# [Wet Thumb Forum]-Here is my setup. What can I grow?



## jaybird002 (May 12, 2006)

I have had more plants die than live, so I wanted to describe my setup and ask for an overview of the problems and limitations.

29-gallon tank
two 20-watt florescent tubes, 10 hours of light
plain gravel substrate
Whisper 40 power filter
ammonia-0, nitrite-0, nitrate-20, pH 7.8, water rather hard, KH-about 4

tank lightly stocked: 7 small tetras, 4 otocats, 1 cory cat, 1 betta, 1 platy, may add an angelfish.

Obviously it is a low-light setup, nothing fancy. Annibus nana grows fine. So do various kinds of algae: brush, hair, green, a little brown. First two sword plants did poorly. I am nursing a third one with Flourish tabs. It is growing a lot of new leaves. Water sprite and hornwort have grown vigorously for a time, then petered out and got clogged with algae. Anyone know why? Did they use up the nutrients, or was it a light problem? Moneywort and hygrophilia defomis never did well.

I scrape algae off the panels (and occasionally the plants) during partial water changes. Also siphon gravel, except at base of swordplant. Right now all I have are the swordplant, anibus, and some new green hygrophilia (corymbosa, polysperma?)

CAN I grow any of these plants in this tank? What are the major problems? Light? Substrate? Other? Are any other plants suitable? Any other suggestions welcome.

Thank you for your help.


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## jaybird002 (May 12, 2006)

I have had more plants die than live, so I wanted to describe my setup and ask for an overview of the problems and limitations.

29-gallon tank
two 20-watt florescent tubes, 10 hours of light
plain gravel substrate
Whisper 40 power filter
ammonia-0, nitrite-0, nitrate-20, pH 7.8, water rather hard, KH-about 4

tank lightly stocked: 7 small tetras, 4 otocats, 1 cory cat, 1 betta, 1 platy, may add an angelfish.

Obviously it is a low-light setup, nothing fancy. Annibus nana grows fine. So do various kinds of algae: brush, hair, green, a little brown. First two sword plants did poorly. I am nursing a third one with Flourish tabs. It is growing a lot of new leaves. Water sprite and hornwort have grown vigorously for a time, then petered out and got clogged with algae. Anyone know why? Did they use up the nutrients, or was it a light problem? Moneywort and hygrophilia defomis never did well.

I scrape algae off the panels (and occasionally the plants) during partial water changes. Also siphon gravel, except at base of swordplant. Right now all I have are the swordplant, anibus, and some new green hygrophilia (corymbosa, polysperma?)

CAN I grow any of these plants in this tank? What are the major problems? Light? Substrate? Other? Are any other plants suitable? Any other suggestions welcome.

Thank you for your help.


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## imported_russell (Sep 14, 2004)

you might not want to dose a lot of fertilizer because, you dont have enough light to support it. 

if you wanted to upgrade anything, you should start with your lighting.


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## imported_russell (Sep 14, 2004)

anubias as you stated will work well. others are mosses, red ludwigia, and aponogeton. some people have luck with anacras, but it usually likes colder water.

how old is the tank?


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## jaybird002 (May 12, 2006)

Tank has been running for one year. I upgraded from a one tube florescent to a two-tube about six months ago. I wish I had gone with a 55- or 65-watt compact florescent instead, which would put me just over 2 watts per gallon for the 29 gallon tank. I still may do that. BTW, do compact florescents get too hot? Is it safe to just lay it on top of the glass cover, or does it need to be mounted above the tank?


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## Margolis (Sep 22, 2004)

with 65W I wouldn't want it laying on top of the glass. Most cf's I have looked at have little legs that will hold the fixture 3" above the tank though, like this model

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=11418&N=2004+113176

and from my limited experience, the swords and other root feeders will need those root tabs on a regular basis to grow well in gravel. It makes a big difference in growth from what I have seen.


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## imported_BSS (Apr 14, 2004)

My first planted tank was a 29g. When I had a 55w AHS setup lying in a DIY hood on the glass, I don't recall too much of a heat problem. When I added a 96w CF on my 46g on top of the glass, I did have a problem.

I had problems getting stem plants to grow in my 29g, and I believe it was mainly due to the standard, lfs-purchased gravel I was using. I think it was too large for many plants to develop a good root structure and start to spread. I had very good luck with Java fern attached to driftwood and my Anubia nana, as you've already witnessed.


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## imported_russell (Sep 14, 2004)

i got ahs 96 watt sittin on my glass


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

The problem is CO2, not light. 40 Watts is plenty for now, and will grow lots of different plants. The ones you've tried (mentioned above) so far will have no trouble with this light.

Either add some method of CO2, or you're going to need to beef up your substrate and really reduce water column dosing (if you ever did so). Stop vacuuming your gravel. That's where the good stuff accumulates. Never vacuum plant tank substrates.

The biggest thing you need to do is add CO2. Try it with a yeast reactor and see for yourself. Once you're convinced, trash the yeast and get a pressurized set-up. It's much less hassle and way more reliable.

Light is not one of your issues.


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## jaybird002 (May 12, 2006)

Thank you for the suggestions received to date. I notice some opinions, from experienced and knowledgable people, seem to conflict. From what I have read, the consensus is that CO2 is not a factor until we get to high light levels, and my 1.4 watts is definitely low light. Wheeler, however, believes I should consider adding CO2.
It was also noted that I shouldn't siphon the gravel of a planted aquarium. I've read that before, but my tank isn't totally "planted." As noted in the description, it has only four plants, a big sword, 2 anibus nanas, and green hygrophelia. Also a light fish load. I've told my fish to stop going to the bathroom but they won't listen. If I don't siphon the gravel, I'm afraid I will have an inch of fish poop before long, with higher ammonia, nitrite and nitrate too. I have to do something to clean out the fish waste don't I?
Also, how should I beef up the substrate? Can I just add some florite or do I have to take down the tank and replace the gravel from scratch.
I guess I am not sure what if anything I should do differently.


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

OK... Now the picture is a little clearer.

Regardless of light levels, CO2 improves plant growth more than anything else. That being said, You don't seem to have a "plant tank" in the sense that we mostly think of now. If I understand you, you just want to have some nice plants to go in your fish tank. A noble endevour









If you decide not to spend the time and money on CO2, there are a number of things you could do to vastly improve growth.

First, is to use pots for your plants with a soil mix covered by plain gravel. Terra cotta clay pots that haven't been varnished work great, or any kind of plastic. A 1/4 inch of garden soil or unammended potting mix in the bottom will make a *huge* difference. BTW, the size of the pot should correspond with the size of a healthy, fully grown plant or you'll need to re-pot them more often. Sword plants and Crypts will need a 4" (or larger) pot each, Stems maybe less depending on how large of a clump you want.

Flourite and peat work great as well, BTW.

Echinodorus, Crypts, Vallisneria, Sagittaria, and many stem plants work very well with this treatment. All will grow and mulitiply.

Best of all, your gravel vacuuming won't mess up your plant substrate, and your fish poo will be easily cleaned.

Epiphytic plants do very well in this type pf tank as well. That is plants that cling to wood and rocks. Anubias, mosses, and java ferns are basically indestructable and you don't have to worry about any type of substrate.

Just some simple ideas. If you combine CO2 and the soil, you'll have excellent, healthy growth even at that light level.


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## Robert Hudson (Feb 5, 2004)

Hey John, welcome back!









The more light you have, the more of a need there is for C02, but C02 makes a difference and improvement at any light level except extremely sub standard light levels.


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## Wheeler (Feb 8, 2004)

Thanks Robert... Good to be around again


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