# ADA substrates



## morefishies (Aug 29, 2006)

I was looking at adgshop.com and I'm interested in the ADA substrates, just a little confused on what would be best for me. 

I'm planning out a 10 gallon heavily planted aquarium that will have corydoras habrosus (pygmy cory), boraras maculatus (dwarf rasbora), and cherry shrimp. 

The substrate (or at least the top layer of the substrate) shoudl be very fine so that the corys can play/sift/dig through it without wearing down their barbels. But the substrate should be good for plants and also something that won't create anaerobic areas (but malaysian trumpet snails might solve this anyways). 

Since I am a beginner I am getting beginner plants (crypt walkeri, java ferns, blood stargrass, japanese fans, dwarf onion plants, sagittaria subulata etc). I will not have CO2 injections and as far as lighting I will have 2 watts per gallon. 

I hope this is enough info for you to get an idea of my setup and help me out a bit. I'm just not sure if I should get power sand, aqua soil, decorative sand, or a mix of any of those. Also what substrate additives do you suggest, if any? I'll do a fishless cycle once the tank is set up but is there something I can get to speed/help the process? 

Sorry for the rambling. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

The decorative sand is for just that, decoration. Unless you want an open 'beach' area you can scratch that off of your shopping list.

Personally I would go with one 9 liter bag of Aquasoil Amazonia. I'm not a big fan of the Powersand layer underneath anymore as it tends to get uprooted and pulled to the top no matter how careful I am. The substrate is very soft in texture so there is no need to worry about your Cories. You will want to setup the tank for about 4-6 weeks before adding any of the fauna to give the tank a chance to cycle properly. 

Also, with a tank that small you could add DIY CO2. Even easy plants benefit from CO2 addition.


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

Make sure the tank isn't so heavily planted that the cories don't have ground room to explore around on.

I've never personally used AquaSoil, but I'd venture a guess that a small bag of the powder type would be nice to have as your top layer for the cories. By the way, the effects of AquaSoil are supposed to make your maculatus really color up, so that's something to look forward to. =]

Like Aaron said, AquaSoil apparently leaches ammonia for the first 4-6 reads according to what I've read, and there's nothing you can do about that unfortunately. You won't have to add anything to Aquasoil. It has everything you'll need for a long while. Also, adding DIY CO2 will benefit the plants just like Aaron said. There are some CO2 mixtures that reportedly last up to a month that I've never tried, but if you can do that, the tank should still stay relatively low maintenance in terms of CO2.

Are you sure you only want 2 watts per gallon? With smaller tanks (<20 gallons) the WPG rule does not apply as nicely. I'm running a 28W fixture over my ten gallon tank that is going to be replaced this week with a 36W fixture, and a lot of plants that I could sustain with 65W in my 20 gallon withered away when I transferred them to the 10 gallon. I understand that you want to go with easy plants, but even 2 watts per gallon might not cut it for them. Try the 28W fixture perhaps? www.hellolights.com has a coralife one for a good price.

In terms of filtration, I just bought a Zoomed 501 turtle canister filter, and it is awesome. Look into that if you want to spend a little extra money for less surface agitation (if you end up injecting CO2 I guess).

Other than that, I like how you're stocking your tank =]. I've got 17 boraras brigittae coming from Mark Denaro at anubiasdesign, and am on the lookout for 5-6 more corydoras habrosus to add to my existing 3. If you live in SoCal and know a source for the habrosus, let me know


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## morefishies (Aug 29, 2006)

First things first: I'm probably getting my c. habrosus from Arizona Aquatic Gardens (they are the only well-organized, experienced place with habrosus that I've been able to find). Here's their website: http://www.azgardens.com/corys_loaches.php
But locally (i'm in so cal too) I've heard that West Coast Aquarium (818 881 2833) and Tokyo Aquarium (323 735 7553) sometimes stock habrosus but I don't think they do at the moment. Also, I've never been to either of those places, just from online research they are the only places I could find.

