# Is a 75g feasible? Ideas?



## javalee (May 8, 2006)

I was given a standard 75g tank (4' long, 20" high). I don't know yet whether to call this a gift or a pain. The idea of having a new tank and not using it really eats at me, but the idea of setting up and maintaining (and financing) such a large tank with my health issues is overwhelming.

OK, so what kind of lighting would y'all recommend for someone sticking to a budget? I do have access to a bright northeast window and a southwest window. Also, I _think_ I'd like to keep it open on top---maybe some glass or acrylic to cover it in the winter. I'm wondering if those CF lights with "legs" could be set up using the support strut that runs from front to back on the top of the tank. I'd prefer not to have to have a hood made.

For plants, I'd like it to be low maintenance. My experience with my 10g has taught me that I grow tired of pruning and replanting stem plants, so I was thinking plants like swords, vals, and some crypts plus floating plants. Any other low maintenance plants for a tank this size?

I think that planting this 75 is my only workable option since weekly water changes would be more than I could handle in a tank this size. The "El Natural" method could make it affordable. I finally have workable soil to use since I gave up on potting soil and tested one from a wooded area of our property. So the expense of lighting and the amount of maintenance for the mentioned plants is the determining factor.

Thanks for any ideas or advice!


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

OK, looking around the internet, I'm wondering if my only lighting options are 2x65W or 4x65W?? These are pretty pricey. Again, if using sunlight can save me $$, then I'm all for using less wattage, but I'm unsure how much I'll need with a 20" high tank that is 18" deep.

My angelfish is looking at me and pleading for this tank. He says he'd prefer the 75g to his 29g!


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

I'd go with the east window.
I have about 2 wpg over my 125. The last set of pics shows the current light set up. I really like them because they're easy to move out of the way (I have a hook on the wall and a cord that I wrap around the fixture to hold it out of the way when I need to work in the tank). I think in the winter when it's getting direct sunlight, I could actually cut it back to 1wpg. Also, Lights of america makes a 65 watt 6500K fluorescent floodlight. I found some cheap on e-bay and used them over the new goldie tank.

The lowest maintence plants I have are the big swords and crypts. My sag subulata is like an invasive weed and my vals are getting that way.


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## goldielovr (Apr 12, 2006)

Funny you should mention this, as I am in the exact same situation and am in the process of setting up and documenting as I go the setting up and maintaining of a 55 given to me (same dimensions, only not so deep) from the POV of someone handicapped or in some other way short on energy/strength. As you might guess, it'll be a while before I can get the photos up. I was focussing on the work involved and the set up, not so much the maintenance. I'll try and pick out a couple main points I can remember.

One thing I took pains to do was measure the height of the tank, the distance from my underarm to the floor and figure the difference minus an inch or two would be the height of the tank, so I wouldn't have to stand on a chair or ladder to service the tank. 

Another thing would be to get lots and lots of stem plants,lettuce and giant duckweed as well as whatever other plants you dream of having because they will make the biggest difference in keeping algae at bey and in filtering/oxygenating the water. 

Also, I noticed in the initial stages, one could make at least three steps of it all if you need, as I did, to stop at some point and rest a day or a couple days. You can put the dirt and gravel/sand/top substrate in one step, then the planting and filling the tank until the plants are at least covered as a second step, and topping the tank, and perhaps adding your fish, as the third step. 

Initially, I hung two shop lights above my tank (it was a hundred gallon). This week we buy the glass to make the versa-tops so we can sit the lights on the top instead of pulling the whole drop ceiling down (!!!)

Mmmm, what else...oh. Get a spritz bottle of water to keep your plants damp while planting in case it takes you a while or you need to take a break. Use small containers and resolve to make more trips so you don't hurt yourself toting water. 

The key to making the natural tanks work, as far as I can see, is getting enough plants to totally stuff the tank with green. Joining a club that's in your area and is about planted tanks (if you can find one--where are you at?) can be a great way to get cheap plants, fish, inverts etc. as well as good advice. APC is a great place to meet or even start such a club. I found my club here, the SWOAPE folk have been a great help to me, and here is also where I found someone to sell me enough plants (at a better price than you'd ever find at the LFS, not to mention a superior selection) to fill up my 100 g. I'm not quite at the point where the plants squeeze out the algae in the hundred, but I set up a 5, and it cycled instantly, never needed anything and never got even a breath of algae, and it's been up for months. I feel sure what little algae there is in the 100g. will disappear when the plants get big enough. 

