# In the market for a new filter. What to do?



## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I'm in the market for a new canister filter. I've had my Eheim 2028 Pro II on my 75 for 10 years now. Lately I've been having issues with it leaking for a few days after the monthly servicing. I have replaced all the gaskets/o-rings including the flow/sight glass and its o-ring and applied silicone grease. I suspect the o-ring on the sight glass is leaking as water builds up in the head.

*My question is:* Do I go with another 2028? This would provide me with some spare parts and immediate start up with hoses and media. -OR- do I go with a new Pro III model?

The G90 is a match for flow with the 2028 and a step up is the G160/model 2075 - 330GPH vs 275GPH. The pads for the new model are about twice the price as for the 2028.


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

if you like a fun diy make your own canister filter or make a sump. only if you have powerhead lying around you're not using. 
one question... why do you HAVE to use their pads??? why not buy filter media and cut to size? it's much cheaper
http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_kw=koi...lstpos=94539&_sc=1&_sop=15&_stpos=94539&gbr=1


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

I get my pads from a guy on eBay in bulk. They are cheaper and better. I was talking to a guy at the LFS yesterday (not a hack place like Petco, mind you) and he said he got a new Pro III to replace his 2028 and was thinking of going back to the ProII 2028. He said my best bet was to get another 2028. They were selling them for $350 w/ media- NOT. I just ordered one last night from Drs FosterSmith for $210 w/o media. I dont need the media anyway.
He said the ProIII has an issue with the slide adjuster binding and breaking.


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## niko (Jan 28, 2004)

It all comes down to filter volume and the flow through it. For an exceptional filter you would do best to get the simplest and best canister and attach a pressure rated pump to it. A huge clear plastic, high quality, canister can be bought for about $140. A pressure rated Japanese extermal pump, ultra quiet can be bought for about $140. For $280 no commercial filter comes even close.

http://www.marineandreef.com/Nu_Clear_Model_506_Inland_Seas_p/ris00506.htm
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=bl_sr_kitchen?_encoding=UTF8&node=1055398&field-brandtextbin=Pan World

Media - if you are using filter pads you probably do not know what ADA does and how it does it. There is no point in denying they know what they are doing and why not emulate it. Biomedia (lava rock) is all you need and they have proven it for years now.

I wonder if anyone has tried these filters?
http://www.aquatraders.com/Odyssea-CFS4-Canister-Filter-p/42044.htm

What is the quality of the plastic used to make these things? Are they heavy duty or flimsy like Eheim's housings?

After tinkering with a wet-dry Eheim and seeing how this expensive filter is made I have lost confidence in this company. This is one of the worst filter designs and material choice I've even seen:
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/sale-trade/75423-fs-eheim-2227-wet-dry-canister.html

--Nikolay


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

Niko,
I'm going to try the Lava rock. Home Depot was out of the Vigoro red lava rock. Not a lot of outdooor garden supplies here in the northeast this time of year.

I've had good luck with my Eheim. 

Wish you had posted this yesterday.


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## spypet (Jul 27, 2007)

if you are considering lava rock, you really should look into Zeolites 
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/substrates/44545-zeolite-sand.html
which is also at most home hardware stores used in swimming pool
filtration. just pour it into a filter bag, and you'll have a nitrates
eating farm of microbes in a matter of weeks. this will give you a
great amount of pours surface exposure with a great water flow.


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## neilshieh (Jun 24, 2010)

damn... i think i'm going to switch to lava rock too. but the bio balls i have now were 24 for 2 dollars shipped ups so :/ do you have to boil lava rocks to sanitize it?


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

spypet said:


> if you are considering lava rock, you really should look into Zeolites
> http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/substrates/44545-zeolite-sand.html
> which is also at most home hardware stores used in swimming pool
> filtration. just pour it into a filter bag, and you'll have a nitrates
> ...


Your biological bed (ammonia and nitrite eating 'bugs') can only be as big as your bio load (food for the 'bugs'). Having a bigger area for the bugs to live on wont increase the colony size. Its a simple matter of food supply = colony size.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

niko said:


> ....................................What is the quality of the plastic used to make these things? Are they heavy duty or flimsy like Eheim's housings?
> 
> After tinkering with a wet-dry Eheim and seeing how this expensive filter is made I have lost confidence in this company. This is one of the worst filter designs and material choice I've even seen:...................................................--Nikolay


Thank you for the input Niko. I cant speak for Eheim's wet/dry filter design as I have never seen one. I believe the plastic is polystyrene. Your other choice would be polypropylene like the Rena filters but that wont last as long as polystyrene. Compared to other canister filters like Rena, Fluval and Marineland I felt the Eheim ProII was a better design and better built. Do I think they are worth the price? NO WAY! But either are the other similar filters. I did get 10 years out of my 2028 and I know what I need to replace to fix my issue. A 25 cent o-ring on the flow meter tube. I got a back-up on sale at FosterSmith and when my original finally dies I'll have an inexpensive replacement.

