# DIY open top glass tank.. need your wisdom.



## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

There is a 20' by 30' room in my home that will be re-arranged. I have cleaned it to bare walls and a floor. Naturally it's day-dream time with what goes where, and I couldn't help with a vision of an open top tank that will be view-able from all sides. The tank may even sit somewhat near the center of the room. Wife didn't say no :dance: so now I'm asking for advise, please feel free to show newbie the DIY way to nirvana.

The desired size is 5' by 3' by 2', although it wouldn't be all that different if it were 6' by 4' by 2' in terms of its footprint. (The real difference is in glass thickness and thereby the cost to the tank itself, and of course the gizmos that go with it, I gathered, providing the construction of the tank was error-free.) Would half an inch glass walls and 3/5 inch bottom piece be sufficient for such size - 5 feet by 3 feet? Probably better if tempered glass, correct? Open top and braceless, is it possible? Where do you recommend to order such pieces if do-able? (I don't need the Starphire glass if the savings mean I can have better canisters and canopies and so on.)

The stand is also going to be DIY on the spot; I have found several useful web pages that provide excellent info, including the APC. But feel free to throw me any word of caution regarding either part about the stand or the tank.. or any part. 

It will be on a hardwood floor with solid concrete underneath. It's weight should not be an issue.

Much thanks in advance!

Ricky


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## kilroy (Aug 6, 2004)

I've actually thought about the idea of doing a tank like that someday. My idea though was to make it square, say 5' X 5', with a drilled bottom and an overflow in the center with rockwork around it to disguise it.

I would imagine that it would be possible to go braceless so long as you increased the thickness of the glass. I'm not sure how much you would need to increase it by but it would stand to reason that with less support thicker material is needed. Another option might be to make a top brace out of some nice 3/4" hardwood plywood finished to match your floor. With some creative scroll work it could actually add to the look of the tank as well. A matching hung light fixture would probably complement the whole thing nicely too.


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

kilroy said:


> I've actually thought about the idea of doing a tank like that someday. My idea though was to make it square, say 5' X 5', with a drilled bottom and an overflow in the center with rockwork around it to disguise it.
> 
> I would imagine that it would be possible to go braceless so long as you increased the thickness of the glass. I'm not sure how much you would need to increase it by but it would stand to reason that with less support thicker material is needed. Another option might be to make a top brace out of some nice 3/4" hardwood plywood finished to match your floor. With some creative scroll work it could actually add to the look of the tank as well. A matching hung light fixture would probably complement the whole thing nicely too.


Thanks for the quick reply and ideas Kilroy.

The thought of such tank started with a composition of what's inside. Unfortunately an overflow tower is kind of hard to go along with the composition so for now I am imagining the tank in the direction without it. I might not even have the bottom drilled.. I realize mimicking nature has its limits and I guess I'm at peace with letting the limits show by having tubes (lily or not) going in and out on one side.

But yes, by light canopy I do mean a ceiling-hanging light fixture like you suggested. I probably would use existing ceiling outlet too to provide power to the light fixtures. Probably a MH + PC + timers combo.

The square tank idea sounds cool. Thanks for sharing!

Ricky


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## kilroy (Aug 6, 2004)

Yeah I have this strange fetish for tanks that aren't rectangular. Probably, simply becuse something like that screams "Custom". A huge circular tank would probably be "uber cool" though it would unfortunately also be "uber expensive".

Something else that might be neat would be a collection of cube tanks, each with thier own theme. Something like 3 rows of 3 arranged in a square with the center one raised up higher than the others for viewing. Or all the tanks could be arranged at slightly different heights for a real funky look. You could do 20"X20"X20" (roughly 34.5 gallons each) without having to go with super thick glass (9mm or 3/8 mght work) but then you will need to buy probably 3 times as much of it. Something like that could be adapted an infinite number of ways though.

It sounds like you have vision for your area though. It should look good whichever direction you go with it. Just be sure to share pics when you're done so others can drool.


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

kilroy said:


> ...It sounds like you have vision for your area though. It should look good whichever direction you go with it. Just be sure to share pics when you're done so others can drool.


Hahaha. It's the other way around, I drool at other people's ability to create serenity all the time. I just want to impress myself as well by bringing an idea into reality, to be part of the "can do." Sure I'd share, if it'd ever get off the papers.

