# Any word on the demo tank?



## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Plants dying/fourishing?
Algae is a plague/undercontrol?
A photo?

please :-D


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## cwlodarczyk (Sep 18, 2005)

The tank is flourishing and looks great... I just need to remember to take my camera with me when I'm headed by there. I promise I'll get some pics up soon.


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## TetraFreak (Mar 15, 2006)

Also, what inhabitants besides the shrimp did they end up putting in there if any???


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## jeff63851 (Feb 23, 2005)

I would also like to see the new tank. I couldn't see much at the meeting since it was cloudy. I think I remember that someone said that some Hemigrammus bleheri (Rummynose Tetra) was going to be in the tank.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

Pictures would be awesome. Jeff is right it was hard to get a good look since the water was so cloudy.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I took a pic last week, but I'm on my phone and can't upload now. The Rotalas were all perked up. No visible algae. Brian put Cardinals in there.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Okay, here it is:


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

Thanks, John! Hopefully things will fill in soon.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I donated some Cherries, too.


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## shrimpy1 (Mar 29, 2006)

Looks good already. I know that CO2 is being injected, but are ferts being dosed?


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I don't think so.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

That looks pretty good. Cna't wait to see it fill in. Thats a shame if he doesn't dose. That tanks going to deteriorate eventually with out ferts. Even flourish ever few days would give him something. I guess its their first attempt at a serious planted tank so it takes time to learn. As long as its low light it should give him some time to react to any obvious deficiencies.


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## jeff63851 (Feb 23, 2005)

Thanks for the photos! So neon tetra and shrimps inhabit the tank? Won't the neon tetras eat the shrimps?


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

those aren't neons, they're cardinals like john said. they won't eat fully grown shrimp. to my knowledge, they'll eat the shrimp if they're less than 3 mm long, so the cherries should be safe as long as they're over that. the cardinals do jaw at shrimp larger than 2mm occasionally but it's unusual in my experience

then again, my cardinals are smaller than the ones brian had stocked, so maybe they'll go for shrimp as big as 5 mm


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

A lot of people wait a couple weeks before dosing.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I realize that. Especially with the use of aqua soil. So the plan is to fertilize eventually, right?


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

slickwillislim said:


> I realize that. Especially with the use of aqua soil. So the plan is to fertilize eventually, right?


When we were there I asked Brian about that. He wasn't sure if it would be a 100% ADA with Brighty, etc., or if fertilizers would be Seachem. I did mention to him that if he went with Seachem he would probably want to work with dosing and end up going heavier than prescribed.

Basically, his show tanks are "sponsored" by one or more vendors, such as the Jebo tank and light combination.


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

Oh ok. I hope he uses the ada so we can see those in action.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I went there today. My pictures didn't turn out well, but I am posting them anyway:

































Both Rotalas have just about reached the surface, the Hygro has grown past the the water's surface, the Java moss is starting to grow, the Tenellus seems stunted, and the Blyxa (augmented by some additional plants from me a week or so ago) is doing well.

Brian hasn't fertilized the tank, though I indicated that he should consider it soon. The Rotala Vietnam is looking great--my cell phone camera barely captured it, however. There's a bit of Staghorn algae on some of the moss, likely due to a CO2 deficiency. Brian seems a little reluctant to push the CO2 past 1 bubble/second, which explains the algae and the foreground's stalling (together with lack of NPK). The diffusor also needs to be moved lower in the tank. As you can tell, haze from "green water" is apparent, and will be addressed with the UV he installed today.

The Cardinals in the tank had a minor bout with ich, and I think a copper solution was used to treat it, as I didn't see any of the Cherry Shrimp in there. 

Anyhow, the tank is maturing.


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

I get staghorn with CO2/NO3 deficiency. Tenellus is slow to start but once it does, they all send out runners in unison.

I may have to stop over there to "touch it up" just out of principle


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I guess I wasnt paying as much attention as I thought. What plant is this:


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

Rotala Vietnam


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Gomer said:


> I may have to stop over there to "touch it up" just out of principle


I get the idea that he doesn't want me tinkering with it! Maybe if several of us give him the same message (increase CO2, ferts, prune, etc.) he'll give in!


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## fishfry (Apr 15, 2004)

my rotala is so pretty


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

Rotala Vietnam, I guess I just never saw apicture of it from above. Thanks.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Yep, nice plant. I guess several people have been asking about it. If only the Rotala Green that I got from Greg would grow vertically ….


