# removing tank trim



## turtlehead

there's been some talk about this around here, does anyone have a step by step tutorial on this?


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## skylsdale

Yup...

http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4738&highlight=frame+removal

http://www.dendroboard.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2567&highlight=10+gal+vert

I know there was actually a step by step tutorial someone did complete with pics, but I can't find it. I think they took a small saw and made cuts in various places on the rim and took it off in sections rather than trying to pry the entire frame off in one piece.


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## Ricky Cain

I don't have a step by step but I can tell you what I did on an old 75 that I am finishing up on. Take a Dremmel with a reinforced cutting wheel and split the frame all the way around. 

Take it slow and you can gauge the thickness of the frame. You're basically just melting the plastic and weakening the hold of the silicone. Now you have two sides and you can run a razor blade between the side of the frame to separate it from the glass.

The tank I'm working on had loads of silicone on it and even after scraping the excess with a razor there was still a residual silicone "stain" so to say.

There is a product called Poly-Gone 500 Silicone Stripper that I used to remove this residue. It's used in the aircraft maintenance industry to remove silicone from cockpit glass, fuel lines and other parts. It actually breaks the silicone's bonding ability apart at the molecular level as I understand it. After its done its thing you just wipe the silicone off with a rag. It beats a razor blade by a mile.


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## turtlehead

seems hard for a 10 g.


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## skylsdale

Because the glass is a LOT thinner.


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## icharus

I gave it a try on a 5.5 gallon but ended up cracking the tank. I had 3 sides off using a razor and a dremel. I thought the whole thing was loose.. but one spot on the 4th side was still stuck and that ended up cracking the tank... wasted $10 bucks... but might buy another one and try again. Using a dremel on the top plastic was somewhat hard. The plastic just melts and you have to pick it out before it cools down. If you drill too deep it also nicks up the glass.


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## icharus

Success! I'll post the details soon


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## niko

Just to note here - the ugly plastic trim that we see on most tanks made here in the US does not serve any reinforsement purpose. It does not help the structural integrity at all. It is used because of 2 reasons:

- When assembling the tank it serves as a guide where to place the glass and holds it in place.
- Helps prevent bumps of bare glass edges during transportation.

I've heard that some tanks have bad edges under the trim. Basically it's a very sharp glass edge, unpolished and dangerous, or just ugly. Is that so?

--Nikolay


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## apistaeasy

For one of the club meetings I took off the rim of a tank, and we made a presentation. Go here and download the "how to remove rim..." pdf


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## houseofcards

apistaeasy said:


> For one of the club meetings I took off the rim of a tank, and we made a presentation. Go here and download the "how to remove rim..." pdf


Thanks, that's good info.

Doesn't anyone know if you can remove the rim and center support on a 46g bowfront without sacrificing any structural integrity?


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## joshjv

houseofcards said:


> Doesn't anyone know if you can remove the rim and center support on a 46g bowfront without sacrificing any structural integrity?


I'd like to take the center support out of my 46g bowfront as well... I have to assume that it is of NO support value, because it does have quite a bit of flex in it. Not sure about the rim, but I'd guess that the same is true as with the other tanks...

-Josh


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## apistaeasy

I have removed the center brace from my 36 bow front with out any negative side effects, and I believe you can do it with a 46 gal as well.


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## Adragontattoo

I have a bowfront that I was given that the center brace was totally melted on (previous owner had the incandescent bulb sitting directly on the brace). It hasnt been used in a few years but it was fine for the 3 years it was up and running and never had a single issue.


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## skinns

Has anybody tried this on a tank that is already in use. I have a 29gallon that I have been wanting to do this to for quite some time.


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## houseofcards

apistaeasy said:


> I have removed the center brace from my 36 bow front with out any negative side effects, and I believe you can do it with a 46 gal as well.


I assume you removed the rim as well? The next poster beat me to my next question. Has anyone done this with the tank already in use?


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## apistaeasy

houseofcards said:


> I assume you removed the rim as well? The next poster beat me to my next question. Has anyone done this with the tank already in use?


I left the rim on, and took the center brace off with the tank full of water. I used sharp razor blades to saw through the plastic.


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## houseofcards

apistaeasy said:


> I left the rim on, and took the center brace off with the tank full of water. I used sharp razor blades to saw through the plastic.


Thanks for confirming that.

Crap, now your gonna make me try this over the weekend. The tank is on an amorie in my bedroom. I could see the expression on my wife's face as the tank cracks while we're having dinner downstairs and the water starts leaking through the ceiling fan over the kitchen table.


