1667. To keep from cutting the plug off, I bought Adaptaplug 6" Power Leads, 273-1742, which provides "open end" wires, no plug. The Adapter is about $17 and the adaptaplug is supposed to come free with the adapter, but separately it is about $2. I just noticed they charged me the $2.

Next, I bought a 12-Position Barrier Strip Terminal, 274-677, about $5. On one side, I tied in my 5 fans, red in first slot, black in second, repeating that pattern for all 5 fans, 10 slots. In the last two slots, I tied in the leads from the adaptaplug, "red" and then "black" (actually, these are black and black/white, black is "red", black/white is "black").

On the other side of the terminal I wired red to red to red all the way down. Then, black to black to black all the way down.

You'll probably need some red wire and black wire and some wire nuts for the fans farthest from the terminal. I got the wire at RS and got the wire nuts at Ace Hardware for 6 cents each.

With the Multi-Voltage Adapter, you should be able to run the fans on "slow" at 9v and at normal at 12v.

As I said, this is probably overkill, but if you ever need to take a fan off-line, it is very easy to figure out which wire is which. I find it to be organized.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by McKee:
> 
> ...


http://www.deardiary.net/cgi-bin/viewer.cgi?diary=27982&view=welcome&comments=on
[/QUOTE]

....What was previously said and I'll add the following....

If you don't have three pronged outlets at the wall, the adapters are OK to start. If you do have three pronged outlets at the wall, I'd just get the proper timers.

If not, I would highly suggest finding a place to ground the third prong. A copper pipe in your house is a common solution. If you only have 2-pronged wall outlets, just post a reply and i'll elaborate further.

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Karl's Parts And Construction Journal


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Jack11:
> Karl et al,
> ...


Assuming you have one fan..

Cut the "plug" off of the fan leavign the wires whind. One is for monitoring temperaure so it will go unused. I forget which one. I'm pressed for time, but I think someone already said what the color of the unused wire is.

Your AC/DC transformer has two wire left for you to play with. Just hook the two wires up to the fan's wires. If the fan is blowing the oposite direction as desired, just swap the wires.

As a disclaimer, don't wire the fan to the transformer while plugged into the wall. I'll admit I would, but since your a new DIY electrician, do wiring without hte transformer plugged in. You can just twist the wires together and use electrical tape to cover them (that black stretchy rubber-like tape). You could go as far as to solder the wires, but that is overkill. I would recomend that you eventualy use wirenuts to finish off the job.

As a note to the fan and it's three wires. You should be able to figure out which of the wires is teh temp sensor by trial and error. Once the fan is running, the unused wire should be the temp sensor.

Also, some fans will only run in one direction, so keep that in mind.

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Karl's Parts And Construction Journal


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## ranchwest (Jul 17, 2005)

About being able to hear the Silencer 80 fans. I can hear my 5 fans, but they're surprisingly quiet. Of course, I'm changing out the furniture in my living room, so it probably is not as accoustically quiet as many rooms would be because of the empty space.


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## Jack11 (Mar 30, 2004)

Another DIY fan question,
How did those of you who have installed 80 mm fans into your hoods fit them in. The fan itself is about three inches in diameter but the housing is somewhat wider, of course. I thought I would be able to drill out a hole the diameter of the portion of the housing around the fan and pull the housing apart to insert in each side and then attach with screws in the provided holes. But, the housing does not pull apart so, I'm at a loss here. If I drilled out a hole the size of the round inner-portion of the housing, I can't fit the housing through it. But if I cut out a squart to fit the whole housing through, I can't attach it. What have you guys done for this? Thanks.
Jack

The opinions expressed in this post do not reflect those of this member of the forum, the author of this topic, the topic itself, the moderators, the all wet thumb community, the United States of America, or the Human Race itself. They are the opinions of the space monkey shown in my Avatar. He tells me what to write so, blame him. Have a great day.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Jack11:
> Another DIY fan question,
> ...


This really depends on your canopy. I'll assume you are mounting the fans in a visible area on the side of the canopy. Most of these fans have a circle shaped housing. They also have four mounting holes which cause the square shape. I'll be referring to these mounting hole parts that create the square shape as tabs. So each fan typically has 4 tabs on each side for the mounting screws. So 8 tabs total.

Now, two solutions:

1) On the fan itself, cut off 4 tabs on one side of the fan. Be sure to know what direction you want air to be pushed for each fan prior to cutting the tabs off. Cut a hole in the canopy to push the circular housing into. Then screw the fan to the canopy. THis should provide a nice finished look.

