# Mutation: encourage or destroy?



## spypet (Jul 27, 2007)

I've been breeding black stripe Endler's for nearly a year,
and sell them for $1 each on craigslist for fun and profit.
I noticed arced spine female, a third generation inbreed.
she is healthy and very active. I don't know if she was
injured as a fry and healed, or was born this way. she
is still a virgin, so my question is, should I breed her in
hopes this arced spine trait might be desirable if a male
offspring inherits it, or should I feed her to my gourami.


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## mikenas102 (Feb 8, 2006)

Damn that's one fat virgin! I say breed her. What's the worst that could happen? After all, CRS are orginally a mutant strain. There may be money to be made. In time maybe you could get a pretzel shaped fish.


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## orlando (Feb 14, 2007)

I thought bent spines were a sure sign of to much inbreeding? Not sure if that's one you would want to breed due to deformation.


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## Six (May 29, 2006)

IMO that's a cull. My preference for acceptable mutations are color forms only. 

CRS aren't mutated body forms, just coloration. A mutated body of a CRS I'd say cull as well. 

The line for acceptable mutations is difficult to draw since it depends on what you want out of the hobby. Personally, I like the naturalness of it all. Colorations that crop up out of natural means is fine with me, there are natural mutations of coloration usually called "morphs" or "varients" mainly catagorized by the location they are found (see mbuna locations or killifish). But to intentionally breed a substandard fish, that's crossing my personal line. If a puppy was born with a back like that, that's a cull since the animal's life will be substandard. If the puppy was black instead of white, that's acceptable.
We have to maintain some logicalness to this. 

That's my opinion.


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## ed seeley (Dec 1, 2006)

I agree completely with Six. There's a curvature of the spine there and while the fish may well be swimming ok now, it doesn't mean it will for as long as those with normal spines.

I think the fat appearance may also be in part due to the spine's curve as well as being well looked after - if you look at fancy goldfish and balloon mollies, their curved and shortened spines go hand-in-hand with fatter bodies.

Cull the fish and get some new blood for your line. Try and get fish completely unrelated to your present fish, so don't just go back to the same shop and get some more as they will more than likely be related anyway.
If you don't want to cull the fish then please don't breed from her, let her live out her days without passing that on.


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## kwc1974 (Jan 4, 2006)

I agree with culling the fish. 
But on the flip side, body mutations have spawed some fish in the aquarium trade. "Balloon molly" "Balloon Rams" and most goldfish other than common only to name a few that I have seen. I do not prefer these fish and most of us who see or have seen these fish see them for what they are, but someone is buying them, otherwise they would not be on the market.
The choice is yours, but culling would be my preferance.


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## Amazon_Replica (Nov 24, 2007)

Yeah I'm leaning the same way, if stripes or splotches of color were the issue, cool beans. But in this case the wellbeing of the fish is at hand. It's a feeder not a breeder


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## Six (May 29, 2006)

Amazon_Replica said:


> It's a feeder not a breeder


Well put!

Also, there are bacterial infections that can cause spinal deformity.

Personally, I cull runts and deformities when I breed my fish. We have a Montezuma lurking in our tank with an imperfect anal fin and he's on the Chaca chaca catfish feeding menu as soon as we can catch him. It's not fun to do but a responsibility I took on when I got into breeding. Plus I'm anal-retentive about these sorts of things!


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## Zapins (Jul 28, 2004)

It might not be genetic. It could be tuberculosis. Thats one of the common symptoms of it in fish. It can spread to humans from fish, so be careful.


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## Haeun (Oct 19, 2006)

A bent spine occurs when you need to outcross your breeding line.

It can occur easily enough, and no it's not desirable.

Yeah, cull it.


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## modster (Jun 16, 2007)

I don't breed fish so i don't know if its time to introduce new blood line. Fish TB was the first thing came to mind. There is almost no way to get rid of fish TB unless you take down your tank completely. Also, as mentioned earlier, it's contagious to human, so be careful.


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## Volenti (Oct 12, 2007)

I'm a bit late to the party here but my parents have a pond full of platies that go inbred every 5 years or so, first time they presented with sideways bent spines, I did a big cull and introduced new females, this was fine for another 4 years or so then they presented with vertically bent spines so another big cull then introduced _wild_ platies (unfortunatly they are wild caught around here) and they appear normal so far.


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