# New NPT questions



## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

I decided to experiement with the NPT setup in one of my tanks. (I have a 55g, 2x30g and a 20g) The lucky winner is the lower 30g on my rack.

I set this up on Tuesday - took everything out and replaced the gravel/eco-complete with about 1.5" of Lowes topsoil. (Upon further reading on the forum, I may have used something like Scott's organic, but maybe next time.) What I put back on top was about 1" of what was in the tank before, so it's about a 50-50 mix of gravel and eco-complete. IMO it's a very nice black color.

Light is 2x24w T5NO with one 6700K bulb and one 10000K bulb.

I put my 3 large pieces of mopani wood back in, about 12 red crypt wedtii from the previous setup and i got about 6 feet of hornwort from the LFS. For water movement I am using an AquaClear 20 that is stuffed full of filter wool. I am planning on chaging that in pieces over to foam as the water clears up. Is that enough water movement on a 30g tank?

The nice thing about the HOB is I put the crypts on the right side of the tank with the HOB over them. All of the hornwort is on the other half of the tank over the mopani wood. Some is floating, some has sunk down and wrapped around the wood. Interesting.

I hope the hornwort is enough fast growing material. I will get accused of being absolutely nuts, but this tank has 10 buenos aires tetras in it. I've never seen them eat my crypts or hornwort, so I think we are good. I periodically add H. polysperma, ludwigia or java fern for them because they treat it like a salad bar. 

I put floss in my HOB because the water was extremely cloudy. The first night, I couldn't see through the water - what looked like milk. Now I'd say visibility is 50-60% - still milky. Should I do a water change or just let the tank go?

There appears to be a bottom layer of tannin on the tank - a brown appearance near the gravel. I'm OK with that - this tank will turn tea colored at some point from the wood.

I forgot to put shells in my tank when I set it up. GH is about 8-10 out of the tap and KH is around 6-8. In my other planted tanks the KH eventually dropped to about 2 after a long time. Should I put shells in now or wait and see what it does? BTW, do mussel shells work or just oyster shells? What about other shells?

I will test water parameters tonight.

Will also try to get a picture later. Thanks for the help.


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

48 hours in and the water is starting to clear up nicely. Still a bit milky, but starting to get clearer.

Test results:

pH: 7.0
Ammonia: .25
Nitrite: .25
Nitrate: 10
KH: 3
GH: 12

Time for a water change? Maybe double down on the hornwort? I can't think of another plant that the tetras won't eat. (I know, I am crazy setting this up with BA tetras, but I've been down this road for over a year. I love 'em.)


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

maxthedog123 said:


> Is that enough water movement on a 30g tank?
> 
> Now I'd say visibility is 50-60% - still milky. Should I do a water change or just let the tank go?
> 
> ...


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

The milky water has been clearing up daily. I've probably done a 50% water change each day because ammonia has spiked up.

Ammonia has been holding steady post water changes (unfortunately) at about 0.5. I did register ammonia as high as 1 two days ago, so hopefully that means we are well past the peak. Nitrites have now gone to 0 and I am not registering nitrates of only about 5.

Should I continue to do water changes if ammonia spikes or just let the tank start to sort itself out at this point? The fish don't seem to be exhibiting any odd behavior, although I know it's not optimum for them with the ammonia. I don't have any other place for them to go, so I am hoping they will make it through this very short cycle.


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

Also, the crypts have been exhibiting quite a bit of melt. I am hoping that they will adapt to having a well fed root system and settle down with the ammonia as well. Thoughts?


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## Dustymac (Apr 26, 2008)

For me, crypts have been pretty slow growing even in new NPTs that have the water charged with lots of nutrients. They probably aren't going to help much with ammonia. I'm not sure about the Hornwort. It only grows well for me in relatively new NPTs.

What about one or two large swords? Would they also be on the salad menu? How about some Duckweed and Frogbit? I think floating plants are the best way to keep your water the cleanest and avoid water changing.

