# Germinating aquatic plant seeds?



## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Hey guys. I was looking for someone that could ship plants to me (Karachi, Pakistan) without the plants dying in the shipping and I came across this. http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free...rass-aquatic-plants-seeds-10g/1116616369.html
It says they ship the seeds and I found the idea very interesting, not to mention cheap. So what do you guys think? Are they easy to germinate from seeds? Or it's just another scam? I'd be happy if I get just one plant out of it.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

It's pretty easy to do with plants that are not obligate aquatics. Just spread them on wet soil and keep them covered and they will germinate. 

It doesn't say what species of plants they sell. The website seems a little off to me too.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

They don't post the species, but they have a list of pictures. With $8 for 18 species of plants, I'm almost willing to risk it being a scam.

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free...rass-aquatic-plants-seeds-10g/1116616369.html

Dump a bunch in a dirt tank and dry start... instant Dutch tank


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## illustrator (Jul 18, 2010)

The photographs show (amongst other plants) moss and _Riccia_, both of which propagate by spores, not seeds. Since spores are dust-like-tiny, my guess would be that it is impractical to ship those. Also, from spores you'd first get a prothallium and I am not sure how easy/difficult it is to get that to produce the "adult" plants.

But who knows what's behind such an advertisement. I am curious if anyone tried to buy these seeds.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

To be honest if I only get 2-3 plants out of this, I'd be happy customer. Plants are this rare here, importing them costs me a fortune and half of the time they die in the shipping. I imported some windelov java fern, it's been 7 months and all the plants are just sitting in my tank, denying to grow. A few even blackened and died, recently two have produced spores and some baby plantlets. So fingers crossed.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

Well I took the bait... I had a credit card with only $8 left on it. I'll let you know what I get in 39 days when it should finally show up.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

I ordered too. But this. http://www.aliexpress.com/item/20-s...sy-to-grow-20pcs-for-each-kind/930036695.html
So how you're planning to grow these? Considering some are true aquatics, they might not go into emersed form.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

Not a clue yet, I was thinking to try my best to sort them if its a mixed bag, then sample some of each in an emersed setup using a dirt base. After some surface and grow, I'll fill it and continue from there.

If it works, I'll probably give most of my seeds away. I'm expecting a mixed bag of hairgrass seeds of various species, but I'm hopeful its more than just bird food.

I was nervous about my Chinese drop checker just the same. It works great, and were only talking about a days worth of coffee money at risk.


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## Cavan Allen (Jul 22, 2004)

You can't collect your own plants?


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

I wouldn't know where to start. What little ditches and swamps and rice fields I've found has nothing but Otellia alismoides, Hydrilla, Nymphae sp, Nelumbo sp, bacopa monnerie, and Najas guadalupensis.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

Hello Tanan,
it may depend on the region within Pakistan (I don't have precise info about that), but you can search in the already mentioned "Flora of Pakistan" (older version: http://www.efloras.org/flora_page.aspx?flora_id=5 newer: http://www.tropicos.org/Project/Pakistan) which aquatic and semi-aquatic species are recorded in the land. But it may be that a number of species isn't common.
Rotala as example:
http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?projectid=32
Rotala indica, the plant that entered the hobby as "Ammania sp. 'Bonsai'": "Rice fields. 300-1800 m alt. Not common". http://www.tropicos.org/Name/19200258?projectid=32
Rotala densiflora: not yet known as aquarium plant. http://www.tropicos.org/Name/19200678?projectid=32


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## pweifan (Jun 23, 2007)

Rotala densiflora looks promising. I'd love to see how that looks in an aquarium.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Already have rotala rotundifolia. Densiflora is in Hazara, Kashmir area. Very far, pretty dangerous.
But that flaura list is great help. Now can you please please tell me some plant specie/family like ammania, crypto, aponogeton etc that I can look up in the search or should look up.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

Rotala indica: I mean the true one, as shown in the Plant Finder, not R. rotundifolia that's erroneously labeled R. indica in the hobby for decades.
You can write or copy-paste a genus name in the search field: http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?projectid=32 The checkbox "Show only names in project" must be activated.

A list of the families: http://www.tropicos.org/RankBrowser.aspx?letter=1&ranklevel=family&projectid=32
and genera: http://www.tropicos.org/RankBrowser.aspx?letter=1&ranklevel=genera&projectid=32
But maybe the Flora doesn't cover all aquatic or amphibious plants occurring in Pakistan, and perhaps some regions aren't thoroughly investigated yet.

