# ADA 60cm 'scape



## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Ok, sorry, so cheap of me but I could not resist I do not have an ADA tank but I notice that the view rate is proportionately higher for tanks with that in the title topic. So shoot me

I did redo my old 15 gallon AGA setup. This is the most pleased I have ever been with this particular tank.

Specs:
Title- Untitled #382
Size- 15 gallon 24x12x12inches
Lighting- 32watt PC, home made fixture suspended 5" above the tank by my ADA knockoff light hanger (ok, maybe it is a-la ADA)
CO2- mostly on for the lighting period, 12oz pintball tank with single guage regulator. In tank nano glass diffuser.
Substrate- Forground, pool filter sand. Back corners, Soilmaster Charcoal
Ferts- lightly when I remember for macros and trace. 5ml homemade gluteraldehyde solution daily
Fauna- 9 long finned Rosy barbs (the fiance's, no option there. Deal with it!)
Flora- Potamegaton gayii, Elatine traindra, Rotala sp. Pink, Anubias coffefolia, Anubas sp. Gaboon, Bylxa japonica, Microsorium Windelov and Bolbitis heudelotti

I still would like to plant a little Marsilea minuta and Anubias nana petite among the rocks.










Comments are more than welcome!


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## Aquaspot (Jan 19, 2006)

The rockwork looks great and once the plants fill in, the whole scape will be good. The Potamogeton gayi grows too fast and it would be better if you could replace it with something slower. Otherwise lots of trimming to do everytime to keep it in shape. 

The fishes seem to be a bit too big for this scape and I would go for a school of something smaller. But that's just my 2 cents.


Ben


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Thanks for the comments. 

I agree that the fish are not quite right but they are technically my soon to be wife's, so they have to stay. The grwoth growth rate is actually pretty slow. Before the rescape the P. gayii took several weeks to get to the top so I can handle that sort of growth rate. The rotala grows about an inch or so a week so pretty easy to maintain there, compared to what I am used to.

I appreciate the comment about the rocks. This is the first time I have done a rock scape that looked ok. This one is a little weak I feel but I am happy with the arrangment and overall appearance.


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## bioch (Apr 8, 2006)

dennis said:


> Ok, sorry, so cheap of me but I could not resist I do not have an ADA tank but I notice that the view rate is proportionately higher for tanks with that in the title topic. So shoot me
> 
> 
> 
> ...


LOL. True, such true words. Like this one http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/14398-ada-style-20-gallon.html , it's not even nice, but hey man its got ADA so we'll give it good rates.



dennis said:


> Fauna- 9 long finned Rosy barbs (the fiance's, no option there. Deal with it!)


What's wrong with these beautiful fishes, stop being so fish*IST*.


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## Steven_Chong (Mar 17, 2005)

Well, there is such a thing as picking fish that are better suited aesthetically to a lay-out than others. Hmmm . . . I'd say they are not a bad choice actually. I think with ferns and anubias in these types of "clean" looking scape, the typical choice are fish that look like they belong in a fast-flow environment. However, with the delicate pond-dwelling potomagetans, this idea is broken anyway, so why not pick a fish that has a good fantasy-feel?


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## daeraion (Oct 25, 2005)

Using tetras and rasboras for every aquascape gets boring after a while anyway.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

The fish are not that bad but they are definately not something I can exchange for something else. In the past people always criticized these fish and my scapes since they rarely "work" aestitically. I to sort of agree with you Steven that they are OK for this layout. I had not realized that they are not a distraction for this layout untill you mentioned it.

I did sort of expect a few more responses on the layout though....


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## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

I'm impressed with the layout. The rock work is spectacular, though I think moving the pointing rock a few inches to the left would help bring more contrast to the rock in front of it. 

I especially like the white substrate, but slightly concerned that the whiteness will become "dirty" as time progresses. Is that something you're concerned about?

I like the placement of the Potamegaton gayii in the background. I always had a hard time figuring out where to stick that plant due to it's rapid growth rates. My only comment regarding the plants is that in the photo, it's hard to see each plant as it's own plant. The plants blend too well together with no defining character, resulting in a blurry section of plants on both the left and right sides. It could be a combination of similar colors and leaf shapes that don't accent each other. 

Overall, I think the tank looks fanastic, and I'm looking forward to the development. 

-John N.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Thanks John,

I do see what you mean about the standing stone. I am not to worried about the white sand as I can stir it up with each water change and the sand in my 29 does not really get gross and its easy to fix by stirring it at water changes. The P. gayii seems to grow pretty slow in this tank, only 1-2" a week and it and the Rotala Pink are the only stem plants so dealing with them should be easy. The plants on the sides are more obvious in person and I will try and get better lighting for the next photos I take.

