# F's e(im)mersed tanks



## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Been playing in a very wet tank for a few weeks now .... 

Question, how do you control algae on a wet emersed growth? Consider that they are wet 24x7 and would almost qualify as being immersed without the benefit of a cleaning crew.

Later Ferdie


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

You could try Seachem Excel in the water. It is an algaecide, so the "rain water" might discourage algae as it splashes around.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Now I am not the biggest lover of glut, but maybe just maybe this could work ...






Not the biggest of water volumes ... will need to think carefully about the dosage.

Later Ferdie


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## jfhrtn (May 7, 2018)

Wow great looking tank. All the thought and work you've put into this tank really shows. Anyway i would probably go with Excel or a generic form of it. If you don't want to treat the water volume maybe spot treat with a syringe? I am currently spot treating with it in my tank. Not sure if h2o2 would be the best option or not. May not get along with all the species you have. That would be my only other go to option if you were going to sit treat

-James

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks James ... growing it in these conditions at first would seem way more challenging, and I am by no means sure I am going down the correct path here. 

I am in no hurry, so going to treat this same as I would an algae issue in a tank. Get the nutrients and plant growth right. Once I am ok with what has transitioned and what is still needs to change how it grows, then I think I will jump in and do more drastic things. 

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

8 weeks and things are starting to root and make new shoots ... some nice growth on the moss.






Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

All going well, but I need to start looking at the fertz that this will be going into the tank. Firstly need to look as some shortcomings - surely I can now look at this as doing fertz for a hydroponic system?
































































I am thinking about Ca and Mg first.

Later Ferdie


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

Those are very good photos! It almost makes me want to try that, too. I don't think you can equate this with hydroponics, since these are plants that like to get nutrients through both the roots and the leaves. I would say you must be doing what works well right now, or you wouldn't have such nice looking plants.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks @hoppycalif , appreciate the comment ...

Yeah this has been great fun. You are right somethings are working very well.










but then this looks like is could be a concern ..










leaning towards Fe or N .. esp since most of the plants are actually not in water but rather water runs off them.

Later Ferdie


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Try phosphate too.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks @mistergreen ... Fe and KNO3 did little.





































Rest of the tanks is still doing well.



















Going to hit it with some MPK , lets see what the phosphates do.

Later Ferdie


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Oh, looking at your plant's dark veins and pale leave, that's a Magnesium deficiency. Anubias needs a bit of Calcium too for their rigid leaves.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Indeed ... will add more dolomite, I am starting to suspect that because the water only flows over the roots all the nutrients are not 100% available as they would be in the aquarium. 

Later Ferdie

PS added a spoon of epson salt ... lets see in a few days.


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

Look like you have put a lot of planning into the layout of the emersed setup. Quite natural looking. 

Hydroponic is simply soil less growing. 

Technically speaking, planted tank using gravel, flourite, non nutrient absorbing clay based substrate, inert substrate is hydroponic.

Things like anubias, ferns, moss growing on wood can be logically group as hydroponic growing. 

plants can absorb nutrients through the leaves, rhizome and stems. 

From looking at the coffeefolia, I agree with green this is a Mg issue. 

Looking at the Buce, and the yellow anubias(?) also point to Sulphate issue. The leaves look rather pale for new growth. 


Do you do any water change? Do you test for pH and nutrient concentration? 

You can do weekly 100% water change and use a 1 dose approach EI method right after each water change.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks for the input @edge 
MgSO4 I think is the ticket ...

the golden anubias, one will have to wait and see with new leaves ..



















as for the rest














































They are all looking a little greener.

I have not done a WC in a while. But TDS is very very very high 570 ppm. So the idea is to do a flood leave that for a few days then a drain. Not sure if all the fish will get back to the water but worth a try.

Once I have done the flood and drain - I will look at EI as a regime .. clearly one will look at the amount of water in the tank and not the entire tank volume ;-)

Later Ferdie


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

If the water trickling down is pump up from the water on the bottom of the tank then the plants is getting the nutrients. All you have to do is add the nutrients into the tank like EI method. 

Shouldn't need to do a flood and drain. You may end up with the plants putting out submersed growth with flood and drain if you leave the tank flooded for a few days at a time. 