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

update update??? :-D


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## Cassie (May 27, 2006)

I was there today, it looks pretty good from far away, but to my newbie eye, I saw a few problems. I appologize in advance for the flash in a few of the pictures and the overall poor quality...cameras have improved quite a bit since I got mine!

full tank:


right side:


algae growth:


brownish/yellow and dirty leaves


close up of a discus with the moss in the back




and a final full tank shot




There are beautiful discus and cardinals in the tank, as well as a few other tetras (rummy-nose and maybe another, I don't remember for sure). I left the pictures full size so you can get a close up should you want one!


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

Thanks for the picks!

Where'd that HOB come from? And he still needs to replace that diffuser with something that works! I wonder if he's doing much in the way of fertilizing with those discus in there.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I went there yesterday and gave him a bunch of Glosso. He said he wanted to replace the Tenellus with something faster growing. I don't think he's fertilized, either. The BGA (algae) appeared when he ran out of CO2 for 2 weeks. I don't know why he's running the HOB--I didn't ask.

We'll see ....


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## [email protected] (May 12, 2005)

Gomer-- you need to go over and help that tank out. $10 says that guy does not know how to trim stemmed plants, and those need a trimming! That tank will look like poo in a few more weeks w/o trimming and proper fert dosing.

You should also find out what happened to the substrate I sent that was not used. I would much rather the club get that rather than the shop as Brian has never contacted me about ordering or carrying any ADA.


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## jeff63851 (Feb 23, 2005)

Thanks for the pictures!

yep...I agree. Looks like the Rotala Vietnam needs a trimming.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> Gomer-- you need to go over and help that tank out. $10 says that guy does not know how to trim stemmed plants, and those need a trimming! That tank will look like poo in a few more weeks w/o trimming and proper fert dosing.
> 
> You should also find out what happened to the substrate I sent that was not used. I would much rather the club get that rather than the shop as Brian has never contacted me about ordering or carrying any ADA.


I get the impression Brian doesn't really want my maintenance assistance. I keep inquiring about ferts. At this point I'm just going to let him roll with it.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

jeff63851 said:


> Thanks for the pictures!
> 
> yep...I agree. Looks like the Rotala Vietnam needs a trimming.


They all do. The tops should be replanted, too, to make the stems a bit more dense. I also would remove the hygro on the left in favor of one of the rotalas. But Jeff's right--the tank really needs some ferts quick.


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

Jeff: I think hes trying to sell it last time I asked he conviently had 3 bags of amazonia aquasoil and 1 bag of powersand M


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

What a shame. He has all those resources and he cant get it together. I guess Everyone was a begginer at one point. 

He wouldnt let you guys help? I think thats a little odd since SCAPE setup the tank.

I have to admit if he hasnt fertilized yet it looks pretty good. 

Thats a shame about the aquasoil. I am sure we could have used it. I would have loved to try some in a nano just to see what I am missing out on and am to broke at the moment to buy enough for my big tanks. It could have been the beggining of a SCAPE fund of some sort. Auctioning it off to us members. I dont know why we would need money but it could help us maybe get a banner on a website or something. Now I am getting wayy... ahead of myself. Just ideas. I assume brian has already sold the stuff because of guppy's post. Well I guess I am just day dreaming. 

By the way thanks for trying to get us that Aquasoil for the demo tank. I think we all really appreciate the effort you put into this. I would love to do business with you in the future.(as soon as I can scrap together some money) It would be a shame if Brian didnt start carrying ADA stuff, but I would probably buy from you guys instead because of the 10% off.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

slickwillislim said:


> I would love to do business with you in the future


Exactly. As soon as I figure out which diffuser to get, I'll get one! I'd like it to work in my 26G, but also up to a 75G (next tank). Jeff--any suggestions?


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

If you do get the aquasoil, I could use a small amount of it. I got a little 4g tank that I need soil for LOL. ..maybe 1L since I want to use sand as well.


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## SnyperP (Dec 10, 2004)

[email protected] said:


> Gomer-- you need to go over and help that tank out. $10 says that guy does not know how to trim stemmed plants, and those need a trimming! That tank will look like poo in a few more weeks w/o trimming and proper fert dosing.
> 
> You should also find out what happened to the substrate I sent that was not used. I would much rather the club get that rather than the shop as Brian has never contacted me about ordering or carrying any ADA.


