# Green Water in El Natural



## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

So, you aren't supposed to do alot of water changes for NPT's, but what about green water? The one I set up for my daughter gets to looking like pea soup in 1 week's times after 80% water changes. Am i just making things worse by adding so much 'fresh' water so often? 

Do I just wait it out for a few months, or do I continue heavy water changes until the water stays clear of green water blooms? Since it's a natural set-up, I want to do the least artificial 'combat' possible. However, I'm not opposed to taing extreme measures if I have to. 

-Dave

Tank is a 12 gallon hex, 1.5" "loamy clay" soil substrate capped with .5 - .75" gravel, heavily planted, no floaters (might be my problem? ) , more fish than I'd feel comfortable putting in a non-planted tank (also may be a problem? - 6 Black Skirts, 4 adult Platy, 1 Bristlenose, 20+ platy fry, a dozen Blue Pearl shrimp, MANY tiny pond snails)

**NOTE: There are NO other algae issues AT ALL in this tank. Only Green Water.


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

Blackout is about the most natural 'algacide' that I know of. 
UV Sterilizer will work, too, and not harm the beneficial organisms. 
Floating plants will create a natural 'blackout'. When they get too dense you can remove half of them, allow more light into the tank to help the other plants. If (when) algae comes back, allow the floaters to cover the surface for a while. Floating plants remove lots of nutrients, too.

Be best to figure out what triggered it, though, or else it can come back.


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## mudboots (Jun 24, 2009)

Just out of curiosity, when did the pea soup form compared to when you set the tank up and how long has it been this way? I don't have the answers to your question, I just want to take notes in case this happens to my ACF tank.


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## gr8nguyen1 (May 18, 2009)

what are the leading causes of green water. when i set up my 20 g. npt. the water was sort of a greenish, brackish color the minute i finished filling the tank with tap water. this is kind of fast for greenwater infestation isn't it? if not what else could it be. and more importantly how do i clear the water. there are several live plants plus a bunch of corie catfishes in the tank


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Okay, so from what I'm reading here and elsewhere, floating plants are the best option.

To answer gr8nguyn1, green water is caused by too high light + ammonia among other things.

Mudboots, I'm going to use floating plants to combat this. It's been going on for over a month and now humbletex's tank is doing the same thing. Neither of us have floaters right now. Between you and me  I"d recommend something that won't get eaten by the average fish, such as Red Root Floater or Salvinia. Maybe Lemna major? The mollies that Dustin and Rita have ate all the Mosquito Fern and Lemna minor. What do you think? Didn't you recently collect some floaters?

By the way, if you'll be in Bryan Saturday, I'll bring that light fixture for your 20 gal. And you can maybe bring me some floating plants for Rita. 

Diana K, I think it was triggered by a sloppy job filling up the tank whenit was first set up a couple months ago, so organics got into the water column. The only thing that makes me suspicious as to whether that may or may not be true is that fact that I've been changing water heavily. So it seems like I would have cleared that up? I do have a very thin gravel layer compared to most NPT's.

-Dave


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## mudboots (Jun 24, 2009)

Yes, I'll be in Bryan so bring on the wattage. On the floaters, I collected 3 species of Lemna and it turns out that the mosquito fish I collected love to eat them and tear them up, leaving naked root pieces lingering all over the place. I'll bring you what I have left. With your wattage they should reproduce pretty quick. Also, I have to go to Linden tomorrow and will pass the Big Cypress Creek bottom, so I might hop off in there a while and see if I can't find some goodies to share with anyone who'd be interested in whatever diseases and toxins I can muster up.


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## Diana K (Dec 20, 2007)

Sunlight and fertilizer is about the only way I have managed to grow green water. I was culturing some Daphnia and they do eat green water algae, but I was having a hard time growing it.

Old tank water by itself did not work (and this was the water that I had rinsed filter media in, really high level of organics).

Perhaps when you stirred up the substrate there was also some fertilizer in it?

gr8nguyen, A new set up should not grow green water algae so fast, but there are no other green cloudy water issues.

Hetertrophic bacteria will grow very fast in a new set up, and can cloud (white or slightly grey-white) the water in just a couple of days. This bacteria explosion will settle down pretty fast, too, and the cloudiness usually goes away in a week or less.

pH issues can cloud the water. If you are using some sort of pH altering materials you can get cloudy water (also, usually white or slightly grey). Some of the materials seem to linger for quite a while, perhaps in the substrate, and re-cloud the water with each water change until they are sufficiently diluted.