Do you know what 570 ppm is made up of? Is this naturally out of the tap or were things in the water to raise the ppm? 

I suggest doing a water change first before adding anything else. I didn't know you have fish in there and I am not sure what the 570 ppm is made up of.


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Doing a water change might be a good thing. Over abundance of a nutrient can actually block other nutrients from being processed by the plants. That's the danger of EI regime with no water change.


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

I think his substrate is leeching into the water. What are you using for substrate?

Do you know what is the pH in your tank?

I wouldn't do more than 50% water change at a time given there are fish in the tank. The values from tap water and tank water may have a big difference.

If you can, test the pH and ppm of the tap water and then test the tank water.

This will give you an idea of how much was leech / added to the tank.

I keep the ppm around 350 ppm in my fish less emersed setup. My tap water comes out at 25 ppm but my emersed setup uses 100% RO water to remove the carbonate buffering. I have diatomite in my emersed setup which raise the pH up.

Edward back then suggest 400 to 600 microsiemens for herbs. Xema suggest similar range for keeping emersed cryptocoryne as well.

At 400 to 600 microsiemens and weekly water change, you shouldn't see deficiency unless the concentration of certain element is way too much.

https://www.easycalculation.com/unit-conversion/ppm-microsiemens-conversion.php


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Tanks has loads of old wood, substrate is a mix of zeolite, LECA and some Langa soil

So I suspect a very low pH.

hmm Diatomaceous earth - sure I have a few kg - will add some just cause thanks.










Think the Mg and SO4 did the trick ...










That said a WC is required.










Hopping these guys do not eat all the plants - and rather take down the snails ...



















Seems like things have rooted well.

30 min in and they have just gone past the normal water level.

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

finally they are hunting



















Later Ferdie


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## EDGE (Feb 28, 2004)

The diatomite I use wasn't intentionally to adjust pH. 

7+ years ago, I bought a 50 lb bag of diatomite gravel and a bag of diatomite rock to test as a substitute for hydroton. 

I am not a scientist so I do not know the reasons why diatomite affect pH. I was trying to isolate the problem of rising pH within a day from 4 pH to 7. The diluted fertilizer in a plastic bucket stay at 4 pH indefinitely but as soon as I add to the tank pH go up rapidly to 7 within a day. I was trying to maintain a pH of 5 and having pH stable at 7 was counterproductive for black water experiment. 


I suggest to do some testing before adding things into the tank, last thing you want is to have huge swing in water parameter from tap water to tank water and not know what is causing the swing.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks for the feedback on the DE ... thinking about it, it might even help with the snails.

WC done - TDS 190 - will keep an eye on that.














































Biggest casualty was loosing some moss when I was draining the tank ... 









other than that 1 plants moved a bit - so everything seems to established.










Will give it a day or two - contemplated what fertz I want to use on it going forward.

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

As time passes and I see how well the e(im)mersed is doing - I am contemplating trying my hand with some nano e(im)mersed tanks.










hmm wondering if I should go spraybar again.

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Thanks guys ...

MPK and MgSO4 I think did the trick.
























Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Going to be interesting to see what this looks like once it opens a bit more. 









Time will tell.

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

not only do have some flowers on a different plant but the original's new leaves are looking soooooo much better.



















So all and all - rather pleased with the weeks growth.




























Later Ferdie


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

wow, looks great. Phosphates help plants flower. I'm curious what anubias seeds look like. You should pollinate them with a brush or something.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Think the tank is not 100% setup to get the seed thing going .. read

https://emersedanubiasblog.wordpres...uaflore-ru-anubias-from-seed-to-and-from-the/

and looking at what I have, it might be a bit wet ;-)



















Later Ferdie


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## mistergreen (Mar 3, 2007)

Interesting. Your environment is too wet for the pollen to 'dust'/develop.


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Yeah - but who knows, added one more TC - a liverwort.






Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Might be time to start looking at trimming back and cleaning up a bit.
































































Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Looking just fine ...



















see for more 




Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

livewort is doing great .. in this heat some moss and stem plants did not make it.



















quick video of more shots ..






Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

And actual video recording of the view form outside the tank ..






Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Still growing wild.

Later Ferdie


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## f-fish (Aug 29, 2009)

Tank is still going ... very low maintenance as it is.






Later Ferdie


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