# [Wet Thumb Forum]-55 gal with Potted Plants



## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Hi Fellow Fishkeepers,

Here is my new 55 gal that I set up two months ago. It has over 20 plant species in it. I set it up with potted plants from two other tanks and new ones I got from our plant club. Some of the Java ferns are growing on lava rocks. Lighting is the usual two 40 watt fluorescent bulbs, but tank gets shaded light from a big North-facing window.

For all those of you who are interested in water and energy conservation, I haven't changed water since the day I set tank up two months ago. 

Almost no algae. The theory is that the plants were all happy in their pots when I moved them into tank. They adjusted immediately and prevented algae growth


For "artistic purposes", I also put 6 regular clay bricks in a row along back side of tank. This really helped in giving plants more room and adding a little dimension to tank. I put pots with the plants I wanted to grow emergent on the bricks. 

I'd like to again plug emergent plants: Note the Water Sprite growing enthusiasticaly at surface. Also, Rotala macrandra (red stem plant) is growing well at surface. I kept water 6 inches below top for first month to help emergent plant growth. As stems elongated, I raised water level. Bricks also helped to get them closer to the water surface.

The rest of tank bottom is covered with a light scattering of gravel (anything deeper that 1/4 inch will go anaerobic and cause major problems).

Tanks with potted plants are nice. And its fun to move pots and rocks around, add new pots, etc


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Hi Fellow Fishkeepers,

Here is my new 55 gal that I set up two months ago. It has over 20 plant species in it. I set it up with potted plants from two other tanks and new ones I got from our plant club. Some of the Java ferns are growing on lava rocks. Lighting is the usual two 40 watt fluorescent bulbs, but tank gets shaded light from a big North-facing window.

For all those of you who are interested in water and energy conservation, I haven't changed water since the day I set tank up two months ago. 

Almost no algae. The theory is that the plants were all happy in their pots when I moved them into tank. They adjusted immediately and prevented algae growth


For "artistic purposes", I also put 6 regular clay bricks in a row along back side of tank. This really helped in giving plants more room and adding a little dimension to tank. I put pots with the plants I wanted to grow emergent on the bricks. 

I'd like to again plug emergent plants: Note the Water Sprite growing enthusiasticaly at surface. Also, Rotala macrandra (red stem plant) is growing well at surface. I kept water 6 inches below top for first month to help emergent plant growth. As stems elongated, I raised water level. Bricks also helped to get them closer to the water surface.

The rest of tank bottom is covered with a light scattering of gravel (anything deeper that 1/4 inch will go anaerobic and cause major problems).

Tanks with potted plants are nice. And its fun to move pots and rocks around, add new pots, etc


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

Looks good, I guess with the plants in pots no one asks you "are those plants real?"


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## Kolkri (May 15, 2004)

With pots do you use the same 1 to 1 1/2 soil and gravel layers? Or do you use more soil for these?


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## imported_Piscesgirl (Feb 19, 2004)

Looks really cool, Diana!


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## Maurici (May 31, 2004)

The plants look fantastic, Diana. What about the K and Fe needs? 
Yours. Maurici.


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## Ben C (Apr 16, 2006)

just wondering if you've ever considered doing any sort of aquascaping with the pots themselves? i mean, what about arranging three into a triangle arrangement and placing a fourth on top, in the middle of the three. 
you could do layers of pots at different heights that way, rather than just having them all sit on the bottom like they're waiting to be sold. 

Also, you could tie the whole thing together by having something like glosso or some sort of moss carpet the bottom and up the sides of the pots. Might look more like a garden that way too. 

just my thoughts. I just think it need something MORE, tho its a good basis for something interesting an unique.

BEN


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## hubbahubbahehe (Mar 29, 2004)

Ben C, I have to say that is such a great idea!!!! And what a novel one at that, cuz i've never heard of it before, but it's so clever!!! KUDOS!!!







The picture that Ben gave me is something like how a garden is with pots of trees and bushes artistically spread out..


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## Ben C (Apr 16, 2006)

if you were after a non-aquatic garden look (which Diana has in no way implied BTW!) you could even throw in some small garden tools or something and have them become covered in moss etc. I dunno, a small trowel or fork for use in window boxes might look quite cool. The observer would see a common site, but entirely aquatic. 

this look has more potential than i realised!!


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Kolkri:
> With pots do you use the same 1 to 1 1/2 soil and gravel layers? Or do you use more soil for these?


I use about 1 and 1/2 inch of soil.

I plug the bottom hole of pot with a small stone and then add a little gravel. Then I add the soil. I put the plant in and try to bury the roots. Then I add a thin layer of gravel. Usually, I put the pots with plants into a bucket of water for a few minutes to get rid of some soil turbidity before adding pots to the main tank.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Ben C:
> just wondering if you've ever considered doing any sort of aquascaping with the pots themselves? i mean, what about arranging three into a triangle arrangement and placing a fourth on top, in the middle of the three.
> ...


Hey, I wish I could envision what you see and possible aquascaping arrangements, but I truly have trouble with artistic concepts. Putting the back row of pots on bricks was my concession to "artistry".