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## Nowherman6

Very interesting info. 

Surprised it hasn't become more popular sooner, considering people seem to be on the look out for rimless tanks that aren't as expensive as the ADA tanks. I know I had no idea that those black rims offered no additional support. Going to have to try this on a spare tank as well... 

Cheers for posting...


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## Adragontattoo

I cant honestly believe that the rim doesnt add any support.


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## longbowaj

I would say that the rim does add support but the amount of support it adds may not be needed, especially for smaller tanks.


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## Adragontattoo

smaller as in below 20g and not breeders or longs?


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## Nowherman6

I'd still be wary of doing the full monty on a long or a bowfront.


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## Roy Deki

I'm wondering what the glass edge looks like under the frame?


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## trag

niko said:


> Just to note here - the ugly plastic trim that we see on most tanks made here in the US does not serve any reinforsement purpose. It does not help the structural integrity at all. It is used because of 2 reasons:
> 
> - When assembling the tank it serves as a guide where to place the glass and holds it in place.
> - Helps prevent bumps of bare glass edges during transportation.
> 
> I've heard that some tanks have bad edges under the trim. Basically it's a very sharp glass edge, unpolished and dangerous, or just ugly. Is that so?


I redid (disassembled and re-siliconed) a 30 gal. tank from Perfecto last month. The edges under the rims were definitely unpolished and dangerous. In their defense, they don't expect folks to ever be exposed to those edges, and those are the edges the glass has after cutting it.

After cutting myself the first time, I took some 600 grit emory paper (fine sandpaper) to all the sharp edges and polished (?) the edges. There are two terms used in the glass cutting biz for finishing the edges. One term just means taking the sharp edge off and the other term is for doing some more extensive shaping and smoothing. Anyone remember them?

Anyway, it cost me about 10 or 15 minutes but made the job much more pleasant and less dangerous.

I had to reseal the tank because the bottom mostly fell out of it. It started it drip leaking in one corner a few weeks earlier and while trying to make time to deal with it, I did a water change. Apparently filling the tank all the way up was a mistake because I came back to 15 out of 30 gallons on the (tile) floor.

Before anyone bashes Perfecto, this tank was purchased back in 1983 and spend about ten of the years since in a hot Texas attic.

Oh, on the topic at hand, I use a small (~1" wide) putty knife and carefully work it between the glass and the rim on both the inside and outside of the tank. This only adhesive where the glass edge actually meets the rim and that's usually pretty week. This a wiggle and pry and work around the tank until the rim comes off and hope that I don't break it too many times in the process. Anyone know a good place to buy replacement tank rims? They may be ugly, but they're handy for holding glass tops up on smaller tanks. I've done three 20s and the one 30 in the last couple of years with the putty knife method. More attic victims.

I think another method would be to separate the front and back panes from the rest of the tank with a razor blade and then (after using the putty knife method) see if you can slide the pane out of the rim at the top or bottom. But I haven't tried that idea.


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## lildark185

Sounds like a very neat and cheap way to have a rimless tank. Has anyone tried this on an All-Glass Aquarium tank and are the edges of the glass under the top rim jagged?


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## apistaeasy

Roy Deki said:


> I'm wondering what the glass edge looks like under the frame?


Have you followed the link I posted? You can zoom in on the pictures to get a good idea of what they look like.
For the most part, the edges are not jagged and you are not in any danger of getting cut. The edge quality is not ADA by any means, but I have seen 5 or so tanks with the rim removed and wouldn't do anything to change the glass edges - they look perfectly fine once all the silicone is removed.



lildark185 said:


> Sounds like a very neat and cheap way to have a rimless tank. Has anyone tried this on an All-Glass Aquarium tank and are the edges of the glass under the top rim jagged?


All the tanks I've done are All-Glass brand, and the edges are nice enough to leave un-modified


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## puttyman70

I just pulled the rim of an AGA 40 gallon breeder I got last year during Petco's dollar per gallon sale. I used the putty knife method like Trag. It was a lot easier than I thought, just required a little muscle. Came of in one piece. I could actually put it back on if I wanted.

Very cool. It makes the tank look so much bigger. 

The edges are a little sharp but clean. Maybe a little sanding, maybe not.

Sweet.


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## armedbiggiet

I love this DIY sprit of USA man! Just why there are people want to try on 5g to 10 g tanks while ADA have those nano at an ok price? And I though some one had imported these ADA look alike tank with a friendlier price already... anyone?