As far as lighting/Co2: I've researched the diy co2 a tad. The 2 liter yeast/sugar/water deal looks doable, its only when it gets to the actually diffusement into the water that I've found a lot of controversary. It seemed I wouldn't get away with a good, trustworthy diy co2 system for less that 50 bucks... eek. 
And as far as lighting, my tank came with a hood with two small screw ins for smaller lights and the most watts I've found on the smaller lights where 10 each. so 2 bulbs = 2 watts per gallon.

And i was just looking to set up a peaceful little tank for under $200... silly me. 

suggestions?? lemme know

thanks for the help so far


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

$50.00 for DIY CO2? I wonder what article you read? All you need is a 2 liter bottle w/ cap, some airline, yeast, sugar, baking soda and a little know-how. Drill a hole in the top of the bottle cap that is just smaller than the airline. Cut the end of the airline at an angle so you have a point that you can use to pull it through the whole that is slightly too small. Use 1 cup sugar, 1/4 tsp. yeast (not fast rising, just the regular kind) and 1 tsp. baking soda and mix in lukewarm water until the bottle is about 2/3 full. Put the cap with airline back on and feed the other end of the line into the intake of whatever filter you have on the tank. The CO2 will enter the filter, be diffused by the impeller and enter the tank. You will want to use a check valve inline as well. Total cost ~ $5.00 max.


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## Aquadise (Jul 26, 2006)

morefishies said:


> First things first: I'm probably getting my c. habrosus from Arizona Aquatic Gardens (they are the only well-organized, experienced place with habrosus that I've been able to find). Here's their website: http://www.azgardens.com/corys_loaches.php


Better double check before you buy with them...:-?


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## morefishies (Aug 29, 2006)

AaronT said:


> $50.00 for DIY CO2? I wonder what article you read? All you need is a 2 liter bottle w/ cap, some airline, yeast, sugar, baking soda and a little know-how. Drill a hole in the top of the bottle cap that is just smaller than the airline. Cut the end of the airline at an angle so you have a point that you can use to pull it through the whole that is slightly too small. Use 1 cup sugar, 1/4 tsp. yeast (not fast rising, just the regular kind) and 1 tsp. baking soda and mix in lukewarm water until the bottle is about 2/3 full. Put the cap with airline back on and feed the other end of the line into the intake of whatever filter you have on the tank. The CO2 will enter the filter, be diffused by the impeller and enter the tank. You will want to use a check valve inline as well. Total cost ~ $5.00 max.


thats easy enough.  sure i'll give that a shot. i guess i just didn't know you can feed it into the filter. how much co2 to i put in? 1 bubble every 4 seconds??? something like that?

aquadise, uhoh, am i missing something? certainly don't wanna buy from the wrong place... but they seemed pretty good plus i've talked to the guy via e-mail and seen other people discuss buying from them in other forums and they seem like a good place.


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

Another member of this forum purchased from them, and got a lot of substitutions without prior notification. I think more than a few of the habrosus he ordered were replaced with pygmaeus. Also, from what I remember, someone local tried picking up an order from them, but they didn't let him into their facilities and instead arranged for a separate meeting spot. Hm.

Anyway, are your lights Compact Flourescents or just Flourescents? If they're not Compact Flourescents, you are probably gonna have a real tough time, even with low maintenance plants. $200 for a ten gallon tank? I wish =[. Lights alone cost me 70 bucks, and the Zoomed canister filter was 30 bucks. A hundred bucks right there, excluding substrate, heater, glass top, tank, plants, and livestock =O


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

morefishies said:


> thats easy enough.  sure i'll give that a shot. i guess i just didn't know you can feed it into the filter. how much co2 to i put in? 1 bubble every 4 seconds??? something like that?


Whatever that mixture produces is what goes in. It's a slow reaction so you shouldn't have to worry about ODing on the CO2. If you are worried about that you can start with 1/8 tsp. of yeast instead of 1/4 tsp. and work up to it if you find you need more.