If the plants grow, the fish are happy, and I don't have to do much work, then I am blissfully content.

I am delighted to leave artistic arrangements up to those who are more energetic and artistic.


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## Kolkri (May 15, 2004)

Not as many pots as you have but I still have some plants that have been in the gravel 9months and just dont wont to move them as long as they do well. Some of the pots look like they have nothing in the but they do have bulbs in them that have not sprouted yet. And I need more plants but this is what I have so far.
Had to do a it from the side cause of the foil I have on the back to help with the lighting. This is just and trail to see how that works. This tank is not by a window and I wanted a way to make as much as I could out of my lighting. Only 32 wats of light on this tank.


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Diana Walstad:
> 
> I plug the bottom hole of pot with a small stone and then add a little gravel. Then I add the soil. I put the plant in and try to bury the roots. Then I add a thin layer of gravel. Usually, I put the pots with plants into a bucket of water for a few minutes to get rid of some soil turbidity before adding pots to the main tank.


Another thrick that works really well is to use a paper towel. What you do is take a dry towel and a dry pot and line the bottom of the plant pot with a whole paper towel do not fold the towel, but rather leave it so that the excess is hanging out over the top fill it with your dirt and then plant. After you plant fold the towel over on top of the dirt and around the stem, then cover with a little bit of gravel. works great.

I used to do this quite a bit with crypts and swords that I would sell at fish club auctions. When I would go to sell them I would just remove the gravel and pull the towel right out along with all the dirt and roots. I would then rinse the whole thing out under a stream of water in my utility sink and just be left with a nice plant with a huge bunch of nice white roots. The nice roots always got me big $$$$


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Wally,

Using paper towels is a great idea! Thanks. 
I will try this out next time I do some repotting.


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

Thanks,

I wish I could take credit for the idea, but I can not. I got that idea from a speaker at a fish club named Bob Cashin.


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## Chris J (Oct 7, 2003)

Just a quick question: So those are aquatic plants in rockwool, or some inert growing medium in clay pots? Am I correct?


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

Chris,

It's potting soil in the pots


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## Nillo (Jun 11, 2005)

I use 1.5" terra cotta pots in my low tech plant propagation/guppy factories. The small pots make it easier to arrange the plants in an aesthetically pleasing manner.

I like the idea of paper towels. How long do they last in the water?


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Maurici:
> The plants look fantastic, Diana. What about the K and Fe needs?
> Yours. Maurici.


Thanks and sorry that I missed this earlier important question. Since I don't add fertilizers, I assume that plants get what they need from fishfood and the soil in the pots (I use either garden soil or potting soil) . In my book, I explained how fishfood and soil can provide all plant nutrients.

The tank is now into 3-4 months with no water changes since setup.


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Nillo:
> 
> I like the idea of paper towels. How long do they last in the water?


I have had them last for at least a year, I usually pull out the plant before that and sell them though. But the ones I had for a year still looked like they could go for another year or two. For what its worth, I use the cheapest paper towels I can find.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

Interesting. I'm assuming you'll let the mulm build up in the bottom of the tank? Did you see any ammonia or nitrIte or did it handle the fish load from the beginning? Also, do you expect to see any inhibition from having so many species of plants in the same tank?

I've been wanting to do the natural planted tank thing, but I'm too stocked to do it at the present... plus too broke to buy a bunch of rooted plants.

Here's my 55 gallon goldie tank. It was originally set up in December of last year. It's probably too stocked to do the natural planted tank thang (4 fancy goldies)?? It has an UGF on one half powered by a penguin 330 and a powerhead. I originally bought a bunch of fast growing plants (anacharis, camboba, hornwort) to help with cycling the tankand added 250 watts of DIY 5000K & full spectrum lighting and DIY CO2, but had pea soup, so I cut lighting back to 180 watts.

Then I read your book.









In February, when I first potted the plants, I was trying to leave one side of the tank bare bottom, cuz the goldie geeks on another board I frequent are anti gravel. I potted the anacharis, hornwort, camboba and a val in two clay pots and a plastic container that you stick in the corner of a shower. I used around 2 inches of topsoil substrate and buried a pond fert tab in each, covered by an inch of sand and a layer of fine gravel. I used panty hose material to cover the holes in the pots.









Here's the same tank in at the end of March after I'd added gravel to the barebottom side.









and here's the same tank today. I added more gravel to the potted side, as Lumpy, my big black moor kept getting stuck between the front glass and the corner pot. He's a big clutz. The anacharis rooted great. The camboba didn't last in this tank...the goldies ate it I think... The hornwort seems to prefer to float. The val looks healthy, but is only a couple of inches tall, I think cuz the goldies break off the leaves. There are also various floating plants (frogbit, duckweed and najas grass) plus java fern tied to slate.









The only thing that worries me is that occasionally I see bubbles coming from the corner pot... I haven't noticed it smelling bad or like sulphur. I'm fixing to buy a couple of rooted plants to fill in that pot to make sure it doesn't go anaerobic.

Any suggestions would be appreciated as to what plants to get. I'd prefer a couple of different species that don't inhibit each other and are fast growing (to provide a food source for the goldies and that would provide more plants down the road).