Ammania is a frequent misspelling of Amma*nn*ia, some species (and synonyms) are recorded. Interestingly Ammannia senegalensis, known as aquarium plant, is listed here as a synonym of A. auriculata http://www.tropicos.org/Name/19200014?projectid=32

Hygrophila quadrivalvis: http://www.tropicos.org/Name/101665?projectid=32 In the "Flora of China" it's a synonym of H. ringens var. ringens, together with H. angustifolia, lancea and salicifolia. Whether it's a species of its own or not, it might be suitable as aquarium plant.

It's also remarkable that Bacopa is not included in the Flora of Pakistan. It may be that the plant looking like B. monnieri that you've found isn't a Bacopa at all, or that species does occur there but isn't recorded yet by the botanists.

It seems that much of the more interesting stuff occurs rather in the northern provinces indeed


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Mire you're a life saver! I was amazed to not find Egeria, Echinodorus or Cryptocoryne.
I think I should go through the synonymous names list too.
Thanks for everything.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Northern areas have a cooler environment. Also most of it is pretty much inaccessible and left untouched. No water pollution either.


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## illustrator (Jul 18, 2010)

Tanan said:


> I wouldn't know where to start. What little ditches and swamps and rice fields I've found has nothing but Otellia alismoides, Hydrilla, Nymphae sp, Nelumbo sp, bacopa monnerie, and Najas guadalupensis.


Aren't Otellia and Najas south American? Being "far from the regular trade" also has an advantage that you might just find species locally that are potentially very suitable but nobody tried them yet in an aquarium ... I would start with plants that need less light, so either those which grow underneath floating plants or those which get some shadow from trees.

If you can, it would be helpfull to test pH and hardness to have some general idea of the water chemistry at the places where you find plants. Most plants in general trade are species from hard water biotopes because most of us get rather hard water out of the tap. So simply those plants which are expected to survive in the petshop conditions for a while before they are sold. If you find beautifull softwater plants, they might not do so well unless you can offer them similar water in your aquarium (I have no idea what comes out of the tap in your place ...). Most softwater-plants tend to be "species for specialists" for the same reason, although they are often not difficult if you take this in account.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

illustrator said:


> Aren't Otellia and Najas south American?


Najas: almost cosmopolitan genus, but N. guadalupensis is a New World species (it was discussed in a thread about a Najas from Pakistan); Ottelia: also Old World tropical; O. alismoides is also introduced in rice-growing areas in South Europe.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Here are the Otellia and Najas collection from the rice fields.

















































P.S. A friend collected them.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

The Otellia and najas adjusted pretty easily to most water parameters, the lotus didn't though. Turned to mush in days. The other small floating two leaved plant were lost in transport.


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## Tugg (Jul 28, 2013)

Seeds finally showed up. They sent them certified mail and I apparently missed the first two delivery attempts.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Mine hasn't yet.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

Tugg said:


> Seeds finally showed up. They sent them certified mail and I apparently missed the first two delivery attempts.


 That in the left bag looks like seed of common lawn grasses, mixed with fertilizer  Was it ordered as aquatic plant seeds?

@Tanan: I guess that the waterlily is Nymphaea nouchali (= N. stellata): http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=5&taxon_id=250097280 
A N. nouchali from Sri Lanka was imported to Europe, some hobbyists keep it in their tanks: http://www.flowgrow.de/artenbestimmung/unbekannte-seerose-t16685.html
Maybe the waterlily you've found could be better established in culture by collecting the tubers when the plant is in the dormant phase.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Yes Mire, ordered as aquatic plants. That's what I was thinking too. The colored ball looks like ferts. Maybe tug would be kind enough to post pics of all the seeds in that package? Maybe make another thread for the germination process. 
I dont why mine hasn't arrived yet. Pakistan is connected to china by road! What could take it so long?


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

Germinating aquatic plants from seeds is actually very easy. I have a small seed bank of sorts of my emersed grown plants, and ive germinated most of them as well. Of my plants the ones I found the easiest to germinate are:hygrophila lancea, lindernia sp. india, polygonum sp (persicaria, kawagoeanum, etc.) i could never get my crypts to send up a spathe but i know someone who grows a bunch of them in hydroponic flats and when they send up spathes he puts in a bunch of fruit flies or fungus gnats and he gets crytocoryne seeds. Anubias seeds are possible too but ive never heard of anyone drying them out for long term; theyre all planted after collecting the seeds from the pods.


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

To germinate the seeds just get some substrate and put in water so that theres a very thin film of water right below the surface and just put the seeds on. alternatively ive also germinated the seeds on just wet paper towels and transferred them when they got bigger. ive never germinated them underwater since obviously they float. Id germinate them emersed and then transfer to submersed later.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

Just on wet paper towel?! How? Man you need to document it. I couldn't find any stuff on aquatic plant germination except someone here who germinated some erios.