I also see I need to better way of blowing the CO2 around as the bubbles dont make it all the way around to the back right corner and thus growth of gayii on the left is much stronger than on the right.

Thanks!


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## Chris S (Feb 27, 2006)

\\/ :supz: :dance: :roll: :whoo: =D> :rock: :bounce: :cheer2: arty:
(That means i like this tank.)


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## Steven_Chong (Mar 17, 2005)

My feel for this tank is that there is not enough space for plants. Rather, the lacking feature is density. Anubias especially look best in thick dense groups which I'm sure you know are not the case in this tank. Bolbitis seems a bit large for the tank, and for a plant acting as both mid and background, is noticibly thin. Pomatageten is just a thin plant by nature. You can have it for years and never really make a bush out of it.

As a result, the planting looks thin, undeveloped, but cramped at the same time so it seems doubtful that they could develop much better. While "proportionate leaf size" should be a creative factor that can be played with by the aquascaper, the realistic limitation is that all plants have a certain amount of space they need to look their best, with larger plants needing more. I think this is a case where many plants (the bolbitis and anubias) just don't have this space.

To me the culprits seem to be:

--Too much space allocated to foreground with not enough thought to making space for plants.

--Plant species that are large for these dimensions.

I also have an 18g 60 cm, and I 'd say that I'd hesitate to to use plants like E. Stellata or L. Cuba just because those plants are so big for a tank of this size. Bolbitis should probably be considered even bigger than these plants.

Sorry for all this critical feedback on a tank I know you are really proud of . . . just trying to help, and you asked for feedback.

It looks like all the pieces really are here though. The rocks and sand are beautiful-- though I think you can make even more improvements with the rockwork. Good luck Dennis! It's really all there! Just keep playing with it.


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## Craig Tarvin (Jul 26, 2005)

Nice, but what are those black things on the top and bottom of the tank?


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## AaronT (Apr 26, 2004)

I really like the rocks you used in this scape. I agree with John that one side or the other needs to be pushed farther to the side. As is it feels to 'symmetric', at least as far as weight goes. 

I think a light blue backround would set this 'scape off nicely as well.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Sorry to let this thread go stagnant. Thank you to all who posted comments since my last post.

Steven, thanks for the criticism. I am not in the least bothered by it and I definitely see what you are saying about the space in the foreground. It seems no matter how hard I want to really think/plan everything though, I always end up not taking enough time. The foreground is certainly to large but then I was trying to create abit more visual depth and initially I considered a Marselia or glosso forground. That's not going to happen though.

Anyway, here it is at 15weeks. The fish eat every stem plant eventually so please excuse the few ratty stems of Rotala in the background. I think it will be a little nicer when the Bolbitis and windelov fill in. Thoughts?


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## stepheus (Jun 13, 2006)

There is beauty in its simplicity. I could imagine staring at it in person with the fauna absolutely contrasting with the plants. Good job.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

dennis said:


> The fish eat every stem plant


I did not know that rosy barbs were big plant-eaters! I'm glad you mentioned this because I was thinking of getting some of them. Eeeeek!


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Yup. P. gayii and an unknown local, Rotala green, colorata and pink, Bacopa araguaia, Bylxa japonica (seems to be their favorite), Hydrocotyle and Ranunculus were all eaten in short order. Mosses also. They go after the Rotala sp. last. The only plants they don't touch are Anubias and the "ferns". Mine never seem to eat any algae either.

Stepheus, Thanks!


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

They don't even eat the algae? Worthless fish! 

I really was considering them for my next tank. I know it's really girly of me, but a tank full of pink fish sounded sooooo pretty. 

I hope your fiance likes the tank.


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## Steven_Chong (Mar 17, 2005)

Tough break with those fish dude. I mean, the bolbitis is really too big IMO. I sitll like the rockwork in this tank though. I wonder if they'd eat crypts?


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

I'll admit the fish are attractive and very fun to watch. I just wish I could keep more plants with them. About the Bolbitis, I am going to start trying to train it to be smaller. I really wanted everything established first though before I tried it. Now that the stemplants won;t work, I may try pushing the Bolbitis back and having something a little lower in front. Bylxa would be... oh nuts That is one nice thing about these kinds of plants, You can easily move the whole mass around.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Well, its been about 5 1/2 months since I set this up. Where does the time go...?

