# [Wet Thumb Forum]-DIY FERTILIZER - Sources



## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I'm looking to put together all the sources for DIY fertilizer (PMDD). Once its done I may make it a sticky at the top of the forum.



> quote:
> 
> This is not a ranking or an endorsement, this list is just for your information. All prices and other information are subject to change, but are up to date as of this posting


www.litemanu.com (USA)
KNO3 - $2.35/lb
KPO4 - $4.20/lb
KSO4 - $5.00/lb
TRACE - (n/a as a dry supplment)
Iron Chelate - $19.00/lb

www.ecogrow.com (USA)
KNO3 - $5.98/lb or $14.90/5 lb. Bag
KH2PO4 - $6.98/lb or $19.90/5 lb. Bag
KSO4 - $5.98/lb or $7.45/5 lb. Bag
TRACE - $9.95/16oz bottle (by volume, ~8-10oz by weight) (Specify Aquatic Trace)


> quote:
> 
> Iron 7%
> Mn 2 %
> ...


www.hydroponics.com (CAN)
KNO3 - $4.90US/1kg
KPO4 - 
KSO4 - $4.90US/1kg
TRACE - $12.90US/300g

www.PlantGuild.com (USA)
KNO3 - $0.50/oz 
KSO4 - $0.75/oz
K2SO4.7H2O - $0.25/oz
TRACE - $2.00/oz (Miller)
**also has great tools for DIY pellets

GENERAL CHEMICAL SUPPLY;
Bio Supply Net

OTHER LISTINGS;
fins.actwin.com mailing list

James Hoftiezer

[This message was edited by JamesHoftiezer on Tue April 29 2003 at 12:02 PM.]


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## m.lemay (Jan 9, 2005)

The Ecogrow site doesn't show the chemicals on thier site. Is it necesary to call or e-mail them to order those products?

75 gal,pressurized CO2 with controller, 3WPG PC lighting,gravel/flourite 50/50 substrate, Filstar XP3, GH=7,KH=5,PH=6.9


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

YOu have to call. Their catalog has most of the items. 
If ordering trace make sure they know it is 'fish trace' you are after.

James Hoftiezer


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I've been using the chems and trace from ecogrow and the DIY route is working well.

When I started doing the trace I realized it was really light stuff compared to the other chemicals. They sent everything out in the same size dark brown glass bottles. When I compared the weights I only had 1/2lb of trace instead of 1lb.

I called them up and they're send out another bottle without any arguement.

James Hoftiezer


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## m.lemay (Jan 9, 2005)

Well at least they stand by thier product. I think I will be ordering a pound of fish trace. I hope they don't ship via USPS. The Mail in my area sucks but UPS and FEDex are on the ball. Would you dose the fish trace the same way as plantex, getting iron levels to .1ppm ?

75 gal,pressurized CO2 with controller, 3WPG PC lighting,gravel/flourite 50/50 substrate, Filstar XP3, GH=7,KH=5,PH=6.9


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I dose based on appearance.
My Estella.Stellata are a great indicator for my trace elements. I trace until they turn red/burgundy at the tops.

For particular dosing suggestions you may want to post in the general area.

James Hoftiezer


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Marcel,

Have you went back down to the PO and talked with the Stupidvisor?

Semper Fi


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## m.lemay (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, I sure did. When I told him that I think someone in his post office is stealing mail, he said "I doubt it". Then He asked me if you had filed a missing package claim. I stated That I didn't know. Then he said theres nothing he could do about it, sorry. Thats it. I'm not gonna have a coronary over a lost package. I just will not use the postal service whenever I can avoid it. I simply don't have the time or the energy to pursue this any further. My time could be better spent pruning my tank.









75 gal,pressurized CO2 with controller, 3WPG PC lighting,gravel/flourite 50/50 substrate, Filstar XP3, GH=7,KH=5,PH=6.9


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Anyone have any sources I can add to the top or any updates?

How about the local substitutions?
KCL (Potassium Chloride)= nu salt
KNO3 (Potassium Nitrate)= green tree stump remover
MgSO4.7H2O (fully hydrated magnesium sulfate)= Epsom Salts

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Guest (Apr 10, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Anyone have any sources I can add to the top or any updates?


Plant Guild

And this one is probably the ultimate search engine when it comes to bio supply.

Type whatever product you want and you should get hundreds of different companies that sell products like:

Potassium Chloride
Magnesium sulfate
Potassium Sulfate

Bio Supply Net

Join as at www.njas.net


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## BobAlston (Jan 23, 2004)

Good idea to create this master list. I would add:

Morton Potassium Chloride pellets - 40 pound bag. Aprox $7-8.

http://www.plantguild.com/html/chemicals_and_tools.html

See the sources listed at this posting:
http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/month.9701/msg00040.html

Also, as alluded to in an earlier post, when that list is done, perhaps a list of "indicator plants", plants that you can use to minitor levels/identify deficiencies in certain chemicals/nutrients.

Bob

[This message was edited by BobAlston on Thu April 10 2003 at 12:00 PM.]


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

List Updated

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## imported_Sicklid (Feb 27, 2003)

What about a brand name/supplier for calcium carbonate?

