# German Blue Rams, New!



## Gordonrichards (Apr 28, 2009)

Hi, I'm adding German Blue Rams to my 33 long planted tank.
Have at least 50% of the tank with stem plants so theres plenty of cover for them.

Since I have two pairs I'll be getting identical caves for them at either side of the tank, placed in the back for privacy. Going to rescape a little before putting them in (blocking the caves a bit from view)

I don't have much in terms of stock currently in the tank.
10 pygmy cories, two rasboras... maybe a few guppies I'm getting rid of.

Any advice regarding keeping the rams will be helpful. I currently have them in a 10 gallon tank, they just chowed down on a ton of brine shrimp, so I'm thinking their transition from the lfs went smoothly.

I plan on a diet of flake, brine shrimp, and pellets.
They will be in a tank with tons of cherry shrimp, I'm sure they will keep the population in check.

-Gordon


----------



## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

Keep a close eye on the rams. These are tempting fish, but they've got adaptation problems and weird diseases that'll pop up for the first month. I've ranted on the subject plenty (hormones, antibiotics, weak strains, etc.) and for good reason. If they stay stable for the next 1-2 months, or you know the LFS buys from a local breeder, this shouldn't be a problem.

33 gal should be good for a couple pairs if you use visual obstructions well. If a pair breaks, you may want to keep an eye out for bullying. The males will probably be the first to tear into each other if there are problems, and an easy solution would be to remove the passive male to create a small harem. Basically start big, shrink until it's stable even if that only means one pair.

Rams, apistos and related fish tend to be pretty prolific once you drop the pH out, decrease the temperature, then bring temp back up. The real variable with most of these fish is how far you've decreased the pH/KH and if you've got relatively clean water (don't worry about ferts) rather than if you've provided some magical spawning location. Rams shouldn't be too bad pH wise; if you can go down to neutral, you'll have very little trouble with spawning these fish.


----------



## wi_blue (Apr 5, 2005)

I'll 2nd Philosophos. Best on luck to you and your new additions.


----------



## Gordonrichards (Apr 28, 2009)

So far so good, they are in my 33 long, along with 4 ottos, 10-11 dwarf cories, a mess of cherry shrimp, two rasboras and a lone dwarf puffer. Out of the 4 that I purchased two are paired, the male wont leave the female's side.

The other male is sometimes with the second female, but not as closely as the other two.

I plan on ditching the two rasboras and moving them to another tank. Moving the dwarf puffer on craigslist hopefully!!!

Will German Blue Rams mix ok with angelfish?


----------



## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

GBR's and angel fish get along just fine. I've never had any problems combining them.


----------



## Gordonrichards (Apr 28, 2009)

Good stuff. I'll be reconfiguring my tank this week. Its too much of a jungle in there to see any of my fish! Just got some "blackwater" treatment for my water. Figured there wouldn't be much harm in adding some to my tank to make it more like a natural habitat for them.

I'm hatching brine shrimp for the first time, the rams love eating them, not to mention my cherry shrimps lol.


----------



## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

Blackwater is basically just boiled down peat. A filter bag/old pair of pantyhose full of peat beneath the coarse level of filtration in a canister or in the back of a HOB will do the same job.


----------



## Vadimshevchuk (Jul 5, 2009)

You are so lucky for getting a pair of german blue rams. Usually they die off after getting them from the lfs. I would not add angels to that tank since it is prety full with 4 GBR,10 cories, shrimp. I would not add angels since they will eat all fry from the GBRs and the cherry shrimp will dissapear pretty quickly to.


----------



## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

I'd say the rams are just as likely to tear into the shrimp. Again, breeding RCS on the side is a good move if you like dwarf apistos in your tank.

Bioload wise, I've kept 20 cardinal tetras, 2 rams, 1 kribensis, an angel fish, and a bristlenose in a non planted tank with 30% monthly water changes without nitrogen related trouble. If anything adding a top swimming angelfish is not going to add social stress in a predominantly bottom swimming tank. Pygmy cory's are also pretty tiny; 1 inch max.

If fry are honestly a concern, I'd set up some removable caves. IME dwarf south americans are the worst enemy to their own fry despite being labeled as good parents.


----------



## Gordonrichards (Apr 28, 2009)

I have mainly males in my tank with the german blue rams. I have two tanks breeding cherry shrimp currently so no issues there.
Raising some brine shrimp currently for my GBRs.

May pickup another pair for my tank next monday.


----------



## mikaila31 (Feb 24, 2006)

IMO it all depends on how good of stock they are from. I didn't have problems with the GBR I got from one of the better local pet stores. As a college student I can't really afford to buy them for $14 each, which is what they go for in stores. I managed to snag a bunch of local bred .25" fry at a auction, for less than a dollar each. I had never raised these fish before and had only a 50% success rate. The ones that did grow up eventually spawned at one point. I lost all of them after a tank crash though. I'm hoping to get some more fry in January and raise them again. Though this time I expect better results.

Mine never bothered cherry shrimp, but their grow out tank had cherrys in it. So maybe they just never figured it out.


----------



## Gordonrichards (Apr 28, 2009)

Yeah, they were I think 9.00 each, so fairly expensive. Store does the 3 day policy on deaths. For one week they've been fine in my tank. They've eaten a few of my cherry shrimp already. I've been slowly moving the females back to my breeder tanks.

I put a canister of black worms in my tank, as well as a bunch of brine shrimp, when I checked my tank last night all my fish were plump.

Hopefully the worms will colonize and breed, maybe supply some food for the fish.

Where was the auction that you went to? I wouldn't mind getting some .25 inch babies myself, maybe 8 or so.


----------



## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

A 3 day policy is very short unless the LFS quarantines for 30 days. I tend to like to watch my locally bought fish for 2-3 weeks with a 1-2 week return policy until I get to know the wholesaler. Once you know who the wholesalers playing in your area are, it gets really easy to make a call about quality and you've got the LFS to back live arrival and quality. This sort of thing is why I value locally owned businesses that work with their customers.

Blackworms will colonize in mulm filled substrate, or if you feed them intensely. I keep a shoebox sized colony of them in a plastic container with pretty minimal upkeep. The only downside I've found is that you can end up training rams/apistos to dig into the substrate for their food. If you've got fine ground cover, this can mean nasty uprooting habits. You can avoid this by feeding worms from mesh/net higher up in the column; they'll hang through while they get picked at. After the fish loose interest in a few minutes, simply move to the next tank. If you feed 2x a week, it's not much extra time taken considering weekly water changes for spawning or EI dosing.


----------