Very fine bubbles in the water can also look cloudy, but they usually out gas overnight. These bubbles can be a problem for fish, though. The bubbles start as individual molecules of gases, kept that way as long as the water is in the pipes. When the water is released from the pipes the molecules join together to form bubbles. If these bubbles form in the gills or other delicate areas it is bad for the fish. 
If this is the cause of the cloudiness then in the future you will need to run the water into a bucket or barrel (depends on how much you need) and let it out gas before adding it to the tank.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Diana K said:


> Sunlight and fertilizer is about the only way I have managed to grow green water...Perhaps when you stirred up the substrate there was also some fertilizer in it?


Diana K, I think you are on to something. This tank does get sunlight from a window (although humbletex's does not) and I used yard soil which may have had some fertilizer in it (although it would have been pretty old by then).

Mudboots, let this be a lesson learned by someone else's mistakes. Don't dig around in your yard unless you know for sure, and don't use potting soil with fertilizers in it. It sure would be a downer to have 125 gallons of Pea Soup.

So, now to combat the nutrient-flooded water column. I do believe that some floating plants (Salvinia, duckweed, Red-Root Floater, etc... ) , along with a couple months of patience, should do the trick.

More thoughts or suggestions?

-Dave


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## mudboots (Jun 24, 2009)

Yep; 125 gallons of pea soup would be frustrating, plus my wife would kill me because I keep telling her how pretty it's going to look once it's been set up for a month or so.

I'll bring you some Lemna this weekend. If you have any other species bring me a sample, as Lemna is not working out for me (the "guppies"). Perhaps after I get the new light fixture on there this will change, but for now it's a mess.


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## StevenLeeds (Jul 21, 2007)

I have always found adding a spare HOB filter with nothing but a sack of activated carbon in it helps with the overload of organics in the water. Change it often.

I also noticed that large water changes just seemed to be feeding it so I backed off the volume I change when I get an outbreak like that.


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## dwalstad (Apr 14, 2006)

The soil probably contained _a starter culture of algae _and fertilizers.

If the plants are doing okay, I wouldn't get too concerned. It won't hurt the fish. Water changes at this stage probably aren't going to help. It seems to me like they only stimulate this algae.

I think your idea to add floating plants is a good one. Make sure you have enough lighting for the floating plants. If you have a filter or pump, I would try turning it off.

I know its frustrating to wait it out. My 45 gal had it for a couple months (soil was heavily fertilized). Then the floating plants kicked in and the algae just disappeared overnight-- never to return. The tank did very well for the next 7 years.


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

dwalstad, you always know exactly what to say to soothe my spirits. 

I do in fact have a filter running (no media, just water flow) so I will disconnect, stock up on floaters, and wait it out.

The nice thing is that the plants do look REALLY good in there. My high tech tank is going through some issues right now and those plants look HORRID. Could be the start of a new NPT in my house. :shock: Hmmm...maybe not quite yet, but it's certainly on my mind.

-Dave


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## DataGuru (Mar 11, 2005)

that's a heavy fish load--plenty of ammonia for the algae to eat.

To clear it fast use a UV.
Daphnia in a breeder net should also work.
Floaters to cut down on the light and help suck up nutrients should also help.


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## Alex123 (Jul 3, 2008)

Of all the algaes, I will say I am now an expert at dealing with green water and fixing it in matters of hours. You can't water change it away. There is an imbalance somewhere, so water change just have it grow back. You can't black out it away. It killed my shrimps and weakens the plants. It's a lot of trouble and you wait days. So what's the remedy? UV and diatom filter would work but expensive. I created a home made filter that can be made in 5 minutes and clear water in a few hours. No need to wait weeks or months to clear. Basic idea is to run the water through you old worn sock or new sock for that matter. I posted detailed instruction in the algae section of the forum.
Once you cleared the water, adding floater and more plants will change the imbalance and fix the problem you have.


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## gr8nguyen1 (May 18, 2009)

i'm curios...some posts suggests that we turn off the HOB. can anyone tell me why. i thought activated carbon filters would decrease excess nutrients? how can they be responsible for algae outbreaks


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