# Crypt parva vs Crypt x willisii aka Crypt. nevillii



## Tex Gal

I just found my two crypts under all my Ranunculus. It was a perfect photo op. to show the differences of these two plants. This is how they grow in my tank. The Crypt parva came from Jeff (Big Stick) and the Crypt x willisii, sold as C. nevilli came from AM (before I knew of their practices..) The one on the right is the Crypt parva. They have both been in the tank for many many months, maybe a year.


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## HeyPK

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*

The C. nevillii is now called C x. willisii because (I think) it is a hybrid between C. parva and some other Sri Lankan crypt. It can get a lot bigger with leaves up to 5 inches long. Parva stays quite small.


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## Tex Gal

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*



HeyPK said:


> The C. nevillii is now called C x. willisii because (I think) it is a hybrid between C. parva and some other Sri Lankan crypt. It can get a lot bigger with leaves up to 5 inches long. Parva stays quite small.


I thought it was aka Crypt. willisii x lucens. I will begin calling it C. x willissi


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## davemonkey

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*



Tex Gal said:


> I thought it was aka Crypt. willissi x lucens


I've seen it written _Crypt x willisii _'lucens' and then _Crypt willisii x lucens _'bronze' for the bronze one. I'm a little confused as to where the "x" is supposed to go. Plant Finder has it written _Crypt x willisii _'lucens' for the one that I assume is the former _C. nevillii_.


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## HeyPK

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*

C. x lucens nevillii has shorter, more diamond-like leaves than var. lucens, which has longer blades, and sometimes the edges are a bit wavy. I used to have it.


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## AaronT

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*

I have this same one from the same source, originally sold to me as nevelii. It never got more than 2" tall for me.

From the Crypts Pages:


> The most 'dramatic' change in the nomenclature of Cryptocoryne for the aquarist was made in 1976 by Niels Jacobsen when he proposed to change the name of the very popular aquariumplant C. nevillii into C. ´willisii (see the arguments on the C. nevillii page). Up to now there are even nurseries and wholesalers who still use the old name. As things can be complicated, it turned out that the plant is a natural hybrid, so the right name is spelled with a cross: C. ´willisii.


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## miremonster

*Re: Crypt Parva vs Crypt Nevelii aka willissi x lucens*

The true C. nevillii is a completely different species, having nothing to do with the C. "nevillii" in the aquarium hobby and not thriving in tanks:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~crypts/Cryptocoryne/Gallery/nev/nev.html
C. x willisii is a hybrid complex with several different forms.


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## nfrank

First, lets all remember that commercial sellers and growers mostly use trade names. Those would typically be different than the correct botanical name found on a site like the Crypt Pages.

I have a plant from this general group which was obtained from Gasser in the 1990's. He listed it as C. nevilli !! That was the trade name everyone was familiar with at that time. Gasser knew that was not the correct name, but one that all his customers were familiar with (including That Fish Place).
I had been keeping in emersed for years, and it barely survived my move. Last month , i added it to my new 120gal tank. I took a picture of the flower last summer It is not the best picture for ID purposes.







(hope i didnt mislabel the photo  )
I cant seem to find a match any of the pictures here: Hybrids from Crypt Pages . So what is it?

Here are pictures of the new submersed leaves.








This one below shows one of the remaining emersed leaves.









For comparison, below is C.parva obtained from Oriental Aquarium Pte. For scale, the substrate granules are 2-3mm wide.


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## Tex Gal

nfrank said:


> For comparison, below is C.parva obtained from Oriental Aquarium Pte. For scale, the substrate granules are 2-3mm wide.


My C. parva again.. Just wanted to see the comparison side by side. I think both our C. Parva look the same. Don't you?


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## nfrank

Side by side we can see that the "C.parva" are probably the same species, but also that your picture is clearer. I am not sure about that new turquoise Amazonia though. Is that the type III?


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## Tex Gal

nfrank said:


> Side by side we can see that the "C.parva" are probably the same species, but also that your picture is clearer. I am not sure about that new turquoise Amazonia though. Is that the type III?


The Turquoise Amazonia is the "shade" variety!  That's what happens when you try to adjust for shade/fog.


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## bigstick120

Add another photo of parva to the mix. Texgal said she got it from me and it is indeed parva. I also have the said x willisii 'lucens', Ill try to get a shot of these together as well.









One of the cool things about crypts is, they grow so different in different conditions. Flowering them is the only real way to know what it is for sure.


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## nfrank

Big stick's photo of "parva" is A+++. Although flowering is the only definitive test, having confirmed id of other species that have different side by side underwater and emersed appearance can help say what they are not. Thus we have 3 photos of what may in fact be the same plant, all originally obtained as parva. The submerged leaves appear to be ~1.5cm long.

I heard back from Jan Bastmeijer on my flower of the other cryptwith small leaves. His best guess as i suspected is that my spathe is from a 'normal' C. x willisii. As we know, the photo is not the best. He says, it should show a bit rough reddish limb, a pronounced collar with some yellowish., but the twisted limb is OK. The submerged leaves of this plant are diamond shape as HeyPK stated. Note that the emerged leaves are much larger.

Here is more from Jan's email.
"In the aquarium hobby there is mostly one clone of x willissi in cultivation and that IS the plant with that name. In nature you will see generally that every stream has it own different variant. Look for example at C. bangkaensis, many different forms. In C. x willisii its even more complicated as other parents may be involved making a genetic "mess" and such a plant may look like a normal leaf C. x willisii. Accept it as fact of life. There are two ways to get out of these problems, one is the DNA way, the other way is to make yourself hybrids and look what coming out. The latter is very funny to do and within the scope of the hobbyist, just try it."​


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## AaronT

Unfortunately this is not the most crisp picture. Here's my "nevelii" flowering submersed. It looked very similar to parva, only the leaves had some variation in the color unlike parva which for me has always been solid light green. It also grew about an inch taller. I still have a few of these growing in my emersed setup.


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## Tex Gal

Loving all the facts. Thanks guys!


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