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## joshjv

I just want to be rid of my center brace so I get better light coverage across the tank..


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## MartialTheory

whats the longest one has had one of these DIY rimless tanks? I just wanna see how long they last because I still feel unsure if they are safe.


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## puttyman70

MartialTheory said:


> whats the longest one has had one of these DIY rimless tanks? I just wanna see how long they last because I still feel unsure if they are safe.


I really feel that it is fine. Think about it. If there were no silicone the top rim would keep the glass from falling outward. Without the top rim the silicon keeps the glass from falling outward. Leave the bottom rim on so that is still helping along the bottom. Many stands hide this anyway. The water pressure is greatest at the bottom. As you get closer to the top the pressure decreases.

Go for it! Whats the worst that could happen? Hold on,....why are my feet wet?!


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## MartialTheory

hey thanks for the confidence.

no wonder ur avatar is drowning. lol


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## Amiga276

I know this topic has been beaten to death. But I would like peoples opinion. I want to remove the rim on my 60gal Glass Cube. Does anyone think this is safe? Maybe just remove the top rim?


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## ISIPPLE

I just removed the trim on my 10gal I am going to start up soon. The bottom trim was definitely easier, as it came off in one piece without breaking. The top took a little more effort, but still only took about 10 minutes. Removing all the silicon was a different story. It took me about 2 hours to get all of it off the tank. I found Goo-Gone works the best. Now I have to scrub the tank down with water to get any chemicals out of it. Good luck to whoever decides to go this route. There is a definite improvement in looks, and it didn't cost me a penny. Now lets see if it holds water...


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## kakkoii

does anyone know if the glass thickness on a diy rimless 10 gallon will hold the water? my 10 gallon tank has 1/8 inch thick glass. The rim was easy to get off.


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## hoppycalif

I don't see the problem being whether or not the tank will hold water. It almost certainly will. The problem would be if the strength of the silicon as an adhesive holding the glass pieces together is able to withstand the water pressure and handling stresses for several years. I have no idea what the answer to that is.

The biggest difference between a 10 gallon tank and a 60 gallon tank, as far as this subject goes, is the consequences if the tank doesn't continue to hold water. Ten gallons of spilled water is a big problem. 60 gallons is a disaster!


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## apistaeasy

kakkoii said:


> does anyone know if the glass thickness on a diy rimless 10 gallon will hold the water? my 10 gallon tank has 1/8 inch thick glass. The rim was easy to get off.


NACU takes the rim off 10 gal. tanks and uses them all the time. Feel confident, the glass will hold.


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## Afyounie

I would have to say the center brace is very important for anything bigger than a 40 gal. I got this from experience when the center brace on my 55 gal snapped in half. The tank bowed out about 2-3 in on either side. It was really scary. I would not recommend taking the rim off anything that has some length to it. 
The tanks built now have far thinner glass than use to be. My friend had an old 55 gal that was used in classrooms. It had no center brace, but the glass was twice as thick. Wish I had bought it from him now.


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## insomniaclush

I'm going ahead and trying out a 29gal. Prob in a week or so I'll fill it and see how long it will hold.
I'll give a update later on


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## Afyounie

I removed the trim on my ten gal last night. It seems to be really sturdy, as if the trim had no support qualities at all. The edges are rough though. My forearms were all raw after I scaped the tank again. The silicone is fairly hard to get off. In the end it looks real nice.


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## skinns

insomniaclush

Please keep me posted on this. I have a 29gallon now and was hoping to do this. Unfortunately my 29gallon is in use. So I would have to try this veeeeeeeery carefully. How was your experience taking the rim off? Any DO's or DON'T's?


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## insomniaclush

skinns said:


> insomniaclush
> 
> Please keep me posted on this. I have a 29gallon now and was hoping to do this. Unfortunately my 29gallon is in use. So I would have to try this veeeeeeeery carefully. How was your experience taking the rim off? Any DO's or DON'T's?


Do's & Don'ts
Cute the black rim in pieces, say in the middle and on the edges. this will make it easier to pry off w/o chipping or putting to much stress on the seals when ripping that thing off.
I would not recommend trying to do this with a tank in-use. I had a time trying to cut off all the silicone on this thing. And once you have all the silicone off the edges of the tank you will want to use stain removers to get off the residue left by the silicone (e.g. will kill your fish). But for now so far so good.


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## apistaeasy

No need to use stain removers for silicone; just lots of brand new razor blades and rubbing alcohol. It's still a bad idea to do this on a tank while in use b/c I have seen a few tanks break while removing trim.


