# C. aponogetifolia vs. C. usteriana



## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

I was just wondering. I've been trying to identify the type of crypt I have in two of my tanks, which is oftenly called "crinkle" at any LFS here. When I saw a picture of C. usteriana, I thought this was it. However, while surfing some for information on how to maintain crypts, I saw a picture of C. aponogetifolia and it looks very much like C. usteriana.

How can I determine which of the two species is the one I currently have? Based on the pictures, it seems that C. aponogetifolia grows bigger. Other than that, are there other differences that can help me determine which of the two I have?


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## Raul-7 (Feb 4, 2004)

The easiest way is to take it out, grow it emersed, wait for it to flower, and then you can easily identify which Crypt you actually have.


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## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

Raul-7 said:


> The easiest way is to take it out, grow it emersed, wait for it to flower, and then you can easily identify which Crypt you actually have.


I was thinking this was the best way of actually finding out. However, I really don't have much experience in plants, and I'm worried that taking it out of the tank may lead to another episode of crypt melt.

Any tips on how to grow crypts emersed? Is there a website I can visit to find out how to do it?

Thanks.


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## Aaron (Feb 12, 2004)

If you have both sps. side by side, it is very apparent to which is which. C. aponogetifolia is a HUGE plant and the leaves are very bullate. 3 to 4 feet is not out of the realm of possibility with this one. From my experience, it is a solid green plant. C. usteriana is much smaller and has a leaf texture more like affinis and will exhibit reddish undersides. IMO, usteriana is closer in appearance to affinis than aponogetifolia. If I can ever find my slides of the 2 side by side, I'll scan it and post it here (don't hold your breath though, I've been looking for that damn box for a while!)

Check older posts in this forum for emersed propagation, there is a wealth of info.


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## tsunami (Jan 24, 2004)

Unlike most crypts, you DO NOT want to grow usteriana and aponogetifolia emersed. They are very difficult to grow this way and prefer to be entirely submersed. They will flower submersed in the aquarium, but only rarely.

Carlos


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## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

tsunami said:


> Unlike most crypts, you DO NOT want to grow usteriana and aponogetifolia emersed. They are very difficult to grow this way and prefer to be entirely submersed. They will flower submersed in the aquarium, but only rarely.
> 
> Carlos


Thanks. Good thing I haven't gotten around to doing it. Well, my crypts' stems don't really grow to be that long. The longest leaf I have is probably around a foot long, give or take a few inches. If size is an indicator, does the size of the aquarium matter? For example, if I place C. aponogetifolia in a 20 gallon aquarium, will its size be limited by the water level? I'm thinking if it doesn't, and my crypts don't grow that big, then that would be an indicator that they're C. usteriana.


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## lorba (Feb 4, 2004)

tsunami said:


> Unlike most crypts, you DO NOT want to grow usteriana and aponogetifolia emersed. They are very difficult to grow this way and prefer to be entirely submersed. They will flower submersed in the aquarium, but only rarely.
> 
> Carlos


I am growing them emersed in a nursing box, but they aren't too good looking though. Must have been around for 4 - 5 months.


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## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

My crypts look something like that. I can't tell if it's my monitor, but mine seem to have darker leaves.


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## lorba (Feb 4, 2004)

Maybe you have a usteriana? I think Aponogetifolia is the one with slgiht purplish submersed leaves with usteriana is full green.

I assume you grow coronata as well? They melted on me easily.


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## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

lorba said:


> Maybe you have a usteriana? I think Aponogetifolia is the one with slgiht purplish submersed leaves with usteriana is full green.
> 
> I assume you grow coronata as well? They melted on me easily.


Mine is full green without any evidence of violet coloration. Some of my other friends think it's C. usteriana. I don't have C. coronata. The ones I have now are the only readily available crypt specie at LFS here.


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## ddaquaria (Nov 12, 2004)

Here is some information that had about these plants:

"Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2002 11:45 pm ** *Post subject: 

The two species are separate and distinct(aponogetiifolia and usteriana). 
C. usteriana does better in lower lighting and aponogetiifolia responds well to high light. 

Both should not be moved once planted. C. usteriana is smaller(20 inches max or so), possesses a red abaxil coloration(the underneath of the leaf is red/purple). 
C aponogetiifolia gets huge, maybe 36 inches or so but this takes awhile. 
Both are pretty tough , rare and worth buying if you see them for sale. "

I asked this question a long time ago as well


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

C. usteriana can get a whole lot bigger than 20 inches. A guy brought one in to one of our club meetings a while ago that was more than three feet long.


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## Error (Apr 16, 2004)

I don't much trust maximum size estimates or measurements, even in ubiquitously cited sources.

I've had plants go twice or three times larger than what Kasselmann (or others) say they should be.

Anyway, I have C. usteriana and I think it's one of the prettiest Crypts out there.


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## SCMurphy (Jan 28, 2004)

_C. aponogetiifolia_ has been imported and sold as _C. usteriana_ which has caused confusion, as you would expect. I have a verified _C. usteriana_ from Jan and it is not more than 18 inches tall, and I have a problem keeping plants small. If it's over 3 feet long it has to be _C. aponogetiifolia_.


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

It doesn't. I've seen both of them in person and they look nothing alike. Size estimates are almost always conservative, and that's no different in this case.


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## SCMurphy (Jan 28, 2004)

It does, that's one of the problems with crypts. I'm sure you've see it with all the regional variations available at the same time too. Both plants have wide, strap like, bullate leaves. One gets really long, the other doesn't.

Look, I've been sold _C. `willisii_ as _C. wendtii_, supposedly I have _C. lutea_ which is synonymous with _C. walkeri_, but I've been sold _walkeri_ too, and the plants I have don't look alike in the same tank. Back to _C. `willisii_, which is synonymous with _C. lucens_, I've been sold both, again the plants I have look nothing alike in the same tank. Heck, get two of the same plant and put them in two different tanks and in 3 weeks you have two completely different looking crypts.

Imagine the confusion when someone imports a half grown _C. aponogetifolia_ and calls it _C. usteriana_ because at that moment that is what it looks like to them, because at that moment it just isn't big enough to look like the larger plant.

Of course in the near future someone could declare that the two should be one species and listed as regional variations. ](*,) 
I'm waiting to find out which name is going to stick _C. pontederiifolia_ or _C. moehlmannii_.


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

Sean, 

We've had this discussion before, and since I can't provide a picture or other proof, it can't be settled. However, I'll still stick to my assertion that the VERY large crypt brought to one of our meetings was indeed C. usteriana. Of course crypts can look different in different conditions. That only goes so far. I believe Ghazanfar has both. Have you seen his? 

PS How do you do italics now?


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## SCMurphy (Jan 28, 2004)

Cavan Allen said:


> PS How do you do italics now?


[ I ] text [ / I ]

Don't use the spaces shown inside the brackets.


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## cryptocoryne (Jan 17, 2005)

Wow. If you guys can't tell one from the other, then I'm satisfied living with the uncertainty of which one is in my tank. 

Thanks for the help guys. In any case, it's doing great in my tank with just an ordinary flourescent lamp. I'll take that as anecdotal evidence that I may have C. usteriana. :neutral:


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## SCMurphy (Jan 28, 2004)

Cavan Allen said:


> Sean,
> 
> We've had this discussion before, and since I can't provide a picture or other proof, it can't be settled. However, I'll still stick to my assertion that the VERY large crypt brought to one of our meetings was indeed C. usteriana. Of course crypts can look different in different conditions. That only goes so far. I believe Ghazanfar has both. Have you seen his?


This would be a lot more fun if we both had a beer and some munchies.


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