The square tanks do sound good as a matter of fact. I will play with that idea in my mind. :yo:

Again you are right that the room's layout plus the composition in my mind do call for something rectangular. I hope I get some more tips/advise with the said size(s)? Thickness? Sources? The whatever?

Ricky


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## jgc (Jan 30, 2006)

I like the idea as well, but I would certainly consider trying to work in a sump. Main reasons is that it would simplify hiding stuff, help maintian your water level, and keep stuff from haning over the edge of your tank. Be creative, you could probably even disign it to look like drift wood, or use clear pvc tubes to help make it disappear. My next tank(s) will probably either be large and cheep (used) or custom cubes.


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

jgc said:


> I like the idea as well, but I would certainly consider trying to work in a sump...


Makes sense. Thank you.


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## freydo (Jan 7, 2006)

another problem will be power to your tank for all the various equipment. i'm assuming this is in the basement, because of the concrete below the hardwood floor?

because this is hardwood on top of concrete, there probably isn't a lot of room between the two. otherwise you're left with running extension cords.

one idea is to use corner columns running from floor to ceiling. this way you can use the columns to hide the plumbing and run the electrical power along the ceiling, which would be easier to hide.

sorry... just spit-balling


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

Thanks for the reply, freydo. I assume I will have to run the wire under one strip of wood - as if replacing the damaged strip - and install a CGFI inside the tank stand. Or risk tripping my young kids every day. It builds toughness, lol. 

I haven't done much for this project other than looking up possible prices for glasses online from just one source in Illinois. The effect is somewhat chilling.. the bottom piece, 37" x 60" by 3/4" thick, which is not tempered at this thickness: $914.17. Just budget on glass panes alone, for the whole tank, pick-up only (the large pieces are over shipping limits of major companies): $1800 to 2200. 1800 if I could substitute the bottom piece to a tempered glass at 1/2" thickness.

For someone who hasn't built a single tank before, perhaps I should consider a more managable learning curve and build something smaller first. I could use a cultivation tank anyways if the big one is built.. lots of coverage to do. Is this the advice no one wants to give for the sake of politeness?  

Well I will report back if it ever happened. Will the village idiot attempt flying by jumping off the steepest cliff?


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## kilroy (Aug 6, 2004)

Something smaller might be more managable for a fist attempt. Something 10g or smaller would probably be much easier to assemble and leak test multiple times until you get the feel for it. And you could always go to someone like Glasscages.com for a tank with custom dimensions.


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

Thanks for the info Kilroy. I will poke around the online resources some more.


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## freydo (Jan 7, 2006)

from what a friend told me regarding custom building your own tank, once you go over 19" in height, you will need bracing at the top. because the tank will be prone to bowing due to increased water pressure.

and i'm not sure if you would need to have just the bottom of the tank as tempered. of course going tempered all around does increase the price of the tank, and if you go with regular glass all around, the thickness is increased.

i myself am going to building a custom 50 gallon tank, but will be using regular glass, which will only have to be 1/4" thick. as for concerns about the tank bottom, i would ensure that you have a piece of foam insulation (1" thk) separating the glass tank and the plywood top of the stand.

is the $914.17 just for the one piece of 3/4" glass? that seems really expensive. i had gotten an estimate from a local glass place for my tank (36x19x19 - 1/4" thk), and they quoted me ~$150.00, which included a discount (~$180.00 before any discount). and that's in canadian dollars. in the end, the cost was cheaper than a store bought tank by about $20 dollars.

there has to be some local glass shops in your area that can cut glass for you for a better price. and kilroy's suggestion of GlassCages.com is not bad for prices in the size you're looking at.

anyways... good luck with your search and keep us updated


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## roamingwesty (Dec 16, 2005)

freydo said:


> from what a friend told me regarding custom building your own tank, once you go over 19" in height, you will need bracing at the top. because the tank will be prone to bowing due to increased water pressure.
> 
> and i'm not sure if you would need to have just the bottom of the tank as tempered. of course going tempered all around does increase the price of the tank, and if you go with regular glass all around, the thickness is increased.
> 
> ...


