# Sinister ghost shrimp?!



## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

WOW. I'm just sitting here and I hear a loud splash then something thumping against my glass top and when I look at my tank all I see is the shadow of one of my dwarf gouramis repeatedly floundering around slamming into the bottom of the tank. It looked like it was panicking and trying to shake something off of it or cough something up like it was choking on something. I used to have bluegills and you'd be amazed at what they would try and fit in their mouth... Anyway I get up to turn on the light so I can see and right as I get to the tank it stops moving and is just laying on its side. When I turned on the light I could see one of my ghost shrimp straddling it right on top of its head behind the eyes like he thought he was a bull rider or something. His forearms were active like he was tryin to eat it! It took me considerable shooing to get it away from the dieing gourami who was convulsing slowly on the sand, which is also odd because my ghosties are usually very shy of my hand.. I picked up the gourami to look in its mouth but didn't see anything and right when it hit the bottom of the tank it got swarmed by 3 more ghost shrimp who were all yankin on it. I quickly shooed two away but the third had a grip on the tail and was tugging at it like crazy! It kind of reminded me of like one of those small ants towing a grasshopper. The thing is 10 times its size and its inching it across the sand. Anyways I put the dieing thing in a net to keep it safe from the shrimps and they kept hounding the outside of the net like a pack of hungry wolves! One actually ate part of its eye through the net! The thing is finally dead now and after inspecting its body there is a distinctly torn up patch on the gouramis forehead where the one had been straddling it as it flipped out. What I think happened, looking at what I saw and the newly torn up part of my tank, is that the ghostie must have hopped on the gouramis head while he was sleeping in some kind of attack! They always sleep on the floor by the hygro or lutea. I mean this just blows my mind! I've never seen or heard of this aggressive of behavior before for dwarf shrimps like my ghosts, its not like they are mantis shrimp or anything. It reminded me exactly like a pack of wolves! I would maybe expect that if they were starving and there was anything smaller than them in the tank but they just got a feast of flake food over the last two days! There's no way they were that hungry, I always watch my tank until the foods gone so I don't overfeed and I just witnessed all five of the ghost shrimps feast like 3 hours before. I better quit now or I'll ramble all night, but I just cant rap my mind around this!


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## NeonFlux (May 15, 2008)

Interesting story. May your fish RIP!


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## THHNguyen (Dec 2, 2006)

I bet that gourami was on its way out. Even macrobrachiums (someone's going to suggest your ghosts are macros...it always happens) won't attack something that much larger than they are.


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## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

Yea, my shrimps are more defiantly not macros. I can tell the difference and it was males and females that attacked the dwarf gourami.



THHNguyen said:


> I bet that gourami was on its way out. Even macrobrachiums (someone's going to suggest your ghosts are macros...it always happens) won't attack something that much larger than they are.


Do you think they could sense the weakened fish if that was the case? I mean it put up a pretty health fight right up until it smoked my glass top head on... and even if it was dieing I can't believe they would so aggressively attack a still kickin' fish and ride it rodeo style into the ground. I know how far fetched this whole thing seems. I mean I barely believe it and I was witness..


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## James0816 (Oct 9, 2008)

Very interesting indeed I must say. Does your ghosties have red claws? I know there are some species of ghosties that are kind of aggressive but this one just sounds odd on a Gourami.


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## MacMyers (Feb 15, 2011)

Ghost Shrimp are Scavengers. They would not attack and bring down a gourami. What you saw was natural scavenging on a dead or dying carcass. They are opportunistic feeders... but not fish killers.


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## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

MacMyers said:


> Ghost Shrimp are Scavengers. They would not attack and bring down a gourami. What you saw was natural scavenging on a dead or dying carcass. They are opportunistic feeders... but not fish killers.


 I apologize in advance if my reply sounds condescending, as that is not my intention, but I am completely aware of this, and I know what I saw, which is why this is so strange. The gourami might have been on his way out but he was nowhere near dead or very weak for that matter until he tore up a corner of my aquarium hit the glass top, *hard*, and then floundered around on the ground. I closely watched my Gouramis before the lights went off because my stealth pro made an attempt to cook them earlier and they both seemed close to fine and were eating. I am not some beginner who has mistaken natural behavior for something its not. I've been keeping fish since I was ten so I'm very familiar, especially with the behaviors of the individuals in my tanks who I often watch closely. Maybe they had mistaken the weakened sleeping fish for a dead or dieing one, I don't know. All I do know is how shockingly different their behavior was from the norm. Like they all went feral or something.