When we finally move into our new home (in the future) I'd like to PM you on your thoughts on proper filtration for my future 8 ft 300 gal. tank.


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## niko (Jan 28, 2004)

Newt, you have followed the threads on the DFWAPC forum concerning filtration. It's really simple, at least it appears so:

- *Optimal volume of the filter:* 10% of the tank volume.

- *Media:* Must not clog easily; Must allow flow without blocking it (should not be too fine); Lava Rock is best/cheapest. Do not use mechanical filtration - it clogs easily and in a balanced system as a planted tank it is not needed (no big chunks of waste floating around).

- *Flow rate:* Aim for 8-10x the tank volume per hour. Every single canister filter model on the market can be equipped with a much more powerful pump. But surely you can't hook up a powerful pump to a tiny canister. There is a formula to figure the pump that can be attached to certain size housing. Ask me if you need to.

- *Flow rate reduction:* The media should not clog easily. In case it does the pump needs to be able to "pull" water through the clogged media without reducing the flow rate until you clean the filter. That means one thing - you need a pressure rated pump (Iwaki, Pan World, Blue Line).

- *Flow pattern:* The water should move from the intake, through the tank, and into the intake. No additional means to stir the water, powerheads, pumps etc. shooting against or cutting across the main flow.

- *Placement of the intake/outtake:* Side by side. Intake is lower than the outtake. Intake is about 2-6 inches off the bottom (depending on tank size). Both pipes are near the front glass - this allows for a creation of a U-shaped water movement that involves all the water in the tank (not only the water in front).

- *Filter cleaning should be done as irregularly as possible:* The idea is to set everything up to where it cleans itself and never clogs.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

Niko,
Thanks for the synopsis. It was easier to follow than the thread which was broken up by post after post w/ interjections and side topics and alternative suggestions. But thats how its supposed to be on a forum.

One question>>>If you have a canister filter with its own motor/impellar do you disable it and run with the larger external pump? 
I know some of the large canister filters come w/o internal pumps/impellars.

I suppose when I finally get my 300 gal retirement tank I will use a 55 gal tank as a sump.


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## spypet (Jul 27, 2007)

what size are these filter media "lava rocks" ?

yeah - forums are a funny place.
one year so called "experts" swear by pumice,
then by sponges, the next year it's lava rocks,
it's hard to keep up.

since zeolites are the smallest lava rock form,
i figured it would help, but i do see your point
about not needing to host more critters than
your closes system can feed, and niko's point
that the smaller the media, the greater chance
the flow rate could get impeded. both reasons
don't explain why it's used in swimming pools,
not aquariums, but that's for another thread.


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## Newt (Apr 1, 2004)

Spypet,

The size and type of Lava rock people in Niko's filtration thread are talking about is Vigoro Red Lava. The size has been posted as 3/4" to 1" pieces.

Isnt zeolite the same thing as Ammo Chips? White 'carbon'


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## davemonkey (Mar 29, 2008)

Sorry if I'm hi-jacking, but I'm also in the market for a new filter for my 125. Suggestions?

If I go with one of those clear canisters and a pressure-rated pump like Niko posted, where do I get the parts to attach tubing to the pump/canister and where would I find the intake and output parts?

And what if I want to put an inline reactor for CO2 that's 5/8" nipples and the canister is set up with 1", and the pump is 3/4" or whatever size I end up with?


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## niko (Jan 28, 2004)

Dave,

Now you start to see how a system like ADA's helps you. You can get everything at once not having to figure connections, sizes and so on.

Basically what you are trying to do is the right thing. At least I think so. And what's available on the market ready-to-go is "not right" but it is "plug and play".

I can't help you with information about fittings. I have made so many trips to Home Depot and Lowe's that I can't even suggest you do the same. But basically make the system as simple as possible. And use curved hoses as much as you can, avoid L-shaped elbows.

Spypet,

I think that a swimming pool is a very different animal than a planted tank. One of the things that are very different is the size of the waste in both systems. Also - a pool does not have living things constantly polluting the water with sticky organic molecules.