Congrats on the Eco-complete. I re-used some for a topper over Lowes topsoil and it's my most problem-free NPT. Consistently good plant growth, even for the Frogbit which doesn't do well in any of my other tanks. This is the only tank where the Apple snails regularly breed and it never has more than a hint of algae.

Good luck!
Jim


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

I put a few sword leaves in the tank at one point and they ended up getting chewed up. I've been thinking about duckweed for a fast growing floating plant. It even grows fast enough that it might be able to stay in ahead of the tetras!


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

I have probably 15 crypts in the tank now - I transferred more in from another tank. There is a mess of hornwort that is growing like mad.

Nitrate is 5, nitrite has gone to 0, but I can't get ammonia under 0.5-1.0. I can't come up with any other plants the BAs won't eat. I guess I should have let the soil gas out overnight ... lesson learned. Not sure what to do now to get the ammonia under control. I put some Prime in last night to try to cut the fish some slack.

Will adding Prime throw off the natural evolution/chemistry for and NPT? If I keep up with water changes to keep the ammonia down, will it eventually settle down?


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

Hey - I'm going to keep talking to myself on this thread!! 

I guess I'm just having a good old fashioned tank cycle. Yesterday, Ammonia was 1.0, Nitrite nonexistent and Nitrate was 5.0. I just tested the water and now I am seeing Ammonia 0ish (the color had a very slight tinge on the API test but not enough to be .25), Nitrite was 2.0! and Nitrates are now showing as 10.

Fish do not seem distressed. They are eating - but then again they are Buenos Aires tetras....

The hornwort is growing quite a bit and I see evidence the crypts that are still with me my be starting to put up new leaves. I can see where hortwort is going to take over the whole tank soon enough. I should be able to take some and use it as a nitrate sponge in all of my other tanks.


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## Tuiflies (Jan 21, 2010)

I'd just keep up with the wc's. Apparently you have enough of the appropriate bacteria to break down the Ammonia (into Nitrites) but I believe the bacteria needed to break down the Nitrites take longer to establish. I'd leave as much of the Hornwort in as you can. If you took it out you'd soon see a large spike in Nitrates.


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## Red_Rose (Mar 18, 2007)

When it comes to removing ammonia and nitrites in a new tank, I rely more on floating plants then the stems. Stem plants and plants like Crypts can take a bit to catch up with the floaters, or at least, that's what I've noticed.

If you can, try to get a hold of some Water Lettuce. While it was only for over a week, when I had first set up my betta's tank back in 2007, the ammonia just lingered at 0.25-0.50ppm and once I added some Water Lettuce to the tank and continued with the water changes, the ammonia was gone in no time.

Also, I could be wrong but from what I've noticed in my tanks, stem plants seem to prefer to take their nutrients from the soil instead of from the water. I had a bit of a mini cycle happen in my guppy tank a few weeks ago and even though I kept doing water changes, the stupid nitrites stayed(it was just a trace amount). Once I added a ton of Hornwort in the tank, they quickly disappeared and my nitrates even dropped from 20ppm down to 5-10ppm!


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## maxthedog123 (Jun 25, 2007)

Well, about 2 weeks after redoing the tank I am reading ammonia 0, nitrite 0, and nitrate 5. The nitrites peaked at about 2. I guess I had enough old gravel in the tank to have a short cycle. Also, I think credit has to be given to all of the floating hornwort in the tank.

The BA tetras seem to have made it through - they are pretty tough. I've added one more thing to the salad bar list - melting crypt leaves. They discovered the melting leaves and eat those as soon as they start melting but still never touch the other crypt leaves.

For the tetras there is that nice satisfying ice tea water. With the hornwort floating there is a green glow that filters down through the water. It's hard to describe, but it's more like a small bit of creek bed than my other tanks. I love the natural look.

My 7 year old is moving to the basement to make room for the new nursery. I think when I move his tank it's will be NPT. The coralife fixture he had melted on one corner and nearly burnt the house down! We are back to the 15w screw in bulbs that came with the tank. Is that enough light over 20g for crypts, java fern and H. polysperma?


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