That help?


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## Urkevitz (Oct 26, 2004)

I had a 4x65 watt aqualight over my 75, but removed it. 

Two shoplights works better for me, I set them directly on top of the open tank. ( the heat from the aqualight cracked my glass cover). 

The lighting from the shoplights is more even and subdued compared to the aqualight, and alot cheaper.


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Thanks DataGuru and Goldielovr for the replies! You both broadened my way of thinking about this tank---especially the lighting. I could maximize the sunlight at the East window, and using shop lighting would be much more affordable. I even have cross-beams in this room to hang them from! The plants I mentioned sound ok since uprooting sag or crypts occasionally won't be as bad has having to chop and replant.

I DO need to try out the depth of my reach though! I hadn't thought about that difficulty yet, Goldielovr! Yes, the stepwise approach is a must. In fact, I've been wanting to redo my 29g for a year, but since it would involve moving the fish and tearing it down, it could actually be easier for me to do the larger tank over a longer period of time!

Unfortunately, I'm not able to hook-up with an aquarium group locally (y'all are all I have! and I'm thrilled to have your help!) but I could transfer lots of floating plants from an existing tank, and I've had a positive experience ordering lots of plants from a seller on Ebay.

Shop lights! Of course!...

Javalee


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Shoplights are a good option for cheap but efficient lighting. Glass covers are really unnecessary in my opinion. If you wanted to elivate teh shoplights so the tank was really open top, they can be hung from the ceiling of from a shelf, or I am sure we could help you figure out a leg system.

A DIY Python can be made very cheapy so you never need a bucket to drain or fill the tank. A cheap garden hose fro Walmart, cheap water bed siphon pump fromteh hardware store (exact same thing that Python uses), a hose barb, couple feet of PVC and a couple 90degree elbows are all it takes. I believe I have aphoto of mine in my gallery.....here

A siol based substrate is certainly an option although I am unfamiliar with them. Personally I would buy 2 bags of Soilmaster, but thats me. A member of our club has soil based tanks and the amounts, sizes and health of the crypts and Echinodorus she brings is amazing....Hmmm, now I want to try a soil based tank

As goldie mentioned, clubs are great. Most generally have alot of generous people who donate tons of plants and help to people starting out. Generally for the price of a pizza and some carrot sticks you canhave all the members over to help with a tank setup. We all love it as its an excuse to setup another tank but without disapproving looks from our signifigant others


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

I have a pair of 24" tweezers I got for Christmas. I can reach just about anything. There are also a couple good long reach claw things for aquariums. Sort of like people use to pick up trash. I know Big Al's or any of the major companies carry such things. Aquatongs is one brand I believe.


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Urkevitz, didn't mean to leave out your post. We must have posted at the same time! That's great that you've even tried out the 4x65w over a 75g; that's exactly what I'm looking at. I'm more and more sold on the shoplights with every post!

Dennis, hmmm, legs are still a possibility? I'm low on ingenuity, but I'm liking all the possibilities here. I'll have to think on that part. Funny you should mention the Python, an e-friend who is also disabled was just telling me how I HAD to have one of these! I always prefer the economical approach too!

I WISH I could have some frustrated MTS (multiple tank syndrome) aquarium club people come over and have their way with my tank! LOL! I live in "the sticks" though, so I'm happy just to have y'all's help! There may be some disapproving looks already over here! But they have also had enough enjoyment out of my natural 10g that I feel like I can push it a bit!


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## texasbec (Feb 2, 2006)

*75 gallon*

I just set up a new 75 gallon myself (same dimensions as yours). I have found that I can reach the bottom of the back, but not without getting wet up to my shoulders! From now on I will wear sleevless shirts to save on my laundry loads of shirts with wet sleeves!