To me swimming pool filtration is like an ultra clean aquarium in which you are trying to polish the water. An actual aquarium is much dirtier. You can run a diatom filter 24/7 on a pool. In an aquarium you will plug it up in a few hours in most cases.

Also - filter pool systems use much larger pumps. I guess they can sustain flow through fine media. The measly pumps that come with all canister filters do what they are supposed to do but readily reduce their flow if the media gets clogged in any way.

I'm sorry, I'm talking about swimming pools and I don't really know anything about them. Just speculating, trying to find things I think I cannot deny. Did I just write a comparison between swimming pools and planted tanks? I must be out of my mind, haha

--Nikolay


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## niko (Jan 28, 2004)

Newt said:


> ...One question>>>If you have a canister filter with its own motor/impellar do you disable it and run with the larger external pump?
> 
> 
> > Yes. You do not use the canister's built in pump. Actually, it helps to remove the impeller because it frees up room for unobstructed flow.
> ...


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## lanceduffy (Jul 15, 2010)

"Then you attach your new stronger pump. Either as an in-line pump or in the tank - connected to the filter intake."

Why on the intake side? Every canister that I know of (and I only know the design of the eheim classic and the ADA) pulls water through the canister. This creates a negative pressure in the canister and sucks the top and bottom of the canister together, creating a seal. If you placed a pump on the intake side of the canister, this would pressurize the canister. You could blow the lid off your canister.


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## Daniil (Oct 30, 2009)

lanceduffy said:


> "Then you attach your new stronger pump. Either as an in-line pump or in the tank - connected to the filter intake."
> 
> Why on the intake side? Every canister that I know of (and I only know the design of the eheim classic and the ADA) pulls water through the canister. This creates a negative pressure in the canister and sucks the top and bottom of the canister together, creating a seal. If you placed a pump on the intake side of the canister, this would pressurize the canister. You could blow the lid off your canister.


Agreed 100%. I have done this and flooded my garage. :bathbaby:
The pump must pull water through the filter


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## Dielectric (Oct 7, 2008)

This thread is interesting. I will also be in the market for a new canister. I plan on ditching my 2 XP3's since i have a huge pressure rated pump. i will probably go with ocean clear, but am waiting til the spring so i can build the plumbing in my garage without freezing.

also good to know about the intake side vs output.


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## lanceduffy (Jul 15, 2010)

additionally, if you are going to run a pump on the discharge side of a canister filter with a functioning pump, keep the impeller in place and plug in the filter.

It will act as a booster pump for the second pump, decreasing the workload on the second pump and increasing the flow. 

That is what I did on my 2213. I added a blueline HD 20, disconnected the eheim pump and removed the impeller. My results were, meh.

Then one day I reinstalled he impeller and WHOH, I was blowing detritus all over the place!

I think niko's suggestion to pull the impeller is good only if you place the pump on the intake side of the canister. However as I stated before, that should NEVER be done. 

You never want to see a positive pressure inside a canister.


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## farrenator (Dec 21, 2008)

Niko, there is an extensive discussion regarding that filter in the equipment forum on plantedtank.net

The biggest complaint seems to be with the qaulity of the material but it may just be that people are manhandling the thing and breaking pieces. It is worth a read. These filters are also available on Ebay. The pump seems quite powerful and if one can avoid the problems outlined in the post I mentioned it seems like it would be very capable for a good price.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/equipment/117191-my-review-odyssea-cfs-500-filter.html



niko said:


> I wonder if anyone has tried these filters?
> http://www.aquatraders.com/Odyssea-CFS4-Canister-Filter-p/42044.htm
> 
> What is the quality of the plastic used to make these things? Are they heavy duty or flimsy like Eheim's housings?
> ...


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## m00se (Jan 18, 2011)

I have a 500 on a 30 gallon and I love it. I did CWO4GUNNER's mod on the the foam sponges. This unit is rock solid so far (3 months now) - people are torquing the daylights out of the cover bolts, and breaking the covers. They redesigned the cover back in May and now there is more reinforcement where necessary. They also were shipping them with O-rings that were too thick, and people were cracking the intake/output barbs after use. This has also been addressed with the new units. This is a great canister filter for the money!


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## Jsthomas (Nov 3, 2010)

I had lava rocks in my Eheim 2217 and it was clog up and slow down my filters flow rate after a week or two. I got tired of taking it all apart and cleaning it, so I switched back to the media that came with the filter. I bought my bag of lava rocks from home depot, most likely the vigiro that was mentioned earlier. Anyone else have any experience with the lava rock? Maybe I'm doing something wrong. I've also noticed that the lava rock has lots of little particles that come loose.


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