_*BlackMesaDesigns*_


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Try your local home brew shop for calcium carbonate.

Moderator










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.


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## imported_Sicklid (Feb 27, 2003)

Thanks again for that advice Rex









Did I mention I live in the middle of nowhere? The closest home brew supplier is probably 80+ miles away in Spokane. If I (and anyone else who is looking) had an actual product brand name, it would really further my/our search efforts.
I've also heard that calcium carbonate is used in swimming pools, and for something to do with potting(?), but my shopping options are limited. My hope by asking again in this thread, is that someone will know of a source/product that I can run down and pick up at a Wal-Mart, or Ace Hardware as I can for the stump remover, or KCI water softener pellets.

_*BlackMesaDesigns*_


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

I've tried to find the calcium carbonate in the swimming pool supplies at Home Depot and Lowes but the products contain (If I remember correctly) cynauric acid as well.

I checked on the bionet listed above and they do have calcium carbonate, but you'll want to search for technical grade. It swould be difficult to buy less than $20-30 worth.

In the end I used crush coral as my source for it. At this point I just haven't found a better source.

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Sicklid,

Ah the joys of living in the sticks! Email me your address and I will get you a pound of calcium carbonate out to you.

Moderator










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.


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## imported_Sicklid (Feb 27, 2003)

Hey Rex, I couldn't find your e-mail, so I think I sent you an ICQ PM through your profile. But I then I realized that I won't know if you get it, nor how to check if you've replied, so just e-mail me at [email protected].

_*BlackMesaDesigns*_


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

Look at my profile! You will find the email there.

Moderator










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

NOTE: Ecogrow is changing how they sell the aquatic trace element. I'll change the price above but they are selling the trace in a 16oz bottle based on volume not weight. The end result is you will only get about 8-10oz of actual trace element for $9.95

*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## Guest (May 1, 2003)

Another one

On-line Catalogues for Chemical and Equipment Supply Companies

Join as at www.njas.net


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

Copied from another thread;



> quote:
> 
> Because you guys are very helpful, I would like to share this with you. I think it is quite cheap and very helpful.
> 
> ...


*James Hoftiezer

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive )
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive )*


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## DaveStall (Feb 14, 2003)

I recently found this site as well, which appears to be a good source for many of the nutrients listed in this thread:

http://www.chemistrystore.com/

Dave


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## gpodio (Feb 4, 2004)

Not retailers but I found some good deals on both eBay and Aquabid when I was having problems finding sources locally. I didn't have a list like this one available however









Giancarlo Podio


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## Doomer (Feb 2, 2003)

I got all my stuff from Rex.









Except for the Fleet Enema. Got that at Walgreens.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Hi all,

If memory serves,( it has been a little while since chemestry class)Calcium carbonate is also known as lime. You might be able to find pure lime (from limestome)in an agricultural store. It is often used to condition fields when farming. If you live in the sticks, this might be your best option. where ever you find it, do a little research to make sure it is pure calcium carbonate.

Luck

Dennis Dietz


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## mikajamama (May 12, 2003)

You can find Kno3 on Ebay for VERY cheap... 8lbs for 9 dollars when I looked. The other nutrients didn't show anything in the search. But there are several ebay kno3 suppliers. They say that it is medicle pure and very finely ground so that it burns fast as a fuel for rockets and such.

Anyways there is my cheap find.


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## Rex Grigg (Jan 22, 2004)

That's not cheap. I found a source that is $.30 a lb. The trick is you have to buy 50 lbs at a time.










American by birth, Marine by the grace of God! This post spell checked with IESpell available at http://www.iespell.com

See my Profile for tank details.

See my planted tank FAQ at http://members.dsl-only.net/~rex/


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## TonyD (Mar 25, 2004)

The least expensive I have found is Plantgeek.net Store.

KNO3/K2SO4 are $1 per lb and KH2PO4 is $1 per 0.5 lb. They also have a dry trace mix at $1 per ounce but I don't know what it contains.

Tony


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## JamesHoftiezer (Feb 2, 2003)

They even carry the mixing bottles I like from www.usplastics.com. I use them so that one squeeze is 1ppm(or 5ppm,0.1ppm) for my tank according to chuck's calculator.

The trace is plantex +B. Without looking up the nutrient breakdown I can say that it it a common trace element.

*James Hoftiezer
Hoftiezer.Net - Journals and Libraries
Rate My Tank!!

Tank Journal - Aquascape ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))
Tank Journal - Parts and Construction ( Latest / Archive(No Longer Active))*


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## Nebur (Aug 12, 2004)

Why don,t you try in your local pharmacy ?
Calcium carbonate is common nutrient, 
Another will be Dolomite I don't remeber exactly what salt it is but it has a lot of calcium, you can buy them easily


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## TonyD (Mar 25, 2004)

James,
I was wondering how those little bottles work. So you mix up your ppm concentration according to your tank size then they have a premeasured dispensing volume? That would be pretty convienent.
Tony


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## SilentMoon (Feb 9, 2004)

You can get all of the ingredents for pmdd and also phosphate at Greg Watson's site. I purchased a pound of each from him and he ships very fast. 
When I ordered mine the prices were:

CSM Plantex 1 lb
$8.59
Mono Potassium Phosphate 1 lb.
$2.17
Potassium Nitrate 1 lb.
$1.97
Potassium Sulfate 1 lb.
$2.17
I think he now carries csm+b only

Moon


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## imported_SueNH (Feb 14, 2004)

Calcium carbonate = chicken grit! Easy to find for folks who live in the middle of nowhere. It's crushed oyster shell that they feed to poultry for eggshell hardness. A 5 lb bag will cost around a dollar. Doesn't take much. I have very soft, acid water and use it in my tank.