James0816 said:


> Does your ghosties have red claws?


No, 2 have the red bracelets on their claws and antennae and the other 3 are completely clear


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## mindnova (Jan 22, 2008)

Strong said:


> I closely watched my Gouramis before the lights went off because my stealth pro made an attempt to cook them earlier and they both seemed close to fine and were eating.


Could the fact that your heater tried to cook them damage the slime coat on the fish. This then could have caused the slime coat to put off some type of scent like rotting flesh. Since shrimp are scavengers they would be sensitive to this type of slime failure since that would be (and has been) my experience with dead or very stressed fish. 
I had a fish that's slime coat turned white and the other fish picked at it until I moved it to safety.

So the shrimp recieved chemical signals of what appeared to be a dying fish and made it's move while the fish was recovering for overheating. Between the stress of overheating and bouncing off the glass it was more than the Gouramis could withstand.

In all of the scavenger patterns I have seen speed counts in getting the food before the pack arives. So your cowboy shrimp was probably hanging on for dear life to what he thought was a dying fish in its death throws.


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## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

@mindnova 

That's pretty close to the conclusion I'm starting to draw. It had to have something to do with the heater. 

I was also thinking about the fact that they were so hyper and voracious last night when they are generally pretty lazy as far as shrimp go. I know that the warmer the water the higher a fishes metabolism is and the more active it is, but is it the same for a shrimp? It would make sense if that were the case that the 90ish degree water would make them act like they were all hopped up on pcp or something.. Generally the tank is around 70, but it went up over 92 which is as high as my thermometer goes.


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## MacMyers (Feb 15, 2011)

I wasn't implying a lack of knowledge about fish on your part :biggrin:.... I was implying a bit of knowledge about Ghost Shrimp on mine (specifically _Palaemonetes paludosus_ in my part of the world). Didn't mean to come off as annoyingly as I obviously did. 
I've had these animals as feeders, breeders, and pets. Some can be aggressive with regards to food (and quite "clever" about outmaneuvering other animals) , but none of them attack and kill.  They will hop on anything that sits still long enough.

EDIT: I'm also old as dirt and have been aquarium keeping since I was a little kid.


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## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

MacMyers said:


> I wasn't implying a lack of knowledge about fish on your part :biggrin:.... I was implying a bit of knowledge about Ghost Shrimp on mine (specifically _Palaemonetes paludosus_ in my part of the world). Didn't mean to come off as annoyingly as I obviously did.
> I've had these animals as feeders, breeders, and pets. Some can be aggressive with regards to food (and quite "clever" about outmaneuvering other animals) , but none of them attack and kill.  They will hop on anything that sits still long enough.
> 
> EDIT: I'm also old as dirt and have been aquarium keeping since I was a little kid.


Haha, well I'm not quite that old, and I did appreciate your reply. I'm not saying the shrimp attacked with the intent to kill, I just think they wanted a free meal. The general theory I've drawn about what happened is kind of outlined by mindnova in his post and then my following post. Still not 100% though, any input on this discussion is appreciated. In my eyes I just think any black and white statement about what any animal (especially humans) will and won't do, behaviorally, is purely opinionated and could not possibly be drawn on facts. The only facts are what they have and have not done. I would agree with the statement that more that likely a ghost shrimp would not try to attack a fish but I cannot say certainly that it won't. This is why it was so strange, because they were acting so much different from their normal behavioral patterns i.e. what they have and have not done in the past.

I love ghost shrimps though and as you said they are very clever and I often find them coming off as slightly mischievous in their activities. You would not expect as much from something so small with no visible brain.


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## MacMyers (Feb 15, 2011)

Yeah.... I used to throw them in 48 at a time with my Axolotls as cleanup crew and food. I ended up with a core group of about 25 shrimp that never got eaten. The were masters at knowing just how close they could get and when. A few of them would even grab live red wigglers right out of the Axolotls mouths.


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## dstrong (Feb 13, 2011)

MacMyers said:


> A few of them would even grab live red wigglers right out of the Axolotls mouths.


Yikes, talk about a daredevil!


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