# Diagnosis Needed Please (Pics within)



## theteh (Jan 19, 2006)

I am new to aquatic plants, this tank (18G) was started about 4 weeks ago with Eco-Complete with great results for the first three weeks with lots of growth, especiall my Sword (growing very very large leaves, going pale gree and seems very fragile). See pic below:









Grass and pennyworth (right) are also dying:









Even my hygrophilia leaves and roots are turning yellow. funny that just two weeks ago, my pennyworth was perling:









Tank Spec:
22W power compact (I know this is not enough but I can't upgrade without changing the whole hood that comes with my tank). 
60L (about 18G)
pH 7.5
KH 10
GH 18
NO3 50
NO2 0
CO2 15-20 (Hagen Nutrafin yeast reactor)
Top wet/dry filter with bio-ceramics+filterwool
Temperature: 25C

This is how it looks:









Many plants are turning yellow except the Java Fern (middle) and Anubias (at the back). My hairgrass is dying...

After reading in the APC, I realise it may be due to nutrition deficiency, so I started dosing Fluorish (double dose) and added 0.2g of KH2PO4 today. Do you think I am doing the right thing? What have I missed?

Any help would be greatly appreciated indeed.

More pics of my setup could be found here:http://www.theteh.com/./html/tropical_planted_aquarium_phot.html


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## hoppycalif (Apr 7, 2005)

You need nitrates, phosphates, potassium, CO2 (or Excel) and traces. It looks like you lack nitrates. Greg Watson sells KNO3, which works very well.


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## rohape (Feb 7, 2005)

i love swords, i had a gigantic amazon sword, and still have two beautiful red melon swords. they love and MUST HAVE iron. i use the iron tabs, as well as the iron supplement from seachem among all my dosing.


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## Longgoodbye (Jan 22, 2006)

You only have enough light to watch your fish. It's not even barely enough to grow anything at all.

Upgrade your lighting.


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## raven_wilde (Nov 16, 2005)

Or resign yourself to low light plants... you already have a few, the anubias and the java fern, which as you say, are doing well. You could try some different varieties of moss: java, weeping, taiwan, etc. Also, there are several varieties of anubias, try finding some petite nana variety ones for the foreground, or some with variegated leaves. Some cryptocoryns will grow at this level as well, but as with all plants growth will be slow. 
Basically, this is the setup I have in my 30 gallon because I too would have to replace the entire hood and can't afford to right now. It's a different look, this mixture of plants, but a nice one, very pretty once it finally grows in.
Another thing you might simply try is replacing the bulb with one that has a higher kelvin rating, I've found that plants really love the 10,000 K bulbs, and at 1 watt per gallon adding kelvins makes a big difference.
Hope this is useful.


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## acbaldwin (Nov 3, 2005)

For the record, my 55 gallon has the standard 40 watt strip of T12 with no reflectors and It still gets by fairly well. My sword is actually the biggest and baddest plant I have, almost 1 1/2 feet across. It started off as a little chunk about four inches across. Iron is a must for swords, mine have turned yellow when lacking Fe. Water wisteria (H. Difformis) is another great grower for this sort of tank, and I particularly find of pennywort. It looks great spread out across the tank, dropping roots along the way.
It sounds like the ferts are the biggest problem, but unfortunately I am no help there . Good luck and the tank looks nice.


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## theteh (Jan 19, 2006)

*Lighting*

Thanks for all the replies and suggestions.

One newb question. If my lighting is not enough to grow anything other than Java fern and Aubias, then why my Amazon sword is growing so quickly too? Is the sword a low light plant?

I will try to dose more Fluorish and Fe to see if anything changes.


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## rohape (Feb 7, 2005)

from my experience, amazon swords are quite hardy. the only thing increased light does for an amazon is speed its growth. after i upgraded my lights my sword really took off. i had to trim its long runners about once a month, where before it never grew any runners. it really turned out to be a tank buster.

i know its tedious, but using a journal and recording your test results will lead you to a good dosing regime. its hard to take one persons regime and make it your own because we all have different water qualities where we live.

just found this too. it may help diagnose some problems
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/gallery/browseimages.php?c=12&userid=

just remember too, dont get all crazy and carried away with a hundred different dosing chemicals.  good luck.


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## raven_wilde (Nov 16, 2005)

I second the idea of keeping a journal, I try to do the same thing with my tanks and it helps to see patterns develop- like algae blooms, they're not so much a mystery if you've got a record of what you've been putting into the tank. Also, and it looks like you're doing this already- keep taking photos, date them, and keep them. A visual record is sometimes more important than anything else.


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## theteh (Jan 19, 2006)

*Update (with pics)*

I have dosed more Flourish (1ml) daily and Fe and 0.2g KH2PO4 for the past few days... and today my Sword is pearling again! I have also noticed new growth (roots and new leaves) on pennyworth and hairgrass!! Could not believe my eyes!! In such a short time one can notice a change.









What is contradictory with the general consensus is that one has to have at least 2WPG to grow any plants but I only have 1.3WPG!!! They must be photosynthesising to be giving off oxygen pearls, am I wrong? In my tank the Amazon sword is the fastest growing one, giving out very large leaves within a short time.
From this:









to this in one week:









Noticed something else has been growing on my Amazon sword leaves recently, could be a staghorn perhaps? I have posted a thread in the Algae forum. Someone suggested Excel. I will give it a try when I receive my Excel hopefully by tomorrow, hope it doesn't kill my shrimps...


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## Blazerfrs (Feb 3, 2006)

That is the best picture of algae I've ever seen! 

It could be stag, but I've had BBA that looks like that too.

I would also agree your problem is lack of light; You simply do not have the intensity most of these plants require IMO. If you have some desk lamps you could put screw-in PC bulbs in and position to shine into the tank this may help as well... it will also test to see if it really is your lighting that's causing this problem.

Good luck


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## acbaldwin (Nov 3, 2005)

I'm willing to bet that CO2 is your problem here. I've got the same ugly stuff on my H. Difformis and swords in my 55 gallon, got some SAE's, and the problem is getting better. Just started DIY Co2 along with the usual Excel, we'll see if that fixes the problem.
BTW, I've only got .75 wpg in my tank. Current plant selection is growing and healthy.


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## BryceM (Nov 6, 2005)

Be cautious with Excel and shrimp. I don't have much experience with shrimp, but plenty of people seem to have nuked theirs by using too much based on what I've read on the forum. Nice photos BTW.


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## theteh (Jan 19, 2006)

*Excel has arrived today*

Thanks for the Excel on Shrimps warning. I have heard about that too. My CO2 yeast reactor has expired today and luckly my Excel arrives on time! I have started a new CO2 culture today but I am dosing Excel in the meantime until the culture starts to bubble tomorrow. I am cautious about dosing the Excel. I have added 5ml to my 60L tank today. This is within the dosing recommendation by Seachem, hope it won't kill the Amano shrimps.

It would be great if someone could tell me the exact dose that I should add to kill the Staghorn without killing the shrimps?


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