# Decision time for big school



## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

So I'm deciding on a big school (40-50) for my new 4ft tank. I want something that schools most of the time (not just for a pic). I was trying to stay away from Rummys and Harleys since I've already had those. So right now based on availability I'm looking at either:

Black Neons
Ember
Pristella
Red-Eye
Serpae

What has your experience been with these fish in terms of schooling? - Thanks!


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

I just got some golden tetras ( Hemigrammus rodwayi). They're a little hard to find but they have an incredible subtle beauty. Mine are schooling very well - maybe not as good as rummies, but certainly better than cardinals.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

I had serpae tetras and they didn't school all that well, but I imagine 40-50 of them would have no choice but to hang out in groups. The one problem I had with them (and maybe because I only had 7) is that they would kill off the weakest fish, and when that one was gone, they moved on to the next....until I had only 2 left. Evil little guys! :axe:

-Dave


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## rich815 (Jun 27, 2007)

BryceM said:


> I just got some golden tetras ( Hemigrammus rodwayi). They're a little hard to find but they have an incredible subtle beauty. Mine are schooling very well - maybe not as good as rummies, but certainly better than cardinals.


I would agree with Bryce. I have about 15 Goldens and they school but not nearly as tightly as my 8 rummies, but certainly better than my 35 or so Cards. That said, as beautiful as Bryce and I feel they are it is indeed a subtle beauty and perhaps not as noticeable as Cards or rummies. Though they each look like a golden piece of jewelry, like a pendant.

I think you should add to your rummies. If they school as tightly in big groups as my 8 do a huge group would be very impressive indeed.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

O.K. forget the Tetras and Rasboras I saw these at my LFS and needless to say I'm in love.










Actually all kidding aside I should have mentioned that I have a dozen or so Gold Tetras in my 46g and they are a nice fish. Actually with a black backround they pop and they have that beautiful metallic type gold coloration. But again they don't school tightly most of the time. I wonder if a strong current would help keep the schooling formation.

Dave thanks for the info on the Serpae. That backs up the fine nipping I noticed at the LFS.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

rich815 said:


> That said, as beautiful as Bryce ...


:angel: :hippie: :humble:

Well, yes, ahem, actually, I am quite beautiful.


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## bigstick120 (Mar 8, 2005)

I just got a nice school or redfin rasboras, real nice and they keep it tight. When they settle in a little more Ill get some photos up.


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## lildark185 (Jul 7, 2006)

Not to side track but, I heard these fish are tattooed with the hearts similar to the colored parrot fish. Is there any truth to it?

There are also GloFish which are genetically engineered to glow with a fluorescent color.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

lildark185 said:


> Not to side track but, I heard these fish are tattooed with the hearts similar to the colored parrot fish. Is there any truth to it?
> 
> There are also GloFish which are genetically engineered to glow with a fluorescent color.


Yes, I'm pretty sure that's correct. I believe the danios have some anenome material in them thus the glo.

Does anyone have Pristella tetras? I recently put a school of these in a tall tank and it looked like the schooled pretty tightly, but I haven't been observing them all the time.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I have 9 Golden Tetras (sometimes refered to as Brass Tetras) and they are nice schoolers. Lemon Tetras is another but they can be finikie with water conditions. The best schooler is Brilliant Rasbora. They always hang together. Better schoolers than tetras.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

Newt said:


> I have 9 Golden Tetras (sometimes refered to as Brass Tetras) and they are nice schoolers. Lemon Tetras is another but they can be finikie with water conditions. The best schooler is Brilliant Rasbora. They always hang together. Better schoolers than tetras.


I don't see Brilliant Rasboras that much.

Bigstick yeah I'd like to see the pic of your redfins when you get a chance.


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## taoyeah (Aug 8, 2007)

alot petshop in Queens have Brilliant Rasboras .btw.you saw the tatoo molly in Pets? there are new livestock coming on sunday i think.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

taoyeah said:


> alot petshop in Queens have Brilliant Rasboras .btw.you saw the tatoo molly in Pets? there are new livestock coming on sunday i think.


What store in queens are you referring to 'Pets'? A pretty good store I've been to is Fish Town USA. The tato mollies I saw on Long Island.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

I've had both pristellas and serpaes before. They both act more or less like neons or cardinals. Loose shoaling would more accurately reflect their behavior. Serpaes are too nippy for my taste. My pristellas always hung out at the bottom of the tank too. I'm not sure the effect would complement a planted tank very much.

If you're dead-set on something from your original list, red-eyes or black neons would probably give you the best overall effect. The briliant rasboras would be better though.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I'll throw Flame Tetras into the mix..............


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## ingg (Apr 8, 2007)

I've never seen anything school as tightly as the Ember tetra school I just got in my 180g.

40 of them, and they are staying in a school no more than 12" wide consistantly. Most of the time even tighter than that. It is like this cool little cloud of red that floats around the lower portion of the tank.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

ingg said:


> I've never seen anything school as tightly as the Ember tetra school I just got in my 180g.
> 
> 40 of them, and they are staying in a school no more than 12" wide consistantly. Most of the time even tighter than that. It is like this cool little cloud of red that floats around the lower portion of the tank.


That must be a nice sight. I've heard mixed things about the schooling of embers so I think you might have to wait longer to see. You said you just got them, so initially from fear, etc I would expect the school to be tighter.

