# Change from FO to planted tank?



## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

What do I need to do to change my Tank setup:FO 58 Gal,Fluval 404,8 watt UV,Azoo backup air pump,2-30 watt light,3" natural stone media to a planted tank?

As which plants and fish are good to start with? 
Tank hardware setup next?


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## evercl92 (Aug 14, 2006)

are you talking FW or SW?


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## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

I'm not sure what a FO tank is. 

There's a good sticky reference in the New to Plants section.

However, you'll need some more light 2.0 watts per gallon of Compact Flourescent light. No air pumps, maybe pressurized CO2 if you are going to have a heavily, high tech tank, and potentially new substrate finer grain substrate like Eco complete or Flourite

I suggest you take a look at ahsupply.com for lighting needs. a 2x55 watt kit will do the trick. The Fluval 404 is perfect, and the UV is good too, but not absolutely necessary for some.

Good plants to start with are Java ferns, anubias, and other classified "easy plants". A foreground of sags can be easily accomplished. See the Plantfinder (top left gold toolbar for more options).

Have fun, and good luck! Welcome to APC! 

-John N.


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## Cassie (May 27, 2006)

John N. said:


> I'm not sure what a FO tank is.


more commonly used when discussing saltwater tanks, FO is a fish only tank


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

The fish were I gone to said that is also used in freshwater as a fish tank with no live plants if that is wrong please tell me the right way!

John n.
Thank you that is what I am looking for a list of plant safe fish is there one that this site has made or can someone make one to help me with more names?
Also why no air pumps what do you do when the power goes out to keep the water moving that is why I got that pump.


The new substrate finer grain substrate like Eco complete or Flourite why what is in it?

Is there a good guide books to read that you all have? I know there is alot out there I do not have years to read them all.

And thanks everyone else for your help I will have alot more questions.


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> Also why no air pumps what do you do when the power goes out to keep the water moving that is why I got that pump.


Air pumps will outgas CO2 which you want in your water for your plants. Most planted tank folks use cannister filters keeping turbulence at a minimum. Some folks with high CO2 do use air pumps at night when lights are out.



> The new substrate finer grain substrate like Eco complete or Flourite why what is in it?


You want finer grained substrates to hold down small plant roots. There are several 'plant specific' type substrates. Do a search.

Here's a couple of references which should be of help to you:
DFW Aquatic Plant Club Articles-- Beginner Basics: Introduction
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/new-to-aquarium-plants/14684-new-tank-set-up-parts-1-a.html
Rex's Guide to Planted Tanks


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

Bert H said:


> Air pumps will outgas CO2 which you want in your water for your plants. Most planted tank folks use cannister filters keeping turbulence at a minimum. Some folks with high CO2 do use air pumps at night when lights are out.
> 
> You want finer grained substrates to hold down small plant roots. There are several 'plant specific' type substrates. Do a search.
> 
> ...


Thank you this will help alot to start now I how to go read now thank you again.

Now is there a list of species to avoid of fish?


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## onemyndseye (May 12, 2006)

On fish to avoid...

Mostly youll just want to avoid fish that have big apeitites for plant matter. Nibbling is ok as it will be replaced with fresh growth.

Also avoid fish that dig in the subtrate. (i.e. cichlids) 

Alot of different kinds of plecos can do alot of damage when wrasping at the leaves when eating algea.

Good Luck! 
-Justin
One Mynds Eye


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

This is just my opinion, but I like to use only cheap, easy to keep fish. I really enjoy both guppies and platys, which have the added benefit of breeding profusely. Then a few otocinclus will help keep down some of the algae, and a couple or so small loaches, like the botia striata, will keep the snails under control. At the moment, my tank only has guppies, a couple of cardinal tetras, an otocinclus and a cory cat.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

Bert H said:


> Air pumps will outgas CO2 which you want in your water for your plants. Most planted tank folks use cannister filters keeping turbulence at a minimum. Some folks with high CO2 do use air pumps at night when lights are out.
> 
> You want finer grained substrates to hold down small plant roots. There are several 'plant specific' type substrates. Do a search.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this to read.
The Carbsea ECO-Complete I see they make differant bags mixes of that which one is it that you all talking about and how deep do you all have it and is it 100% only of that or that I read a 50/50 mixture of corse sand and ECO-complete?
Is there a chart to show how many lbs for tank sizes to inches?