2) I've done this for "non-finished" looks for other projects(car audio). If you just want to mount the fan on the inside of the canopy so it is to be unseen, you can just drill many 0.5" holes into the canopy so that the holes cover the area that the fan is to blow air. Then mount hte fan on the inside of the canopy. The fan won't be seen, but the holes are typically unsightly.

I'd personally go the route of (1).



> quote:
> 
> The opinions expressed in this post do not reflect those of this member of the forum, the author of this topic, the topic itself, the moderators, the all wet thumb community, the United States of America, or the Human Race itself. They are the opinions of the space monkey shown in my Avatar. He tells me what to write so, blame him. Have a great day.


HAhahahahhahaahhaah

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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

James,

Could you take a picture of the wiring? I am going to lower my PC light closer to the glasslid (1.5" to glass) and I am not sure if I will need to add fan to the new canopy. The canopy will be fully seal 3 side with an opening in the back for hose and an opening at the top for warm air to rise. (2x 1/2 H "x4" W board to hold the light up instead of full size board for complete seal)

Thanks

72 Gal, 3 WPG PC 10 hour, pressurize co2 /w controller 1 bps, Fluval 404, ph 6.8
A Canadian's Plant Traders website


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## gpodio (Feb 4, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Doomer:
> My experience has been that the more air a fan moves, the noisier it is. Simplistic I know but a good rule of thumb.


I agree. Most PC fans are brushless, have bearings and are pretty well balanced, the majority of the noise is from air turbulance. Speed and blade design are two key players and reducing the speed of the fan using a resistor or variable tripod is the easiest method in my opinion. To make even easier, get a multiple voltage transformer to power the fans. At 12V it will spin them at full speed but if you drop the voltage to say 9V you'll get a slower speed and quieter operation. As long as the current rating is same or higher than the total drawn by the fans. You can also place 2 fans in series to half the speed but you want to test it to make sure they have enough voltage to start spinning.

Giancarlo Podio


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## ranchwest (Jul 17, 2005)

Sorry, I just got around to reading this message. I'm not much of a carpenter. I cut the holes about the size of the fans and then used double sided mounting tape to secure them in place. If you can sorta jam them in with the tape, they're probably not going anywhere.


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## kherman (Apr 7, 2003)

From my experience with PC fans. They are designed to run at 12 volts. The lowest Ican normlly run them in reality is with 9 volts. They'll be quieter, but also move less air. Sometimes 7.5 volts will work. IMHO, the variable transformers are definitely the way to go in order to ballance noise and performance.

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Karl's Parts And Construction Journal


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## Jack11 (Mar 30, 2004)

Karl,
Thanks for the helpful reply. You were able to make sense of my poor description of the situation and gave a much easier to understand explanation than the question I asked. I may have to do just what you have described.

RanchWest,
You wrote:


> quote:
> 
> Sorry, I just got around to reading this message. I'm not much of a carpenter. I cut the holes about the size of the fans and then used double sided mounting tape to secure them in place. If you can sorta jam them in with the tape, they're probably not going anywhere.


For the holes you cut, were they the sizes of the inner fan case or the entire assembly with 'tabs' as kherman has described? If you cut the holes the size of the entire housing assembly, did you run the double sided tape around the outside of the whole assembly? And finally, how does your technique look now that it is finished? Are you happy with the results? Thanks for the replies. I'm trying to weigh some options before I start cutting. 
Jack

The opinions expressed in this post do not reflect those of this member of the forum, the author of this topic, the topic itself, the moderators, the all wet thumb community, the United States of America, or the Human Race itself. They are the opinions of the space monkey shown in my Avatar. He tells me what to write so, blame him. Have a great day.


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## ranchwest (Jul 17, 2005)

My holes were cut approximately the size of the entire fan assembly. I then used the mounting tape on only one side, which made a fairly tight fit. Since the fans are all in the rear of the canopy, not in sight, I didn't really care what they looked like, but I suppose they look OK. I wouldn't want the fans on the inside of the canopy, as that might interfere with work space.

I've got my wiring on the back side, too. The ballasts, wires, terminal for the fans, etc. are on the back, so all of that is rather ugly anyway, so the fans don't detract much from that stuff. lol

Also, note that I put the fan holes at the top of the rear of the canopy, so as to be in line with the hot air after it has risen.


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