I was there about a week ago. What surprises me is that Brian said they were planning to carry ADA and would be recieving a shipment within the month. He also mentioned that they were the only supplier within Southern California. I'm starting to find it uneasy that he has lied to a customer.

When I was wondering the shop, I noticed the bags of Aquasoil. He didn't really mention it, but i asked if they were competitively priced to ADG. He said they would be, but then Jeff you mention that he hasn't even contacted you about it. Interesting stuff. =/


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## SnyperP (Dec 10, 2004)

It seems my mail box was full. Someone tried to PM me and i imagine since it's from this post since i haven't posted in quite awhile. It's clear now.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

I called him a few weeks ago asking about ada and he told me he would sell the substrate and the fret lines and he added that the prices would be the retail price plus the shipping. So I assumed that he would be ordering from Jeff. Hmmm... this is a mystery to me.... he may have changed his mind last minute to not sell ada?


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

Jeff (ADG) isnt the only ADA supplier in the US...


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

Didn't see any of the glosso John was talking about. One plant is pretty badly algaed, I think it was a java fern. Everything else looks fine except for the fact that it's all overgrown. The tennelus looks healthy although it doesn't have the red tint that a lot of people like. I agree with Mike, he needs a better diffuser. The one he's using right now breaks the co2 into pretty big bubbles that go to the surface right away. Didn't ask any questions about the tank though because according to this thread it sounds like he gets irked when someone asks.


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

erijnal said:


> Didn't see any of the glosso John was talking about.


Isn't that nice. I gave him about 2 ft2 of it, too. C'est la vie.


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## cwlodarczyk (Sep 18, 2005)

I stopped by Ocean Blue today and snapped a couple of pics with my phone. Excuse the funny purple tint. :madgrin:


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Boy, those stems are leggy in the back, huh? Needs water, too. What's up with the rocks on the right?


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

I've got to think he's trying to hide the diffuser...which I still think he needs to replace with better quality (ADA?).


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## Cassie (May 27, 2006)

wouldn't it make more since to put the diffuser behind all the plants if he really wanted to hide it...?


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## ShortFin (Jan 13, 2006)

I was there 2 weeks ago. He still have 3 bags of ADA soil. It's no use trying to hide the diffuser behind the rocks because when standing you'll be looking over the rocks.


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## jeff63851 (Feb 23, 2005)

The moss on the driftwood and the stem plants looks like its dieing. Are they using ferts on the tank?


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## Gomer (Feb 2, 2004)

He has been offered help with ferts and pruning and all that good stuff. Unfortunately, he has turned it down and it shows.


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## jeff63851 (Feb 23, 2005)

Really? Why didn't he accept?


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

Maybe it has something to do with the bags of Aquasoil he took off our hands. Oh, and maybe it also has something to do with his failure to follow through with stocking ADA supplies.


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## fishfry (Apr 15, 2004)

wow...that tank certainly makes people want to jump right in and start a planted tank


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

so ethan when are you going to use your gift card there... you better use it before they go out of business...


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

Are they?



guppy said:


> so ethan when are you going to use your gift card there... you better use it before they go out of business...


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

I was just kidding with that... i havent stopped by there in a while though


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

Sorry for the flame stopped by today and snapped this with the camera phone.


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## turtlehead (Nov 27, 2004)

Ouch.. looks like the bottom leaves are dying....


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## slickwillislim (Oct 11, 2005)

I just want to reach in and trim those stems. I thought The tennellus would have spread by now. IS it lack of ferts or was it replanted?


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## John P. (Nov 24, 2004)

I was there today. We discussed ferts, and I guess Brian's only added Excel and Flourish ... no macros. We discussed this a little bit.

I think the tenellus has stalled because of no dosing and the Flora Base substrate. The Java moss on the braches looks in need of some macros, too. Hopefully the tank will see some Nitrate and Phosphate soon!


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## guppy (Mar 7, 2004)

maybe you should dump some in while he isnt looking =p


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

lol yeah, I don't think Brian has any idea what he's doing, and it doesn't seem like he wants to learn. He even has all those Seachem brochures lying around, but I doubt he's looked at them. About the tennelus.. he sounded like he was blaming whoever gave him the tennelus because it wasn't growing. Could have misinterpreted though.

John, did he actually listen or did it seem like he was just humoring you..?


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