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> The Carbsea ECO-Complete I see they make differant bags mixes of that which one is it that you all talking about and how deep do you all have it and is it 100% only of that or that I read a 50/50 mixture of corse sand and ECO-complete?


 I don't think they make different 'bag mixes'. What they have is a range of particle sizes in the bag which settle out nicely in your tank when you use it.

As far as depth, I go with 2-3 inch depth, the higher amount towards the rear, if possible. Typically, I've found one bag per about 10gal will get you in the ball park.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

Bert H said:


> I don't think they make different 'bag mixes'. What they have is a range of particle sizes in the bag which settle out nicely in your tank when you use it.
> 
> As far as depth, I go with 2-3 inch depth, the higher amount towards the rear, if possible. Typically, I've found one bag per about 10gal will get you in the ball park.


I took the big fish as silver dollars and the others the the LFS so I can start out right has to you all helped me about fish.
At the LFS I saw eco-complete cichlid substrate black and white in color it has aragonite in it for higher ph I did not get that as Rex said not to get that with aragonite in it bad he wrote.
I got straight Eco-complete black and a bag of Flourite and mixed it with Caribsea Super Naturals sand Riogrande 1-5 mm so it will not be so dark.
Put down as Rex said peat moss first then put the others on top all about 2-3inches depth.
Plants - crypt wendtii,& spiratis/java lace, & moss/anubias barteri/jungle vallisneria I hope these are good that I picked!
Now as to light what is the size for a 36"L x 18"d x 21"H tank should have for the plants I know about watts per gallon put Rex said about Lux is more important he lost me how to find that out with the figures.


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

The easy way to pick out a light is to go by the watts per gallon, with 2 - 2.5 being in the ball park for a 58 gallon tank, or 120 - 150 watts, but only if you use PC or T5 bulbs with good reflectors. The higher the wattage above that the more algae problems you can have. But, much lower than that limits your ability to grow some plants. Lux may well be more important than watts, but bulbs rarely have a lux rating, while they always have a watt rating. And, this isn't a critical factor anyway.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

hoppycalif said:


> The easy way to pick out a light is to go by the watts per gallon, with 2 - 2.5 being in the ball park for a 58 gallon tank, or 120 - 150 watts, but only if you use PC or T5 bulbs with good reflectors. The higher the wattage above that the more algae problems you can have. But, much lower than that limits your ability to grow some plants. Lux may well be more important than watts, but bulbs rarely have a lux rating, while they always have a watt rating. And, this isn't a critical factor anyway.


Ok which AH supply bright kit would that come close too?
Can you please tell me sorry to be a pain the others here on the site said to ask before you get in to problems. 
What do you run is the filter as a setup for my 404?
Times of water changes for a planted tank?
What water tests do I need and do not need to look for eveyone I read has a differant way and waht brand works for you?
What do you feed the plantes?


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

For AHS light kits, you could use two 55 watt kits, and know any algae problems will occur slow enough for you to correct the conditions causing them, but with possible problems trying to grow low growing plants or high light plants. Or, you could use two 96 watt kits, and be able to grow anything you please, but algae problems would occur quickly, grow rapidly, and be a bigger headache to correct. If it were me I would probably use the 96 watt kits.

This, http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/...zing/15225-estimative-index-dosing-guide.html
is a good place to go to figure out what fertilizers to use, how often and how much, plus how often and how much water changing to do.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

Thank you for that help.
I have a well with a water softner is the water ok for the plants from the water softner or straight for the well it has alot of red iron and phosphate but it is 7.0 ph.
This potassium permanganate does a pet company make small bottles under a company name product that I read to clean the plants of snails I can not find it only as a pond farms product in big sizes or what do you do for snails?

