# A little help plese....



## 2ManyHobbies (Sep 11, 2007)

Thanks-


----------



## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

first one looks like persicaria hydropiperoides (http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/plantfinder/details.php?id=240)
is the second one a plant that you have? or did you just recently get it? i have a plant that looks just like that and it's either from you or aaron t.


----------



## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

1st is a _Persicaria_, yes. Species? Not sure. Been growing emersed?

2nd is _Gratiola virginiana_.


----------



## Seattle_Aquarist (Mar 7, 2008)

2ManyHobbies said:


> Thanks-


Hi 2ManyHobbies,

The second one looks very similar to a plant I see sold as Limnophilia sp 'Wavy' which some believe may be a variant of Limnophilia aromatica which is sold as a Chinese herb Ra Om.


----------



## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

It's not that. Opposite leaves (not whorls of 3), no odor, slightly reddish, leaves wider near the tip. He got it from Aaron, who got it from me.


----------



## AzFishKid (Aug 22, 2009)

First one is Persicaria odorata.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

I keep Persicaria odorata emersed and also believe that TooManyHobbies' plant is that species, but can other Persicarias as the P. hydropiperoides (that I don't know live) be excluded?

[offtopic] Meanwhile I'm sure that the Limnophila "Wavy" is identical to the "Rau Om"/"Rice paddy herb" variant of Limnophila aromatica. Once I've buyed Rau Om and kept it submersed, then it looked exactly like "Wavy". Light green, no red tinge, 3 (- 4) wavy leaves per node. Still lacking evidence photo. [/offtopic]


----------



## 2ManyHobbies (Sep 11, 2007)

Wow, thanks everyone. Much appreciated.


----------



## wabisabi (Dec 4, 2010)

AzFishKid said:


> First one is Persicaria odorata.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


Agreed. Submerged grown.

The leaves of P. hydropiperoides are narrower and longer.


----------



## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

wabisabi said:


> Agreed. Submerged grown.
> 
> The leaves of P. hydropiperoides are narrower and longer.


While i've never kept the submersed form of any of my persicarias for the emersed form, which I suspect isn't too much different from their submersed form, the leaves of p. odorata are a bright lime green. The plant pictured has a darker green and p. hydropiperoides has varying leaf shapes and thickness. thus i concluded it was hydropiperoides though it seems the majority say it's odorata. 
The fail proof way to find out would just be to break a leaf and smell it. if there's none of that vietnamese cuisine smell then it's not odorata.


----------



## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

Identifying _Persicaria_ species that aren't in a recognizable submersed form (such as the Sao Paulo) and without a specimen to key out is a bit... dicey. I wouldn't commit to an ID based on what we've got here.


----------



## AzFishKid (Aug 22, 2009)

Based on what has been sold in the past, it's safe to assume it's Persicaria odorata... whether that is the correct ID of the species that has been circulated is another thing.


----------



## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

I don't think it's safe to assume that.


----------



## wabisabi (Dec 4, 2010)

neilshieh said:


> While i've never kept the submersed form of any of my persicarias for the emersed form, which I suspect isn't too much different from their submersed form, the leaves of p. odorata are a bright lime green. The plant pictured has a darker green and p. hydropiperoides has varying leaf shapes and thickness. thus i concluded it was hydropiperoides though it seems the majority say it's odorata.
> The fail proof way to find out would just be to break a leaf and smell it. if there's none of that vietnamese cuisine smell then it's not odorata.


True the emerged and submersed forms don't differ dramatically, but there are definite differences in their growth habits. I have grown Persicaria odorata and Persicaria hydropiperoides both submersed and emersed. The picture from 2manyhobbies is a dead ringer for P.odorata grown submersed. I think Azfishkid would agree.

Just as the leaf shape and thickness can vary from growing conditions so can the leaf color, with leaf color being much more variable in my experience.

Here is P. odorata with submerged red leaves









The dutch have this plant labeled as Polygonum odoratum aka Persicaria odorata. Doesn't mean we have a definite ID though. Cavan, would we need a flowering specimen for a definite ID?
http://www.aquaplantexchange.nl/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=4967


----------



## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

As for flowering of Persicaria (cf.) odorata: Once I grew "Vietnamese cilantro"/"Rau Ram" from an Asia shop (hopefully true P. odorata...) in a greenhouse in the Bot. Garden Göttingen, it flowered only in the winter half year incl. spring, apparently a short day plant. Rather small inflorescences, but single flowers quite large for a Persicaria. But I don't have that strain longer; my current "odorata" is from the above mentioned Dutch source. So the ID isn't proved as well, although the emersed plant looks and smells like the "Vietnamese cilantro" then.

A little OT again: Persicaria hydropiper that's i.a. native to Europe (not the ...oides from America) has about the same smell and pungent taste as P. odorata. 2 years ago I've collected seedlings of that sp. and drowned it in my tank - and it did grow: http://www.flowgrow.de/pflanzen-allgemein/polygonum-formen-t5727-15.html#p148798 I can't say if it can be kept permanently as aquarium plant (it's annual in the natural habitats), as I pulled it out after a period of total neglect of the tank.


----------



## 2ManyHobbies (Sep 11, 2007)

FWIW a crushed leaf is aromatic. Similar to the pho I get at the local dive.

I will try to get a flower to help with the ID.


----------



## wabisabi (Dec 4, 2010)

I forgot manini had flowered this a while back.

http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/new-plants-planted-aquariums/81259-persicaria-sp.html


----------