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

Yeah, when i first got seeds from my plants i didnt know what to do with them but i figured seeds are seeds so i just put them on a wet paper towel in a plastic ziplock bag and blew in some air so thered be co2. sealed the bag and they grew into seedlings. this way isnt that great though because the roots embed themselves in the paper towel and its near impossible to separate the roots. i recommend just getting a small clear plastic bottle or glass jar with lid and put in some soil or substrate put in water so that its wetter than just moist but not saturated either. (too wet and you get mold/fungus which will kill the seedling) and put it in a place with light but dont let it overheat!!
one of the apc moderators, asukawashere, also has plants that go to seed very frequently. She doesnt collect the seeds though, she lets them fall to the soil and grow into new plants. Seeds are definitely viable for aquatic plants but we probaby dont see them because it takes too much work to collect all those seeds and selling seeds is an odd concept the hobby isnt really set to accept when you could just buy plant clippings/trimmings.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

@Tanan: anyway there's no clear-cut difference between aquatic and non-aquatic plant. Aquarium-suitable plants are a motley bunch of disparate plant types. 
I've noticed that e.g. Persicaria "Kawagoeanum" and Lindernia rotundifolia spontaneously germinate and grow well in normal, only moderately moist soil (there are weedy, common Persicaria (knotweed) species, perhaps also in your area, even backyard), I think they can also be seen as terrestrial plants tolerating wetness and flooding. 
At the other end of the scale are extreme aquatics like Ottelia, their seeds need to be covered with water for germinating because their seedlings can't grow emersed.

But back to the China shipment - if it contains others than lawn seed (apart from the cabbage seed) and the coloured balls are really ferts (and not pelleted seeds), I'd separate the seed from the ferts and rinse it before sowing.


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## Tanan (Mar 11, 2009)

@Mire: I was thinking aquatic plants on the line of true aquatic plants like vals and aponogetons. I do have had aponogetons to flower, seed and produce plants in my tank. 
I'm trying to locate some local ditches, swamps and lakes that are left somehow untouched. It's hard to find any freshwater bodies in Karachi. Our boring's and well gives brackish/saltwater. I'm thinking of organizing a small group trip to some ditches in March/April. I think spring is a good time to look for plants. No?
My shipment has yet to arrive. We need @Tugg to find out more about the seeds at the moment.


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## totziens (Jun 28, 2008)

Yes, the blue ones are definitely fertilisers. I have seen those being used by my mother-in-law in her garden. I am not sure of the ingredients. So, it's unknown whether it's harmful or not to the fishes. I agree with miremonster's suggestion to separate the seeds from the ferts.


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## miremonster (Mar 26, 2006)

totziens said:


> Yes, the blue ones are definitely fertilisers. I have seen those being used by my mother-in-law in her garden. I am not sure of the ingredients. So, it's unknown whether it's harmful or not to the fishes. I agree with miremonster's suggestion to separate the seeds from the ferts.


Yes, customary mineralic NPK garden ferts here in Europe looks alike, the blue stuff is called "Blaukorndünger" (blue grain fertilizer) in German. 
Maybe a mix for sowing lawn or meadow outdoors incl. starter ferts, so probably the content of the shipment can be used to make a nice cabbage patch bordered by grass  The longish seed looks to me like that of common temperate grasses (Festuca, Poa, Lolium etc) but I don't know what the big dark and small yellow grains are (seed?), we'll see.



Tanan said:


> I'm trying to locate some local ditches, swamps and lakes that are left somehow untouched. It's hard to find any freshwater bodies in Karachi. Our boring's and well gives brackish/saltwater. I'm thinking of organizing a small group trip to some ditches in March/April. I think spring is a good time to look for plants. No?


Surely interesting! Is there a possibility to find folks knowing the local flora, botanists or so? Favorable time: I can't really judge that for your area, it's dry period in the spring months, not? Maybe several aquatic or semi-aquatic plants are still dormant or dried, but probably still seed-bearing then. It's surely paying to have a thorough look at every green stuff, also when it looks boring at first glance, in all zones that are at least regularly flooded during the moist period.


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## alanle (May 8, 2013)

Wrap them up with a bagb

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## Abhijit (Aug 18, 2015)

Hello to all the experts,
I am very new in all the aquarium stuff, recently I bought some seeds on ebay and followed the instructions given to germinate ,according to there instruction plants will grow upto 2-3 inches in 8-10 days after which they can be transferred into the aquarium.

Attaching a snap of my plants after 15 days 

1) Are my plants dead?
2)Are they good enough to transfer them into an aquarium?
3)if yes what is the right process of doing that 

Thank you in advance.


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