My tank water runs pH 7.6, KH runs between 5 and 8 (I have to buffer weekly with baking soda to keep KH up). GH is 125ppm. I'm doing partial water changes/gravel vac weekly.

I do think the plants are helping with nitrAtes.. I've been wondering to what degree denitrification is at work in the pots? I've been considering setting up a trickle denitrifying filter, but after reading your book again, I'm thinking about adding more potted plants instead.

Here's the 20 gallon tropical tank, right after the potted plants were added in February. It has an UGF powered by a penguin 170 and a powerhead. It only has 15 watts of cool white over it, but it's by a south window so all the plants appear to be happy.









and today








The camboba is doing well potted in this tank as is the anacharis. The java fern and anubias are very happy, as is the najas grass and java fern.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

As to substrates for your Goldfish tank, you added a thick gravel layer to one side of your tank? You will need to vacumn this regularly.

A thick gravel layer (without undergravel filter) will eventually accumulate organic matter and go anaerobic and poison the tank. Thus, I would make sure to vacumn this section frequently and religiously.

Personally, I would remove most of the gravel from this side and find another way to keep Lumpy from getting caught. I think a deep gravel layer without an undergravel filter invites lots of future problems. See the Q&A on page 140 in my book.

Tropical tanks look fine.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

Yea. I vacuum the entire tank thoroughly each week to keep that from happening. I could probably stick another pot over there.


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## feefeefish (Apr 5, 2004)

If fish go several months without water changes, I have always heard that they are deprived of vital minerals in fresh water; is this not true?


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by feefeefish:
> If fish go several months without water changes, I have always heard that they are deprived of vital minerals in fresh water; is this not true?


No, that's not true. Fish get their minerals (calcium, magnesium, etc) from fishfood not the water.

Also, most of the minerals ingested by the fish get passed back to the tank environment, so minerals would tend to build up. Water changes would remove these minerals.

In tanks without plants, you probably want to do water changes to prevent excessive mineral buildup. However, in planted tanks where plants can and will use these nutrients, it's probably better not to change the water.


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

So how many fancy goldfish do you think could be safely housed in a 55 gallon natural planted tank?


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## hubbahubbahehe (Mar 29, 2004)

can we use styrofoam cups as pots? are they inert and won't cause problems?

Thank you for your time.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Betty:
> So how many fancy goldfish do you think could be safely housed in a 55 gallon natural planted tank?


Difficult question since even fancy goldfish get up to more than 5 inchs. The 55 gal could be temporary housing for 50 one inch juvenile goldfish but may hold only 3 full-sized adults of 5-6 inches. Even then it may not be really fair to your fish...bumping into glass every time they turn around. However, if you're planning on later setting up a pond, raising juvenile goldfish in a 55 gallon would work nicely.

You can house as many in a planted tank as a non-planted tank. I would use established guidelines.


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## hubbahubbahehe (Mar 29, 2004)

does anyone know if styrofoam cups are safe for plant pots?


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## Wally (Aug 31, 2003)

Yep you can use them, they are kinda small however.


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## superjohnny (Jul 31, 2004)

Diana that's just lovely. If I weren't already married...


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## feefeefish (Apr 5, 2004)

> quote:
> 
> Originally posted by Diana Walstad:
> 
> ...


That is amazing! I'll have to try it. I have a good amount of plants in a cycled 29g; it's time!


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## feefeefish (Apr 5, 2004)

19 days now since I changed the water! Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate are all zero. ph 6.6, KH 40ppm, GH 150ppm. So, no water change AGAIN, and I just added a little sodium bicarbonate to raise the KH a bit.









I have a question: Is the sodium in the sodium bicarb harmful to my fish? I use a total of about a teaspoonful and a half every month. Thank you!


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## superjohnny (Jul 31, 2004)

feefeefish if you haven't read her book yet you really should. It's not just about not changing the water, it's about setting up a balanced ecosystem.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

Sodium is not harmful to fish. You know that many fish diseases are treated with salt (sodium chloride).

However, high salt will eventually harm plants if it gets high enough. Remember how the Romans destroyed Carthrage by adding salt to their soil. 

Bacopa monneiri, a brackish water plant, can tolerate 0.2% NaCl, which is 2 grams/liter of water. This is the absolute maximum for aquarium plants.

One teaspoon of salt weighs about 5 g (grams) and 1 gal is equivalent to 3.8 liters. You'll have to calculate how much you are adding to your tank to determine whether you are coming close to the 0.2% limit.

If you think you are adding too much sodium, there's another way. Instead of sodium bicarbonate, you could use calcium bicarbonate (available as oyster grit, lime pellets, etc.) to bring up your KH.


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## feefeefish (Apr 5, 2004)

Thank you for the replies.









Superjohnny, I have Diana's book, and consult it when I can. I am just amazed that a tank can go so long between water changes with the parameters staying within acceptable limits and the fish thriving and breeding, that I have to keep coming here for reassurance.

Diana has brought back the simplicity to fishkeeping that has been lost by the high-tech approach, and it seems that it IS possible to keep healthy, happy fish without the weekly water change grind!


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