# More ADA AS Qs



## gf225 (Mar 26, 2005)

My new 33G setup will have a substrate of 100% ADA Aqua Soil + mulm. 

I understand peat can be used to good effect too. Is this placed on the bottom along with the mulm and topped with AS? 

I understand the mulm kickstarts the good bacteria production, what function does the peat have?

How much mulm and peat are we talking? What type of peat, aquarium-branded peat moss?

I assume I should be starting EI from the outset (high-light, pressurized CO2, large bio-mass)?


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

gf225 said:


> My new 33G setup will have a substrate of 100% ADA Aqua Soil + mulm.
> 
> I understand peat can be used to good effect too. Is this placed on the bottom along with the mulm and topped with AS?
> 
> I understand the mulm kickstarts the good bacteria production, what function does the peat have?


There is no reason to add peat to your substrate. It serves to jump start bacteria colonization, but if you are adding mulm already then you don't need to add peat also.



> How much mulm and peat are we talking? What type of peat, aquarium-branded peat moss?


Add just enough mulm underneath the substrate to barely cover the bottom of the tank.


> I assume I should be starting EI from the outset (high-light, pressurized CO2, large bio-mass)?


No, definitely not. I do not recommend dosing any other fert aside from Potassium for the first 4-6 weeks. You will find that the Aquasoil has plenty of everything else for the plants. Also, do not add fish for 4-6 weeks either. When you start to notice the plants need some ferst start them slowly, not all at once as you would EI.


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## jsenske (Mar 15, 2004)

AaronT seems to have it figured out! I have never done the mulm instead of Power Sand approach, but Aaron's reply seems logical.


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## gf225 (Mar 26, 2005)

Thanks for the advice. I am a little confused though. I was of the understanding that pure AS lacked the N (and P?) that is contained in PS, therefore requiring water column ferts right away when using pure AS.

So AS contains lots of N and P then? I assume it must do if plants grow well with no requirement for additional dosing (except K), especially with no fish food/waste to provide any. I guess I'm so used to "overdosing" via EI it goes against my instinct to have such a lean regime.

What would dosing EI from the outset do? Cause algae? Even with 30ppm CO2 and high bio-mass, fast weeds? Or are we just talking waste?

Good to know I don't need peat. When describing mulm is it literally just the waste "gunk" from old substrate? Any tips on separating it from the gravel? Would squeezing mature filter sponges over the bottom help too, I assume its a similar substance.

Or I could just add some PS or PS Special eh? lol


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## Jimbo205 (Feb 2, 2006)

First question - when you say mulm - Do you mean plant trimmings from fast growing plants, etc buried beneath the substrate to provide decomposition for CO2 and bacteria in the Diana Walstad Natural Plant Tank way? Or do you mean something completely different? 

Second question - AS (AquaSoil) and PS (PowerSand) - How are these different from SoilMaster Select? 

Thank you in advance for patience with my questions. 
I wish you healthy and happy plants!


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

I think you'll find that the Aquasoil by itself has some macros in it. If you heavily dose the water column and the plants have nutrients in the substrate as well you'll get algae...even with fast weeds.


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## Craig Tarvin (Jul 26, 2005)

AaronT said:


> I think you'll find that the Aquasoil by itself has some macros in it. If you heavily dose the water column and the plants have nutrients in the substrate as well you'll get algae...even with fast weeds.


I dose normal EI levels from day 1 with no algae (also high CO2, lots of fast growing plants, no fish for the first month as well, adding mulm). There are always going to be macros in the water column whether or not you put them there... They will leach out of the substrate and leak out of the plants. Algae are triggered to grow when certain nutrients get depleted, rather than the assumption that most people make which is that algae grow when there are excess nutrients in the water column. Therefore, it makes sense to have the proper amounts of all nutrients available in the water column from the very beginning. Also, and this is just one of my thoughts... when you first plant a tank, most of the plants don't have established roots anyways, how could they be making an efficient use of nutrients in the substrate?

The "ADA method" obviously has great results as does EI from day 1. I choose to go with the EI because Tom has given us the science behind it, and it makes sense. It's just a matter of preference as to which method you go with.


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## jsenske (Mar 15, 2004)

In terms of new plants using nutrients in ADA substrate, they are leeched into the water column, not just taken on at the roots.


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## trckrunrmike (Jan 31, 2005)

I'm about to install AS this weekend and I have a question about AS and red plants. Normally red plants will fade into green when I put them into my tank. I tried to lower NO3, add more Fe, and intesify the lighting by letting the plants grow close to the light but all this yielded no red plants. I was looking at tanks that have red plants and they seem to be in the perfect shade of red. Is this because of AS?


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## gf225 (Mar 26, 2005)

Craig Tarvin said:


> I dose normal EI levels from day 1 with no algae (also high CO2, lots of fast growing plants, no fish for the first month as well, adding mulm).


Thanks Craig, your experiences are reassuring to hear. I was understanding too that 'excess' nutrients to not cause algae providing there's enough growth/bio-mass.

I do find the whole ADA system fascinating though and it obviously works. l'd love to try our their whole liquid fert system and substrate system one day.


> In terms of new plants using nutrients in ADA substrate, they are leeched into the water column, not just taken on at the roots.


Jeff, would I be correct in assuming that the leeched nutrients early on into the water column result in the need for ADA Step 1 that has minimal macros? When the AS (& PS) has done leeching Step 2 is used, that I assume has some macros? And Step 3 is for when the substrate has gone stale, and is loaded with even more nutrients?

I've also heard that AS dissolves over time, yet I hear that some successful setups are 3+ years old with the same AS. Can you confirm this please?


> I was looking at tanks that have red plants and they seem to be in the perfect shade of red. Is this because of AS?


Maybe AS, photoshop, or maybe a bit of both?


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## [email protected] (May 12, 2005)

Actually there are no macros in either Step 1 or 2. ADA delivers macros via Green Brighty "LIGHTS"- a blue colored liquid with N and P (K comes primarily from Brighty K- a separate liquid). Amano is not real big on liquid supplementation of macros and seems to limit them to specific layout types or periods of need. Step 2 and Brighty K always form the foundation. 

As for the longevity issue, I have not kept any one aquascape with AS long enough to to speak to it personally, but Oliver Knott-- who I know and trust implicitly-- has told me of AS tanks he had going for 4 and 5 years. Generally speaking I am confident I will always be able to get a good run out of any AS layout, and use it without worry in client and other longevity dependent installations.


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## thatguy (Oct 16, 2005)

i didnt dose with AS/PS for the first several months... maybe 6 total. After that id dosed sporadically but rarely.


without dosing, everything grew extremely well. after time, it slowed down in terms of growth, from what i assume was the ferts being used up. by then, i didnt mind the slower growth (relative to what it was earlier), as i got tired of pulling out tons of plants every 3 weeks.


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## gf225 (Mar 26, 2005)

Fascinating Jeff and thatguy, thanks. I guess I'll let the plants tell me what they need and when.

Reassuring to here that AS lasts long-term.


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## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

thatguy said:


> without dosing, everything grew extremely well. after time, it slowed down in terms of growth, from what i assume was the ferts being used up.


I'm curious if this quality of eventually depleting out nutrients over 6-12+ months also applies to the pH and KH lowering capabilities of Aquasoil. In other words, will pH and KH continue to have a stable drop while using Aquasoil for say 1-2 years?

-John N.


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