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## insomniaclush

apistaeasy said:


> No need to use stain removers for silicone; just lots of brand new razor blades and rubbing alcohol. It's still a bad idea to do this on a tank while in use b/c I have seen a few tanks break while removing trim.


I tryed with a few packs of blades (one really needs alot to do this) and the alcohol but the Goo-Gone really did the trick.


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## Funk

I'm really interested in trying this. Can we get a long term update from some of you on how these shaved tanks are holding up?


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## Daniil

I have done it with 29g and use it for about 6 month with no problem.
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/diy-aquarium-projects/71467-derimming-29-gallon.html


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## B-9

Use a razor blade, and BE GENTLE take your time. Naw away at the silicone until the trim pops off.

You can and will crack/chip the glass if you are to rough on it. I've de-rimmed over a dozen tanks. I would not recomend anything over a 29g AGA be de-rimmed.

I tried it on a 40long (48 x 12 x 12) and it did not work out, bowed seriously without trim.
(found the tank in the garbage, was worth a try  )

Heres a picture of my 29g de-rimmed:


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## funnytrash

i derimmed my ten gallon but one bit of the corner accidently broke so i just taped it on the back with electric tape and theres no leaks!


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## Michael

I de-rimmed a 20 tall and a 10 nine months ago, and both are trouble free.

WD-40 really helps get the silicone off the glass.


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## gitusukka

Might give it a go on my 20 G.


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## Mike_E_P

Would people care to post pics of their rimless tanks. I've seen plenty of ADA ones just no DIY. Got to scope em out


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## wi_blue

Any ideas on rounding the edges of the glass?


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## idex

wi_blue said:


> Any ideas on rounding the edges of the glass?


Probably not a good idea.


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## ShrimpNewbie

skinns said:


> Has anybody tried this on a tank that is already in use. I have a 29gallon that I have been wanting to do this to for quite some time.


Yes, I have derimmed My 20g long while fish and plants were inside, I grew tired of looking at the black trim.... very easy to do and now all my tanks have no trim, haven't cracked a single tank or scratched for that matter, I have a couple 10 gallon that I took the top rim off for trade for anyone interested


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## ShrimpNewbie

wi_blue said:


> Any ideas on rounding the edges of the glass?


Dremmel with the diamond cutter bit or diamond sanding thing, not sure what exactly it is called but worked for me


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## ShrimpNewbie

Mike_E_P said:


> Would people care to post pics of their rimless tanks. I've seen plenty of ADA ones just no DIY. Got to scope em out


A little late but here are the tanks I have de rimmed that I still have
the 20 looks new cause I just broke it down and re did it yesterday and I am pleased with how it is now though bare








20Long, ignore the back, i haven't put a background on this thing as i just set it up last nice in an old red wood tv stand that i can to break quite a bit off of








10g qt[for sale, frosted background]
















another 10 gallon plain and full of blyxa japonica and like 3 stems of something i forgot the name of, all of which came from last night's tear down, for sale also

And my chinchilla cause he is the cutest little guy ever


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## Tikulila

i did is last week, not too hard, but i used a surgery scalpel, works wonders, its extremely shap obviasly, watch out to use dremel, if you arened experianced in it you can cut the glass straight to the other side.

and it costs alot.


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## DogFish2.0

ShrimpNewbie - I'm thinking of deriming a 20L. How long has yours been topless?


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## rmsalaysay

is 75 Gallon safe for be de-rimmed? 24x36x24 (2ft x 3ft x 2ft),


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## Michael

De-rimming a 75 would be very risky.


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## rmsalaysay

Michael said:


> De-rimming a 75 would be very risky.


sir michael i have a really bad mistakes i measured it after work and its only 50 Gallon. is that safe?, i currently treating it with vinegar because there is a lot of calcium or white residue left in the tank, that is the current problem of the tank anyway its only a free give by the company i work for.


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## Michael

The largest tank I have ever de-rimmed is a 20 gallon, and even that made me uneasy. I think 50 gallon is too big to de-rim.


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## rmsalaysay

Michael said:


> The largest tank I have ever de-rimmed is a 20 gallon, and even that made me uneasy. I think 50 gallon is too big to de-rim.


last night i just removed the black plastic but not de-rimmed, i think i will stick to that for safety, if i remove the bottom plastic is that okay also? i wanna make the tank look rimless without the black plastic, the glass thickness is 5mm.

thank you michael


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