My tank is not a natural planted tank, but only because I have goldfish in it. I used an Eco-Complete and gravel mixture and am hoping some plants will be able to withstand the goldfish nibbles. My lighting is a coralife aqualight 2x65, it just arrived yesterday and I hope that it is sufficient. The tank is not near any windows.

What I really wanted to tell you was about the Python. I just got one because I hate hauling buckets to change water in my 29 gallon, I knew with a 75 gallon it was time to buy a Python. At the small lps where I got my tank they were selling the 25 foot model for $49.99!!! At Petsmart it was $39.99!!! But, Petsmart will honor their online price and so I took a print out and got it for $23!! I have since read (don't know if its true) that they will honor ANY online price, just bring the print out.

I love the Python, have only used it twice so far. But just filling up the 75 was worth it!


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Texasbec,

Thanks for sharing your experience. Please keep us posted here or on another thread with how your lighting works out and with which plants. I'd be interested in knowing. I'm sure it'll be a while before I can actually start this tank.

I've looked up Python on the internet. Do you just flush water out and then fill straight from the tap? Is that the idea? I've always wondered if it's safe to put water in straight out of the tap since my water chemistry (pH and goodness knows what else) changes over the next 24 hours after it leaves the tap. 

I'd also like to know how your tank works as a goldie tank with plants and Eco-complete. I love our outdoor goldfish and have considered having them in this large tank too, but I've never kept them indoors in tanks before. Thanks for the reply!


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## Miss Fishy (May 13, 2006)

As another person with health problems slowly setting up a large tank, I too thought long and hard about plant choices and setting up plans.

I love stem plants, and I couldn't bear to have a tank without them, so I decided on a mixture of Milfoils (_Myriophyllum_ species) as the main background plants. I'm only using native Australian plants in this tank, and it just so happens that many of the native species of Milfoils develop extensive root systems and also branch a lot. Because of this, if you plant densly enough to begin with, you can just cut the tops off without ever having to replant the tops and you will soon end up with a dense forest. For the main foreground plant I decided on a _Chara_ species for the same reason. The other plants in the tank will be mainly plants that spread by runners and so only need thinning out from time to time.

I'm also planning to set the tank up over a number of days. First I'll add the soil, then the next day the gravel. I'll also plant the tank in stages over a few days starting with the smallest plants, and working up to the larger ones (I get very tired planting tiny plants so it's better if I do them first). Also, by starting with the small plants, I can leave the tank with just enough water to cover them so I'm not trying to plant the rest of the plants with the tank full. Filling the tank will be easy; I just put the garden hose through the window next to the tank!

On the subject of tank depth, my tank is 24 inches high, so my father and I designed and built a very short stand for the tank so it is easy to reach into. The tank is 28 inches wide, so I also positioned it away from the wall so I can get around the back and sides to prune the plants without falling into the tank!

From Alex.

P.S. I get most of my plants from mail-order pond plant growers - they are much cheaper (in Australia anyway) and the plants are often much bigger and healthier.


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Thanks Miss Fishy! I think you know exactly what I'm dealing with. That's why getting this large tank is a gift of sorts, since my fish can continue living in their 29g while I slowly set up. That's a real luxury!

I don't know much about the range of plants out there other than the ones living in my 10g, so I appreciate your plant suggestions! Your plan sounds like one I could use since sitting up and concentrating on things like replanting little stem plants leaves me a bit dizzy. I've never had Milfoil; it's sounding good for my large tank to. I LOVE my cabomba in my 10g, but it grows so fast and is so difficult to keep planted in the substrate that I could never keep more than a few stems in the 10g.

Chara is sounding better all the time (good for my nano too!), and I've found someone to go Chara hunting for me around here. She's a wildlife biologist so I'm thrilled!

My windows are low to the floor anyway, so if this tank is gonna use lots of sun, I thought that having a low-to-the-ground stand built would be helpful in keeping things easily accessable as well. Maybe the shorter stand will be cheaper to build too! Always a plus.

Yeah, my plants came from my Ebay seller in good condition and in good time, but I admit they were very teeny samples. I'll have to see if our proximity to Florida means lower prices from the nurseries shipping from there.

Thanks again, Miss Fishy! Keep us updated on your tank. I always love to see your jungles and hear about the invertebrates you keep.