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## gregwatson (May 24, 2004)

>>You can get all of the ingredents for pmdd 
>>and also phosphate at Greg Watson's site. I 
>>purchased a pound of each from him and he

>>I think he now carries csm+b only

Thanks for the referral ... I actually have Plantex CSM available with or without the boron. But when I started offering it pre-mixed with boron, everyone ordered it pre-mixed ... to keep things simple, that's all that's on the website ...

Greg Watson

Greg Watson
http://www.gregwatson.com


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## Garmoni (Dec 24, 2003)

Welcome to the forum Greg. I recently placed an order with you and was pleased with the service. Thanks!

Got a question on the Plantex CMS. Are there any recommended dosing guidelines for adding this particular trace mix. I would like to mix up a stock solution of it but don’t know how much to mix up and add to the tank.


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## gregwatson (May 24, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Welcome to the forum Greg. I recently placed an order with you and was pleased with the service. Thanks!
> 
> Got a question on the Plantex CMS. Are there any recommended dosing guidelines for adding this particular trace mix. I would like to mix up a stock solution of it but don't know how much to mix up and add to the tank.


There are quite a few published guidelines for dosing the PMDD "receipe" ... however, I believe many of us prefer to dose macro and micro nutrients separately.

Your question is one of the most commone questions I get.

Short term, if you would like to email me privately (since you ordered, you have my email address, others can get it at my website), I'll discuss a "mixing strategy" and a "dosing strategy" that is appropriate for the way *you* do things ...

Long term, I've started working on a How To Dose Plantex CSM article - I've emailed the first draft off to a couple guys to check the "chemistry" assumptions <GRIN> ...

Greg

Greg Watson
http://www.gregwatson.com


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## gregwatson (May 24, 2004)

Garmoni wrote:


> quote:
> 
> Got a question on the Plantex CMS. Are there any recommended dosing guidelines for adding this particular trace mix. I would like to mix up a stock solution of it but don't know how much to mix up and add to the tank.


I've recently posted a draft of a dosing guidelines:
*"How To roll your own PMDD Micro-Nutrient Solution with Plantex CSM + B"*

I'd welcome any feedback or comments...


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## Carl Kontak (Dec 29, 2003)

I just purchased the PMDD pre-mix from Greg Watson. I got it fast and had some questions which Greg answered within 15 minutes at 8pm (his local time). Didn't know him before (and no affiliation), but you couldn't ask for better service.
Tom in Morris Plains, NJ


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## Ben C (Apr 16, 2006)

not to take anything away from Greg, but i ordered everything at a pharmacy (apart from the trace elements, which i still can't find, apart from ADA Greeny Brighty!). The pharmacist said he could get anything i wanted.. medicine or not. it took about 4 days, then he called me. I got MgSO4, KNO3, CaCO3, K2SO4. I think he thought i was making a bomb! Am going back later for some KH2PO4. I guess their suppliers have pretty much anything out there. Try it.. i just bought 100g of each off him for starters, but he ordered a large 500g tub of each. 
Makes life very easy when you can get them all at one place. 

BEN


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## zig (Jul 3, 2005)

For anybody in the UK trying to source ingredients here are some links.

Potassium nitrate KNO3 LINK
Potassium phosphate KH2PO4 LINK
Potassium sulphate K2SO4 LINK

Hope this helps


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## zig (Jul 3, 2005)

^^^ok the first link above does not seem to be working for some reason, it says cookies not enabled, well cookies are enabled, just click on the second link and browse the site and you will find the Potassium nitrate KNO3.


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## simonbrown403 (Sep 3, 2005)

> Originally posted by zig:
> For anybody in the UK trying to source ingredients here are some links.
> 
> Potassium sulphate K2SO4 LINK
> ...


You can get boxed potassium sulfate (J.Arther Bower's) from most descent garden centers for £2 to £3for 1.3kg


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## Josh Simonson (Feb 4, 2004)

I tried to get the chelated trace element mix at the local hydroponics shop, but they didn't have it (boy their wares aren't very discreet about their intended use!) Anyway they did have stuff called general hydroponics floramicro, which looks to be pretty close to fully mixed PMDD. There's some non-ammonia nitrogen and K, but no P, and the usual slew of micros. 

It was $10 for a pint, and 30 something for a gallon. I got a pint a week ago, and so far everything seems fine with it. The pint is only about 40% cheaper than flourish, ect, but one could get a lot of mileage out of a gallon. 

It seems most hydroponic stores would carry this stuff, so it may be an easier to get alternative to the fish mix if it continues to work out well.


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