# Micro dosing



## bigstick120 (Mar 8, 2005)

Ive been having some trouble in a tank. Stuff will grow great then all of a sudden stunt or not look as robust as it did. N,P,K all check out, Mg, Ca seem fine as well and CO2 is cranked, yes Im sure! Im thinking I have been underdosing micros. I normally dose 3ml of flourish and 1 ml of flourish iron a day in a 55. Im going to double it and see what happens. So, my question what do you use for micros and at what rate are you dosing it? If you use CSM+B whats your concentration of the mix and are you adding extra iron as well.


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## bosmahe1 (May 14, 2005)

I dose .0625 teaspoon (pinch or 1/16th) per day of CSM+B in a 46 gallon tank. That usually is in the evening. I also add 2.5 ml of Flourish Iron in the mornings before lights on. I'm not sure if the Flourish Iron is necessary but, I have it so I'm using it up. I do at least one 50% water change per week.


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## houseofcards (Feb 16, 2005)

I've never really been a consistent micro doser, but I dose about 5ml Flourish twice a week in my 72g. That plus regular water changes seems to work. I don't see any deficiencies, but as you know everything is relative to your parameters. I never dose iron separately, only what's in the Flourish.


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## barbarossa4122 (Dec 31, 2009)

I am dosing Fe 3 times/week as follows:

10% DPTA-0.26PPM
Flourish Iron-0.24ppm
CSM+B-0.34ppm
Sprint 138-0.05ppm
TPN-0.05ppm

Total=0.94ppm/2.82ppm for the whole week.


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

I've always dosed 1 ml / 10 gallons of tank of both Flourish Comprehensive and Flourish Iron.

One thing I noticed recently is that my tap water is a lot softer than it was 2 years ago when we moved in. The pH is now in the mid to low 6's. I wonder if your water comes from the same source seeing as how you don't live that far away?


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## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

My weekly dosing ends up being about .3ppm of Fe from CSM+B, .45ppm from whatever chelate is hanging around (DTPA when I can, EDTA when I must, probably going to try some gluconate next).

I rarely mix my own stock the same way twice though; too much to play with.


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## barbarossa4122 (Dec 31, 2009)

Philosophos said:


> My weekly dosing ends up being about .3ppm of Fe from CSM+B, .45ppm from whatever chelate is hanging around (DTPA when I can, EDTA when I must, probably going to try some gluconate next).
> 
> I rarely mix my own stock the same way twice though; too much to play with.


Hi,

Am I dosing too much Fe ? You dose .3/week and I dose 2.82 or maybe .3 means 3.


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## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

Not at all. The study being passed around (can't seem to find it in my bookmarks) shows that some of the weedy species of plant have a luxury uptake of iron that peaks around 6-8ppm. On the other hand, nobody's suffering deficiency at .1ppm of dosing that often either. I don't think there's necessarily a point to dosing 6-8ppm, but I'm not sure it'd hurt if it's coming from pure iron chelate.

I dose .3 through CSM+B and .45 through other iron, that's .75ppm of Fe per week.


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## barbarossa4122 (Dec 31, 2009)

Philosophos said:


> Not at all. The study being passed around (can't seem to find it in my bookmarks) shows that some of the weedy species of plant have a luxury uptake of iron that peaks around 6-8ppm. On the other hand, nobody's suffering deficiency at .1ppm of dosing that often either. I don't think there's necessarily a point to dosing 6-8ppm, but I'm not sure it'd hurt if it's coming from pure iron chelate.
> 
> I dose .3 through CSM+B and .45 through other iron, that's .75ppm of Fe per week.


Thanks Philosophos.

Ps. Can you check this out for me. I am confused about cacl2 and mgso4 solutions.

http://www.barrreport.com/showthread.php/6903-My-tap-water-report?p=48214#post48214


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## ibanezfrelon (Mar 1, 2010)

Philosophos said:


> Not at all. The study being passed around (can't seem to find it in my bookmarks) shows that some of the weedy species of plant have a luxury uptake of iron that peaks around 6-8ppm. On the other hand, nobody's suffering deficiency at .1ppm of dosing that often either. I don't think there's necessarily a point to dosing 6-8ppm, but I'm not sure it'd hurt if it's coming from pure iron chelate.
> 
> I dose .3 through CSM+B and .45 through other iron, that's .75ppm of Fe per week.


Hallo!
I was just wondering about this 6-8ppm that are mentioned...
Is that much iron safe for the fish?
What is the max concentration of iron that fish can handle?

Chears!


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## WhiteDevil (May 7, 2009)

www.bestaquariumregulator.com has a great dosing chart for micros and macros


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## Philosophos (Mar 1, 2009)

I haven't looked at the subject before; 6-8ppm is completely luxury uptake, it's non-limiting before even 1ppm. There's not much to it for reds in plants either; iron = red plants is 100% myth. There is no iron in the carotenoids that provide any color to plants.

Anyhow, it's a good question to know the answer to, so I did some reading.

In general, salmonids go belly up long before our warm water fish even begin to complain. Many live in cold temperatures with fast running, clean water and tend to be hypersensitive to a number of things.

This study shows a very slight/near meaningless difference in the hatch rates of O. kisutch: https://kb.osu.edu/dspace/bitstream/1811/22504/1/V078N1_034.pdf

Here's an O. mykiss field report showing trout in its natural habitat experiencing 5-10ppm Fe... water so heavy with the stuff that it's red:
http://www.springerlink.com/content/h521240435714277/

The EPA ECOTOX database wasn't very helpful this time around; EDTA iron and Fe2O3 showed some unrelated species dieing off at 40-100ppm in studies basically consisting of dumping in a pile of the stuff and saying, "Yup, that'll kill 'em all right." Normally this is my #1 resource for toxicity information.

As far as the EPA and drinking water goes, it's a secondary limitation at .3ppm for the sake of aesthetic.

For something a little closer to the hobby, but farther from the column, here's a little study on the positive growth rate impact of feeding Xyphophorus spp. gobs of iron sulfate: http://jn.nutrition.org/cgi/reprint/90/1/86.pdf

In general, I haven't seen a reason to dose iron at 6-8ppm, but I can't see any indication that it may be harmful. If you want to take it to the next step, perhaps try comparing a multiple of LC50's and NOAEL's for chelated compounds vs. their sulfate related salts. This will give you an idea of what difference chelates make.


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