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## pawslover (Feb 22, 2006)

javalee said:


> I've looked up Python on the internet. Do you just flush water out and then fill straight from the tap? Is that the idea? I've always wondered if it's safe to put water in straight out of the tap since my water chemistry (pH and goodness knows what else) changes over the next 24 hours after it leaves the tap.


Yes, that's how it works. I was a little nervous about the refilling part when I first got it as I had always let my water age before using it. I have had the Python for about 9 mo now and LOVE it. When I get to the refilling stage, I give a good squirt of water conditioner to the tank and have not had any problems. My tanks seem healthier now as I am better about water changes than when I had to lug buckets.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

Welcome Becky! 

I love my python. When using it I dose dechlorinator for the full volume of the tank, not just the amount of water changed out and I shuush fish away from where the water flows into the tank. but I have lots of non natural tanks and do weekly partial water changes on those. I mainly use it to fill buckets to top off the NPTs, since I rarely do partial water changes in those tanks and don't want to have to use all that dechlorinator just to top off the tanks. So it may or may not be helpful with NPTs. A garden hose to fill it initially would work just fine.


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## Miss Fishy (May 13, 2006)

The Milfoil species I like the best and which have good root systems and branch a lot are _Myriophyllum caput-medusae_, _M. papillosum_, _M. variifolium_, _M. salsugineum_, and _M. simulans_. I don't know whether you could find them in America though; I got them from nurseries that specialise in Australian native aquatic plants. You should be able to find some of the many other species of Milfoils for your tank, however, as the genus is cosmopolitan and there are quite a few popular aquarium species.

If you do find some _Chara_, please keep me informed! I'd love to see some photos of it!

If you are interested, I could post a plan of the stand my father and I made. It is a very simple design that doesn't use much wood (so it's nice and cheap!), it is easy to adapt the design to fit the dimensions of any aquarium, and it is quick to put together. We have built four stands using this design, and I have found them to be very sturdy.

From Alex.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Dataguru, what is an NPT? National Pipe Thread

I use my DIY python to change water in my 50 and 15 gallon tanks. The 50 every week and the 15 every 2-3 weeks. It works very well. Generally I start the syphon with the sink and then pinch off the hose and romove it to drain into the toilet which eliminates a lot of wasted water. If the toilet was not convienent I would a way of draining into the drain under the sink, or out into a garden, etc, etc. I while the tank drains I clean the glass when get the water temo adjusted at the faucet, reattach the hose, and start filling the tank. Once the tankis filling I go add the appropriate amount of Prime to neutralize the tap. I have never had a loss doing this and generally the fish and shrimp are hangig out in the flow from the incoming tap water. Check the temp with your hand once in a while to make sure the water has not gotten hot.

Another option for tank location is to have it perpendicular to the wall so it is accessable on both long sides. This can very very interesting actually if you have the room.

Stemplants can be a lot of work but are certainly not necessary for a beautiful aquarium. Look at the photos of Jeff Senske, Luiz Navarro and Amano for truely stuning layouts using Swords, Anubias, mosses, Crtptocoryne and Microsorium sp, etc. There are many very slow growing stemplants also so don't be put off. Proserpenaca paustris(I might have spelled that wrong), true Rotala indica, Ludwigia arcuata, and many others grow pretty slow and with low to moderate light you could go several weeks without trimming them.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

Yea, I drain mine into the back yard.

NPT=natural planted tank.


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Miss Fishy, I might get those plans from you later via Private Message if that's ok. Thank you! I'm not going to reveal my plans here on the homefront until I have it all efficient and figured out. That way, the idea of a 75g tank will be harder for my family to reject! I do know someone who would build a stand for me and charge very little outside of materials, and he will want a design to look at. Thanks also for the species lists!

Dennis, yeah, I am having to take into account the floor and supports and such since I live in a raised home, but I too like the idea of a tank jutting out lengthwise from the wall. I have the perfect spot where it would create a hallway-like effect or a barrier between kitchen and living room AND it would be only 3 feet from a large window! I think it would be cool to look through it.
I think I'm gonna have to look at the plans for the house to see where the floor has the most support. Thanks for the plant ideas. It really helps to hear from someone with experience since webpages don't tell you specifics about pruning, etc.