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## Salt (Apr 5, 2005)

morefishies said:


> aquadise, uhoh, am i missing something? certainly don't wanna buy from the wrong place... but they seemed pretty good plus i've talked to the guy via e-mail and seen other people discuss buying from them in other forums and they seem like a good place.


Actually, there have been quite a large number of posts and threads from people who had negative experiences with AAZ. The problem is, most of these threads get deleted. Not that I blame the administrators, who likely don't want to have to spend time and money defending themselves in case legal issues arise.


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## morefishies (Aug 29, 2006)

erijnal said:


> Another member of this forum purchased from them, and got a lot of substitutions without prior notification. I think more than a few of the habrosus he ordered were replaced with pygmaeus. Also, from what I remember, someone local tried picking up an order from them, but they didn't let him into their facilities and instead arranged for a separate meeting spot. Hm.





Salt said:


> Actually, there have been quite a large number of posts and threads from people who had negative experiences with AAZ. The problem is, most of these threads get deleted. Not that I blame the administrators, who likely don't want to have to spend time and money defending themselves in case legal issues arise.


huh, good to know. i'll try to plan on getting my livestock elsewhere then. i know anubiasdesign has boraras maculatus and better bettas have habrosus... or at least they are getting a shipment in soon. are these places safe??

thanks for all the help.


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## erijnal (Apr 5, 2006)

From my experience, I'd say that BetterBettas is good. They included an extra fish with my order. AnubiasDesign is also a reputable seller


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## Wood (Jul 27, 2006)

OK. DIY CO2 is very simple. I use a 20ounce plastic coke bottle with Yeast, sugar, and water. I run the tube inside of my tank, underneath the gravel (for aesthetic purposes), and poke the tube just outside of the substrate. At the end of the tube is a basic airstone. I use the "bell method" right overhead of the airstone I have a small piece of plastic that collects the CO2 and forms one big bubble that actually diffuses rather fast. There are some disadvantages to the bell method though. Sometimes the giant bubble will pop out of the bell and not diffuse. Basically diffusing the CO2 with DIY is the hard part....

As far as lighting I HIGHLY suggest you put that screw in hood back over your tank. Get rid of that coralife, its out of date. Go to Home Depot and purchase "Daylight Compacy Flourescent Bulbs". They come in all different wattages. I bought 2x 27watt screw-in for my 10 gallon. They are 5500k. Each costs $6. For 12 dollars you can have an excellent lighting system. Dont get fancy with other stuff. With a 10 gallon and screw in hood this is all you will need.

Here is my 10 gallon. Cost me around $40 for substrate, DIY CO2, and lighting:

My 10 gallon


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## morefishies (Aug 29, 2006)

alright. a couple last questions just for my clarification. 

i plan on aquascaping with the ADA techniques as inspiration. instead of putting a line of rocks between the foreground and background, however, i want to put the line of rocks to cut off a back corner of the tank so my habrosus will have at least 65% of the substrate to explore without running into heavily planted areas. 

as far as the substrate to use... so aquasoil it is. i know most people use amazonia but since a lot of my substrate will be exposed i dunno if i should use a lighter decorative sand or if you recommend a dark substrate anyways. 

also, i hear that i should use the regular sized gravel so as not to compact the roots of plants. but, the surface should be a sand for the cories. but wouldn't sand over gravel cause anaerobic areas to form? how would i clean the gravel without mixing all my substrates together or bringing up any of the good bacteria in my substrate? 

thanks


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## Ajax (Apr 3, 2006)

The latest trend is to seperate the Aquasoil from the decorative sand in the foreground using card board. There are threads in the aquascaping forum that describe this, and if you order the Aquasoil from ADG you should get an ADA catalog that has very detailed step-by-step instructions.


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## sherry (Sep 30, 2005)

I have had only very good dealings with Arizona Aquatic GArdens.. and if you don't want substitutions just tell them. They have been more than reasonable with me. They have been generous. When I lost a large number of fish due ot a tank disaster, NOT AZGardens fault at all, the owner still sent me a huge shipment as a gift, just because I had the disaster. Give them a chance. Just be very clear about what you want. I really do think highly of these people!!!


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