I tend to be a bit neglectful of this tank, letting weeks or a month+ go by without water changes. The only issue that creates is a little diatom-like algae on the plants and glass. I have not dosed this tank with any fertilizer in months. CO2 ran out weeks ago and I have not refilled it. I think I will try more frequent, smaller wc's (like 25-30%) once every week or two.

As always, not the best photo, I apologize. This tank is the only one I have that could be entered in the ADA contest. There is obviously no way it would do well but I am debating really cleaning it up and entering (I somehow feel like I have to enter something) or making this the first time since I started in the hobby that I don't enter a contest. No one really has to worry about me beating them with this particular setup but I sort of feel it is my duty to enter just so that the contests are that much bigger.....

Anyway, what do you all think?


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## stepheus (Jun 13, 2006)

wow i havent had an inkling that it ll turn out this way. its awesome. but i think you ll stand more chances in ADA if you have smaller fishes - part of the "fauna compatibility" requirement. i see a lot of potential in this tank now. more than previously. to meet those potential, maybe you could add some red vallis behind your narrow leaf have fern and some moss covered rocks along the white sand for depth. you might still make it for the may 31 dateline! good luck!


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Thanks Stepheus, that means a lot. I'd really like to try more plants in this tank, and I may try some moss again, but the fish tend to eat it. I am at the point (right now in my life) where since I know I would not do that well in the ADA, I don't care and would simply enter for the "hobby's sake".

Still, I'm surprised I only got one response. I know its not fantastic work or anything but I don't think it sucks. I don't even want "good jobs", just a critique of any kind.


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## John N. (Dec 11, 2005)

Looks great, and you managed to keep the foreground sand clean too! It could be the photograph, but everything appears "flat" and one dimensional. There doesn't seem to be any type of slope, lines, or definition from the plants and/or the layout. I have no doubt those qualities exist in the real life viewing of the tank, but in the photograph it doesn't show up. 

-John N.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Thanks for the input John. I agree that it does seem flat. The entire problem is not photography, but the pic is not helping. I will try to take a photo tonight with a lighted background to see if that adds any depth. Right now, the photo is so dark in the back and at the bottom that the path effect is lost and I think that kills some of the depth.

In truth though, the only real "midground" is the hardscape and I think that leads to an off balanced, unfinished look.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

What beautiful bolbitus! It has really taken over. Is there a way to thin it a bit to expose a bit more of the hardscape. I really like the hardscape that you have and would like to see it more. Also, I think that perhaps a better photograph will help show more definition in the midground and more detail of the pretty pink fish. (You know how I love them!). Perhaps you could find a friend a friend or relative with a better camera and more skill to help you out. Sometimes I think that 3/4 of what goes into these contests is just the photograph. I often wonder if people are creating a tank to enjoy in their home or just for a pretty contest photo...


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## Steven_Chong (Mar 17, 2005)

It's beautiul Dennis. I just can't help but feel it's small looking though. I have a 60cm in my own room after all, and th size just feels completely different


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Kelly, do you think my photography sucks <single tear rolls down check>?

Kidding!!! Seriously, I wish I knew someone or had a nice new Nikon D-body with appropriate lens and remote flash. But allas, no.

Also, I have been thinking and slowly studying on thinning the Bolbitis. I will look at it for a long time, or over a day, and then trim one branch. I am afraid to remove to much as there is no going back then As to your photo/contest thought, I agree. However, while we all love having nice looking aquariums in our homes, I think the only way we really have to share our enjoyment or hobby is through photos. I also think that if you make a tank look its best in a photo, it will look that much better in real life. Photos are also the only way really to inspire new people or get our hobby out to the masses so contests and photos are a terrific "marketing" tool for the hobby. That's why I way I want to enter something, anything regardless of how good it is- its just more exposure for the hobby and more weight that manufacturers will see as the hobby grows.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

oh, Dennis! Don't cry. I like your photo just fine! But I'm not a judge.

You need to start making friends with art majors. They have access to very nice cameras. Also, perhaps journalism majors?


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

Does this look any better? The Bolbitis and Java on the left need some fluffing and trimming, but I'm working on that slowly. I may try some small moss rocks but I don;t hold out much hope for them 1) growing in time and 2) not being eaten.


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## Kelley (Aug 27, 2006)

Much better, thank you.


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## dennis (Mar 1, 2004)

I have always thought this tank looked better from an angle (looking over my left shoulder when sitting at my desk). Maybe the angle adds depth....or maybe I am used to seeing it from that direction.

I love GIMP!


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