Yes the estimate was for 1/2 inch thick tempered glass panes all around; the only variable number in the equation would be the bottom piece. I was wondering if I could substitute a 3/4 inch thick regular glass with a 1/2 inch thick tempered glass to cut the cost down from 9 to 5 bills. I don't know for a fact which is stronger to withstand the weight pressure. I also don't know for sure if the 1/2 inch tempered glass is strong enough to retain its flatness when loaded with water. Not sure if these questions will be answered here. Would you mind asking your friend, when convenient, to elaborate some more about this bowing factor, maybe specifically with my dimensions in mind (5' x 3' x 2, 0.5" tempered all around')? That would be great to know.

There are local glass shops indeed. They probably can provide me some pointers I seek or overlooked; it's just that I haven't got time to step in one to ask away. But for something like this I wouldn't even mind driving cross a stateline for a pick-up if the price justifies. And yes indeed on the foam padding, another good call.

Thanks for giving it much thoughts freydo.

Ricky


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## freydo (Jan 7, 2006)

my friend had only mentioned the water pressure issue for regular glass, and he was a little fuzzy on his recollection. he just knew that he read/heard it somewhere that anything over 19" brought in additional issues to deal with, mainly water pressure against the glass walls. i'm sure tempered glass would be a lot stronger in resisting increased water pressure. so regardless of the type of glass you will be going with, bracing would be a good idea.

i'm sure others here have more clearer knowledge on this.

now that you mention that it could be tempered glass all around, then the ~$900 for the tank is appropriate.

i found this site on constructing your own glass tank, if you will be the one doing it. lots of good information on things to have on hand and such:

http://www.aquarticles.com/articles/literature/Subramanian_Glass_Aquarium.html

honestly, the way i got my price quote was going through the yellow pages, and looked up the glass shops that had an email. i asked them what the glass cost and their suggestion for glass thickness would be for my tank. a whole lot easier than driving out to the four corners of the city.

i'm sorry if i wasn't able to answer all your questions, or creating more questions, i'm kind of going through the same thing as you. or will be in a few months. but if you do have more questions, i'll more than be glad to help out if i can.

blind leading the blind sort of thing


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## Tai95 (Feb 10, 2006)

http://www.garf.org has a ton of information about building your own tanks. The site is a little hard to navigate, But it's well worth your time. This link will take you to the tank build page.

http://www.garf.org/tank/buildtank.asp

It will give you the cut list and some basic instructions to build your own tank.


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## anthonysquire (Mar 15, 2006)

http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/aquariumdiy/l/blcustomtank.htm If I did this correctly this should link you to a table to help you calculate the thickness of the glass for your diy tank. I seem to remember seeing somewhere in my research for diy tanks that you do not need to use tempered glass because when tempered glass fails it will shatter into a million little pieces instead of just cracking, but I could be mistaken. Good luck on the build, I've been toying with the idea of a plywood aquarium like the one in the garf link in the previous post.


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## anthonysquire (Mar 15, 2006)

found some links about tempered glass. The first is from a glass manufacturer and the second one is from the krib. http://www.factoryglassdirect.com/faq.cfm
http://www.thekrib.com/TankHardware/glass.html#7 Good luck on the build and it would be great to see some pics of the process when you start.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

Just a word of warning. I've been looking into a large custom aquarium lately, about the same size as you're looking at. I haven't found any place that will do it without at least a stainless steel frame around the top and bottom. Most of the smaller shops use a glass reinforcement around the top with openings similar in size & location to an acrylic tank.

There is a VERY good reason that they do this. Just becasue it doens't leak the first 2 years doesn't mean it never will. A catastrophic failure in something this big canl wipe out an entire level of your house. I have absolutely nothing against a DIY tank, but make sure you do your homework before you start.

Tempered glass is vastly stronger than regular when it comes to resisting bending forces which are maximal at the mid-point of the pane. This allows much thinner and lighter glass. It does have a peculiar method of failure if it ever does fail though. On rare occasions a small point load (dropped rock, maybe) can lead to an impressive explosion resulting in a zillion little pieces. Anyone who has tried to drill a tempered bottom knows what this looks like. Regular glass would either simply crack, or might just get pitted or scored by a similar event.


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## Breadman (Feb 19, 2005)

Here are a couple of links with very detailed instructions on building a frameless tank. It's not as big as the one you are planning, but it should give you some good ideas, I know it did for me. I'm picking up glass today for a small test tank build using this information as a guide.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/diy/27814-building-75g-all-glass-tank.html

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/diy/13669-diy-all-glass-tank-ada-style-rimless-frameless-finished-56k-warning.html

Good luck with your tank, and I hope you find some of this information helpful.


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