Bryce, I'm not stuck on my list I just know I can get those at any given time. The black neons are a good fish as well. Never had a big school just a few and them seem to school pretty well. My tank has a black background so I'm also working that into the equation. I also read someone that fish also school to reduce energy usage. If that's true I wonder if they do school better in a strong current.


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## jmontee (Feb 7, 2008)

OK so I'll throw my $.02 in. I have only seen these in pictures but they look incredible, how about Kubotai rasboras. They have an emerald green metallic color that would really complement lots of green plants and a black background. I am not sure how they would school but I think Nicolai and Pedro have them available at Invertz Factory. If you ask them I am sure they woud be happy to tell you how they school. 

IMHO going with a smaller fish for the school makes a better impression. I think that 40-50 black neons would be a lot of fish in a 4ft tank, albeit pretty amazing fish. Microrasboras, IMO, would be a better fit.


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## jazzlvr123 (Apr 29, 2007)

the silver on these guys kinda reminds me of the shimmer on praecox rainbows. are these hard to find?


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

Availability of Gold Tetras depends where your located. I think Bryce said they are hard to find in his area. In the NY area they are everywhere. I know the picture looks silver, but they are gold for the most part. Although the gold coloration is supposely from a micro-organism that inhabits the fish in the wild. Here's a pic of some in one of my tanks:


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## addo (Apr 25, 2007)

You should look in to "Five band barbs"- Puntius Pentazona, they are the best shoalers ive had and look stunning with their tiger pattern! They stay within 2" from the bottom 95% of the time and are werry shy at first. The only bad thing i have to say about them is that they nip at my HC if i dont keep them well fed, they dont touch anny other plant that ive kept them with thoug. http://images.google.se/images?q=Pu...ent=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=sv&tab=wi


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## Fishtory (Jan 21, 2009)

BryceM said:


> I've had both pristellas and serpaes before. They both act more or less like neons or cardinals. Loose shoaling would more accurately reflect their behavior. Serpaes are too nippy for my taste. My pristellas always hung out at the bottom of the tank too. I'm not sure the effect would complement a planted tank very much.


Isn't it interesting how different fish can act? My pristellas are schooling tightly all the time, and I would call them mid-tank fish, or mid-to-upper. I would recommend them. (sorry, Bryce!)


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

I think there's a lot more to schooling than just protection from predators. I'm sure a tank's dynamics (size, flow, tankmates, hardscape, conditions, etc. ) can affect the way a group schools.


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## Tobias (Apr 8, 2007)

I just got them and only have 7 of them but my ember tetras stay in a tight little knot. I was surprised how close they stay together. I was going to get white clouds to go with the celestial pearls and sparkling gouramis when I started this new tank but really liked the embers I saw at the store. I like their schooling so much I am going to bump their number up to 10 or 12.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

I appreciate all the comments about schooling fish, but I don't think we can count fishes behavior in the first few days or week. If I was in an unknown body of water with big eyes looking at me I would school too.


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## milalic (Aug 26, 2005)

Ember tetras are pretty tight schoolers in my opinion. I keep around 25 of them in my 58G tank with furcata and celebese rainbow, albino cories and boraras maculatus. What I have seen is the more you have of them, the better they school.

Another small schoolet is the boraras briggittae. You have to keep them in large numbers. I am also under the impression that tank dynamics play a role in how well 'schooling' fish will school.


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## hooha (Apr 21, 2005)

IME the larger the group of fish the tighter they seem to school/shoal. I've had a group of 40 serpaes in a 75 gallon tank. They seemed to shoal pretty well. They do nip at each other but with a group as large as that it gets evenly distributed. It makes for an active appearance in the tank.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

It's funny I was in the Shedd Aquarium a few years ago and I snapped this pic of a large school of cardinals that were part of a large Amazon exhibit. Are the fish really schooling or are their just so many of them? Then again I'm pretty sure this exhibit had some nasty reptiles in it as well so they would have more reason to school.


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## Texex94 (Jul 29, 2004)

Oooooh... Kubotai rasboras? I need to check about getting these. They don't school all that well, but they are beautiful rasboras. Another cool "tetra" that schools well are the diptail pencilfish if you can find them in large enough quantities. Nanastomus esques (sp?) are really cool and pretty when comfortable. The ember tetras I used to have school really nicely, even with a small group of 8.


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## Texex94 (Jul 29, 2004)

Oh.. another really pretty and cool rasbora is the clown rasbora, rasbora kalachroma. These are larger and school reasonably well.

http://www.amtra.de/feat_trop0605_D.html


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## Bettatail (Jan 14, 2009)

addo said:


> You should look in to "Five band barbs"- Puntius Pentazona, they are the best shoalers ive had and look stunning with their tiger pattern! They stay within 2" from the bottom 95% of the time and are werry shy at first. The only bad thing i have to say about them is that they nip at my HC if i dont keep them well fed, they dont touch anny other plant that ive kept them with thoug. http://images.google.se/images?q=Pu...ent=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=sv&tab=wi


I used to catch over thousand of this fish in a half dry fish pond near rice paddle when I was a kid-to feed my cat. they eat plants, end of the story.


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## addo (Apr 25, 2007)

Bettatail said:


> I used to catch over thousand of this fish in a half dry fish pond near rice paddle when I was a kid-to feed my cat. they eat plants, end of the story.


They haven't touched anything but the HC for the two months Ive had them and Ive seen them in planted tanks several times, but i guess only time will tell


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