The peat moss I did not read that anywhere what does that do and if i have put a little more than a thin layer will that be bad?


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

I'm going to offer up a different suggestion for lights here. Your tank is 36" long - that's the exact size for an ahs 96W kit set up. The 55W kits will not give you total coverage side to side in the tank. I have a 50gal breeder tank which is 36". I have the 96W kit and a separate 30W standard flourescent strip as my lighting. It works well for me.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

Bert H said:


> I'm going to offer up a different suggestion for lights here. Your tank is 36" long - that's the exact size for an ahs 96W kit set up. The 55W kits will not give you total coverage side to side in the tank. I have a 50gal breeder tank which is 36". I have the 96W kit and a separate 30W standard flourescent strip as my lighting. It works well for me.


I would have put the two 55w end to end over lapping in the middle as I saw other light companies do there fixtures.
Now is the 96 and 30 both 6700k?
But as you said would that make more algae as you said before with too much light?
How many plants of what can be planted in the tank would over take the algae problem?
I read as to fertilizer do you put in slow release in the media what do you do?


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## Bert H (Mar 2, 2004)

> Now is the 96 and 30 both 6700k?


The 96W is 6700K, the 30W is a strip I got at the lfs, and don't remember what it was rated at.



> But as you said would that make more algae as you said before with too much light?


For a 58gal tank, 126W of lighting is not too much light - just a little over 2wpg.



> How many plants of what can be planted in the tank would over take the algae problem?


It's not a matter of overtaking algae, it's having a large plant mass, preferably fast growers to start with, and giving the plants all they need to grow healthily from the beginning.



> I read as to fertilizer do you put in slow release in the media what do you do?


Go back and re-read those references which were referred to you. They cover how to start, what's needed and guidelines for fertilizing. You can use dry ferts from Greg Watson or premixed ones like the stuff Seachem sells. They all work.


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

No one addressed your question about well water. You'll probably want to bypass the softener for filling your tank. To control hardness some people will do a combination of well water and RO water. 

Your thought to overlap the two bulbs is not bad. It will work. There are 65W bulbs and/or fixtures that could give you a little more light. Otherwise, a single 96W and a smaller 30W or something would work well, too. Lot's of options!

Peat moss gives bacteria something to feed on in the substrate. That, and mulm from an established tank/filter, will give you a head start on your tank being stable. That and lots of plants which you're already getting ready for.

Potassium permangenate isn't required, but isn't a bad idea for killing stuff before it gets in your tank. If you're consistent, you may never need fish like loaches to clear out snails.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

thank you boyh again for your help.

I looked at the web site of AH supply bright kit again the two 55 with the reflector put out 2 1/2 times more so the two 55 will =178 watts 3 wpg
The 96 plus the 30 will = 185 watts 3.18 wpg as to AH supply site. Not much differants then two 55's use less electric.

fertilizing I will do that.

Water I will also do that.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

turbomkt said:


> No one addressed your question about well water. You'll probably want to bypass the softener for filling your tank. To control hardness some people will do a combination of well water and RO water.
> 
> Your thought to overlap the two bulbs is not bad. It will work. There are 65W bulbs and/or fixtures that could give you a little more light. Otherwise, a single 96W and a smaller 30W or something would work well, too. Lot's of options!
> 
> ...


tubomkt,
I got the 2-65 kit put on tank works ok I got it also because the 65 bulbs are cheaper then 96 bulbs big jump $.
Thank you for telling me about the others no one I think only you know about that to give me a answer.

Also do you put a fan for to cool the lights on retrofits?


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## turbomkt (Mar 31, 2004)

I put a fan on my DIY hood with 2x13W over a 10g and it made a real difference.


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## fishtk75 (Sep 6, 2006)

turbomkt said:


> I put a fan on my DIY hood with 2x13W over a 10g and it made a real difference.


Will do thank for your help again


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