Thanks everyone for the explanations of the Python. I feel like an idiot; I know these things are incredibly popular but the website didn't explain how it works. I'm imagining running the waste water out the door and into the yard/garden (I like to water my plants with my fish water to fertilize them and conserve water!). There's a sink by the door so I guess that would work. I have to get one!

I'm gonna start looking at shoplights for now and how people design these things. Right now, there's still some resistance over here so I'm staying quiet and planning! I think this could really work!


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## texasbec (Feb 2, 2006)

*75 gallon*

Good luck! You will love the tank, I think it is a really good size. It's so nice you have someone to build a stand for you. And other tank crazy people to talk to about it here!


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## Miss Fishy (May 13, 2006)

I will draw up a plan today or tomorrow, scan it and PM it to you, javalee. I know all about resistence on the home front to new tanks! If only everyone were crazy aquarium hobbyists and understood that more and more tanks are _absolutely nescessary_! My family is gradually putting up less and less of a fight though... maybe after so many years they are finally realising that more tanks are inevitable. 

From Alex.


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## Jane in Upton (Aug 10, 2005)

I've enjoyed following this discussion! I've been toying with the Python idea, too. For an established tank, it might suck up too many critters, but for filling a larger new tank, it seems ideal!

I've PM'd Alex to get the aquarium stand plans, as well. 
Thanks!
-Jane


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## Miss Fishy (May 13, 2006)

Actually, maybe I should post the plan for the stand in the "Do It Yourself" section as well as sending it to javalee and Jane. What do people think? That way, if anyone as well as javalee and Jane is interested, they can easily look at it. Be warned that it's not a spectacular or fancy design that everyone will be wowed by, just a basic wooden stand! 

From Alex.


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## Jane in Upton (Aug 10, 2005)

Yeah, Alex - DIY plans are always welcome!

And Javalee - I too had to read an explanation of the Python before I "got it", LOL!

Oh, and I've seen Dennis' 24" tweezer/tongs, and I gotta get me a pair of those!!! I have a pair of 10" ones that I use constantly. The gargantuan ones look fabulous. 

-Jane


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Sure Miss Fishy, go ahead and post it so everyone can benefit! I've had a health set-back so I'll be ruminating on this more than actually working on it for a while. I can show the plans to a few people while I'm waiting.

I think those super-tweezers are another common-sense tool that I've waited too long to get. Chop sticks don't always cut it---or plant it! he he

I've also got another soil-jar test going in the meantime to make darn sure I use a good one this time.


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## Miss Fishy (May 13, 2006)

I've posted the plans in the DIY section.

I must get some long tweezers sometime. They sound great. At the moment I use two bamboo skewer taped together to plant tiny plants and it works alright. I leave a small section of one end un-taped and use it to grab the plant, then use another skewer to push it into the substrate.

I'm sorry to hear that you are not so well, javalee. My big tank project has had so many setbacks over the past four years that I've lost count. In the end it has turned out for the best because during that time I've gained valuable experience with soil-based tanks. I can't believe it now, but four years ago I was all ready to set it up as a high-tech tank with CO2 and the lot! I was very worried about how I would cope with the maintenance of such a huge tank, but then during a period when I was too sick to start setting it up I discovered _Ecology of the Planted Aquarium_ and the rest, as they say, is history!

From Alex.


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## javalee (May 8, 2006)

Yes, as i was "out of commission" for the past 6 days, I thought maybe I shouldn't start such a large tank when I have health issues that detain me for weeks at a time, but then I thought that, hey, what better than a natural, soil-based tank for someone like me. Once it's set up, if I go through a bad spell, the only thing it could need at worst would be evaporation replacement. 

I've even found it interesting how the "aquascape" of my 10g has changed since I often can't trim and prune just when it needs it, it tends to run away with itself and rearrange itself as plants spread to areas where I wouldn't have placed them myself. It's constantly evolving.

I found sb483's post "El natural saved me so much $$$" encouraging since it speaks of having a 55g full of amazons and livebearers that only needed a thinning of the amazons occasionally. Besides, there's nothing better than having a beautiful lively tank to watch when you're stuck in bed for days.


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